Is it me or is there a shortage of high quality HO passenger cars on the market? I searched high and low this morning for a CN Heavy Weight Passenger car. checked Walthers, checked Branchline, checked Ebay and called a couple of LHS' and Nada. What I found was there seems to be a shortage right across the board. Is Walthers, Branchline and Rapido the only high quality affordable manufacturer of cars?
http://www.trainboard.com/railimages/showgallery.php?cat=500&ppuser=5959
If one could roll back the hands of time... They would be waiting for the next train into the future. A. H. Francey 1921-2007
It seems that it is always feast or famine when it comes to full size passenger cars. And, right now, it appears to be famine. Hopefully, for your sake, one or more of our Canadian friends will chime in with some suggestions for finding the CN cars at their LHS.
Rich
Alton Junction
The line of Branchline freight and passenger cars are now Atlas so,roll your dice on a release date.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
Fergie ... Good to see you.
The Rapido cars are CNR prototype, and you should be good for the post WWII era.
If you care to assemble a craftsman kit, go to the NKP Car Company website. Under Canadian National, they list a 12-1 heayweight sleeper with modernized windows. They also offer 2 streamlined cars I did not know were owned CNR (PS fluted sides cars). There are 2 head end cars that may interest you.
That is just 5 cars under CNR.
GARRY
HEARTLAND DIVISION, CB&Q RR
EVERYWHERE LOST; WE HUSTLE OUR CABOOSE FOR YOU
Unfortunately, we are caught up in the same situation in passenger cars as in freight cars and motive power. On the good news - we are getting MUCH more accurate prototype cars for each railroad. On the bad news - they are all made in limited runs in overseas factories (basically China). For decades we had to deal with some cars that were generic and modified for prototype to fit model curves (Athearn "standards" and MDC "Harrimans") or were cars based on one prototype and painted for every railroad under the sun (Rivarossi/AHM). With the generic cars the manufacturers could keep them in production as long as the public would buy them. With the prototype-based cars the sales are made to the fans of one, or just a few, railroads so the other guys go hungry. So, with tooling costs versus sales, there is a dearth of passenger cars for many railroads or eras. Every modeler wants HIS railroads' cars done ASAP, so there will remain a lot of unsatisfied modelers out there. I am very grateful that my primary road (Union Pacific) had a nice run of cars from Walthers just a couple years ago, but even then there are cars that are desired that weren't produced, so back to kitbashing and converting :-)
Fergmiester Is it me or is there a shortage of high quality HO passenger cars on the market? I searched high and low this morning for a CN Heavy Weight Passenger car. checked Walthers, checked Branchline, checked Ebay and called a couple of LHS' and Nada. What I found was there seems to be a shortage right across the board. Is Walthers, Branchline and Rapido the only high quality affordable manufacturer of cars?
So just how do you get from an inability to find a single CN heavyweight passenger car of indeterminate type to a generalized shortage of heavyweight passenger cars of all types and presumably all road names.? Just checking eBay for Branchline cars revealed quite a few of them. Amazingly, one of them was a CN 12-1 sleeper http://www.ebay.com/itm/Branchline-Canadian-National-12-1-Pullman-Sleeper-Red-Hook-/151196025237?hash=item2333fc4195 . Lemme see. Heavyweight. Check. Passenger car. Check. Canadian National. Check. In kit form no less. For under $30 CDN and it's for sale from a Canadian seller. Of course, if you're looking for a CN coach, and all you can find is a CN sleeper, that's kinda disappointing, but hardly indicative of an across the board shortage of heavyweight passenger cars.
I can find all kinds of passenger cars on eBay alone.
Of course, I never have been able to find a model of the "Oliver Millet", the parlor car used on SP's "Del Monte" until sometime in the very early 60's, so I guess there really is a shortage of high quaility passenger cars.
Andre
While many of us may have a few passenger cars, freight is more fun to operate for most. So, the market for each specific road's passenger cars is somewhat limited.
What I've noticed about the recent passenger car offerings in HO is that I can't run them on my layout. The minimum radius for many of these cars just won't fit on the tight curves many of us HO modelers must use to get much of a layout into our small rooms.
