ran a non-DCC loco on NCE PHR system

[cacole]

I was in on the original NMRA DCC development.  Back then, the cheapest decoder you could find cost $75, so the NMRA decided to include the ability to run a non-decoder equipped locomotive on address Zero by stretching the command signal bit to allow a motor to run on the positive or negative pulse of the DCC signal.

I foresaw problems and potential damage to some motors by allowing this to be part of the NMRA DCC Standards and Recommended Practices, but it was incorporated.  I still don't think it should have ever been allowed.

In my opinion, NCE's choice to not incorporate this "feature" was a very wise decision.  You should either run DCC or stick with DC, but don't try to mix them or you're letting yourself in for overheated motors and other problems, such as the runaway trains that users sometimes mention on these forums.

With decoders costing only $12 each in lots of 10 from NCE, there's really no reason to try running a DC motor on DCC through gimmickry.

[Vail and Southwestern RR]

I'm a bit surprised that two minutes would fry it, but it sounds like it might have. I'd try it (on DC obviously) again now that it's cooled off. Even though the NCE system doesn't support operation of a DC loco, the potential for damage is the same on any DCC system, even the ones that do support DC operation. Based on some tests that some folks have done on various forums, most modern locos can handle more sitting still on the DCC rails than the model railroader can handle the noise!

[Oakhurst Railroad Engineer]

Just hooked up my new Digitrax system to my existing DC layout.  I have tested and it works well and passes the quarter test for shorts. I have one DCC sound locomotive and will be converting most of my other locomotives to DCC over the coming months.  The DC locomotives work well, but they do "sing" loudly when not running.  I use the old DC block switches to turn off power to the DC locomotives whenever they are not running.  I can park the DCC locomotive(s) in the engine house the same way.

So, I'm able to run the DC locomotives (one at a time) and things are going well so far with the Digitrax technology.

Marty

 

[retsignalmtr]

The Digitrax system you exchanged for the NCE does support running DC loco's on DCC. You just can't leave the loco's on a powered track when not running them. It is nice to be able to do that when you can't afford to put in a decoder, have too many loco's to convert them all at once, or it is too difficult for you to do it yourself. I have my empire builder system for four years and still run analog loco's on it. You could still return the NCE and wait for the Digitrax to come in. I did have a problem once when I left a loco on a powered track. The motor heated up and siezed the motor so it wouldn't move. When it cooled down it ran ok thereafter.

[Motley]

I guess I'll chalk this up as one of my newbie lessons! Expensive lesson, $100 loco. I'm starting from scratch here, I bought the loco for testing purposes with a small DC power supply, it was cheaper than buying everything DCC right off the bat.

I was in the store yesterday, and I saw the new Athearn D&RGW SD50s, so I'm gonna get that next week and have them install a Tsunami for me.

[simon1966]

locoi1sa

I still can't figure out why someone would buy a $500 to $600 dollar system and not a $16 decoder.

 Perhaps he did not want to, or couldn't?  I have DC locos that I will never bother to convert, they are too old and would be a real chore, due to their design.  But they hold some sentimental value to me and I do like to run them occasionally, which is how I use the DC support on DCC that comes with my Digitrax system.

[locoi1sa]

 NCE does not support running a non decoder equipped locomotive. That is one of the questions that needs to be asked before purchasing a system. I still can't figure out why someone would buy a $500 to $600 dollar system and not a $16 decoder. I put decoders in all my locos before I bought my system and ran on DC until all the non decodered locos were converted. 

  In the beginning of the manual NCE wants you to set up a test track before hooking the system to your layout to get a feel of the system. Step #5 of the quick start guide. Place a DCC equipped locomotive on the test track. Select loco #3 and on and on.

  If we had warnings for every possible thing that could go wrong then we would not be able to muddle through life.

         Pete

[simon1966]

Too bad Caboose hobbies did not have that 2nd DT402 in stock. 

[pajrr]

You most likely fried the motor. You tried to operate a DC motor on AC, just like hooking a Lionel transformer to your track. Next time you turn on ANY piece of electrical equipment and it makes a funny noise, do yourself a favor and turn it off right away and  investigate to save yourself a headache. I had a guy come into the store who fried 4 HO locomotives by trying to run them with a Lionel ZW. One at a time he put each one on the track and watched it fry. I would have stopped after the first one when the thing started smoking. He then came into the store saying his locomotives AND TRACKS "must have gone bad while in storage, since they worked when he put them away". 

[Motley]

Before I figured out you can't even run a non-DCC loco on the NCE, I put the loco on the track, heard a wherring sound, didn't move, kept it on there about 2 minutes. Well I think I killed my Athearn SD45. It doesn't even run on DC now, it's completely dead. It actually moved a little bit, then finally died.

What do I do now? And why wasn't there a big "WARNING DO NOT RUN YOUR NON-DCC loco with this system" in the manual?

Now what? I guess I can have Caboose hobbies take a look at it, see what got fried.