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NEW: Upcoming Whitcomb 65 Ton Switcher!

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NEW: Upcoming Whitcomb 65 Ton Switcher!
Posted by AntonioFP45 on Sunday, January 3, 2021 6:53 PM

Hi Crew!

I read the news on FB and on another forum and thought I'd share it here.

PIKO (German manufacturer) will be producing the Whitcomb 65 Ton Centercab switcher.  I was happy to read of  the news as this is one of the units that a number of modelers have been requesting for years!  Standard response from our favorite manufactuers: "It won't sell"(which was said of the SDP40f.......FL9....... EP5.......U36B....... fill in the blank ). 

I've always liked the appearance of these unusual looking switchers.

Here's a CAD photo from Piko's catalog and a photo of the Atlantic Coast Line "patch" paint scheme that I plan on painting the model in when I get it:

If no Undec version will be available, I hope that the shell will be easy to remove for a "bath"  in Super Clean.  Here's a link to PIKO Catalog. The switcher is on page 171.  https://www.piko.de/KAT_PDF/99501.pdf

The prototype European connection to the 65 tonner is that the Netherlands Railways bought 20 used units from the U.S army, which may have sparked PIKO's interest in producing it.  One of the paint schemes being offered is in the US Army Transportation Corp.

The CAD drawing features European bumpers, but this looks like a model that may be easy to "Americanize" bY removing the European bumpers and installing Kadee #17 thru #20 couplers.

Although the ACL unit in the photo did not make it into the SCL merger (1967), in my world, the unit survived to the early 1970's in that ACL scheme.

One potential "bug" of an issue is that it will come equipped with NEM wheels (which most of us here call "Pizza Cutters). For those  of us that use Code 83 track, that's not welcome news. 

I'm hoping that, perhaps, the NEM wheels can be removed from the axles and replaced with RP-25 style wheels.  But we're early in the game, so we'll likely see/hear more detailed info in the future, including DCC compatibility.

 

"I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!"

 


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Posted by mlehman on Sunday, January 3, 2021 8:46 PM

An interesting choice. I wonder what the trucks will look like internally? Because if it can be narrow-gauged relatively easily, they could sell one here, maybe more.

Most Euro models will convert easily to the Kadee Euro coupler (NEM?), so there's a path to the US versions in most cases. NWSL might offer a solution to the deep flanged wheels.

Mike Lehman

Urbana, IL

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Sunday, January 3, 2021 8:50 PM

I am excited about this. Like center coupola cabooses, I have a thing for center cab diesel locomotives. This is one I want.

Will it need to be mail ordered from Europe?

-Kevin

Wink Happily modeling my STRATTON & GILLETTE RAILROAD. A Class A line located in a personal fantasy world of semi-plausible nonsense on Tuesday, August 3rd, 1954.

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Posted by NVSRR on Sunday, January 3, 2021 9:42 PM

They taking pre orders yet?     I can think of a bunch of northeast railroads that had them. Should be interesting loco.     there is a shell avaliable on shapeways. 

 

Shane

 

 

A pessimist sees a dark tunnel

An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel

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Posted by gmpullman on Sunday, January 3, 2021 10:21 PM

SeeYou190
Will it need to be mail ordered from Europe?

I have dealt with Reynaulds for mail-order of European products imported to North America:

https://www.reynaulds.com/

Perhaps check with them about availability.

Good Luck, Ed

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Posted by Heartland Division CB&Q on Sunday, January 3, 2021 10:41 PM

Thanks for sharing this information.

 

CB&Q had a Whitcomb center cab switcher, but it looked different. The cab was higher than the hoods. 

GARRY

HEARTLAND DIVISION, CB&Q RR

EVERYWHERE LOST; WE HUSTLE OUR CABOOSE FOR YOU

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Posted by doctorwayne on Monday, January 4, 2021 12:51 AM

More than 30 years ago, I was in a hobbyshop chatting with the owner's son.  A well-dressed guy came in (I think that he knew the owner's father, whom I also knew through my father, as they had worked together elsewhere).
"Do you fellas know anybody who might be interested in a free locomotive?", he asked.  Not wanting to sound too eager, I offered a "I might be interested, depending on what it is."
"Well, it's a Whitcomb 65 tonner, with a centre cab."  I did recall seeing photos of those locos, and I had at least an idea of what it looked like.  I was about to ask if he had it with him, when he said, "I forgot to mention, but it's not one of your model trains, it's a real one.  The company is going to scrap it, but would prefer to donate it to anyone willing to take it.  The loco's free, getting it to where you want it is your responsibilty."

