Moving Nuclear Waste By Rail, Yay or Nay???

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by trainheartedguy

QUOTE: Originally posted by macguy

QUOTE: Originally posted by trainheartedguy

hey, why don't we drop the stuff in a volcano in the middle of nowhere in the pacific an Nuke it. LOL

Why not just load it up in a rocket ship and send it on a one-way ticket into deep space?

Well.....with our luck it would turn around and crash back down onto the landing pad. Bye Bye NASA[xx(][:(]

I was stationed onboard a nuclear powered cruiser for 3 years. During my time onboard, we removed and replaced both reactors (it has 2). There is a great exposure to radiation for the crewmember out on deck than for the crew running the reactors in the engineering spaces. There are so many safeguards and you have to have so many qualifications before you can get into those engineering spaces, the people who go through them get all sorts of proficiency pay from the Navy - over and above their regular pay.

When the fuel and control rods are disposed, they are sealed into melted glass. I would much rather trust a rail car than a truck. I've seen the tests they do on the rail cars - they put them in the path of a speeding locomotive and let them get smacked. The trucks, couplers, and mounting gear scatter, but the tank that holds the material remains intact.

Unless terrorists knew exactly which train was carrying the material and which car on that train was carrying the material, I doubt they'd be able to hit it. There was an episode on either The Learning Channel or Discovery Channel about a truck driver who is licensed to transport this stuff across country. The man carries a four-year college degree, has had over 2, 000,000 accident-free miles as a truck driver, and has had to undergo all sorts of certifications. I'd be awfully discreet about securing the route. The last thing I'd want would be a bunch of guys in 3-piece suits, sunglasses, and funny looking things in their ears scoping out the route - they'd alert even the stupidest person that something was up.

As for disposing of the material in a volcano, temperatures in a volcano don't reach high enough to destroy the radioactivity. Shooting it into space has been promoted before, but the problem is the excessive weight of the materials to shield anyone working around the launch vehicles. You could easily exceed the payload limit of the launch vehicle just in shielding alone, not to mention any of the stuff you're trying to get rid of.

[Anonymous]

Sure I don't mine the transport going through my town.... just keep away the protesters.mrlove.

[UPTRAIN]

It dosn't bother me...as long as there are SPECIAL AGENTS, and a hi-railer preceding the train boy about a half mile.

[Anonymous]

Cool if im standind out side my back door here in blair,ne. will it glow like a light lamp?......no serous, id say MABY! mrlove.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by macguy

QUOTE: Originally posted by trainheartedguy

hey, why don't we drop the stuff in a volcano in the middle of nowhere in the pacific an Nuke it. LOL

Why not just load it up in a rocket ship and send it on a one-way ticket into deep space?

Well.....with our luck it would turn around and crash back down onto the landing pad. Bye Bye NASA[xx(][:(]

[louisnash]

I found this on Cincinnati WCPO website today. Just thought I would share it with ya'll.

Brian (KY)



Possible Lawsuit Could Delay Fernald Clean-Up

Reported by: 9News
Web produced by: Stacy Puzo
Photographed by: 9News
4/15/04 5:09:12 PM
A possible lawsuit could further delay clean-up at the former Fernald Uranium processing plant site.

Nevada's attorney general is threatening legal action if the U.S. Department of Energy doesn't keep radioactive waste from Fernald out of his state.

The Cincinnati Enquirer reported in a letter sent Tuesday, the attorney general threatened to file a federal lawsuit and seek a court injunction to stop the shipments before they can begin.

Government lawyers are reviewing the letter.

[wallyworld]

My only concern is the terrorist angle. Why bomb or derail a passenger or everyday freight train when some lunatic with a RPG could target a nuclear load and hit it from some distance.. I agree the real issue is securing every square foot of the route. An expensive proposition to be sure. I don't envy the tough job these folks who would do the heavy lifting in this operation will have. While I have no great affinity toward nuclear power in general, a central depository away from urban areas is the only practical alternative if it must be relocated. The only qualifier is getting the current CIA-FBI dysfunctions cured or settled before tackling this one. Great idea- but it's bad timing.

