UP bashing

[Anonymous]

personally, i am sick of reading thread after thread bashing the Union pacific Railroad from people who have no facts, but like to pretend they do. many many members have been chased off this forum due to the constand childish whining. logo licensing hapens all the time, but since someone is stil acting like a 5 year old because the UP "took" their favorite railroad, they just cant let it go.

[Anonymous]

UP isn't my Favorite thing but I'm very sick of a Flame war everytime theres a topic about UP

[garr]

UP protecting their logo is just good business sense--just wish UP upper management had this good of business sense in the areas that really matter when running a railroad.

Jay

[Anonymous]

I don't like UP's recent licensing practices, and feel they are detrimental to both our hobby and UP's public image, but there is very little we as model railroaders can do about it. Sad to say, this is how the world works these days - goodwill is not a concept recognised by big business.

In my opinion, the bashing (and especially the flame wars) are getting a little boring and are not helping the hobby. On the other hand, if people want to talk about this, I respect their right to do so - the forums are intended to be a free platform to discuss these matters. Just my view on the situation - apologies if I have inadvertantly caused offence as none is intended!

[cacole]

Absolutely -- I think it's time for the forum moderator to step in and delete or lock these topics. Enough is enough, and this topic has been beaten into the ground over and over. I don't even bother reading them anymore, since no one has anything new to contribute.

[Anonymous]

I'm sick of this, I have no use for UP but flaming isn't a good way to prove a point.

[Anonymous]

It's time for the forum moderator to BAN such threads.

And/or the people who start them.

People think the ATLAS FORUM is bad about such threads ???

This forum takes the prize !

At least on the Atlas forum the arguments usually have some INTELLIGENCE behind them.

And moderators who DO THEIR JOBS.

But I don't care.

This forum is not worth my time.

I have outgrown it.

First, I want a forum that is a good resource for learning new things about this hobby. That resource is not here.

Second, I want a forum that makes me enjoy the hobby, not one that turns me off to the hobby like this one.

And thrid, I don't have either the time nor patience for the childish behavior allowed to continue ad nauseam on this forum.


When (if) some of you grow up and realize you want to grow in the hobby, you might try some of the more advanced forums, such as the one on the Atlas website.

If you do, I'll see you and the other Atlas castaways there in August.

But I won't be back here.

Goodbye.

- Dr. George Bailey

[Anonymous]

Yeah, I agree with George. Isn't there a business forum on Yahoo! or something this can be discussed? I don't model the UP, but NS uses UP and CSX power on its line sometimes, so I might buy a UP locomotive or two in the future. But, you know what, I buy the expensive Atlas and Kato locomotives, and an extra 5 bucks really doesnt mean a lot to me when I already pay 75-110 bucks. But, I use forums to learn things and see other peoples things, not discuss proper business practices. See ya!

Matt

[Big_Boy_4005]

QUOTE: Originally posted by cacole

Absolutely -- I think it's time for the forum moderator to step in and delete or lock these topics. Enough is enough, and this topic has been beaten into the ground over and over. I don't even bother reading them anymore, since no one has anything new to contribute.

Yes, there have probably been too many UP topics in the last few months, but locking them is not the answer. UP's actions have brought this kind of attention on themselves. This is news for railfans and modelers, even if UP isn't their favorite railroad. People are angry and need to vent. It will die down when everyone has said their piece.

I didn't really even notice or care until the announcement of the law suit against Lionel and Athearn, then I was insensed. I still have my opinion, but I don't feel the need to share it every time someone else brings the subject up. When people stop responding to these topics, people won't write them anymore, it's as simple as that. Ignore them completely and they will go away.

The problem is that someone always wants to talk about this. If you don't like it, say nothing !!! Complaining only perpetuates it.[:(][:(!][V]

P.S. For those threatening to leave the forum over this, please take a step back. Who are you trying to punish by your actions??? Certainly it is NOT the people writing the topics. Why cut off your nose to spite your face? Relax!!! ignore!!! You'll lower your blood pressure and feel better.[:0][:D]

[dave9999]

QUOTE: Originally posted by gbailey

It's time for the forum moderator to BAN such threads.

And/or the people who start them.

People think the ATLAS FORUM is bad about such threads ???

This forum takes the prize !

At least on the Atlas forum the arguments usually have some INTELLIGENCE behind them.

And moderators who DO THEIR JOBS.

But I don't care.

This forum is not worth my time.

I have outgrown it.

First, I want a forum that is a good resource for learning new things about this hobby. That resource is not here.

Second, I want a forum that makes me enjoy the hobby, not one that turns me off to the hobby like this one.

And thrid, I don't have either the time nor patience for the childish behavior allowed to continue ad nauseam on this forum.


When (if) some of you grow up and realize you want to grow in the hobby, you might try some of the more advanced forums, such as the one on the Atlas website.

