I am researching DCC systems and am still running DC for now. I run 1 locomotive on a shelf layout. I don't attend a club due to time and other constraints. I would prefer walk around or wireless capabilities. HO scale. So my question is: which one to go with? I do have a smartphone so could use that for wireless. I've looked in to NCE DCC and MRC but please share your thoughts.
My short answer is NCE, not MRC. But I suggest you review the almost countless posts on this forum discussing this question on ad nauseum. go to the "Searth the Community" box on the right han side of the page and type a search phrase such as "Entry level DCC." But go to the bathroom and pour a fresh cup of coffee first. There will be a lot to read.
DCC - focus on and choose from NCE or Digitrax.
Non DCC - want be on the leading edge using wireless control from smartphone or any bluetoothLE capable device -- Contact BlueRail Trains
RR Baron
NCE PH-Pro 5 amp wireless.
All of your dreams will come true.
Rich
Alton Junction
If you are only running one loco, what will DCC give you. Sound could be a factor, but as a DCC user myself, I would have a hard time convincing myself to change to DCC if I was running your current system in DC
brakeman618,
I would go with NCE over MRC any day.... And I use Digitrax!
DCC go with either NCE or Digitrax systems, only.
NCE has one comes with walk around, so does Digitrax. But, if you chose Digitrax, I would suggest the Zephyr Xtra, with a add-on hand held throttle.
NCE I am not as familiar with, so will leave the suggestions of their systems to those with more experience.
Out of curiosity, why were you looking to switch to DCC? Are you looking at expanding soon? Want sound? These answers would help us suggest better systems, but for now, until further info is given, my recommendation is stated above.
Ricky W.
HO scale Proto-freelancer.
My Railroad rules:
1: It's my railroad, my rules.
2: It's for having fun and enjoyment.
3: Any objections, consult above rules.
NCE Power Cab starter system. It can be upgraded as your layout gets larger.
Or Google 'Dead Rail' for battery powered, radio controlled trains if you are going to stay with one engine.
Hey guys, there is not much in the above replies that will be of value to the OP. As usual this question has got the usual NCE vs Digitrax debate, and dismiss MRC out of hand. You should really give him some pros and cons of each.
As far as I know Digitrax entry level walk around is the Super Empire Builder at $283.99. How is this superior to the MRC Prodigy at $139.99, or the NCE Powercab at $155.99?
Remember this is someone new to DCC, has a (presumably) small layout, and is not a member of a club.
If you gave both Digitrax and MRC systems to someone completely new to DCC to try, there is a good chance that they would actually prefer MRC!
Cheers
Bill
bagal Hey guys, there is not much in the above replies that will be of value to the OP.
Hey guys, there is not much in the above replies that will be of value to the OP.
The OP says he prefers walk around or wireless capabilities. He has looked into NCE and MRC. He asks, which one to go with. My reply says to choose the NCE PH-Pro 5 amp wireless. How is that not of value to the OP? I told him which one to go with. Shall we all write essays on the pros and cons of each?
How is your reply more helpful by indicating that if you gave him both Digitrax and MRC to try that he would actually prefer MRC? What is the basis for your assertion? Shouldn't you give him some pros and cons of each?
Bill:
They might indeed prefer MRC - at first. Then, once they have a little time under their belts, if someone was to hand them an NCE PowerCab, they might wish they had spent their money differently.
Sorry, I'm stirring the pot.
First, I have to say that I have only actually operated the NCE PowerCab system with tethered throttle so I'm not claiming to be an expert by any means.
When I was deciding on which system I would buy several years ago I narrowed it down to a beginner system, either Digitrax or NCE, by simply reading reviews. When I was ready to part with my money I went to The Credit Valley Railway store in Mississauga, Ontario and looked at the NCE PowerCab system and a basic Digitrax system. I can't remember which one.
