The CB&Q hauled coal originating in the southern Illionis coal fields. I am trying to simulate some of those coal operations.
These photos show coal being handled on my Heartland Division of CB&Q (fictional division) . My trains haul coal from the mines to the steel mill and to the power house in the city. Also, some industries receive single carloads of coal.
Hoppers switched at the mine by a GP7:
Train with two SD9's leaving the mines.
Coal train moving down the line.
Rolling through the country.
Arriving in the City of Heartland.
Baldwin switcher moving hoppers at the power plant.
Another pair of SD's is picking up empty hoppers at the steel mill.
If you would like to add pictures of hauling coal on your layout, feel free to do that.
GARRY
HEARTLAND DIVISION, CB&Q RR
EVERYWHERE LOST; WE HUSTLE OUR CABOOSE FOR YOU
Thanks for starting a coal-hauling thread, Garry
Here's an overview of my company houses and the screening and washing house:
IMG_7349_fix by Edmund, on Flickr
IMG_7345_fix by Edmund, on Flickr
Regards, Ed
Heartland Division CB&QIf you would like to add pictures of hauling coal on your layout, feel free to do that.
I feel honored to be sharing a thread with Garry and Ed.
Here is a picture of a string of STRATTON AND GILLETTE coal hoppers running on the beach route.
Thank you for starting this thread Garry. I really enjoyed the "train chasing" presentation of your pictures. I hope to see lots of pictures of trains hauling coal.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."
Enjoy it while you can. Coal is going the way of the Dodo - there was an article on the decline of the Powder River Basin in Trains in the past coupla months. Stored locos and cars that may never roll again, UP ripping up tracks laid down a decade ago for traffic volumes that never came. This is serious stuff, it's no coinkydink that railroads started as a way to efficiently move coal and other bulk commodities from point A to B and bulk traffic remained the backbone ever since. One hundred car trains of one commodity - what's been described as "wholesale" transportation. Trucks took away the far more lucrative "retail" traffic - what used to be LCL is now LTL. What, if anything is going to replace coal is a really big question - we may well see rail fading into a even lower percentage of the transporartion business without it.
To be less gloomy, IIRC, CB&Q used 2-10-2's and the its fleet of 2-10-4's to haul the Illinois coal back in the day. Always liked the looks of its Baldwin built class M-4 and M-4A Colorado types,
https://steamlocomotive.com/whyte/2-10-4/USA/photos/cbq6313-navari.jpg
https://steamlocomotive.com/locobase.php?country=USA&wheel=2-10-4&railroad=cbq
BEAUSABREEnjoy it while you can. Coal is going the way of the Dodo
You'll indulge us then as we enjoy a bit of nostagia.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
SeeYou190 I feel honored to be sharing a thread with Garry and Ed.
(Just kidding JaBear)
Rich
Alton Junction
Great photo sequence, Garry.
What a great way to show operations on a layout.
BEAUSABRE Enjoy it while you can. Coal is going the way of the Dodo
Enjoy it while you can. Coal is going the way of the Dodo
Coal might be in decline but until there is an alternative means of producing the energy we get from coal, it's going to keep getting mined and moved by rail. That day is a long way off. I don't expect to see it in my lifetime.
My own coal operations are quite simple. I didn't have space for either a coal mine or a coal consuming industry, other than two coaling towers. I have matching sets of coal hoppers, one for empties and one for loads. 15 cars per train (HO). My schematic is loop-to-loop but I have bypass tracks for the coal trains so they are running on an oval in opposite directions. Loads in one direction, empties in the other. I run my coal trains as extras so whenever I feel like it, I can send a coal train onto the visible part of the layout.
John-NYBW My own coal operations are quite simple. I didn't have space for either a coal mine or a coal consuming industry, other than two coaling towers. I have matching sets of coal hoppers, one for empties and one for loads. 15 cars per train (HO). My schematic is loop-to-loop but I have bypass tracks for the coal trains so they are running on an oval in opposite directions. Loads in one direction, empties in the other. I run my coal trains as extras so whenever I feel like it, I can send a coal train onto the visible part of the layout.
John-NYBW Coal might be in decline but until there is an alternative means of producing the energy we get from coal, it's going to keep getting mined and moved by rail. That day is a long way off. I don't expect to see it in my lifetime.
Yep. This push for electric cars will, ironically, increase the demand for coal needed to make the electricity.
Rick
BEAUSABRE Enjoy it while you can. Coal is going the way of the Dodo -
Enjoy it while you can. Coal is going the way of the Dodo -
If one is modeling a railroad of a time when coal trains run, then coal trains will run.
David
To the world you are someone. To someone you are the world
I cannot afford the luxury of a negative thought
Great photos! Hard to tell of the scene is reality or a model.
