Holy guacomole! Ten to twelve shows in a year!!! I don't know if I've ever lived within 10 miles of that many shows. Well, I guess if I count all the Greenberg shows that hit various towns in in that Radius, it might be that many. The Greenberg show has so much "schlock" that to me it's not worth it to go unless it's fairly close, which for me is Chantilly Virginia and "maybe" Fredericksberg. Timinium is roughly every 3 months but it does seem to be getting worse and even the people putting on the show have seriously considered dropping it to 3 shows. The summer show is small and not really worth such a long drive now. Yeah, not worth it for apple pie!
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
Jim,Back in the 90s I went to 10-12 shows that was within a 100 mile radius. After I entered the computer age in 2001 the number of shows I attended started dropping. Bucyrus,Berea and Dalton will survive since they are good shows.
Marion may become a drop show since the last three years I attended the only thing I bought there was a cup of coffee and a slice of apple pie.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
BRAKIE Jim, I was big on train shows and now I attend four a year.. 95% of my shopping is done on line.
I've been a show dealer for 25 years, and I've never seen a show pack up 2 hours early. That's crazy. The show boss should have stopped it by threatening their invitation to next year. Or at the least, make the vendors all sign contracts that requires them to stay until a certain time or have penalties applied for the next show. Something. As a vendor, I can say we have all packed up early at a show. Usually it's because the show is dead, and usually it's only 30 min. before the end of the show. If the show is still busy right until closing, the dealers will stay. But if no one has even walked by your table for 30 min. (and it takes you an 30 - 60 min. to tear down), you begin to think of clearing out. Paul A. Cutler III
As a vendor, I can say we have all packed up early at a show. Usually it's because the show is dead, and usually it's only 30 min. before the end of the show. If the show is still busy right until closing, the dealers will stay. But if no one has even walked by your table for 30 min. (and it takes you an 30 - 60 min. to tear down), you begin to think of clearing out.
Paul A. Cutler III
I'm sure thats true for most shows, that if it's slow, vendors start packing up early. Yes, I've never seen an entire show pack up at 2, but I recall a vendors packing up as early as 2 or 2:30 on a Sunday, although thats probably the earliest I've seen it. It probably was slow but as a customer wanting to browse, it's not nice to see them packing up before you've had a chance to see everything and knowing the show is supposed to go to 4pm. Because of vendors packing up early, I make it a point to go on Saturdays if possible to avoid getting shut out like that.
riogrande5761 Bob Schuknecht At one time a used to attend 6 to 8 shows a year. Now with the Internet I can shop at home at my convenience. I have been to one show in the past two years. The internet helps, yes. I've been using it to shop for the past 10-12 years but I enjoy going to shows as well and seeing things first hand; it's like a giant hobby shop and many good deals can be had. As always, some shows are better than others.
Bob Schuknecht At one time a used to attend 6 to 8 shows a year. Now with the Internet I can shop at home at my convenience. I have been to one show in the past two years.
At one time a used to attend 6 to 8 shows a year. Now with the Internet I can shop at home at my convenience. I have been to one show in the past two years.
The internet helps, yes. I've been using it to shop for the past 10-12 years but I enjoy going to shows as well and seeing things first hand; it's like a giant hobby shop and many good deals can be had. As always, some shows are better than others.
Jim,I was big on train shows and now I attend four a year.. 95% of my shopping is done on line. As for my not so local hobby shop its been awhile since I shopped there and the last time was for ABS plastics and scale 2x4s for spacers for pipe and flat sheet steel loads and a Accurail boxcar.
I spend more at the bigger Berea and Dalton shows then the other two.
ricktrains4824,I've been a show dealer for 25 years, and I've never seen a show pack up 2 hours early. That's crazy. The show boss should have stopped it by threatening their invitation to next year. Or at the least, make the vendors all sign contracts that requires them to stay until a certain time or have penalties applied for the next show. Something.
Shows tend to follow a pattern: busy at first as the initial rush is on at 9 or 10AM. It dies down around noon, then there's another rush as people come in after lunch. Then it dies down again. By 3 o'clock, there's not much going on. By 3:30PM, you generally start packing up and you're out the door at 4.