What struck me immediately was the difference in throttle layouts. I immediately felt comfortable with the NCE set up and display, whereas the Digitrax boggled my mind. It appeared to be a bunch of identical buttons and the display was inferior, IMHO. I have to explain that I am all thumbs by nature. Manual dexterity was never a strong point. Forget trying to learn how to play a guitar (I tried)!
That pretty much eliminated the possibility of buying a Digitrax system for me. However, what I personally found daunting about the Digitrax system thousands of other people have been fine with. I'm not saying that Digitrax is a bad product at all!
Here are the things I find good about my NCE PowerCab:
- I have read that some systems require a booster to program some decoders. The PowerCab has been able to program every decoder I have purchased.
- I understand that some systems cannot read back CV values (MRC?). NCE does it just fine.
- Programming decoders is intuitive, at least for me.
- The throttle layout makes sense. I also like the different acceleration/deceleration options.
- The PowerCab is a self contained system. Everything comes in one package. I didn't have to worry about which power pack to buy etc.
- The PowerCab is easily expandible. If I ever get so brave (or foolish), I can have a dozen or more sound locos all running at the same time by going to a bigger NCE system. More importantly I think is that the basic PowerCab system is quite capable of running 3 or 4 sound locomotives right out of the box. Other basic systems may boast more amperage but the PowerCab has plenty of power, especially if you are running a switching layout.
I can't speak to the wireless aspect which the OP mentioned as a possible consideration, other than to say that it is available.
Hope this helps the OP a bit.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Rich, the point I am trying to make is that people dis MRC but don't provide any sound reasons why. Most of the reasons often given against MRC have little relevance eg, people don't like their marketing systems, or don't like that MRC doesn't support JMRI. These aren't really relevant to a newby who is likely to be perfectly happy with MRC. I know people who are.
Regards
I have no experience with MRC, never owned one, never operated one.
But I have owned an NCE PH-Pro 5 amp wireless system for almost 12 years now, and it has performed trouble free. It has a user friendly throttle and operates tetherless, although a tether cable can be added for wired operations if you prefer.
The NCE system supports other DCC features as well, including stationary decoder functions for operating turnouts and signals and for automatic routing which is ideal for passenger stations and classification yards. The NCE system is totally compatible with other electronic components such as auto-reversers, circuit breakers, and occupancy detectors.
He also says he has a wireless phone that could be used as a throttle. That means JMRI and an appropriate interface for whatever system.
SO walkaround wireless control does NOT need a PH-Pro Wireless system, or a Digitrax Super Empire Builder Radio system. PowerCab and interface + JMRI on his computer, or a Zephyr Xtra and interface + JMRI an he has wireless walkaround control.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
rrinker He also says he has a wireless phone that could be used as a throttle. That means JMRI and an appropriate interface for whatever system. SO walkaround wireless control does NOT need a PH-Pro Wireless system, or a Digitrax Super Empire Builder Radio system. PowerCab and interface + JMRI on his computer, or a Zephyr Xtra and interface + JMRI an he has wireless walkaround control. --Randy
Let's say that he has the NCE PH-Pro system, but not wireless. If someone uses a smart phone and JMRI, do you use the smart phone as the throttle or the Pro Cab?
So My initial reasoning for DCC is sound. I know BLI sells DC and DCC compatible locos and I wonder what is the best way to run it? Is it best to bite the big expense now to possibly expand the layout later? I guess I really only see myself running one loco at a time but still would benefit from wireless. Thanks for the input so far...
If sound is important and future expansion is in the offing, then making the move makes sense. I use Digitrax, and have a control panel. But it sounds like NCE would be a good fit for your needs.
brakeman618 So My initial reasoning for DCC is sound. I know BLI sells DC and DCC compatible locos and I wonder what is the best way to run it? Is it best to bite the big expense now to possibly expand the layout later? I guess I really only see myself running one loco at a time but still would benefit from wireless. Thanks for the input so far...