If you do, I'll see you and the other Atlas castaways there in August.

But I won't be back here.

Goodbye.

- Dr. George Bailey

Dr. Bailey,
I'm going to have to take a defensive stand on this.
With the exception of a few isolated threads (you know the ones), this is a
very good forum for information and learning. There are some intellegent,
helpful and well informed people here whose opinion and advice I welcome.

But for you to put down the entire forum because of the few "bad apple" topics
and members is not right.

You have to weed out the nonesense and find the constuctive. It's here, it just
gets buried sometimes.

You have been a welcomed contributor and I hate to see you go, as I'm sure
others will as well. Don't let a few ruin it for all. Dave

[Big_Boy_4005]

Exactly Dave, I just added that part to my previous post while you were typing.

[brothaslide]

Here's a simple solution. There are 3 forums under the MR forum; create a 4th forum specifically for UP issues. People seem to like to talk about it. Make a place for them to go - everyone's happy.

[grandpopswalt]

If you have a strong negative opinion regarding this matter you owe it to yourself to keep on "bashing" the UP for it's actions. They have the Legal right to do this but what's being questioned is the ethics of their decision.
Where else can you voice your opinion about this matter that will have an audience that is as in tune with the issue as on a railroading forum? What we're doing is trying to mold public opinion by presenting our side of the argument. If we're persuasive and persistent enough we may be able to get the UP to reconsider their decision.

Walt

[dave9999]

QUOTE: Originally posted by grandpopswalt

If you have a strong negative opinion regarding this matter you owe it to yourself to keep on "bashing" the UP for it's actions. They have the Legal right to do this but what's being questioned is the ethics of their decision.
Where else can you voice your opinion about this matter that will have an audience that is as in tune with the issue as on a railroading forum? What we're doing is trying to mold public opinion by presenting our side of the argument. If we're persuasive and persistent enough we may be able to get the UP to reconsider their decision.

Walt

Grandpop,
It's just become a little redundant. This has been kicked and beaten until it's
black and blue. There are umpteen topics on this matter and it seems a new
one pops up everyday.

The whole thing just causes bad blood. I really have no opinion on the subject,
but I do have a concern for the integrity of this forum, as I enjoy spending time
here and communicating with the members. Dave

[rayhippard]

Hi everyone ! Not all real railroads are like the UP ! I am a member of the GREAT NORTHEN RAILWAY HISTORICAL SOCIETY and the Burlington Northern RR donated a historically significant SD 45 engine to us several years ago and DM&IR RR helped us to maintain and store it untill we found a permanent home. THIS SHOWS EXCELLENT PUBLIC RELATIONS THAT THE UP COULD LEARN FROM IF THEY WERE INTERESTED. This shows that it's the people running the business and not the basic railroads fault. That said, I would encourage everyone to join the Railroad Society that represents your favorite railroad. The cost per year ( $25 for GNRHS ) is small but pays big dividends for you with newsletters, reference booklets, conventions and great comeraderie between members. You can find a list for these in MR magazine and I think also on their web site. I hope this helps you all to enjoy our hobby more than you have been and will bring new information for your favorite railroad.

Ray

[Anonymous]

It's all about the all mighty "dollar".

[simon1966]

It is not exactly difficult to NOT click on a topic that is of no interest. Unlike the Yahoo groups type e-mail forums when the messages come to you regardless of interest.

[CP5415]

It's time for everyone who has a problem with what Union Pacific is doing to protect their company logo GET OVER IT!!!!!!!!
Why continue to drag on about something that should have been over months ago!
If you don't like what UP went & did, SWITCH TO A DIFFERENT RAILROAD TO MODEL!!!
WHAT EVER HAPPENED TO "HOW DOES THIS WORK?" & "WHAT DOES ONE DO TO FIX THIS?"

Gordon

[Anonymous]

If a thread doesn't interest me, I just don't click on it, simple as that.

[tomwatkins]

Yes, I think enough is enough. Right now there are 6 posts on the first page of the "Model Railroader" forum about the UP and it's corporate behavior. The hard truth is that it's their logo and they can do with it as they will. Flaming, for or against, isn't likely to change anyone's opinion. Nor is it likely to help anyone become a better model railroader . It's a hobby, and it's supposed to something we do for fun.
Tom Watkins

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by NightCrawler

personally, i am sick of reading thread after thread bashing the Union pacific Railroad from people who have no facts, but like to pretend they do. many many members have been chased off this forum due to the constand childish whining. logo licensing hapens all the time, but since someone is stil acting like a 5 year old because the UP "took" their favorite railroad, they just cant let it go.

