Hello All,
For my switchers I use 14 steps, for the rest of the diesels I use 28 steps and for the steam engine I use 128 steps.
Go figure!
The switchers; a 70-tonner and a 44-tonner, react better on 14 steps while doing switching chores.
The consist of three GP30's run well with 28 steps as does the consist of four GP40's. There is also a single GP40 and a GP38-2 that work well at this same setting along with the F7B and RS-11 used on the snowplow train. The F7A-B-B-A consist runs just fine on 28 steps too. Excellent low speed performance!
The steam loco, a USRA 0-6-0, has better low-speed and mid-range performance on 128 steps.
All of my locos have had CV's 2, 3, 4, 5 & 6 manipulated; starting voltage, acceleration, deceleration, max speed and mid-range respectively.
Mid-range is calculated by the average sum of the starting voltage setting and the max speed setting (e.g. GP40: CV 2 @ 20 + CV 5 @ 255 = 275 ÷ 2 = [137.5] CV 6 @ 138).
Hope this helps.
"Uhh...I didn’t know it was 'impossible' I just made it work...sorry"
Thanks Robert. So, what about light and sound control ? I'm assuming you also have to set up the mu'd engine(s) whether they are to respond to certain functions or not ? Don't want the horn on both units blowing, or don't want the headlights to be on the second unit.
My ESU system does this automatically - de-activates bell, horn and lights on all non-lead units (although this can be over-rided if desired). See my edit above for other reasonings ....
Mark.
¡ uʍop ǝpısdn sı ǝɹnʇɐuƃıs ʎɯ 'dlǝɥ
Mark R.Ok - say I want to consist 123 and 456 with 123 in the lead. I would obviously be using POM to do this correct ?
Correct, you would be using Ops mode programming, which many refer to as "Programming On the Main" You could move the locos to the program track and program them there, but there would be no reason to do that unless they do not support Ops mode programming.
Mark R.So, under its own power, I couple 123 to 456. So then I access 456 and enter 123 in CV19. (?)
Correct, if they are facing the same direction. If you want them facing opposite directions, then you would program CV19 in 456 to 251 (123+128, adding 128 to the consist address tells this loco to run in the opposite direction).
Mark R.Then they will both respond to address 123 ?
Correct.
Mark R.What if I'm dealing with 4-digit addresses ? - can't enter anything higher than 127 in CV19 can you ?
Correct, you can not use an address higher than 127 as a consist address. Just pick an address, it doesn't have to be the address of one of the engines in the consist. For example, I have locomotives 8700 and 8703 that I usually run together, so I use consist address 87. I program one to 87 and the other to 215 (87 + 128) because I run them back to back.
CSX Robert Mark R. ...As soon as I select a consist, the screen automatically changes to 128 speed steps .... nothing I can do about it. Well there is something you can do about it. You can program the consist address manually, then select the address like you would a standalone engine and run it using 28 speed steps.
Mark R. ...As soon as I select a consist, the screen automatically changes to 128 speed steps .... nothing I can do about it.
Well there is something you can do about it. You can program the consist address manually, then select the address like you would a standalone engine and run it using 28 speed steps.
Ok - say I want to consist 123 and 456 with 123 in the lead. I would obviously be using POM to do this correct ?
So, under its own power, I couple 123 to 456. So then I access 456 and enter 123 in CV19. (?) Then they will both respond to address 123 ?
What if I'm dealing with 4-digit addresses ? - can't enter anything higher than 127 in CV19 can you ?
(Edit) - Ok, I just read through this ....
https://sites.google.com/site/markgurries/home/technical-discussions/consisting-information/nmra-dcc-consisting
What I prefer to do is not do-able. The ESU system creates consists within the command station complete with on-screen icons that show me which engines are consisted together and which direction they are facing, so I can easily select the consist I want to run. I prefer this method as it gives me a visual of what I have configured. I just wish it didn't default to 128 speed steps for consists as I normally prefer to run in 28 speed steps with my wireless push-button throttles .... 128 steps require too many button pushes.
Mark R....As soon as I select a consist, the screen automatically changes to 128 speed steps .... nothing I can do about it.
I normally run my engine on 28 speed steps, however, when I set up a consist using my ESU EcoS system, the consist automatically transmits 128 speed steps. I've even contacted the manufacturer, and there's no way to change it.
When running single engines, the touch screen displays 28 steps. As soon as I select a consist, the screen automatically changes to 128 speed steps .... nothing I can do about it.
Like Robert said - there is no difference between the command station sending 128 speed step commands to short address 10 and sending 128 speed steps to consist address 10. The command station does not know that address 10 is a consist or not (well, it does keep track, at least with NCE, because it also aliases the decoder's actual address - which still respods to function commands when in CV19 consist, btw). It is the decoder that decides which address to respond to - the address in CV1, or in CV17/18, based on the setting of CV29, OR the address in CV19. The command station has zero to do with this. If your consist address are only getting sent 28 speed steps, it's because you have configured the command station to send 28 steps to that address.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
DigitalGriffin...The throttle may say 0-127, but in reality consist was invented before 128 steps was a standard feature...
I don't remember which came first, advanced consists or 128 speed steps, but it doesn't really matter. When the command station is sending commands to an advanced consist, all it's really doing is sending the commands to a primary ("2-digit") address, which it can do using 14, 28, or 128 speed steps and the loco will respond appropriately as long as it supports the speed steps and is configured correctly.
If you use the command station functions to build an advanced consist and select and run that consist, then it may vary from command station to command station as far as what speed steps it uses. Regardless of how the command station wants to handle it, you can always program CV19 manually and just select the consist address as you would any other address and run it using whatever speed steps you want.