If you only run a single locomotive on a small layout, it seems difficult to justify DCC. But, if you are willing to incur the expense now with the thought of a larger layout later, why not. Chances are, as soon as you install DCC, you will want to run more than one locomotive simply because you can.
richhotrain rrinker He also says he has a wireless phone that could be used as a throttle. That means JMRI and an appropriate interface for whatever system. SO walkaround wireless control does NOT need a PH-Pro Wireless system, or a Digitrax Super Empire Builder Radio system. PowerCab and interface + JMRI on his computer, or a Zephyr Xtra and interface + JMRI an he has wireless walkaround control. --Randy I have to plead ignorance to that concept since I don't have a smart phone, and I don't use JMRI. Let's say that he has the NCE PH-Pro system, but not wireless. If someone uses a smart phone and JMRI, do you use the smart phone as the throttle or the Pro Cab? Rich
I have to plead ignorance to that concept since I don't have a smart phone, and I don't use JMRI.
Both. And the limits of JMRI and wireless routers generally exceed those of any DCC system, or certainly the practical limits of any DCC system (does it matter if a system can support 1024 cabs, when if you were actually running that many locos/consists the lag for controlling them would be unbearable?), you can have others come over and join as well. ANyone with an APple or Androind smartphone can run the approriate app and connect via wifi (does not use phone minutes or data plan) and operate a train. You can mix and match - someone with a tethered ProCAB can run one train, maybe you have two wireless ProCABs, they can each run a train, and 5 friends with smartphones can run 5 more trains. Nothing special needed - just the computer interface for your DCC system, for PH-PRO, a USB to serial adapter, for PowerCAB the NCE USB, for Digitrax a PR3 or LocoBuffer-USB, etc., JMRI software, and a wireless router, which you probably already have if you have some sort of internet connection. The phones and tablets being used don;t even have to be activated for cellular service, so you can use an old one. Sometimes there are cheap Android phones available for as little as $30 with no contract for cellular service - they work fine as wireless throttles, and you can't beat the price. Cheaper than even the most basic cabs from NCE and Digitrax and MRC. Of course, not everyone likes a touch interface so it's not for everyone.
Thanks, Randy.
For what the OP has, the Crest Electronics' Train Engineer would be sufficient -- wireless control of a DC layout.
The very basic Crest system is a module that connects between a power pack and track, to allow wireless control of speed and direction of a DC locomotive.
MRC has a reputation for lack of expandability. Their older sound decoders are well known for being "problematic" and not very realiable.So unfortunately they have a bad rep.IF you were going to go walk around, I would go with either NCE or Digitrax.If you have an old spare windows PC around, and you connect it to a wireless network you can run JMRI with the handheld throttle app (accesible from your smart phone) (You will have to buy the computer interface made by NCE or Digitrax)My old club used NCE. And unfortunately we had nothing but problems with burned out boosters and broken off throttle antennas. The throttles were just poorly designed as they weren't very serviceable. The boosters might have been a wiring issue we could never track down, but breakers never tripped. Everything was properly grounded with #12 wire. So I'm suspect of the cause.
Don - Specializing in layout DC->DCC conversions
Modeling C&O transition era and steel industries There's Nothing Like Big Steam!
cacoleFor what the OP has, the Crest Electronics' Train Engineer would be sufficient -- wireless control of a DC layout.
Uhhh no. -
brakeman618So My initial reasoning for DCC is sound...
I don't think Crest Electronics' Train Engineer is going to give him control of sound.
CSX Robert cacole For what the OP has, the Crest Electronics' Train Engineer would be sufficient -- wireless control of a DC layout. Uhhh no. - brakeman618 So My initial reasoning for DCC is sound... I don't think Crest Electronics' Train Engineer is going to give him control of sound.
cacole For what the OP has, the Crest Electronics' Train Engineer would be sufficient -- wireless control of a DC layout.
brakeman618 So My initial reasoning for DCC is sound...
It can do sound. I Googled it but pricey.
If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.
If the OP wants to run ONE DC loco, the Digitrax Zephyr would be nice. Annoying motor buzz but it can be done. Motor does get hot when the loco is sitting still though. Yeah, opened another can of worms.