I have a coal effort on my layout. Fun fact: about 70% of train operation in VA is coal. Let's see how that changes.
Good morning
Well I've said it before but I'll say it again. Beautiful modeling on your layout Garry! You too Ed! It was fun looking over the coal mining operations on your layouts over coffee this morning.
It was a toss-up for me to decide whether to model coal or ore on my layout since both are prevalent to the area up here. The satellites from space that discovered huge deposits of coal near the Powder River Basin area in Montana shifted coal mining operations into high gear a while back.
Driving across the plains in North Dakota to go visit my son I've seen very long coal drags with lead locomotives, a center and a pusher. You can see the whole train from some focal points driving down the highway as Judy would smack me on the arm as I was bouncing off the shoulder of the road watching
BNSF doesn't like to add radius dragging coal. They charge right through the middle of the small lakes to keep going straight. Too bad a train wasn't on the mound while I took the picture.
The decision I made was to model ore. Since Duluth was in-between the two places I grew up in St Louis Park and then Voyageurs National Park, the ore modeling won the debate. DMIR, DWP, GN, then BN, Green Machines
Not a huge difference between modeling coal or modeling ore. Just a lot of smaller Bins hauling a lot of weight down the rails
P.S. There's the Bear's Viaduct again
TF
Please, let's not digress into an off-topic converation about long term trends regarding coal vs. other energy sources.
Thanks.
One of my favorites, a Pennsy N1s 2-10-2 hauling coal to one of the ports on Lake Erie that will be shipped by boat to somewhere on the upper great lakes. On the return trio these cars will be loaded with iron ore for the blast furnaces in Pittsburgh.
Rick Jesionowski
Rule 1: This is my railroad.
Rule 2: I make the rules.
Rule 3: Illuminating discussion of prototype history, equipment and operating practices is always welcome, but in the event of visitor-perceived anacronisms, detail descrepancies or operating errors, consult RULE 1!
Ed: .... You are welcome. Your coal mine scene is awesome.
Kevin .... You are welcome, too. Your S&G hoppers look great.
Bear ... Thsnks for sharing a beautiful picture.
riogrande5761 ...... Very nice D&RGW train. Thanks for posting it.
Rich .... Thanks for your kind remarks.
JohnNWBW ..... Thanks for explaining your coal operations.
David North Brit. .... Yes, most layouts represent a certain era.
kassakaboose .... Thanks for commenting about the photos.
TF ..... Thanks for your comments and for the photos. Actually, I also have an ore train. It runs from my staging yard to the steel mill.
Rick ..... Thanks for the very nice photo of the PRR coal train with a 2-10-2.
Last Spike Mike ..... I agree N Scale is good for long unit trains.
Heartland Division CB&Q Please, let's not digress into an off-topic converation about long term trends regarding coal vs. other energy sources.
Track fiddler Heartland Division CB&Q Please, let's not digress into an off-topic converation about long term trends regarding coal vs. other energy sources. Well I beg your humble pardon Garry. I will refrain from other things as well. TF
TF .... I was not talking about you at all. Your post is appreciated!
I was hoping we would not digress into a conversation about coal being replaced by other energy sources.
This comment from somebody else could lead to unwanted conversations: "Enjoy it while you can. Coal is going the way of the Dodo ...... " .... Next, somebody might spout off about fossile fuels, and politics might be after that.
I just want to show and talk about model train operations in this thread.
Gotcha
For all of you modeling coal operations, do you remove the loads to show the empties returning or do you have a separate set of empty cars in a staging area?
Soupy For all of you modeling coal operations, do you remove the loads to show the empties returning or do you have a separate set of empty cars in a staging area?
Soupy ... Thanks for your excellent question. On my layout , I would like to convert all coal hoppers so they have removable loads. Then I could have more realistic operations.
Until then, I return loaded cars to the mine after the operating session is completed. Same with empty cars to be returned to coal receiving industries.
SoupyFor all of you modeling coal operations, do you remove the loads to show the empties returning or do you have a separate set of empty cars in a staging area?
I do not model mining, or end users on my layouts. Coal loads and empties are all just passing through.
Heartland Division CB&Q Soupy For all of you modeling coal operations, do you remove the loads to show the empties returning or do you have a separate set of empty cars in a staging area? Soupy ... Thanks for your excellent question. On my layout , I would like to convert all coal hoppers so they have removable loads. Then I could have more realistic operations. Until then, I return loaded cars to the mine after the operating session is completed. Same with empty cars to be returned to coal receiving industries.
It was really neat Garry! I was at a train show quite a few years back. This guy had a pretty large layout set up with coal mining operations only.