I guess I would fall into HZ's C+ category. I'm a pretty die hard show attender and go to most of the T shows offered plus at least one Greenberg show each year, so 4 to 5 shows a year. I'm on a modest budget so I don't go loaded for bear but I bring a modest sum of cash and give the show a once over and then decide how to spend it, unless I find something I have to have during the first pass. Ocassionally there has been a show here or there where I dont' find anything I have to have and I go over to MBK and see what I can find there.
I usually try to go to the Saturday show because I've seen vendors closing up early on Sundays at some past shows. Plus it's more likely I'll find some items early on Saturday before the show has been picked over.
Last Saturday I finally sprung for Spring Mill B&O Canstock car. The Spring Mill table seemed to be sold out of the original B&O scheme but I found one at a vendor fortuately. Been thinking about getting one of those for over 2 years and finally got one. I still need one of their nice PD hoppers too - gorgeous cars.
In the Allentown PA area, I typically look forward to the Fall Frost and Spring Thaw shows at the Fairgrounds.
They fill 2 large buildings with vendors and a section for modular layouts.
You get full on retail dealers and other lessor ones who follow the smaller show circuit that exists here in PA.
I would say that it is an even mix of Lionel/AF (both vintage and new) and HO and other scales.
Whenever I have gone, it seems like attendance has been good.
I can't comment on how dealer sales have been.
Our bi-annual club show has held steady with vendors attending, but ticket sales have declined to a degree. However, we are still make enough money to allow us to help pay operating expenses for the building that we own and continue to promote the show in the future.
The last couple of shows I've been to have been well-attended, and the dealers were doing a brisk business.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
The thing I have enjoyed a lot is some of the clinics at shows. In the past, at the all-brass show that Howard ran, we had John Glaab discuss the history of HO brass. Also John (different guy) from Pecos River discussed the challenges of actually getting models made, and of course there have been some good custom paint clinics done, as well.
In general the clinics can provide some of the most "memorable" show experiences...some of us are more "entertaining" than others...
John
In my area there are a few smaller shows, then two bigger ones near enough in Ohio. (Kirkland Railfest and Berea are on my list to attend nearly every year.) Kirkland and Berea are always larger shows, with lots of people in attendance.
One of the smaller shows near me I now refuse to attend. The reason being, namely, lack of reason to attend. The last time I was at said show, Nov. 2014, there was one operating layout in HO, and one small (8x8) O gauge layout. The HO layout was not operational until approxamately one hour after the show started (per a individual present in the know, explained further down in the post), and they started tear down more than 2 hours () before scheduled close! There were only a few shops with owners present, and they all began to pack up and leave when the layouts (the only two) began tear down. (The HO guys started it, as they were fully disassembled by 2:15, gone entirely shortly thereafter, then the O guys followed by being fully disassembled by 2:30. All the Vendors soon followed.) The others there selling items, all swap style excess items they no longer use, were also leaving early. (Why stay when everyone else is leaving?)
What was really irritating, to me, was I came early afternoon, show scheduled to run 10-4, I arrived about 10 minutes before 2pm due to a scheduling conflict. With just over 2 hours remaining on the schedule, I figured it should still be fine. I was charged full price admission, and everyone was starting to leave shortly after.
When I asked a store owner I knew why everyone was leaving early, he mentioned that he didn't wear his watch, and was just following the lead of the others. (He was very surprised when I told him it was now only going on for 2:15pm!) He then had his assistant get one of the promoters, and when I asked why everyone was leaving so early, he said he was unaware, and apologized for the issue. He then asked why I was "empty-handed", and was wondering if he could assist me in finding any items I was looking for. I then informed him I had just arrived only about 25 minutes prior at that point. I explained that I was annoyed that the show is scheduled for almost 2 more hours, you are still charging full price admission, and everyone is leaving already. He then apologized again, explaining that most vendors are individuals, and they might have other plans and things to do, like I had prior to attending. (I fully understood this, and this was not why I was annoyed.) I clarified my point, explaining that the groups who agreed to supply the operating layouts, both nearby (within 45 miles) clubs, should not be tearing down so early, and that if there was some issue with scheduling with the building, it should have been explained to those just arriving. (No other event scheduled, so no conflict there.) I also expressed my frustration at being charged full admission price when everyone is packing up to leave.
