Originally posted by vsmith OH COME ON GUYS!!! Do any of you take these polls seriously? I don't take these polls seriously at all. The amazing thing is that this forum boasts 124,297. registered members. I can probably count on my fingers and toes and maybe someone else's fingers and toes the people(OK and maybe another set of fingers and toes) who actively participate. I have only been active in his hobby for a little over a year. Prior to meeting my boyfriend, I'm going to admit to you hear in writing, that I probably wasn't even aware that model railroading existed as a hobby prior to two years ago. So with limited experience and obviously being a women, I don't for a moment believe that 26% model z scale. The z scale people just did a better job of voting. Numbers can be skewed by the people who vote and BY THOSE WHO DON'T. Even if half of the 124,297 participated or 62,149 are actively acttually lurking around on this forum, only 1738 or 2% actually took the time to vote. I don't read much into these polls because I tend to very much be an independent thinker and don't much follow the crowd. Some of us have had great experiences in clubs and some haven't. Even though my first experience wasn't great, that's not to say that I might not choose to join another in the future. I don't think newcomers will be frightened off model railroading by this poll or that. On the polls and threads posted, people give both points of view. But it is for us to decide which is best for us. It's a very hard thing to post on a forum because you are exposing yourself to verbal tangles with others.This can be very intimidating. I know it was for me. Let's face it, when someone posts on a forum, we can't hear the tone of voice, intonation or see the body language or facial features. But, as I said in another thread somewhere else, what makes American great (and Canada, too) is that we can agree to disagree. I think you are all a bunch of great guys with great opinions and differences of opinions. And I hope we keep exchanging them. Hope everyone has a great Labor Day. I know I will, I'll be laboring at the restaurant. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, August 31, 2003 3:58 PM Originally posted by vsmith OH COME ON GUYS!!! Do any of you take these polls seriously? I don't take these polls seriously at all. The amazing thing is that this forum boasts 124,297. registered members. I can probably count on my fingers and toes and maybe someone else's fingers and toes the people(OK and maybe another set of fingers and toes) who actively participate. I have only been active in his hobby for a little over a year. Prior to meeting my boyfriend, I'm going to admit to you hear in writing, that I probably wasn't even aware that model railroading existed as a hobby prior to two years ago. So with limited experience and obviously being a women, I don't for a moment believe that 26% model z scale. The z scale people just did a better job of voting. Numbers can be skewed by the people who vote and BY THOSE WHO DON'T. Even if half of the 124,297 participated or 62,149 are actively acttually lurking around on this forum, only 1738 or 2% actually took the time to vote. I don't read much into these polls because I tend to very much be an independent thinker and don't much follow the crowd. Some of us have had great experiences in clubs and some haven't. Even though my first experience wasn't great, that's not to say that I might not choose to join another in the future. I don't think newcomers will be frightened off model railroading by this poll or that. On the polls and threads posted, people give both points of view. But it is for us to decide which is best for us. It's a very hard thing to post on a forum because you are exposing yourself to verbal tangles with others.This can be very intimidating. I know it was for me. Let's face it, when someone posts on a forum, we can't hear the tone of voice, intonation or see the body language or facial features. But, as I said in another thread somewhere else, what makes American great (and Canada, too) is that we can agree to disagree. I think you are all a bunch of great guys with great opinions and differences of opinions. And I hope we keep exchanging them. Hope everyone has a great Labor Day. I know I will, I'll be laboring at the restaurant. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 1:45 PM Interesting discussion with valid points. I think polls on sites are meant to be indicative of the opinion of the people who visit that site AND participate. Their not supposed to represent the opinions of everyone in the hobby which the site represents. (I think I repeated what everyone else said.) Anyways, an issue was presented. What are the options and/or solutions? Do polls need disclaimers added that they are neither scientific nor representative of the overall hobby? CNN has a disclaimer on their polls: QUOTE: CNN Disclaimer This QuickVote is not scientific and reflects the opinions of only those Internet users who have chosen to participate. The results cannot be assumed to represent the opinions of Internet users in general, nor the public as a whole. That would take care of people on other sites referencing polls on this site to support their discussions. