Looking forward to pics. Been hard to visit this site for weeks, keep timing out.
Hi rrebell,
I owe you an apology. I forgot to respond to your suggestion about using plastic boxes to lower the LED potlights.
My plan is to create one large box which will hold all the potlights that will shine directly onto the layout. They will be 4000k 3" spot lights with a 40° spread. The box will extend about 10" below the main ceiling and it will be shaped similarly to the layout. The bottom of the box will be the same height as the beams that run through it. There will not be individual boxes for each potlight, which I think is what you were suggesting. Correct me if I'm wrong.
The general room lighting will come from 5000k 6" wide beam LED potlights at the height of the original ceiling.
It's a bit difficult to explain. You will understand better when I get some pictures in a few weeks.
Cheers!!
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Hi Simon,
I want the garage to 'pop' when you first step into it. Based on our past experience, the contractor is a master at straight lines and smooth surfaces. When they did our kitchen and dining room they fixed a number of builder's mistakes that were not in the contract. Some of those jobs were not minor. For example, they straightened out the dividing wall between the kitchen and the living room. They had to replace wall studs to fix the problem.
Hiring contractors usually causes great stress. This time I have nothing to worry about.
One other point worth noting is that you pay as the work is done. For a four week job, there is 5% due on signing and then 25% due per week with a final payment upon completion. There is no huge payment up front. They also stay on your project until it is done. They do not try to do a bunch of jobs at the same time.
Dave, I think you are making a wise decision with respect to the drywall. An awfull drywall job really stands out and is a pain to fix.
Simon
Hi John,
Thanks for the kind words. This disease is not going to slow me down. Quite the opposite in fact.
Back to the garage renovation, I finally got the quote for all the drywall and electrical work yesterday. The electrician's portion is about what I expected, but the drywall is a fair bit higher. After consulting with my wonderfully supportive wife, Dianne, we decided to go ahead. Not only will this give me a beautiful train room, but it will enhance the value of the house significantly.
I did not get any other quotes. Some will call me stupid for that but I refuse to take a chance on getting a shoddy job from an unknown contractor. The company that we are using has done a lot of work for us before and their workmanship is absolutely flawless!! For me to say that is amazing. I am a very fussy customer.
Work will begin in 5 - 6 weeks and it will take about a month to complete. All that will be left to do in the garage is the floor, and of course, the layout!
Your perseverance and positive attitude in the midst of your health issues is a great example, Dave.
Sorry I didn't get back right away on your wife's strawberry/rhubarb/custard pie. It sounds fantastic! (I was away for the weekend at a men's retreat. Nothing quite like "How Great Thou Art" being sung a capella by 1200 guys.)
Sending prayers and vibes your way, buddy. Hope you can sense the support of your forum friends.
John
Here is where my health situation sits as of this morning. Feel free to skip it if you are tired of my whining.
I got an update on what is going on with me. After several weeks of being told that I have multiple myeloma, the doctors announced that they don't actually know what is wrong with me! All the initial signs pointed to multiple myeloma, but the bone biopsy came out clean. Several of the recent blood tests have also indicated that there isn't any multiple myeloma in my blood. In other words, they haven't a clue what is causing the irregular bone masses or the low hemoglobin. They are going to do a second bone biopsy on September 23rd, this time taking the sample directly from one of the masses behind my right eye. All we can do while we wait for the results of the second bone scan is monitor my vital signs.
The doctors have to decide whether or not I can go home while we wait for the biopsy. They may decide to keep me in the hospital so they can watch my vital signs which I admit are borderline at the moment.
I've been stuck in the hospital for close to two weeks so I haven't been able to do anything train modeling wise. However things have been happening on a couple of fronts.
The two new cabinets arrived on Wednesday. I ordered them assembled so all I have to do is put the dollies together. The assembly costs were quite reasonable and they eliminated the problem of me having to find someone to do the assembly for me (our nephew is no longer available to help us. He started his career in the Navy on Sept 2nd). The delivery man was quite impressed with my 'man cave' even though it is still a work in progress.