The promoter, trying to smooth things over, apologized again, and asked if I would return for the next show, (but come slightly earlier for a better experience), offering a discounted admission for the next show scheduled in about 6 months. (Now, no fault here, I do not blame him. But, why would I want a discount admission for another show that will end way too early 6 months from now?) No offer was made for a discounted admission for that show. (I declined this offer for the next show, expressing my disappointment that there was nothing to entice me to attend, especially if everyone is going to leave this early.....)
The promoter then apologized again, and wished me a good afternoon, and walked away. (Again, no offer for a discount or refund of admission for the show that day.) The shop owner I know was also clearly irritated that this occurred, and verbally stated to me that I should have been offered a full refund of my admission. (I would have been happy with just a partial refund, even less than half, for that current show.) He then asked if I was interested in anything he had brought. (I did get one railcar from him, which he offered me at a steep discount. I refused to let him discount it that much, as he had nothing to do with everyone else leaving early, nor the fact that I was still charged full admission. He also refused to let me pay him what he was asking everyone else, so we settled in between.)
One other vendor who was still packing up, had a "junk box" with HO scale freight cars labeled as one for $3, or 2/$5. I offered him $6 for 3 of the cars, 2 coal hoppers, one mill gon, all decent shape, all with body mounted coupler boxes, but still having plastic wheelsets, and one having horn-hook couplers, the other 2 kadee clones. He accepted.
The shop owner who I know, mentioned later on, after the next show in spring 2015, that again, everyone started packing up way early. He stated that again, the layout groups started it.
The last show there, this past March, they now have a different layout group, so it maybe better than my experience, but I have not attended the show after my last experience there. (I have not heard from anyone if it was a better experience or not.)
When I attend Kirkland and Berea however, there is almost always a very large group of attendees, including families with children, and a very large number of vendors who are there every show. I also almost always find something useful at a very good price. I have only ever been disappointed in attendance numbers once in Kirkland, and it was the crowded year where they had lost use of the main hall due to it being flooded because of a broken sprinkler head. (Really not a bigger crowd, but a smaller space than the normal one.)
Overall, the larger area shows seem to be doing quite well, but the smaller shows are a huge hit-or-miss.
Ricky W.
HO scale Proto-freelancer.
My Railroad rules:
1: It's my railroad, my rules.
2: It's for having fun and enjoyment.
3: Any objections, consult above rules.
Here are a few interesting facts and observations I have made over the 30+ years I co-ran the Timonium show.....
I have found that there are basically three types of attendees, Type A,B & C. The C's are the fair weather folks who are looking for something to do with the kids for a weekend day. One of the kids may have a small train set and the dad once had a train under the tree growing up. Many of these C's do aquire a renewed interest and many do enter the hobby. This is why display layouts and helpful staff are important. The B's are already into the hobby, but will opt for another activity on train show day, knowing they can come to the next show. Then the A's....These are the die-hards. They will never miss a show, arrive and hour early ready for bear. We always enjoyed moving the C's to B category and B's to A's.
Weather....a major factor. Any show from late March until late October must have lousy weather as the above B's and C's will many times choose other family actities if weather is nice. A winter show just does not want snow. Again A's will always be there.
Now a gripe about most shows. I will begin with that The Timonium show always took great pride in telling exact attendance figures.Other shows..............well here is a basic formula to tell attendance. it is quite easy.....count number of ticket sellers, multiply times 150, then multiply hours of show which is usually 6. This comes out quite close The 150 is the average number each ticket seller will sell during the show. 350 is the maximum any experienced seller can handle.
Other wise a good show with two sellers during a 6 hour run will most likely have an atendance of 2100 using this formula. It has worked with quite good accuarcy for Timonium. Prior to 9-11, the 150 figure was 200, and that worked to perfection. Try it at the next show that claims to have huge attendance figures. You'll have a ball.
HZ
Sheldon,From their website: http://www.railroadhobbyshow.com/abouttheshow.php
The Springfield Show is currently over 350,000 sq. ft., or just over 8 acres.
Kassakaboose
Just saw your PM. I responded.