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 1:45 PM Interesting discussion with valid points. I think polls on sites are meant to be indicative of the opinion of the people who visit that site AND participate. Their not supposed to represent the opinions of everyone in the hobby which the site represents. (I think I repeated what everyone else said.) Anyways, an issue was presented. What are the options and/or solutions? Do polls need disclaimers added that they are neither scientific nor representative of the overall hobby? CNN has a disclaimer on their polls: QUOTE: CNN Disclaimer This QuickVote is not scientific and reflects the opinions of only those Internet users who have chosen to participate. The results cannot be assumed to represent the opinions of Internet users in general, nor the public as a whole. That would take care of people on other sites referencing polls on this site to support their discussions. Reply Edit cacole Member sinceJuly 2003 From: Sierra Vista, Arizona 13,757 posts Posted by cacole on Friday, September 12, 2003 10:28 AM Personally, I've never really seen any value to these on-line polls, because they are always going to be skewed one way or another. For example, my posting of this message -- I have been passing over this particular thread for at least two weeks and never bothered to read any of the comments. I usually don't bother with any of the polls unless one happens to be on a subject that I have a particular interest in because I have experience in that area or am looking for information about a product that is being discussed. As others have very well pointed out, poll results are, and always will be, unreliable and must be looked at with a jaundiced eye, especially a controversial topic such as, "What scale is best?" There is no BEST scale! I would prefer 1:1, but have to model in HO because I can't afford to own a real railroad, N and Z are too small for my eyes, and S, O, and larger scales are too expensive. Reply cacole Member sinceJuly 2003 From: Sierra Vista, Arizona 13,757 posts Posted by cacole on Friday, September 12, 2003 10:28 AM Personally, I've never really seen any value to these on-line polls, because they are always going to be skewed one way or another. For example, my posting of this message -- I have been passing over this particular thread for at least two weeks and never bothered to read any of the comments. I usually don't bother with any of the polls unless one happens to be on a subject that I have a particular interest in because I have experience in that area or am looking for information about a product that is being discussed. As others have very well pointed out, poll results are, and always will be, unreliable and must be looked at with a jaundiced eye, especially a controversial topic such as, "What scale is best?" There is no BEST scale! I would prefer 1:1, but have to model in HO because I can't afford to own a real railroad, N and Z are too small for my eyes, and S, O, and larger scales are too expensive. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, September 12, 2003 4:33 PM I held a poll in my house to see if MR polls were worthwhile. here's what the public had to say. My son was out, my wife told me to 'sod off' (1 abstention), 4 of the cats had no comment, while the other two agreed to vote with me for a small bribe. I like the comments in the polls which interest me, and how many other voters follow my train of thought (geddit) on a particular subject . So there we have it, a resounding 3-0 for the MR polls. Jon(is the tin of tuna fi***ax deductable)Grant Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, September 12, 2003 4:33 PM I held a poll in my house to see if MR polls were worthwhile. here's what the public had to say. My son was out, my wife told me to 'sod off' (1 abstention), 4 of the cats had no comment, while the other two agreed to vote with me for a small bribe. I like the comments in the polls which interest me, and how many other voters follow my train of thought (geddit) on a particular subject . So there we have it, a resounding 3-0 for the MR polls. Jon(is the tin of tuna fi***ax deductable)Grant Reply Edit Bergie Member sinceJanuary 2001 From: US 1,431 posts Posted by Bergie on Friday, September 19, 2003 11:08 AM Here's the new disclaimer that will appear at the bottom of all of our polls from here on out: Polls on Trains.com are not scientific and reflect only the opinions of the users who have chosen to participate. The results cannot be assumed to represent the opinions of Internet users in general, the readers of our magazines, nor the public as a whole. Bottom line, our polls are meant for fun and to stimulated conversation amongst our forum users. They're meant for fun and to stimulate conversation. Remember, it's a poll, NOT a survey. Big difference. I don't think anyone is intentionally trying to mislead beginners. Take them for what they're worth. [:)] Erik Erik Bergstrom Reply Bergie Member sinceJanuary 2001 From: US 1,431 posts Posted by Bergie on Friday, September 19, 2003 11:08 AM Here's the new disclaimer that will appear at the bottom of all of our polls from here on out: Polls on Trains.com are not scientific and reflect only the opinions of the users who have chosen to participate. The results cannot be assumed to represent the opinions of Internet users in general, the readers of our magazines, nor the public as a whole. Bottom line, our polls are meant for fun and to stimulated conversation amongst our forum users. They're meant for fun and to stimulate conversation. Remember, it's a poll, NOT a survey. Big difference. I don't think anyone is intentionally trying to mislead beginners. Take them for what they're worth. [:)] Erik Erik Bergstrom Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, September 19, 2003 3:11 PM Me and the cats agree 100% Jon, Sparky and Boswell Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, September 19, 2003 3:11 PM Me and the cats agree 100% Jon, Sparky and Boswell Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, September 20, 2003 12:39 AM Polls are just for fun!If you're influenced by polls you obviously need to get a life or some backbone.They're just a chance for someone to express what they think ,and move on.Errors in polls?,These polls are open to who ever wishes to chime in,where's the science in that?As in ALL polls ,you minipulate the questions to get the answer you want ,just check the liberal news media to verify this.How could any poll ever be accurate?While not a poll,here's an example as to how to twist data:Two cars are in a race,one from the USA,one from Russia.The USA wins the race,in the US it's reported that USA was first,Russia second.In Russia it's reported that the USSR was second and the USA next to last,you can skew anything! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, September 20, 2003 12:39 AM Polls are just for fun!If you're influenced by polls you obviously need to get a life or some backbone.They're just a chance for someone to express what they think ,and move on.Errors in polls?,These polls are open to who ever wishes to chime in,where's the science in that?As in ALL polls ,you minipulate the questions to get the answer you want ,just check the liberal news media to verify this.How could any poll ever be accurate?While not a poll,here's an example as to how to twist data:Two cars are in a race,one from the USA,one from Russia.The USA wins the race,in the US it's reported that USA was first,Russia second.In Russia it's reported that the USSR was second and the USA next to last,you can skew anything! Reply Edit CNJ831 Member sinceApril 2001 From: US 3,150 posts Posted by CNJ831 on Saturday, September 20, 2003 7:51 AM Coalfired - I'd have to speculate that half the readers of these pages don't understand the difference between figures derived from a poll and those resulting from a survey. You'll also note that the figures being seriously quoted in the media re the gov. race in CA are being called polls, not surveys, and are purported to have considerable accuracy. Confusing, no? So never give the understanding of the public mind too much credit. Likewise, if polls have no statisical significance whatever (and they don't but note that some of MR's polls have been quoted as supposed fact on other boards!) why post a poll to begin with? Why not simply post a question and ask for comments, like most posters do? You should get the same responses and that way no one can be misled. I think MR's statement that they will include a disclaimer with all future polls postings is the correct thing to do. JB Reply CNJ831 Member sinceApril 2001 From: US 3,150 posts Posted by CNJ831 on Saturday, September 20, 2003 7:51 AM Coalfired - I'd have to speculate that half the readers of these pages don't understand the difference between figures derived from a poll and those resulting from a survey. You'll also note that the figures being seriously quoted in the media re the gov. race in CA are being called polls, not surveys, and are purported to have considerable accuracy. Confusing, no? So never give the understanding of the public mind too much credit. Likewise, if polls have no statisical significance whatever (and they don't but note that some of MR's polls have been quoted as supposed fact on other boards!) why post a poll to begin with? Why not simply post a question and ask for comments, like most posters do? You should get the same responses and that way no one can be misled. I think MR's statement that they will include a disclaimer with all future polls postings is the correct thing to do. JB Reply 12 Subscriber & Member Login Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more! Login Register Users Online Jackflash see all » Search the Community ADVERTISEMENT ADVERTISEMENT ADVERTISEMENT Model Railroader Newsletter See all Sign up for our FREE e-newsletter and get model railroad news in your inbox! Sign up
Originally posted by vsmith OH COME ON GUYS!!! Do any of you take these polls seriously? I don't take these polls seriously at all. The amazing thing is that this forum boasts 124,297. registered members. I can probably count on my fingers and toes and maybe someone else's fingers and toes the people(OK and maybe another set of fingers and toes) who actively participate. I have only been active in his hobby for a little over a year. Prior to meeting my boyfriend, I'm going to admit to you hear in writing, that I probably wasn't even aware that model railroading existed as a hobby prior to two years ago. So with limited experience and obviously being a women, I don't for a moment believe that 26% model z scale. The z scale people just did a better job of voting. Numbers can be skewed by the people who vote and BY THOSE WHO DON'T. Even if half of the 124,297 participated or 62,149 are actively acttually lurking around on this forum, only 1738 or 2% actually took the time to vote. I don't read much into these polls because I tend to very much be an independent thinker and don't much follow the crowd. Some of us have had great experiences in clubs and some haven't. Even though my first experience wasn't great, that's not to say that I might not choose to join another in the future. I don't think newcomers will be frightened off model railroading by this poll or that. On the polls and threads posted, people give both points of view. But it is for us to decide which is best for us. It's a very hard thing to post on a forum because you are exposing yourself to verbal tangles with others.This can be very intimidating. I know it was for me. Let's face it, when someone posts on a forum, we can't hear the tone of voice, intonation or see the body language or facial features. But, as I said in another thread somewhere else, what makes American great (and Canada, too) is that we can agree to disagree. I think you are all a bunch of great guys with great opinions and differences of opinions. And I hope we keep exchanging them. Hope everyone has a great Labor Day. I know I will, I'll be laboring at the restaurant. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 1:45 PM Interesting discussion with valid points. I think polls on sites are meant to be indicative of the opinion of the people who visit that site AND participate. Their not supposed to represent the opinions of everyone in the hobby which the site represents. (I think I repeated what everyone else said.) Anyways, an issue was presented. What are the options and/or solutions? Do polls need disclaimers added that they are neither scientific nor representative of the overall hobby? CNN has a disclaimer on their polls: QUOTE: CNN Disclaimer This QuickVote is not scientific and reflects the opinions of only those Internet users who have chosen to participate. The results cannot be assumed to represent the opinions of Internet users in general, nor the public as a whole. That would take care of people on other sites referencing polls on this site to support their discussions. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 1:45 PM Interesting discussion with valid points. I think polls on sites are meant to be indicative of the opinion of the people who visit that site AND participate. Their not supposed to represent the opinions of everyone in the hobby which the site represents. (I think I repeated what everyone else said.) Anyways, an issue was presented. What are the options and/or solutions? Do polls need disclaimers added that they are neither scientific nor representative of the overall hobby? CNN has a disclaimer on their polls: QUOTE: CNN Disclaimer This QuickVote is not scientific and reflects the opinions of only those Internet users who have chosen to participate. The results cannot be assumed to represent the opinions of Internet users in general, nor the public as a whole. That would take care of people on other sites referencing polls on this site to support their discussions. Reply Edit cacole Member sinceJuly 2003 From: Sierra Vista, Arizona 13,757 posts Posted by cacole on Friday, September 12, 2003 10:28 AM Personally, I've never really seen any value to these on-line polls, because they are always going to be skewed one way or another. For example, my posting of this message -- I have been passing over this particular thread for at least two weeks and never bothered to read any of the comments. I usually don't bother with any of the polls unless one happens to be on a subject that I have a particular interest in because I have experience in that area or am looking for information about a product that is being discussed. As others have very well pointed out, poll results are, and always will be, unreliable and must be looked at with a jaundiced eye, especially a controversial topic such as, "What scale is best?" There is no BEST scale! I would prefer 1:1, but have to model in HO because I can't afford to own a real railroad, N and Z are too small for my eyes, and S, O, and larger scales are too expensive. Reply cacole Member sinceJuly 2003 From: Sierra Vista, Arizona 13,757 posts Posted by cacole on Friday, September 12, 2003 10:28 AM Personally, I've never really seen any value to these on-line polls, because they are always going to be skewed one way or another. For example, my posting of this message -- I have been passing over this particular thread for at least two weeks and never bothered to read any of the comments. I usually don't bother with any of the polls unless one happens to be on a subject that I have a particular interest in because I have experience in that area or am looking for information about a product that is being discussed. As others have very well pointed out, poll results are, and always will be, unreliable and must be looked at with a jaundiced eye, especially a controversial topic such as, "What scale is best?" There is no BEST scale! I would prefer 1:1, but have to model in HO because I can't afford to own a real railroad, N and Z are too small for my eyes, and S, O, and larger scales are too expensive. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, September 12, 2003 4:33 PM I held a poll in my house to see if MR polls were worthwhile. here's what the public had to say. My son was out, my wife told me to 'sod off' (1 abstention), 4 of the cats had no comment, while the other two agreed to vote with me for a small bribe. I like the comments in the polls which interest me, and how many other voters follow my train of thought (geddit) on a particular subject . So there we have it, a resounding 3-0 for the MR polls. Jon(is the tin of tuna fi***ax deductable)Grant Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, September 12, 2003 4:33 PM I held a poll in my house to see if MR polls were worthwhile. here's what the public had to say. My son was out, my wife told me to 'sod off' (1 abstention), 4 of the cats had no comment, while the other two agreed to vote with me for a small bribe. I like the comments in the polls which interest me, and how many other voters follow my train of thought (geddit) on a particular subject . So there we have it, a resounding 3-0 for the MR polls. Jon(is the tin of tuna fi***ax deductable)Grant Reply Edit Bergie Member sinceJanuary 2001 From: US 1,431 posts Posted by Bergie on Friday, September 19, 2003 11:08 AM Here's the new disclaimer that will appear at the bottom of all of our polls from here on out: Polls on Trains.com are not scientific and reflect only the opinions of the users who have chosen to participate. The results