I managed to set-up a potentially do-able way to get that loco to our small farm, so contacted the town hall to see if there were any regulations on where it could or could not be located, as I didn't need the hassle of relocating it if I happened to choose the wrong spot.  Turned out that it could not be located anywhere within the town's jurisdiction, and likewise for boxcars used as sheds or cabooses used for anything. 

While I was initially disappointed, in retrospect it was probably the right outcome.

Wayne

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Monday, January 4, 2021 2:07 AM

gmpullman
I have dealt with Reynaulds for mail-order of European products

I have ordered from Reynaulds, but I did not think of them. They are a great source for some unique and beautiful equipment models. Off to check out their website...

Heartland Division CB&Q
CB&Q had a Whitcomb center cab switcher, but it looked different.

CB&Q had this center cab switcher, but it is not a Whitcomb.

This is the most magnificent center cab locomotive, and there has never been a model of it.

-Kevin

Wink Happily modeling my STRATTON & GILLETTE RAILROAD. A Class A line located in a personal fantasy world of semi-plausible nonsense on Tuesday, August 3rd, 1954.

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Posted by NorthBrit on Monday, January 4, 2021 3:43 AM

Kevin.  That looks a 'huge beast'.  Smile   Not like our old Class 17s.   

 

This is a picture of a Heljan model.   

 

David

 

 

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Posted by rrinker on Monday, January 4, 2021 7:25 AM

 Nearby torusit railroad WK&S has an ex-Army Whitcomb like that. Still needs work to be made serviceable, but they have painted it for LNE, which also had one (also ex-Army). LNE's actual one was #601, WK&S has theirs painted as LNE #602.

                                           --Randy


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by Engi1487 on Monday, January 4, 2021 9:33 AM

I looked at the Piko PDF brochur and while I cant understand the native language the company is using, I could not see what paint liveries besides the US army transportation corps are being offered.

Prehaps you could tell us?

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Monday, January 4, 2021 9:41 AM

NorthBrit
Kevin.  That looks a 'huge beast'. 

It was a one-of-a-kind beast! It was built by Cummins Engine Company and General Electric in 1935. AT 1,000 horsepower, it was a formidable locomotive for the time.

It had "Cummins Diesel" cast into the radiator housings, barely visible in this picture.

This is the info slide from the "Cummins 100" centennial in 2019.

The "L" in VL engine stands for Locomotive. As things would go, the "L" series Cummins engine was only installed in a handful of one-of-a-kind locomotives, and Cummins left the North American locomotive market before 1940.

The "L" series engine was successful in heavy equipment and stationary applications, so parts remained available for a long time. This probably resulted in this locomotive being able to have a decent dervice life.

-Kevin

Wink Happily modeling my STRATTON & GILLETTE RAILROAD. A Class A line located in a personal fantasy world of semi-plausible nonsense on Tuesday, August 3rd, 1954.

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Posted by NorthBrit on Monday, January 4, 2021 10:46 AM

A video montage of The Trolley Museum of New York's Whitcomb 65 Tonner Diesel Locomotive #9 moving on its own through the museum yard. The diesel locomotive ran on track that was repaired by museum volunteers and members of the Car Preservation and Restoration Group .

 

I believe Hooker Chemicals of Vancouver had one .  I think one was orange with a dark blue cab.    Columbia Business Centre had something similar  in blue and white.

 

David

To the world you are someone.    To someone you are the world

I cannot afford the luxury of a negative thought

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Posted by dknelson on Monday, January 4, 2021 11:20 AM

Whitcomb locomotives were built in Rochelle Illinois until 1946 and in fact the old factory still exists and is worth taking a look at but is no longer rail served to my knowledge. Two Whitcombs are stuffed and mounted at the Railroad Park in Rochelle: a little 7 ton "critter" (narrow gauge) that kids can crawl over and a more impressive 50 ton locomotive which has a very different outline than this proposed model.

Whitcomb was owned by Baldwin Locomotive Works for many years.