I may have to call you guys on the 28 speed steps in advanced consist mode.The throttle may say 0-127, but in reality consist was invented before 128 steps was a standard feature. As engines may be mixed and matched, (You can run 14/28 and 128 step engines on the same layout) they default to the greatest common speed (28 steps)
I'll look at the track signal protocol tonight and tell you.
Don - Specializing in layout DC->DCC conversions
Modeling C&O transition era and steel industries There's Nothing Like Big Steam!
Yes, quite impressive - it even had traction control. There was an air operated variable resistor controlling the main generator excitation so even if you yanked the throttle from stop to full, the loco wouldn;t take off an yank out the drawbars or spin its wheels, it still accelerated smoothly. Not that it was recommened to run them this way and rely on all that, but smooth easy starts were much easier than with other locos. Only problem - it was a LOT more complicated than the others, and complicated things with many pieces that can break are not welcome around railroads. Details here: http://baldwindiesels.railfan.net/throttle/index.html
rrinker Baldwin diesel air throttles have a lot more than 8 notches as well. I say 'have' because there are still some running with the original Baldwin prime movers. --Randy
Baldwin diesel air throttles have a lot more than 8 notches as well. I say 'have' because there are still some running with the original Baldwin prime movers.
That's true too, and Loksound's file for the Baldwin has additional notches (14 I believe) to smooth out the transitions. They weren't actually a notched throttle, but an air throttle that behaved like that of the throttle in your car with an almost infinite adjustment. That's why the additional notches in the Loksound decoder, to try and smooth out the steps so they weren't as distinct - kinda tough to create on a digital device.
7j43k Mark R. If you think about it, real engines only have eight notches, not 128 ! Oh, really?: Ed
Mark R. If you think about it, real engines only have eight notches, not 128 !
If you think about it, real engines only have eight notches, not 128 !
Oh, really?:
Ed
Oh yeah .... well .... I only run diesels, so I forgot to take steam into consideration - totally different animal in that regard !
CSX Robert DigitalGriffin You don't get an option when you advanced consist. It's 28 speeds steps or nothing if I recall correctly. Nope, an advanced consist can be run with 14, 28, or 128 speed steps.
DigitalGriffin You don't get an option when you advanced consist. It's 28 speeds steps or nothing if I recall correctly.
Nope, an advanced consist can be run with 14, 28, or 128 speed steps.
My ESU EcoS system dfaults to 128 speed steps for a consist and there's no way to change it to anything else.
DigitalGriffinYou don't get an option when you advanced consist. It's 28 speeds steps or nothing if I recall correctly.
You don't get an option when you advanced consist. It's 28 speeds steps or nothing if I recall correctly.
But I think 128 speed steps should be used. Especially when doing switching operations.
Odd man out. 1024 speed steps on my Rail Pro. With a dash of momentum it is a delight. No sensation of steps at all. Smoooooth across the full range.
Alan
Freelancing the LK&O Railroad
Yes, everything should work with 14 speed steps as long as you set CV29 correctly. Remember, the option in CV29 is for 14 steps or 28/128 - there is no decoder configuration change for 28 vs 128, that distinction is strictly from the command station side. A 14 step DCC packet is slightly different in format, so the decoder needs to be told which type to expect, the older 14 speed step version, or the newer 28/128 version.
On the NCE systems, you can throttle to 14 steps, but if CV29 is not programmed for 14 steps, funny things happen.
Rich
Alton Junction
maxman JoeinPA If you want to experiment with 28 or 14 speed steps It has been my understanding that operating in 14 speed step mode causes difficulties with some functions or operations of decoders.
JoeinPA If you want to experiment with 28 or 14 speed steps
It has been my understanding that operating in 14 speed step mode causes difficulties with some functions or operations of decoders.
As long as both the decoder and command station are configured for 14 steps, the functions all work correctly.
I use the DB150 for the Digitrax Super Empire Builder model with two DT400's (Gawd, but I love that throttle!!!) So, I'm always using 128, and I wouldn't have it any other way. I programme each locomotive with lots of value in both CV's 3 and 4. I can zip dial my throttle all the way up to 60 or something, reach for my coffee, and just enjoy the agonizing acceleration for the next 30 seconds or more.
It's hard to drink from a cup and grin at the same time. Ever tried it?
Yes it does with some. But some of the older decoders (MRC, etc) will work. With the newer decoders on 28 steps I have found that step one on my DT400r is 3 clicks or more while with 128 they respond to 1 click.
Joe
JoeinPAIf you want to experiment with 28 or 14 speed steps
NP
If you want to experiment with 28 or 14 speed steps you can use your Zephyr to "Status Edit" so that the command station will send 28 or 14 speed dteps to a particular locos decoder. This is covered in your Zephyr manual and is handy for locos that have decoders that won't use the higher speed steps. You can also set your Zephyr to broadcast 28 or 14 speed steps to all locos but I wouldn't recommend it.
My Digitrax Zephyr is set to 128 speed steps? I guess I learn something new every day. I really don't care that real diesels had only 8 notches. I feel it's more important to have realistic speed than realistic throttles. Control is key for me.
NP 2626 "Northern Pacific, really terrific"
Northern Pacific Railway Historical Association: http://www.nprha.org/
Digitrax, 128 speed steps, I prefer slow geared steam speeds.
"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination."-Albert Einstein
http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/
Some very well known modellers use 14 speed steps with LOTS of momentum. If you think about it, real engines only have eight notches, not 128 !
I tried it once myself, and while it did take a bit of getting used to, the realism far surpassed that of having full control of 128 steps with minimum momentum. Try it .... you might be surprised at how you really have to improve your handling of your train. Another realistic aspect is that with sound engines set to 14 speed steps, the engine notches up with each speed step - even more realistic !
I prefer the 128 speed steps, the reason being, if I have more than one train running, I can fine tune them so that "ne'er the twain shall meet".
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."