So, many of us aren't in the market for these cars, even if we'd like to be.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
I have collected a number of the Con-Cor Suburban Coaches in both the CP and CN HW sets.
http://www.con-cor.com/HO-1920-1950-Heavyweight-Passenger-Cars.html
These coaches are rated to handle 18" radius curves. The coaches come with interiors and have a 12Volt lighting system.
Like Andre' pointed out, it depends a lot on what you want and what you are willing to pay.
The thing with passenger cars is many were nearly one of a kind. Sure, coaches and some types of sleepers were made on standard plans for lots of roads, over spans of a decade ot so.
But if you really examine the passenger roster of even the largest railroads, you will be amazed at how many cars are unique, or only exist in quanities of two or three or six.
Given the number of different railroads in the history of North America, and nearly 160 years of rail travel, at least 110 of those years in the 80' steel car era, how could the manufacturers even begin to offer all those products? If they could even find correct info on them? Especially to offer them in the current "high quality", high detail RTR versions common today?
Considering how small the market is for any given car - or even whole consist, what has been offered in the last 15 years is actually very impressive.
Yet it still has not put a dent in the list - it is like ripping two pages out of the NYC phone book.
Freight more fun than passenger? Like Patirick Swayze said in Road House "opinions vary". I love passenger cars and trains, and they don't even have to be dead on perfect models of a specific prototype - the real railroads rebuilt, repurposed, redesigned, and reused them endlessly anyway.
The only way a passenger train model is accurate is if you happen to have dated photos and other the detailed info - too intense for me.
Anyway, they may not meet some peoples "high quality" standards, but there are about 200 passenger cars at my house - not rare at all.
And about this radius of curve issue - you all do what you like, but I don'y get settling for 24" or 30" radius curves but "having" to have high detail 85" passenger cars, that then have to be modified and coupled at passenger killing distances like some LIONEL toy?
Sheldon
I was actually surprised at the realtively few offerings of CN passenger cars on ebay. If you're looking for RTR, things are scarce. But even a search for those old Branchline kits shows very little even if you are willing to roll up those sleeves.
Walthers does show lots of Pullmans in stock under various roadnames and configuations. Might look for the correct type, catch it on sale, then strip and paint it for a economical solution.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
FergmiesterIs Walthers, Branchline and Rapido the only high quality affordable manufacturer of cars?
Fergy,
MTH has been making some VERY nice HO passenger cars in the past couple of years. I picked up eight of the ten '40 20th Century Limited cars for my BLI '40 Dreyfuss Hudson and I couldn't be happier. The detailing is quite nice and the LED lighting system developed by MTH to light each car is 2nd to none.
MTH uses a no-hands-on capacitor module for lighting their passenger cars. It takes about a minute for a car to fully charge on the track and about 5 minutes for it to completely discharge, once you remove it from the track. There's NO flickering and NO need to turn each car on or off, or accidentally drain the batteries. And access to the lighting module and interior of the car is just loosening a few screws.
If MTH is smart they will market their lighting system so that it can be retrofitted in passenger cars of other manufacturers. I'll be going to the WGH show here in Cleveland this coming Saturday and I plan on making that suggestion to them, as well as asking if they are planning to release any more 20th Century Limited cars in the future.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
Respectfully to all - the OP's specific request was for a heavy weight passenger car - MTH and Rapido don't make any heavy weight cars?
The ConCor cars Don refered to are very nice - but they are freelanced. Does not seem to be what the OP is looking for.
Athearn is currently taking preorders for CN cars in their line of RTR heavy weights, but they are 72' freelanced shorties of no particular prototype and come with no interiors or lights - they do run well, can be easily upgraded detail wise, and always have nice paintwork. But not "modern" high detail, high accuracy RTR by any measure.
http://www.athearn.com/newsletter/122713/07_RTR_Heavyweight_Pass_Car_122713.pdf
AHM and Branchline have offered CN cars over the years - trick is finding them.