The Railroad Park is located where the UP (former C&NW) east/west main crosses a BNSF (ex-CB&Q) main that ran north and west from Aurora to Savannah IL and eventually to the Twin Cities.  The Milwaukee Road line south from Rockford IL had trackage rights on the CB&Q through the diamond and then south of town at Steward Junction split off on its on track down to Mendota IL and on to Ladd.  That is why there is also a Milwaukee Road caboose stuffed and mounted near the Railroad Park. 

When Whitcomb was in active production in Rochelle I do believe it was the C&NW that had the spur that ran to the factory, snaking its way through residential areas to get there - track now gone.  

Dave Nelson

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Posted by AntonioFP45 on Wednesday, January 6, 2021 5:26 AM

(photo credit: Alex Martin)

I had forgotten to mention that, years back, I no interest in small, industrial switchers.

What sparked my interest in "Critters", like the unit in the above photo, was when I saw several videos posted by a talented modeler in Germany with the YouTube name of "Wedudler" (I think, first name was Wolfgang). 

Wolfgang was a member of this forum and provided excellent info and tips.  His videos featured a smooth running, sound-equipped centercab switcher performing realistic switching jobs for industrial customers. Always ran at prototype speeds

For me, Wolfgang's videos were enjoyable and relaxing to watch.  Sadly,  he passed away a few years back and I can't find any of his videos on YouTube.

If anyone finds them, please post the link or links. I'm hoping that they were not taken down.

 

"I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!"

 


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Posted by hon30critter on Wednesday, January 6, 2021 6:10 AM

AntonioFP45
Wolfgang's videos were enjoyable and relaxing to watch.  Sadly,  he passed away a few years back and I can't find any of his videos on YouTube.

Hi AntonioFP45,

It looks like Wolfgang's website is still up:

http://www.westportterminal.de/

He was a very creative modeller. I copied his design for a 25 ton switcher with sound and it worked out very well. Unfortunately the source that Wolfgang used for his power drive for that project, Hollywood Foundries in Australia, is no longer in business but there are lots of other drives available that will work.

Cheers!!

Dave

P.S. Still no sign of the RDC that ended up in Australia. If it shows up I will contact you before shipping it to the address you gave me.

I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!

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Posted by rrinker on Wednesday, January 6, 2021 8:34 AM

 It seems like most of that styler Whitcomb 65 ton loco were made for the Army, then later sold off to other owners following WWII. The one owned by the LNE, the one currently owned by the WK&S, and I found another owned by the Trolley Museum of New York that started life in the Army. And short line Columbia and Greenville has TWO that have since been scrapped, but both originally US Army. 

 Would make sense for Piko to do this loco in the Army scheme - people old enough to remember in Europe likely saw these locos being used. ANd some were in regular use after the Army sold them off rather than bring them back to the US, and there are preserved ones in Europe. https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/NS_2000_(diesellocomotief)

 So in case you were wondering why a European train company is making this model....

 

                                         --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by AntonioFP45 on Friday, January 8, 2021 5:43 AM

Dave, "You're Da Man!" Thanks!

I had forgotten that his layout was named "West Port Terminal".  This was the layout that made me appreciate small switchers or "Critters". I've started watching the vids again. 

Here's a link to one of the videos. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVzRvpLIoQ4

Hopefully the price listed on the PIKO unit is just msrp and a better discount will be available from our dealers.

"I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!"

 


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Posted by rrinker on Friday, January 8, 2021 8:12 AM

 That's most certainly a list price, but also in line with most well done sound equipped locos these days. Unless these aren't partiocualrly well detailed or something, but they look pretty complete. 

 Darn, saw the GE 25 tonner and figured I need another critter, but drat, only G scale.

                                   --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by AntonioFP45 on Saturday, January 9, 2021 4:12 PM

Randy, thanks! I had forgotten about the DCC-sound option, which I'm assuming (and hoping) that it is Loksound.

Since the information on page 171 is in German, I copied and pasted it to a translator.  Here is what comes up:

 

Matching accessories: DIESELLOKOMOTIVE BR 65-DE-19-A.
For all locomotives Rh 2000 / BR 65: 3OX; For all AC-Rh 2000 / BR 65 the following also applies:
Matching accessories: CAD drawing
 
The Model:
The model of the 62-DE-19A will appear for both US and European investment topics. In terms of quality, the route taken by the latest PIKO mold innovations is consistently continued: sculptural engravings, filigree mold construction, state-of-the-art technology.
 