YGW
Where I live, I'm lucky to attend a train show about once every year to year-and-a-half, if that often. There's a big one that comes up every year in a neighboring state, but I'd have to drive about 6 hours to get to that one; its really about an overnight excursion if you want to spend any time at it (meaning hotel room expense, meals, etc.). I've never been able to justify the expense or the time to go to it. There used to be a show fairly local to me (about a 45 min. ride) but it has long gone by the wayside. When I lived in Denver, to my surprise, there were hardly any train shows there as well. In Ohio, on the other hand (where I lived for 22 years), it seemed back then (back in the 80's and 90's) that on any given weekend there was a train show somewhere in the state, many of them local or not too far of a drive to get to; I attended plenty of them. So, I would be happy these days to even attend a train show, no matter how "crappy", or how great it may be.
dehusman I have a little bit different take on train shows. I model 1900-1905. The vast majority of the models for my era are out of production and haven't been made for years. So the "flea market" vendors are my prime source for modeling materials. From that standpoint, the stuff I buy is getting pretty thin.
I have a little bit different take on train shows. I model 1900-1905. The vast majority of the models for my era are out of production and haven't been made for years. So the "flea market" vendors are my prime source for modeling materials.
From that standpoint, the stuff I buy is getting pretty thin.
Shows in the same general geographic area tend to attract many of the same dealers/sellers, catering to the same buyers, and after a few seasons, if you have specialized interests you start to feel like you are picking away at the same leavings you saw at the last show. That is why I like to expand my range now and then -- even if it means a long drive -- because you are seeing inventory for the first time.
For example, the train shows in Milwaukee, Madison, and Green Bay all attract the guys who seek out Milwaukee Road, Chicago & North Western, and other local roads, and stuff is either in short supply or the prices seem jacked up. A buddy who models the BN does well at those shows because he has so little competition. Conversely, down at Galesburg IL the BN, CB&Q, and Santa Fe stuff all gets gobbled up early, leaving the C&NW stuff alone for me to acquire. When I go to the Davenport IA show, it seems Rock Island and Iowa Interstate stuff gets gobbled up and again, the C&NW stuff is left alone for me to swoop in on.
The swap meets held on the last day of the Chicago & North Western Historical Society conventions are great because again you are in a fresh geographic market and area and you are seeing stuff you have not seen before at the last show.
One other thing I like about train shows is ... lunch! While the food is sometimes awful or at best unmemorable, I enjoy talking trains and model trains with people I have never met before.
Dave Nelson
ATLANTIC CENTRAL Maybe the weather is a factor? I can't say because for me, model railroading is a year round activity not driven or controlled by the season or the weather. And to be honest, I'm not someone with a lot of other outdoor hobbies that would compete with trains for my time. Outdoors is mostly just work for me - work I now do most of with a checkbook. I enjoyed the light crowd, makes it easier to manage the 4 year old..... Truth is I hate crowds, a fact that has kept me away from the shows unless I really thought I could find a few things on my want list. Sheldon
Maybe the weather is a factor?
I can't say because for me, model railroading is a year round activity not driven or controlled by the season or the weather. And to be honest, I'm not someone with a lot of other outdoor hobbies that would compete with trains for my time.
Outdoors is mostly just work for me - work I now do most of with a checkbook.
I enjoyed the light crowd, makes it easier to manage the 4 year old.....
Truth is I hate crowds, a fact that has kept me away from the shows unless I really thought I could find a few things on my want list.
Sheldon
I agree - I prefer to model year round myself and I usually go to 3 fall/winter/spring Timonium shows regardless of how good they may or may not be since I can usually find items I can use and I enjoy watching the layouts run too. But, you and I may not be like many of the attendee's who weather can easily distract them from going. There are train nuts and then there are "fair weather" people. If enough of the fair weather people bail during good weather, it could mean the difference between a good show and a lousy show in terms of attendance; it seems plausible but maybe it's an urban myth which is all to easy to believe. Me, I hate crowds too and it was not very often I wanted to see items at a table and had to wait for a cluster of old men to clear-off so I could get a better look!
As for the dealers perspective, I'm passing on what my wife and I heard. Next time I run into one who subscribes to the Timonium has changed and aren't happy types, I'll try to question them to find out "what it's all about". Don't shoot me, I'm just the messenger. I'll ask my wife when I get home; she has a better memory than me and she's rarely wrong. Just saying... when it comes to arguing with her, more often than not, later she proves herself to be correct! But I might be wrong!
On the other hand I visit the brick and mortar hobby shops for kitbashing, scratchbuilding and scenery supplies.