As other have suggested - modeling may actually require building/painting something?
tstage If MTH is smart they will market their lighting system so that it can be retrofitted in passenger cars of other manufacturers. I'll be going to the WGH show here in Cleveland this coming Saturday and I plan on making that suggestion to them, as well as asking if they are planning to release any more 20th Century Limited cars in the future. Tom
Miniatronics has had that for years - pricey - and I don't see MTH being able to do it any cheaper as a seperate item:
http://www.miniatronics.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=M&Product_Code=100-ICL-01&Category_Code=2_8&Product_Count=3
ATLANTIC CENTRALRespectfully to all - the OP's specific request was for a heavy weight passenger car - MTH and Rapido don't make any heavy weight cars?
True...but Fergy asked a generic question about other manufacturers of "high quality HO passenger cars" so that opened up (expanded) the conversation in my eyes.
Just looked, and there are 2 Branchline 12-1 sleepers in CNR listed on eBay. The auctions expire in 20 hours.
Also, eBay has some Rivarossi heavyweight cars in CNR listed.
ndbprrSo why not buy one and repaint it? That is what many of us have done over the years. This doesn't have to be a ready to run hobby .
But if you're an HO scale post-2000 Amtrak era guy, you're sort of out of luck no matter what.
You can get Superliners and Amfleets, but good luck getting locomotives or baggage cars. Or Viewliners.
Tracklayer
Thank You for your responses! I've found them all very enlightening and realized afterwards I should have explained my own personal dilemma in detail before posting. Binder001 hit the nail on the head with his comment, Andre I should have said what I was looking for and Tom thanks for jumping in with your comment as it was also very apres-po.
When I started building "My Empire" I didn't think I'd be going with passenger service except for a RDC or two car consist. However when Rapido started manufacturing CN cars it turned my head and some of the gears started to loosen up... (never a good thing!) As each car became available, and I started hauling longer passenger trains it was apparent the single track mainline and 24" curves had to go! They are now gone and now I find myself into a whole new world of the passenger train, which I know little of.
I do have an assortment of old AHM Heavy Weights but they are crude by to-days standards, to say the least. I do have 3 Branchline Sleepers but because of availability of other heavyweight cars I am restricted (other releases are pending).
What I am looking for specifically and was the reason for my posting this was this: CN did not have Budd Observation/Solarium Cars, what they did, so I'm told, was have a Heavy Weight Observation Car car at the rear of the train consist of Budd cars.
So what I'm looking in particular is a highly detailed, not in brass, green livery heavy weight CN Observation car, which none can be found! Walthers did make them but they are all sold out
FWIW...
MTH is supposed to be producing a line of heavyweights. I don't see any coaches or diners but they may be worth a look when they hit the streets.
They were due in September. http://www.mthtrains.com/sites/default/files/catalog_files/2014_ho_v_1/index.html
Go to page 82/83.
Happy Modeling! Ed
Fergy;
Nice to "hear" from you again! May I make a suggestion. Look for the older Walthers passnger car kits. The ones with the metal sides. They made several versions of Pullman manufactured heavyweight Obs, and these kits are very easily upgraded to "present day" detail with some "sweat equity", ie work.
I've been running the old AHM/IHC heavyweights on my Crescent Limited, but as I find the proper Pullmans for the train, via the Walthers kits, I replace the plastic cars with the Walthers. You may want to check this out. I've paid as much as $30 for one kit, but also as little as $10 for 3 others, that are now a part of the train.
Looking for OOP kits for specific cars is many times quicker and cheaper than looking for a RTR, that doesn't exsist.
Here's a picture of the Pullman John T Morgan, that no one yet except Walthers had made. Its a 12 sect Pullman with 4 separate wash/rest/bath rooms, 2 at each end.
The door at the nerest end appears bent, but I can assure you that its not. It has, however come loose from the end, and needs to be fixed. The roof can also come off so later I can add an interior, and can get rid of those frosted windows. That tells me the car doesn't have an interior yet.
Carey
Keep it between the Rails
Alabama Central Homepage
Nara member #128
NMRA &SER Life member
gmpullman FWIW... MTH is supposed to be producing a line of heavyweights. I don't see any coaches or diners but they may be worth a look when they hit the streets. They were due in September. http://www.mthtrains.com/sites/default/files/catalog_files/2014_ho_v_1/index.html Go to page 82/83. Happy Modeling! Ed
I will do my best to inquire about that with the MTH rep, if you'd like. Just let me know what you'd want to know from them. And, if they have some prototypes there at the show of the heavyweights, I'll see if I can take some pics, as well.