Our contractor let us know that he has finally been able to gather all the numbers together. He will draw up a formal quote this weekend and we should have it by early next week. I am really curious to see the numbers!
I have also contacted a company to get a quote on having the floor refinished with polyaspartic epoxy. I anticipate that the floor will be rather expensive. The parts of it where the previous owners parked their cars in the winter are badly pitted and will require a lot of work to clean them up and fill them in. I didn't realize how bad they were until I was rolling around in.my wheelchair.
I have also made arrangements for getting rid of my train stuff once I am no.longer able to use it. I approached my old train club and offered to donate the entire collection to them in exchange for them getting rid of my layout. They were happy to accept the offer. Hopefully that isn't going to happen any time soon.
The club has had a great deal of success selling donated train collections, so much so that they have been able to make significant donations to local charities. I'm sure they will be able to do the same with my collection.
I want to buy two more storage cabinets for the garage. With two exceptions, I have purchased all the cabinets and shelving units from Uline. At first glance their stuff seems to be expensive, but when you compare them to the lower quality units from Home Depot or Canadian Tire, the prices aren't all that bad.
All of the Uline units are steel. Two of the cabinets were purchased years ago from Home Depot. They are made out of particle board. When I filled one shelf with all my engines ( 24 +-) it started to sag. I guess I should have expected that. As I have said, you get what you pay for.
BATMANGood on ya Dave! We will continue to follow along......at a faster pace, of course.
Mike
hon30critterI will carry on with the layout, and, as I said, I will pick up the pace.
Good on ya Dave! We will continue to follow along......at a faster pace, of course.
"St. Francis of Assisi was hoeing his garden when someone asked what he would do if he were suddenly to learn that he would die before sunset that very day. "I wouldfinish hoeing my garden,“ he replied."
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."
The pace of my layout construction just got a big boost, but not in the best way.
I admitted myself to the hospital this afternoon because I was feeling extremely weak. One of the tests they performed was a CT Scan of my head. Unfortunately they discovered two masses in my right sinuses. They are very likely cancerous and the fact that there are two of them probably means that the cancer has metastised. I had a CT Scan in mid June and nothing showed up then. That suggests that the cancer is spreading rapidly.
It's a bit of a shock but I refuse to let it depress me. I will carry on with the layout, and, as I said, I will pick up the pace.
Please do me a favour and share my attitude by being positive. I hate having people try to console me or ringing their hands in some feeble attempt to make me feel better.
I have spent a lot of time researching LED potlights, mostly on Amazon, and they all have the same thing in common. A significant number of reviewers complained about short life expectancies and/or flickering. The commercial potlights that were installed in our dining room and kitchen nine years ago are all still operating properly. I'm willing to pay for reliability. As the old adage says, you get what you pay for.
I doubt that they will be overpriced. The commercial suppliers have to compete just like everyone else does. The electrician will charge a premium for supplying them, but that's a fact of life.
The type of pot lights that will be used can be really cheap, as little as $5 a peice including box etc. Simple plug connector to box that anyone can change out. Bet you were quoted a bundle for lifetime led's, remember lifetime is as long as the company exists.
Hi betamax,
Thanks for the suggestions.
The ceiling is insulated. To avoid having to deal with the insulation we are putting in a false ceiling. The LED potlights are only about 3/4" thick so they will only lower the ceiling by about 2" including the strapping. We did the same thing in our kitchen and dining room and the difference in height isn't noticeable.
One thing I did specify is that I want commercial quality potlights. I don't want to have to replace potlights every couple of years. The brand the electrician recommended comes with a life time warranty, and they replace all of the potlights when there is a failure, partly to make sure that the colours are all the same, and partly because if one light fails the others are likely to fail soon after. $$$. Oh well.