E-Bay is pretty much the really unique stuff and engines (although K-10 hobbies in Illinois had some Roundhouse 2-8-0's and over a year long period i think I bought a half dozen of them).
Direct from the manufacturer or vendor on line is pretty much tools and limited edition resin kits.
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
mlehman and sunlight and warmth make some jobs easier now than in December. Much as I might like to spend more time in cool, clear Colorado, oftentimes I simply must spend it in muggy, ol' Illinois. And I get slow when it gets hot as my survival reflex kicks in.
Yes,I go from railfaning back to modeling under the old A/C. I never could understand how a person could persue his/her outside hobby interests when its in the high 90s with a heat index of over a hundred.
Last year we had a cool summer (so the weather man said) with mid 80 degree days and I spent more time railfaning then modeling..
Actually the meeting and sharing with old friends is most likely the main reason I attend these shows. At my age and I need more choo choos like I need a 25 pound carbunckle on my butt. I'm sure other old dinosaurs like me feel the same.
I do like seeing what is new and many dealers do present new products along with several manufacturers/importers who attend these shows. Then there are the guys thinning out or dumping items they no longer use or need. That is the best part of the buying scene and is a thow-back to the wondeful old "swap meets".
Many years back there were the so many die-hards who would line up an hour before the show to be the first in to snag the bargains. We had at Timonium several folks who would rent a table, just to get in early (We stopped this practice as soon as it began). Folks once offered us additional money for early admittance, which again we refused. and then there were always friends of vendor who would come in during set-up hours...then disappear into the bowels of the show only surfacing later with a mess of trains they just purchased. Oh well!! the shows are all about having fun with model trains.....and they still are just this....great fun!
I once owned a model train store here in Maryland before the mass influx of train shows. There was one swap meet, but it was 90% tin plate as was the TCA, already in existance. The following year after I sold the store Bruce Greenberg began his show here in Ellicott city, and it was great. I would have as a store owner paid a healthy sum to get in, make Grenberg dinner, and tuck him in bed for a month just to get into the show. My god, man my store was lucky to have 1500 visitors a year, whereas a good show will have 1500 folks pass by your tables in the first hour...many buying, and most remembering who you are. This is still almost the same today....1500 visitors a year in most shops, and the same during the first hour of a good show. What amazes me is why the many shops within traveling distance of the shows don't take advantage of this. What a great opportunity to advertise the store. Some shop owners of course do attend, but mainly to dump old trains and such.
Good topic....there is so much more to discuss here.
Howard--
Thanks for your insights here.
I do think it has more to do with people shopping online more than in the past.
It cannot be emphasized enough that for those who actually do go out to the shows, besides the camaradarie with friends, there are deals to be had at the shows that the remaining brick and mortar shops cannot always beat. Some of us can't buy everything when it comes out and have to spread purchases out over time. The shows make it possible to find some items released a little while ago that may be gone from the easily searchable online inventories of others.
The Amherst Railway Society's Big Railroad Hobby Show in West Springfield total this year was 23,687 according to one society member who post at the MRH forums. Down a little from last year and still good weather. I went Saturday.
We also have a nice LHS, Pioneer Valley Hobbies in West Springfield.
Rich
If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.
mlehman ATLANTIC CENTRAL Maybe the weather is a factor? I can't say because for me, model railroading is a year round activity not driven or controlled by the season or the weather. And to be honest, I'm not someone with a lot of other outdoor hobbies that would compete with trains for my time. Outdoors is mostly just work for me - work I now do most of with a checkbook. Sheldon, On my part, and I suspect Jim's, too, I was simply making an observation. People have different interests and so do their families, so the demands on their time can vary, as well as their interests during the year. I get less done RR-wise in the summer, because there are only so many days when some things can be done (coming up, painting a rental house) and sunlight and warmth make some jobs easier now than in December. Much as I might like to spend more time in cool, clear Colorado, oftentimes I simply must spend it in muggy, ol' Illinois. And I get slow when it gets hot as my survival reflex kicks in.
ATLANTIC CENTRAL Maybe the weather is a factor? I can't say because for me, model railroading is a year round activity not driven or controlled by the season or the weather. And to be honest, I'm not someone with a lot of other outdoor hobbies that would compete with trains for my time. Outdoors is mostly just work for me - work I now do most of with a checkbook.