The plant where the coal was dumped had an enclosure over the top with magnets that pulled the coal loads out of the hoppers. Of course the hand of God would have to flip the roof that had hinges on it to reclaim the loads. It still was cool seeing the cars pulled out empty though.
I have ever known only one layout that had empty hoppers arriving at a mine, then full hoppers leaving.
Basically it worked by having two parallel lines with a turnout at each end. Engine run round is also provided at the mine entrance end. A backscene was between the parallel lines.
A train of empties leave the staging area and travel the line in front of the backscene. Once at the other end the turnout was changed and the train reverses down behind the backscene to the staging area.
After a suitable time a similar train, of this time full hoppers, would leave the staging area and travel behind the backscene and be seen at the other end. The locomotive runs round the wagons so to be at the front. Then the train heads towards the staging area in front of the backscene.
No loading or unloading, just two identical trains. One of loaded hoppers, the other empties. Simple, yet very effective and convincing.
What a great idea for a thread. Includes nostalgia, steam, coal, long trains, and great scenery. Your layout looks very good, Garry. And I offer my thanks to all who have played along.
Here are a few contributions. Most of you know them well.
A buddy of mine models the coal operations south of Canton IL (so the Buckheart Mine) as the loads are brought north to Yates City IL, a stop on the CB&Q/BN line between Galesburg and Peoria. He has used "live" loads of actual pulverized coal so that the staging yard yardmaster (me) could empty the loads into old coffee cans and the cars could be returned to Yates City as empties. Sounds great in theory (and in truth the loads looked -- and smelled!! -- very realistic, and the insides of his coal hoppers got very realistically weathered by coal dust, but frankly it was tiresome for the yard operator to get so dirty in the process. So he tried something else: foam rubber cut to the precise size of his coal hoppers and spray painted black. When pushed into the coal hoppers by the staging yard operator it was remarkably realistic. The foam rubber coal loads were kept in an old shoe box.
More recently however his operating system has evolved so that he has a set of empties and a set of loads, and he hand stages the loads at Yates City between sessions.
This question but also the OP's original topic are a good reminder that Illinois was a considerable coal producing state and that the CB&Q but also other railroads including the C&NW, Milwaukee Road, C&IM, Illinois Central, had a considerable traffic in Illinois coal. And not all of is was southern Illinois. There was coal in the central and northern parts of the state too. Much of it was dedicated to the railroad itself back in steam days, meaning the coal had a single final customer: the railroad itself. In the case of the C&IM I think all their coal went to Con Edison which owned it.
Not far from Galesburg, a short line called the Galesburg & Great Eastern was a coal road that used steam until the late 1950s, and interchanged with the CB&Q north of Galesburg running 9 miles to Victoria IL. The track is now gone and the open pit coal mines abandoned, and now filled with water. They are privately owned by wealthy Chicago area sportsmen for fishing purposes! But the G&GE's station at Victoria, water tank and engine house still stand or did last I looked. A small bit of the track is still found in Wataga IL along the BNSF. The G&GE could be the basis for a very interesting and compact model railroad.
Dave Nelson
Hello All,
I run Tyco 34-foot operating hoppers with live loads. The live loads are represented by non-magnetic sand use in smoking urns (ashtrays).
The unloading mechanism doesn't allow a locomotive to pass over it, the cars have to be shoved over it.
A string of empty hoppers passes below the unloading platform to receive the loads on a siding.
The unloading platform is disguised by a kitbashed Suydam, Wyoming Coal Mine/Bulk Loading Plant (Kit #24), that represents the tipple from the mine.
Because the cars have to be shoved through the structure, two critters work the upper siding.
This is all modeled in a 4'x8' space.
Hope this helps.
"Uhh...I didn’t know it was 'impossible' I just made it work...sorry"
jjdamnitI run Tyco 34-foot operating hoppers with live loads. The live loads are represented by non-magnetic sand use in smoking urns (ashtrays).
Me too!
I've got, I think, 11 of those old Tyco clamshell hoppers. I load them at an old Vollmer loader, which is wholly inadequate because at best it holds about 2 cars worth, but it's still fun.
I've also got one of the old Tyco between-the-tracks triggers that causes the doors to open and the coal to be dropped. I built a ramp with a trestle, and put a box beneath the layout to catch the coal.
This is one of the cars. My first step with these was simply to replace the original Talgo horn-hooks with body-mounted Kadees. Later, I replaced what was left of the old trucks, because they didn't come apart and I wanted to get rid of the plastic wheelsets and replace them with metal. While I had the cars apart, I repainted the metal body frames black and weathered the cars.
The cars run a lot better with the Intermountain wheelsets.
I use WS "cinders" ballast for coal. It's quite light, but does the job.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.