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Proto 2000 Heritage 2-8-8-2 repair

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Proto 2000 Heritage 2-8-8-2 repair
Posted by Steven2007 on Tuesday, February 23, 2021 10:35 PM

Well my N&W Y3 arrived today. Unfortunately it took quite the beating during shipping from Pennsylvania to California(thanks a lot UPS). I have a broken drawbar and cab. How may I go about ordering replacements? Life-Like has long been gobbled up by Walthers. Also, the original owner replaced the tender with one from the Rivarossi Y6B. How should I get around to inserting the tender PCB from the P2k into the Rivarossi?

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Posted by Trainman440 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 12:40 AM

You can get drawbar replacements from Walthers depending on how lucky you are. 

The PCB should be a standard JST plug, search on ebay for "6 pin micro JST" and you should find some similar items. No way to know for sure.

Honestly, if I were you, Id return the item. That engine sounds like a nightmare. Those drawbars that LL used are a nightmare to repair/replace. Coupled with broken cab, and a mismatched tender, youre looking for one heck of a time! 

PS a working proto 2000 drawbar will not connect to a Rivarossi tender. Rivarossi use a hole and pin system whereas Proto 2000 used a snap fit clamp IIRC.

Good luck either way!

Charles

 

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Posted by "JaBear" on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 1:05 AM

Trainman440
Honestly, if I were you, Id return the item. That engine sounds like a nightmare. Those drawbars that LL used are a nightmare to repair/replace.

While I’m up for a challenge, Charles is unfortunately right!
If it still has the original Proto 2000 coupler, and that the coupler is the same arrangement as the one I had to replace on my Heritage 2-10-2. I had to virtually strip the engine right down to do the replacement.
 
That said, could you provide a photo because I’m wondering what butchery modification was done for the Rivarossi tender to work, if it actually did!
 
Cheers, the bearer of bad tidings Bear.Sad

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Posted by ATLANTIC CENTRAL on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 5:47 AM

Send it back, sounds like a rip off and a problem to me.

Sheldon

    

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Posted by richhotrain on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 6:37 AM

I'll make that 4 for 4. Return it and be done with it.

I wouldn't blame UPS for this. How well was the loco packaged? I have had nothing but good experience with UPS.

Rich

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 6:47 AM

Steven2007
How should I get around to inserting the tender PCB from the P2k into the Rivarossi?

Just exactly how was this listed and sold?  As a project?  Where is 'the tender PCB from the P2K' if not already mounted and connected?

I'd certainly pursue this with eBay Concierge but it's likely to depend on what the seller indicated in the listing.  I'd also file a claim ASAP with UPS about the damage -- don't throw away any of the packaging before they resolve that.

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Posted by Spalato68 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 9:53 AM

Return this locomotive, if required add some amount and buy another one, there are many now listed on eBay, either pre-owned or even brand new (brand new available for 350 USD). 

Original drawbar is very complicated because it uses "close coupling cinematic system" usually applied on European models, i.e. not easy to duplicate, and even if it is not broken, it cannot be used with RR tender. 

Hrvoje

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Posted by rrebell on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 9:58 AM

You are taking cost out of the eqision, if it was cheap enough then great project, if not then send it back.

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Posted by Trainman440 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 10:18 AM

Think of it this way, Ive seen those engines sell used-like new for around $160-200 non-dcc sound.

Assuming your engine also has no DCC/sound, and has a broken drawbar and cab, Id value it at around $75. I wouldnt pay any more than $90 for that.

Of couse, I am cheap :D

Charles

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Posted by Steven2007 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 10:56 AM

I got it for 200 + 23 shipping + 18 tax. I have been considering mounting an all weather cab(I have a freelanced road) and possibly getting the frame from the original tender, and cutting up the Rivarossi tender shell to fit.

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Posted by Steven2007 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 11:09 AM

Trainman440

Think of it this way, Ive seen those engines sell used-like new for around $160-200 non-dcc sound.

 

I've seen them sell for 180-350!

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Posted by Steven2007 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 11:12 AM

https://photos.app.goo.gl/cpyYNebWQgFPQhW26This is what it was packed in and the detail parts also in there

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Posted by snjroy on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 11:30 AM

If it was described as being in "good running condition", for sure you should consider returning.

Of course, you could be the stubborn type like me and see this as a challenge. The full-weather cab idea kinda settles the broken cab debate. For the drawbar, because it was adapted to a Rivarossi, getting an "original" part might not be the best solution. Can you post a picture? Is it just the bar or the connecting parts that broke? Maybe you can make another one.

Simon

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Posted by Steven2007 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 11:46 AM

Description on ebay: 

Norfolk and Western N&W Y5 2-8-8-2 HO Project based on Proto 2000. Condition is "Used". Shipped with USPS Priority Mail.  I started but never finished a project to kit bash a N&W Y5 2-8-8-2.  They have only been available in Brass.  Y5's had 22,000 gallon tenders with plain bearing Buckeye trucks, which are included.   I was going to detail this as a hump duty loco as used in Roanoke, but never got to it. DC currently.