Sheldon,
On my part, and I suspect Jim's, too, I was simply making an observation.
People have different interests and so do their families, so the demands on their time can vary, as well as their interests during the year. I get less done RR-wise in the summer, because there are only so many days when some things can be done (coming up, painting a rental house) and sunlight and warmth make some jobs easier now than in December. Much as I might like to spend more time in cool, clear Colorado, oftentimes I simply must spend it in muggy, ol' Illinois. And I get slow when it gets hot as my survival reflex kicks in.
I understand, I'm not questioning that as a possiblity, I'm just saying I did not really think about that, because it has little effect on me.
My wife has been to a couple train shows, not likely to ever go to another one. She is supportive of my hobby, just not very interested in it. It's only a family event to the extent described in my original post - me and the youngest grandson.
And, as I said, I'm not really a regular attendee myself.
I always have lots of work I can do, but it's hard to do most of it watching a four year old.....
ATLANTIC CENTRALHow big is the Amherst show?
According to their website, the Amherst show occupies four buildings over 8 acres or 360,000 square feet in floor space.
http://www.railroadhobbyshow.com/exhibiting.php
ATLANTIC CENTRALMaybe the weather is a factor? I can't say because for me, model railroading is a year round activity not driven or controlled by the season or the weather. And to be honest, I'm not someone with a lot of other outdoor hobbies that would compete with trains for my time. Outdoors is mostly just work for me - work I now do most of with a checkbook.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
Howard,I can remember when train shows didn't have vendors except modelers displaying models and selling excess models and parts. They even held auctions for large collections or estates.
The cost to get in? Free or donation.
Hence the name "Model Train Show and Swap meet".
I'm not sure when business(vendors) got invited to the dance but,there hasn't been a real model train show and swap meet for decades since today's shows is more like a flea market...
'
Howard Zane Since I have some knowledge of train shows and in particular, the Timonium, MD show....I'd like to correct a few facts and offer some opinion. First, the show is held 4 times per year, not 5. Declining vendors have nothing to do with new management as they are tops and are going way overboard to accomodate vendors. It has everything to do with attrition and new marketing trends. Dealers and attendees are aging and newer dealers are not coming on the scene as in days of yore. On-line buying, and auction activities are increasing every year....and that coupled with changing tastes such as RTR everythings, what is now found at most shows is not as appealing as the once abundance of used and new brass, built-ups, craftsman kits, and the really wonderful things that model railroading was once about. Still enough can be found to make most shows worthy of a day's outing. Things changes, and most times improvements are questionable. I will again take out and wear my favorite T shirt. Across the front.....just one word with a powerful exclaimation mark.....ENOUGH! HZ
Since I have some knowledge of train shows and in particular, the Timonium, MD show....I'd like to correct a few facts and offer some opinion.
First, the show is held 4 times per year, not 5. Declining vendors have nothing to do with new management as they are tops and are going way overboard to accomodate vendors. It has everything to do with attrition and new marketing trends. Dealers and attendees are aging and newer dealers are not coming on the scene as in days of yore. On-line buying, and auction activities are increasing every year....and that coupled with changing tastes such as RTR everythings, what is now found at most shows is not as appealing as the once abundance of used and new brass, built-ups, craftsman kits, and the really wonderful things that model railroading was once about. Still enough can be found to make most shows worthy of a day's outing.
Things changes, and most times improvements are questionable. I will again take out and wear my favorite T shirt. Across the front.....just one word with a powerful exclaimation mark.....ENOUGH!
Howard, thanks for your comments. Yes four times a year , sorry about that.
I know several of the dealers personally and I had not heard of any issues with the new management.
Having worked in this business years ago, I can say it has never been an "easy" business - not one I would get into now for sure.