[mudchicken]

QUOTE: Originally posted by hogger42

QUOTE: Originally posted by mudchicken

Railroads have moved much more volatile stuff than this for years in AEMX , AECX cars that look like white, chopped, low-ridered boxcars. (Example: plutonium triggers from Amarillo, TX /PANTEX to Hanford, WA)...These were not moved in the overly tested containers now at the AAR/TTC "FAST" track at Pueblo...


Travelling Feathers[banghead][banghead][banghead]

Geez MC,
I remember switching these cars in Pueblo Yard some years ago... They had lights and horns all over them....

Do you remember the incident at NA Junction in the mid-80's when an old refrigerator and washing machine dumped in the switch in front of a special Pantex move? (only to have an EB MoP train spoil all their fun)???

[hogger42]

QUOTE: Originally posted by mudchicken

Railroads have moved much more volatile stuff than this for years in AEMX , AECX cars that look like white, chopped, low-ridered boxcars. (Example: plutonium triggers from Amarillo, TX /PANTEX to Hanford, WA)...These were not moved in the overly tested containers now at the AAR/TTC "FAST" track at Pueblo...


Travelling Feathers[banghead][banghead][banghead]

Geez MC,
I remember switching these cars in Pueblo Yard some years ago... They had lights and horns all over them....

[Anonymous]

I don't have a problem with it. It's been safely done before and the cars are better constructed than what could be built to travel on highways.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by trainheartedguy

hey, why don't we drop the stuff in a volcano in the middle of nowhere in the pacific an Nuke it. LOL

Why not just load it up in a rocket ship and send it on a one-way ticket into deep space?

[Anonymous]

I worked on ideas of transporting and storing nuclear waste for the nuclear industry of America Canada and the UK .I was quite pleased by the idea of the
building material as waste going by rail.I was not worried by accidents as knew state
as rail industry had safe guards on hand and would place proper hazmat units as needed.would we ship oil ect and other way .

think safety think rail

David Brown

[dharmon]

QUOTE: Originally posted by vsmith

Hey I had a thought,

What if we got that nuclear-powered ex-Norfolk 2-8-8-2 from India to pull the train,
we'd be killing two birds with one stone...

[8)][:P][X-)][censored][%-)][D)][(-D]

Yeah....Yeah..and me and girlfriend...Morgan...yeah Morgan Fairchild could run it....

[vsmith]

Hey I had a thought,

What if we got that nuclear-powered ex-Norfolk 2-8-8-2 from India to pull the train,
we'd be killing two birds with one stone...

[8)][:P][X-)][censored][%-)][D)][(-D]

[edblysard]

Just a though,
But did anyone wonder how they moved the radioactive fuel into the plants in the first place?

Its not like they ran down to Home Depot and picked up a few fuel rod bundles on sale...

And most of the waste is going to be things along the lines of junk, sections of reactor vessels, left over construction material, just about anything that has been exposed for a long period of time.
Was watching a Discovery Channel program on the disposal site, and what was going to be stored there.
All the junk from Three mile Island, used protective clothing, tools, broken control rods, contaiminated dirt and trash,heck, they even showed a bucket or pail that was exposed, and they chop it all up, stuff it in 55 gallon drums, and ship it.

It isnt going to be just used fuel rods.
Ever wonder what they do with old X-Ray equipment, and the radioactive leftovers from that?
Its gotta go somewhere.
We service a place called Safety Clean, they dispose of stuff like that, and medical waste.
Have hauled a lot of old gons out to them, marked "radioactive" and covered with a tarp.
Some of it they bury, some gets incinerated.

Its a smart move, putting all this stuff in a place where most humans dont really want to go.
Better move would be to not create the junk in the first place, but thats a different story...

Ed

[Anonymous]

Ok, so what routes will 3 mile island and the Calvert Cliffs Nuclear Power company be useing? will they be running by here? who wants to take a bath in some glowin' green jello?

[DSchmitt]

Radioactive materials have been moved safely for years by both truck and rail. When possible rail is the best way to go.

By the way if you think radiation is always hazardous read this article:

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2004/3/31/163126.shtml

[Anonymous]

Well I'd rather it be by train than by truck. With a truck anything can happen and shipping by rail is safer.