cannot be assumed to represent the opinions of Internet users in general, the readers of our magazines, nor the public as a whole. Bottom line, our polls are meant for fun and to stimulated conversation amongst our forum users. They're meant for fun and to stimulate conversation. Remember, it's a poll, NOT a survey. Big difference. I don't think anyone is intentionally trying to mislead beginners. Take them for what they're worth. [:)] Erik Erik Bergstrom Reply Bergie Member sinceJanuary 2001 From: US 1,431 posts Posted by Bergie on Friday, September 19, 2003 11:08 AM Here's the new disclaimer that will appear at the bottom of all of our polls from here on out: Polls on Trains.com are not scientific and reflect only the opinions of the users who have chosen to participate. The results cannot be assumed to represent the opinions of Internet users in general, the readers of our magazines, nor the public as a whole. Bottom line, our polls are meant for fun and to stimulated conversation amongst our forum users. They're meant for fun and to stimulate conversation. Remember, it's a poll, NOT a survey. Big difference. I don't think anyone is intentionally trying to mislead beginners. Take them for what they're worth. [:)] Erik Erik Bergstrom Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, September 19, 2003 3:11 PM Me and the cats agree 100% Jon, Sparky and Boswell Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, September 19, 2003 3:11 PM Me and the cats agree 100% Jon, Sparky and Boswell Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, September 20, 2003 12:39 AM Polls are just for fun!If you're influenced by polls you obviously need to get a life or some backbone.They're just a chance for someone to express what they think ,and move on.Errors in polls?,These polls are open to who ever wishes to chime in,where's the science in that?As in ALL polls ,you minipulate the questions to get the answer you want ,just check the liberal news media to verify this.How could any poll ever be accurate?While not a poll,here's an example as to how to twist data:Two cars are in a race,one from the USA,one from Russia.The USA wins the race,in the US it's reported that USA was first,Russia second.In Russia it's reported that the USSR was second and the USA next to last,you can skew anything! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, September 20, 2003 12:39 AM Polls are just for fun!If you're influenced by polls you obviously need to get a life or some backbone.They're just a chance for someone to express what they think ,and move on.Errors in polls?,These polls are open to who ever wishes to chime in,where's the science in that?As in ALL polls ,you minipulate the questions to get the answer you want ,just check the liberal news media to verify this.How could any poll ever be accurate?While not a poll,here's an example as to how to twist data:Two cars are in a race,one from the USA,one from Russia.The USA wins the race,in the US it's reported that USA was first,Russia second.In Russia it's reported that the USSR was second and the USA next to last,you can skew anything! Reply Edit CNJ831 Member sinceApril 2001 From: US 3,150 posts Posted by CNJ831 on Saturday, September 20, 2003 7:51 AM Coalfired - I'd have to speculate that half the readers of these pages don't understand the difference between figures derived from a poll and those resulting from a survey. You'll also note that the figures being seriously quoted in the media re the gov. race in CA are being called polls, not surveys, and are purported to have considerable accuracy. Confusing, no? So never give the understanding of the public mind too much credit. Likewise, if polls have no statisical significance whatever (and they don't but note that some of MR's polls have been quoted as supposed fact on other boards!) why post a poll to begin with? Why not simply post a question and ask for comments, like most posters do? You should get the same responses and that way no one can be misled. I think MR's statement that they will include a disclaimer with all future polls postings is the correct thing to do. JB Reply CNJ831 Member sinceApril 2001 From: US 3,150 posts Posted by CNJ831 on Saturday, September 20, 2003 7:51 AM Coalfired - I'd have to speculate that half the readers of these pages don't understand the difference between figures derived from a poll and those resulting from a survey. You'll also note that the figures being seriously quoted in the media re the gov. race in CA are being called polls, not surveys, and are purported to have considerable accuracy. Confusing, no? So never give the understanding of the public mind too much credit. Likewise, if polls have no statisical significance whatever (and they don't but note that some of MR's polls have been quoted as supposed fact on other boards!) why post a poll to begin with? Why not simply post a question and ask for comments, like most posters do? You should get the same responses and that way no one can be misled. I think MR's statement that they will include a disclaimer with all future polls postings is the correct thing to do. JB Reply 12 Subscriber & Member Login Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more! Login Register Users Online Jackflash see all » Search the Community ADVERTISEMENT ADVERTISEMENT ADVERTISEMENT Model Railroader Newsletter See all Sign up for our FREE e-newsletter and get model railroad news in your inbox! Sign up
QUOTE: CNN Disclaimer This QuickVote is not scientific and reflects the opinions of only those Internet users who have chosen to participate. The results cannot be assumed to represent the opinions of Internet users in general, nor the public as a whole.