[#ditto][#ditto][#ditto][#ditto][#ditto]

[sigh]

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Hi everyone ! Not all real railroads are like the UP ! I am a member of the GREAT NORTHEN RAILWAY HISTORICAL SOCIETY and the Burlington Northern RR donated a historically significant SD 45 engine to us several years ago and DM&IR RR helped us to maintain and store it untill we found a permanent home. THIS SHOWS EXCELLENT PUBLIC RELATIONS THAT THE UP COULD LEARN FROM IF THEY WERE INTERESTED

what about the dozens and dozens of locomotives, freight cars, and cabooses that the Union Pacific has donated to museums??????? what about the ongoing UP steam program??

i dont see any other railroads doing that.

[Anonymous]

The topic of Union Pacific has now gotten stale to me. To the point I have decided to restrain my urge to fire up the airbrush until the factory paint falls off my Union Pacific models. When I do they will be repainted GN, BN, or BNSF depending on what railroad owned what. I have taken a close look at my modeling options lately and might go with the Milwuakee Road as my interchange road.

James.

[CP5415]

Nightcrawler:

CP has an on going steam program. Remember 2816?
While she's not as big as 844 or 3985, she is a corporate steam locomotive & extremely active, especially this year.
CP has also donated a large quantity of locomotives & rollingstock to museums as well.

Gordon

Gordon

[Anonymous]

Lets put all the UP gripers and supporters in 1 single thread. That way they would have a place to gripe or toot UP's horn, without bothering the rest of the country. (Yes UP fans, there are parts of America that UP is not directly "building") I'd be interested to see how long it takes to overtake the "coffeeshop" thread!!![(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D]

[Big_Boy_4005]

QUOTE: Originally posted by CP5415

Nightcrawler:

CP has an on going steam program. Remember 2816?
While she's not as big as 844 or 3985, she is a corporate steam locomotive & extremely active, especially this year.
CP has also donated a large quantity of locomotives & rollingstock to museums as well.

Gordon

Gordon

Yes Gordon, it's hard to forget 2816 after last weekend. At least CP isn't as childish as UP about the licensing.[swg]



By the way, UP has every LEGAL right to do what they are doing. The question is, is it RIGHT, ethicly and morally. I say no.[V]

The logo is only worth what people are willing to pay, and from what we have seen here, there are a lot of people who are NOT willing to pay more. The most sickening part of UP's claim is on the fallen flags. They should have no rights there. The courts will decide!!!! In the meantime they should focus on delivering freight, and quit crashing trains, and leave their fans in peace. Those suggestions would all be good for business.[B)][:0][}:)][;)]

[Anonymous]

I stopped back here briefly to vote after getting an email that there is a poll about the ridiculous UP threads. Seems like most people get it but there are a few that still don't or can't understand the objections.

This has NOTHING to do with the issue some people have with UP. I realize that for some this has proven to be the defining issue of their lives. Others simply have strong feelings about it. No question they deserve to make their voice heard & this forum is the proper place to speak out.

However, the objections to "UP bashing" here are generally aimed at those who feel the need to begin a new topic after new topic rather than following the accepted and normal forum behavior in which one continues the conversation in an existing thread rather than everyone starting their own thread. Little to nothing new is offered in each of these newly posted threads, except for those who have posted polls comparing the management of UP with Saddam Hussein, or speculating they will be hauled off in handcuffs because of some alleged criminal activities. (I'd be careful making charges like that which could result in lawyers showing up at your door..)

This need of some to start a new thread everytime UP triggers a synapse in their mind is what I termed childish and I stand by that. It is as silly as starting a daily ground-foam topic. I appreciate that there are children on the boards, but there is no need to act childish.

I personally could care less about UP or if there is a Never-ending UP Thread. I came here for the modelling info, and yes, we all know we can ignore the daily UP threads. But flooding the forums with nearly identical threads serves no purpose except to annoy, which I suppose is the intent. Either that or some simply don't understand the concept of "threads."

Wayne

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by marcmr

Yeah, I agree with George. Isn't there a business forum on Yahoo! or something this can be discussed? I don't model the UP, but NS uses UP and CSX power on its line sometimes, so I might buy a UP locomotive or two in the future. But, you know what, I buy the expensive Atlas and Kato locomotives, and an extra 5 bucks really doesnt mean a lot to me when I already pay 75-110 bucks. But, I use forums to learn things and see other peoples things, not discuss proper business practices. See ya!

Matt

[#ditto] What's an extra $5 if you're already paying close to $200.00? And yes, the bashing has to stop![:(!]

[Anonymous]

Too bad the smiley list doesn't have a face that doesn't cry like a baby.
If you kmow what I mean?
BNSF railfan.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by 4884bigboy
What's an extra $5 if you're already paying close to $200.00?

Hmmm.... if NS did this tommarow I'd be paying around $300 a year for stuff (not all MR) that I would wind up paying for, about three or four are engines, thats 20 plus book, photos, ect. , I'd wind up paying $30 or $40 more, might not sound like a lot to most of you but I can hardly afford this hobby, also, $5 adds up over time, you might wind up paying hundreds, maybe thousands extra over time.