[dharmon]

Why waste a perfectly good train...lets contract ValueJet.......that way we get a good firey crash and greater radiation spread.

[wabash1]

been hauling this stuff for years now. on rail thru here. at track speed. never had a problem. this is low level stuff of course but nobody knows its happening.

[rrnut282]

This should be a no-brainer. Ship it by rail. The casks that actually hold the material have been tested at impacts around 20g's. Nothing short of a concentrated blast of high-explosives will rupture them. The ONLY problem is the NIMBY's and as someone mentioned before, quack environmentalists. I find it ironic that they would try to disrupt a shipment and risk poisoning their sacred environment for so little gain. Several months ago, we had a shipment pass through and the TV stations got wind of it and made some noise. It passed through quietly in the night to lessen the chance of a grade-crossing incident and everyone slept peacefully, which is what this whole program at Yucca Mountain is all about. Until they develop a rocket capable of heavy lift that will target the sun, this is the best alternative available.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by edblysard

Man, not to be a spoil sport, but if John Q Public knew what we already haul around, and through their citys, towns and neighborhoods, they would pull up the rails.

Hydrocyanatic acid, LPG, MDI, chlorine, amonia, acrylic acid, and so many chemicals with tounge twister names that, if it leaks, things die.

Hundreds of thousands of gallons of things that curl you toes when you read the hazmat info on them, yet we move them every single day, millions of miles a year, through towns and cities, safely and without incident..

Nuclear waste?

Not a problem, wheres the trainsheet and the motors?

Ed

Yeah, try one day getting really close, and reading what the actaul freight cars contain, Amonium-hydroxide, Potassium Nitrate, Basically any element on the peridoic table AND its compounds..

Not to mention, C3H8, C3H6,

[mudchicken]

Railroads have moved much more volatile stuff than this for years in AEMX , AECX cars that look like white, chopped, low-ridered boxcars. (Example: plutonium triggers from Amarillo, TX /PANTEX to Hanford, WA)...These were not moved in the overly tested containers now at the AAR/TTC "FAST" track at Pueblo...

The bigger problem is NIMBY and quack environmentalists trying to disrupt train operations by derailing the train. Have seen these clowns dump old refrigerators in switches and try to burn timber bridges (both unsuccessfully) in Southern Colorado....

The rail containers going to Yucca Mountain and WIPP are vertical containers about 10 feet in diameter and 8-10 ft tall. These are already a common sight on I-25 between Albuquerque and Denver. What is more interesting to me is the ex-Amtrak F40's in graph paper paint (silver & black grid) used as cra***est dummies at the Pueblo test track....

Travelling Feathers[banghead][banghead][banghead]

[Mookie]

Will this travel in tank cars? And will it be marked as Nuclear Waste or will it just have a placard and # to look up? Just wondering if they will "keep it under wraps" while they are shipping it? Is it liquid?

Mookie

[Anonymous]

By rail is best!

In Germany, we made the nuclear transports, waste or not, since years by rail! Highest poissible security was made when such a train run. The waste was loaded in so called CASTORS´s and the transport was made with a mass of police and security.

The biggest problem is that our waste site, near Hamburg, is away from rail. So they must load the heavy Castor onto a platform roller and drive it to the site.

I remember only one accident - nobody was injured ! The wagons that handle the castor, I think they were made in the USA are loaded extreme heavy - about 300 tons. In Forbach, at the border to France - reactorcores to the refreshplant in Northfrance or UK - was derailed because of a damaged track. This was happened at a low speed.

Nuclear transports are every time dangerous so the highest possible security is a must!

[Anonymous]

hey, why don't we drop the stuff in a volcano in the middle of nowhere in the pacific an Nuke it. LOL

[Anonymous]

It's rail or truck, (don't think they've ever tried to move this stuff in planes).

Trains overall would be much safer, and can be moved more efficiently given a consistant, clear right-of-way.

Seems like the better choice to me.

[Modelcar]

....If it must be moved and the rails have the proper equipment then it is my opinion that is the way it should be moved. I'm not passing judgement of where it should go, just how....

[RudyRockvilleMD]

What are the alternate modes of transportation, and are they safer? No.