 

 

here is the link to the damage photo

 

https://photos.app.goo.gl/TZAYy7yZ1RTPyeLx8

 

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Posted by rrebell on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 12:34 PM

Cab fixable.

 

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Posted by Trainman440 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 12:46 PM

snjroy

If it was described as being in "good running condition", for sure you should consider returning.

Of course, you could be the stubborn type like me and see this as a challenge. The full-weather cab idea kinda settles the broken cab debate. For the drawbar, because it was adapted to a Rivarossi, getting an "original" part might not be the best solution. Can you post a picture? Is it just the bar or the connecting parts that broke? Maybe you can make another one.

Simon

 

 

I enjoy a challenge as much as the next, but not when ive paid $200 for an engine!

And yes, obviously some sell for more, Ive seen some sold for $350! My price range was to say how low you can generally get them for. 

The cab is fixable. Id just make a new drawbar with some brass sheet and a drill. Its certainty possible to fix but personally Id get my $200 back. 

Let us know how it turns out either way!

Charles

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 1:03 PM

The cab damage does not look too bad. The sides, which are the most visible parts seem to be intact.

-Kevin

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Posted by Steven2007 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 1:03 PM

How do I fix the cab? I am missing some of the fragments of the front side

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 1:05 PM

Steven, send the pictures to the seller via eBay and ask for a partial refund based on the damages in shipping that could have been avoided if it was properly packaged for shipment.

I had a run of three consecutive locomotives I bought on eBay that all arrived damaged. I was able to get full or fair partial refunds on all of them.

Steven2007
How do I fix the cab? I am missing some of the fragments of the front side.

Glue together what you have, and fill with putty. Sand smooth and paint to match.

-Kevin

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Posted by Steven2007 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 1:32 PM

Any reccomended putty? I don't have much experience building models with anything except cement. Also, about how much should i ask for a refund?

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 1:36 PM

Steven2007
Any reccomended putty? I don't have much experience building models with anything except cement.

You will get a lot of different answers to this one. I like Bondo spot filler for small spots and hiding seams. I use Milliput Yellow/Gray for filling.

Steven2007
About how much should i ask for a refund?

I would ask for 50% if you can verify the model still runs OK. If running condition cannot be confirmed, I would ask for a full refund.

The description said "used", not "inoperative".

-Kevin

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Posted by Steven2007 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 1:38 PM

It runs although I have to have it drag the PCB behind it on the track(Remember the tender is from a Rivarossi Y6b and I havent gotten around to converting it yet)

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 1:40 PM

Steven2007
It runs although I have to have it drag the PCB behind it on the track.

In that case, if it is something you really want to work on, I think a 50% refund is appropriate.

If it is not a project you want to take on, I would return it for a full refund.

-Kevin

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 1:52 PM

Part of what this comes down to is whether the broken drawbar is visible in any of the listing photos.  Seller is likely to say 'this was a project and the original drawbar would likely have to be replaced' if it can be seen damaged in pictures.

If it was NOT broken, he should ask for a refund and have the seller go after UPS for whatever part of the $200, shipping and fees the seller insured it for.

Then see if the seller will do a BIN for a better agreed price for the damaged item if UPS lets the seller keep it and he will sell to you.

 

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Posted by Steven2007 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 1:54 PM

Just for reference the same seller sold one with original tender but with a few detail parts fallen off/broken(bell and mount, one of the holders for the bell pull, whistle, tender footboards) for 165 dollars

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Posted by Steven2007 on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 1:58 PM

Drawbar was not visible in photos, but there were fragments in the box. Also, what is a BIN?

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Posted by snjroy on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 4:00 PM

For sure, the damage is there. A partial refund is justifiable. Don't wait too long if you are going that route... I agree with Kevin, as is, it's probably worth 100$.

Installing a vestibule cab, such as the one from Precision Scale, will address the cab issue. 

We can't help much about the drawbar... But I can't see that as being overly difficult. The fact that is runs is the bottom line!

Simon

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, February 24, 2021 4:05 PM

It's normal for detail parts to fall off.  Not normal for big pieces of the cab to spall off.

BIN is eBay-speak for 'Buy it Now'.  You're not supposed to reach a transaction outside the eBay system, so one way to buy something immediately is to agree with the seller on a price, and he then lists the item as 'Buy it Now' at that price... and lets you know so you'll be the first to pounce when it appears.  

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Posted by Southgate 2 on Friday, February 26, 2021 1:15 AM

Embarrassed You're not alone. I just recieved an Ebay item, Pocher (late 60's AHM-Riv.) JW Bowker, described as "Looks unused?"  The question mark leaving a little room for error. Single blurry picture on description of reflective cello window hides a missing front wheel and drive line, obvious when holding it in hand. And that, I noticed before opening it up further and finding other obvious signs of wear and minor breakage-damage. 

Sez seller doesn't take returns, but I contacted him to request a partial refund. We'll see... Dan

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Posted by Steven2007 on Friday, February 26, 2021 10:57 AM

Alright everybody, I filed a claim with UPS 2 days ago. Hopefully this goes well. I only claimed 150 dollars though.

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