Choices.
bagal Remember this is someone new to DCC, has a (presumably) small layout, and is not a member of a club. If you gave both Digitrax and MRC systems to someone completely new to DCC to try, there is a good chance that they would actually prefer MRC.
If you gave both Digitrax and MRC systems to someone completely new to DCC to try, there is a good chance that they would actually prefer MRC.
Actually, the OP won't choose the MRC System... He stated he wants to use a JMRI WiThrottle, so MRC, which does not support JMRI, is already ruled out by the OP.....
So, I stick by my suggestion of Digitrax Zephyr Xtra, with a Locobuffer, so he can use the WiThrottle through JMRI, and be able to expand later on. No need to spend big $$$ on a wireless throttle, or even a tethered throttle, as the WiThrottle will give him the wireless walk around throttle on his (presumed) already owned smart phone/tablet. If, the OP decides, later on as part of the expansion, he can add in an extra throttle (or two).
I am not knowledgable on NCE systems, so will defer to others on them, but they will also work with JMRI.
ricktrains4824 So, I stick by my suggestion of Digitrax Zephyr Xtra, with a Locobuffer, so he can use the WiThrottle through JMRI, and be able to expand later on. No need to spend big $$$ on a wireless throttle, or even a tethered throttle, as the WiThrottle will give him the wireless walk around throttle on his (presumed) already owned smart phone/tablet. If, the OP decides, later on as part of the expansion, he can add in an extra throttle (or two).
ricktrains4824 >> Actually, the OP won't choose the MRC System... He stated he wants to use a JMRI WiThrottle, so MRC, which does not support JMRI, is already ruled out by the OP..... >>
>>
After enough complaints, possibly by reading the forums here and the number of times anyone who has done DCC for a long time said to skip MRC because it doesn;t support JMRI MRC gave in, and JMRI now has support for MRC.
What I still don;t like about MRC is their complete lack of information. Those ads they rean featuring a club that used MRC - I really would love to know how they did it, since there is little to no technical information on expanding the system to club-size in the manuals. Sure, the manual is simple, and common instructions are on the back of the throttle - not that any of the others couldn;t do the same, because the basic operations like selecting and running a train are simple with ALL systems, and nearly identical, except for what the label might be on the button you push. Some say "select", some say "loco", etc. You can download the manuals for all the major systems. MRC's is the smallest. Sure, it's simple - but the problem is they don;t tell you anything past the basics. All the others have a quick start section at the front of the manual PLUS all the technical details you might want to know after becoming familiar with basic operation.
The real gotcha? When you do want to expand for a larger layout, there's only a brief mention in the MRC manual about needing powered cab jacks. No one else hides the fact that after the wires get long enough and/or you have enough cabs plugged in, you need to supplant the power in the cab bus because you can only draw so much current through thin telephone wires. And most charge about $15 for each extension jack. MRC's are like $40. And MRC uses what should be, in this day of everything networked, much more common (and therefore less expensive) RJ45 jacks for their throttle bus. The 6P6C jacks used by Digitrax and NCE are relics of the analog office phone days and hardly used anywhere else these days - I have a box ful of Loconet cables I snagged over 7 years ago when we ripped out our analog phone system and went IP phone. I snagged a phone and took it apart but there weren't too many useful and easily salvaged parts so i ended up just saving all the wall cords. Sure, you cna get them from numerous sources, but standard Ethernet jacks should be cheaper.
And there is a whole other ball of wax with their sound decoders..
I have been using MRC Prodigy DCC since 2004 with no complaints.
Bob Bochenek
The assumption has to be a smaller layout. If he is just busting into DCC I would go with the digitrax Zephyr extra. Street price can be as low as under $125, used even less and there is expandability. Not a lot lost if later he wishes to move out to walk-around as his empire grows. Walk-around seems a bit silly on a small road in a small space. The zephyr can be relegated to program track use and testing much later if the walk around becomes important on a bigger layout.
Richard
If I can't fix it, I can fix it so it can't be fixed