The impression of the model is rounded off by painting and printing in the usual high PIKO quality. The proven PIKO motor, in combination with large, precisely dimensioned flywheels, ensures excellent running properties. In order to guarantee high tractive forces, the model has two traction tires that are arranged diagonally on the axles running inside both bogies.
 
The PIKO 65-DE-14 has a tidy circuit board with PluX22 interface and is prepared for uncomplicated installation of a decoder and sound with the largest possible loudspeaker

 _____________________________________________________

rrinker

 That's most certainly a list price, but also in line with most well done sound equipped locos these days. Unless these aren't partiocualrly well detailed or something, but they look pretty complete. 

 Darn, saw the GE 25 tonner and figured I need another critter, but drat, only G scale.

                                   --Randy

 

 

"I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!"

 


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Posted by rrinker on Saturday, January 9, 2021 4:26 PM

 Ugg, traction tires. Is it two total, or is it two traction tires per bogie? Hard to tell the way it is worded (probably the translation). Sure hope not the latter! That would be half the wheels available to pick up power have traction tires on them. 

                                             --Randy


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by AntonioFP45 on Sunday, January 10, 2021 9:26 AM

Not a fan of Traction tires.

I wonder if if the manufaturer could have made the chassis itself dense or "heavy enough" to where traction tires would not be required. Mild steel, generally, is still rather inexpensive.

I realize that I don't know what type of chassis this locomotive will have and, perhaps, its chassis would not have enough mass to contribute to significant weight, even if was "cast iron". 

Realistically 3 cars is the maximum that I plan to pull with a "critter" like this during an operating session, so I would not expect it to weigh as much as an Atlas FP-7 (those yellow-box Rocos were bricks!).

But it is a "wait and see" game for a video review in the future.

rrinker

 Ugg, traction tires. Is it two total, or is it two traction tires per bogie? Hard to tell the way it is worded (probably the translation). Sure hope not the latter! That would be half the wheels available to pick up power have traction tires on them. 

                                             --Randy

 

"I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!"

 


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Posted by BEAUSABRE on Sunday, January 10, 2021 12:31 PM

The Whitcomb was not just a switcher, the US Army used them as mainline locomotives in Northwest Europe and Italy.

http://www.robertsarmory.com/whitcomb.htm

 

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Posted by mlehman on Sunday, January 10, 2021 3:08 PM

rrinker
Ugg, traction tires. Is it two total, or is it two traction tires per bogie?

Based on other Euro locos, I suspect that's one traction tire per bogie. Otherwise that would substantially impact power pickup.

Traction tires don't surprise me. Small switchers with sound do it by providing speaker space that is almost always robbed from weight vs non-sound versions. Traction tires compensate for this.

Mike Lehman

Urbana, IL

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Posted by AntonioFP45 on Tuesday, January 12, 2021 4:29 AM

A) Thanks Mike, that makes sense.

B) Beausabre, good info!  I just remembered that a number of short lines and industrial complexes in the U.S and Europe use switchers, of varioius sizes and weights, as road units in addition to performing switching duties.

 

mlehman

 rrinker

Ugg, traction tires. Is it two total, or is it two traction tires per bogie?

 

Based on other Euro locos, I suspect that's one traction tire per bogie. Otherwise that would substantially impact power pickup.

Traction tires don't surprise me. Small switchers with sound do it by providing speaker space that is almost always robbed from weight vs non-sound versions. Traction tires compensate for this.

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------

BEAUSABRE

The Whitcomb was not just a switcher, the US Army used them as mainline locomotives in Northwest Europe and Italy.

http://www.robertsarmory.com/whitcomb.htm

 

 

"I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!"

 


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Posted by NVSRR on Tuesday, January 12, 2021 8:58 AM

If they use the same motor in this as the G scale, then you are getting a Beuller motor.   Really good silent motor.   Wonder if the traction tire axles will be replaceable?    

Shane

A pessimist sees a dark tunnel

An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel

A realist sees a frieght train

An engineer sees three idiots standing on the tracks stairing blankly in space

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