Paul3 Sheldon,Here in Massachusetts, we're sort of spoiled by the Amherst Railway Society's Big Railroad Hobby Show in West Springfield at the end of January. It's arguably the largest model train show in the USA, and sees 20,000+ visitors every year. In the past 10 years, the show has only gotten bigger and bigger by going into a fourth building to the show (first just the front part, then the back). We also have the NMRA Hub Division's show in December. It's held at the Best Western Royal Plaza Trade Center in Marlborough every year. They fill the display area up every year. It's probably the 2nd largest train show in Mass. The other might be the Greenberg Show in Wilmington, but I've never been to that one. As for the small local shows, there's the Taunton Show in September, the Brockton/Randolph Show in November, and the Hingham Show in both October and March (we had 1500 people in two days back last month). All are small shows with 50 to 100 dealer tables. In the past 10 years, we've lost Train Shows in Fall River, Foxboro, and West Barnstable. Fall River lost their school space due to local politics, Foxboro's hosting group all retired, and West Barnstable was too far from anything else. I've been a show dealer with my local railroad historical group for the past 25 years. I've seen plenty of shows come and go. The major change is that in the olden days, you'd have the "basement bombers"...guys that would make a hobby shop out of their house and only do train shows. The distributers of the era were pretty loose with their rules about who they sold to, so as long as you had a tax ID, a business card, and an address, you could get a wholesale discount. These guys would travel from show to show, selling new stock. Naturally, brick & mortar retailers screamed bloody murder, and the distributers clamped down. Now, there are few basement-type retailers any more. And you know the hobby shops won't support a local show unless it's a huge show like Springfield or they're members of the organization hosting the show. So what you have a left are a lot of "junk dealers"...retailers selling used stuff, mostly in the larger scales. They certainly outnumber the new dealers at every small show I go to. And I haven't even touched on how the internet is bleeding the local train shows dry... Still, train shows make money for me as a dealer, and for me as a member of a hosting group. I don't make a living at it. Heck, I don't even get paid. But it helps out the non-profits, and for them/us, that's still a good deal. Paul A. Cutler III
Sheldon,Here in Massachusetts, we're sort of spoiled by the Amherst Railway Society's Big Railroad Hobby Show in West Springfield at the end of January. It's arguably the largest model train show in the USA, and sees 20,000+ visitors every year. In the past 10 years, the show has only gotten bigger and bigger by going into a fourth building to the show (first just the front part, then the back).
We also have the NMRA Hub Division's show in December. It's held at the Best Western Royal Plaza Trade Center in Marlborough every year. They fill the display area up every year. It's probably the 2nd largest train show in Mass. The other might be the Greenberg Show in Wilmington, but I've never been to that one.
As for the small local shows, there's the Taunton Show in September, the Brockton/Randolph Show in November, and the Hingham Show in both October and March (we had 1500 people in two days back last month). All are small shows with 50 to 100 dealer tables.
In the past 10 years, we've lost Train Shows in Fall River, Foxboro, and West Barnstable. Fall River lost their school space due to local politics, Foxboro's hosting group all retired, and West Barnstable was too far from anything else.
I've been a show dealer with my local railroad historical group for the past 25 years. I've seen plenty of shows come and go. The major change is that in the olden days, you'd have the "basement bombers"...guys that would make a hobby shop out of their house and only do train shows. The distributers of the era were pretty loose with their rules about who they sold to, so as long as you had a tax ID, a business card, and an address, you could get a wholesale discount. These guys would travel from show to show, selling new stock.
Naturally, brick & mortar retailers screamed bloody murder, and the distributers clamped down. Now, there are few basement-type retailers any more. And you know the hobby shops won't support a local show unless it's a huge show like Springfield or they're members of the organization hosting the show.
So what you have a left are a lot of "junk dealers"...retailers selling used stuff, mostly in the larger scales. They certainly outnumber the new dealers at every small show I go to.
And I haven't even touched on how the internet is bleeding the local train shows dry...
Still, train shows make money for me as a dealer, and for me as a member of a hosting group. I don't make a living at it. Heck, I don't even get paid. But it helps out the non-profits, and for them/us, that's still a good deal.
Paul, a few specific comments.
How big is the Amherst show? 3 of the four GSMTS events each year are in the main building at the Maryland state fair grounds - 3-1/2 acres under roof.
The GSMTS has only a small area of S, O gauge and large scale, it is almost exclusively HO and N.
As I said in my general reply, trains shows have never been a major source for me.
I know quite well about a the basement dealers of the past - I managed a train department in a brick and mortar store - but that is largely gone.
I do think the internet has changed the way people shop, and in the case of the GSMTS, the retail store of www.modeltrainstuff.com is literally 10 minutes from this show - they have not been a vendor there for a long time.......