What I would like to see is some reliable mid-range heavyweight coaches to build a fleet of commuter cars. I thought the Bachmann cars would fit the bill but their performance is rather poor due to stiff trucks and I've tried to rework them without much luck. Lots of derailments. The only other name that comes to mind is Athearn and their entire line is either Sold Out or Due in August, which means sometime after that. I'm not looking for something high end with a lot of detail. Just something that would look halfway decent and operate reliably.
jecorbett What I would like to see is some reliable mid-range heavyweight coaches to build a fleet of commuter cars. I thought the Bachmann cars would fit the bill but their performance is rather poor due to stiff trucks and I've tried to rework them without much luck. Lots of derailments. The only other name that comes to mind is Athearn and their entire line is either Sold Out or Due in August, which means sometime after that. I'm not looking for something high end with a lot of detail. Just something that would look halfway decent and operate reliably.
Athearn blue box kits can always be found on Ebay. The new RTR cars are the same as the older kits - and Athearn sells the newer, nicer metal wheelsets for drop in replacement of the older metal/plastic combo wheels.
And the Athearn cars can be easily detailed just enough to make them very nice. You might have to get into painting and lettering......
What roadname/paint scheme are yo looking for?
Carey nice to see you too! I know it's been awhile but life seems to get in the way on a ongoing basis!
Jecorbet and Sheldon thanks for re-directing me to Athearn. I searched through there site and found what I'm looking for... Unfortunately as Je pointed out, it won't be available until August 2014. So I will probably see it Christmas next year!
Fergie
Fergie, depending on how much work you're willing to do, the old Rivarossi cars can be made into very good representations of many CNR cars. I have done quite a few for a very good friend who is a CN modeller.
The Rivarossi Pullman observation is a decent stand-in for several CN cars, and can be modified into very close copies using parts from New England Rail Services and Precision Scale.
While it's not a car commonly seen in most CNR trains, their Mountain Observation cars can be done using the Rivarossi coach:
While this car was done for my own free-lance road, it's loosely based on CN's Parlour/Buffet car "Amethyst". It's a Rivarossi Pullman, with parts from NERS to alter the windows:
Another car from the Rivarossi coach, an Express Horse car, is a fairly straightforward conversion, :
You should be able to find used Walthers or Branchline coaches on-line, and while they may not be CN cars, most in Pullman Green could be re-lettered. Otherwise, you may need to re-paint. Otherwise, the Rivarossi Pullman can be converted into several variations of CNR coaches using New England Rail Services windows - they come in several styles and sizes. Additional underbody detail is also available from them and Precision Scale.
Wayne
Fergie,
2. The shades of green used by the two manufacturers may be substantially different; if that is the case, and it bothers you, but the 72 foot length does not, you could get a complete set of Athearn cars.
Jerry
ATLANTIC CENTRAL jecorbett What I would like to see is some reliable mid-range heavyweight coaches to build a fleet of commuter cars. I thought the Bachmann cars would fit the bill but their performance is rather poor due to stiff trucks and I've tried to rework them without much luck. Lots of derailments. The only other name that comes to mind is Athearn and their entire line is either Sold Out or Due in August, which means sometime after that. I'm not looking for something high end with a lot of detail. Just something that would look halfway decent and operate reliably. Athearn blue box kits can always be found on Ebay. The new RTR cars are the same as the older kits - and Athearn sells the newer, nicer metal wheelsets for drop in replacement of the older metal/plastic combo wheels. And the Athearn cars can be easily detailed just enough to make them very nice. You might have to get into painting and lettering...... What roadname/paint scheme are yo looking for? Sheldon
ATLANTIC CENTRAL Athearn blue box kits can always be found on Ebay. The new RTR cars are the same as the older kits - and Athearn sells the newer, nicer metal wheelsets for drop in replacement of the older metal/plastic combo wheels. And the Athearn cars can be easily detailed just enough to make them very nice. You might have to get into painting and lettering...... What roadname/paint scheme are yo looking for? Sheldon