I will have two separate lighting systems. One will be for general lighting of the garage and the other will be focused specifically on the layout using 40 degree spread spot lights. There will also be dimmable lights mounted under the edge of the layout to illuminate the floor when I'm doing night running.
hon30critter Hi rrebell, Thanks for the suggestion about using plastic to surround the LED potlights. I explored the possibility of using 'plastic' panels to do the entire garage, but the more I read about them, the less enthused I was. Several reviews commented about them tending to warp, and apparently they scratch easily. The contractor has worked with plastic panels in the past but he prefers good old fashioned drywall. He has done drywall work for us in the past and his workmanship is impressive. Cheers!! Dave
Thanks for the suggestion about using plastic to surround the LED potlights. I explored the possibility of using 'plastic' panels to do the entire garage, but the more I read about them, the less enthused I was. Several reviews commented about them tending to warp, and apparently they scratch easily.
The contractor has worked with plastic panels in the past but he prefers good old fashioned drywall. He has done drywall work for us in the past and his workmanship is impressive.
I used LED pot lights in my layout room. I installed them into a suspended ceiling, drywall is similar, you just cut a hole and insert them. Two spring loaded clips hold them in place.
If your ceiling is insulated, there are some rules about that. Ask your electrician. The incandescent ones had to be in a large metal box in that situation.
When you plan the layout for the pot lights, general rules: 2' from the walls, and spacing is half ceiling height. Result is nice even light without shadows. Many people install too few lights. My layout room has about 40 pot lights, on dimmers.
Was not suggesting panels but boxes mounted to the surface to extend the lights down, when painted they blend with the drywall but are faster to do than drywall work and more durable. Maybe I misinterpeted your original need.
If you are building boxes around the LED's it would be best to make box light fixtures out of sheet plastic. Around here it would be quite cheap as there are companies that will cut the parts for projects (they will do the construction too but that would cost way more. You can get bulb extentions if the locals consider the box to need a UL certification to make it work. The plastic would look the same as the drywall if properly painted (we used to take plastic ceiling medalions look like plaster ones with proper paint).
Hi Mike,
I'm not sure that 'straight forward' means 'simple'. Our nephew got a lot done towards fixing all the irregularities in the drywall, but Marlon, the contractor, said there is a lot more to do. At least one of the ceiling panels needs to be replaced because it is sagging, and building the boxes around the pot lights is more complex than simply going from wall to wall.
I can hardly wait to see the quote. I feel like a kid in a candy shop!
Good news on both fronts. Quick to start and likely not so expensive if it's as straight forward as they suggested.
I had the contractor and the electrician at the house Wednesday morning. They both said the project was pretty straight forward. I don't have a quote yet - that will take a couple of days, but they did suggest that they could start in about six weeks. That's sooner than I expected.
Progress!!
One of the challenges with putting in a false ceiling for the LED pot lights in my garage is that there are three areas where the ceiling can't be lowered. There are two man doors as well as two garage doors, all of which are too close to the ceiling. The original plan was to box in those areas but I think it would have looked terrible. It certainly wouldn't have the clean look that I am hoping for.
A little light came on in my head tonight and I think I have a better idea. Instead of lowering the entire ceiling, I'm only going to lower it where the lights are. That will allow clearance for the doors and be much cleaner and more symetrical in appearance. It will also be a much easier installation. You will have to wait for the before and after pictures to see for yourselves. I hope the work will be done fairly soon.
At long last I have finally been able to arrange for the contractor and electrician to come to the house next week to give me a quote. I had to postpone their visit several times because of my health issues. Now that it is actually happening, I'm extremely happy.
I am really curious to see how much my plans are going to set me back. The work will definitely get done. I have invested far too much in the garage renovation to quit now. Besides, I am so sick and tired of the current dingy lighting and helter skelter exposed wiring running everywhere that I would do the renovations for that reason alone.
I'm definitely not going to give up on the hobby!
Dave, here's hoping you can get some things accomplished in spite of the shaking. It must be frustrating, but you've overcome quite a few things in the past year, so I hope you find some way to keep at the hobby.
York1 John
I haven't done any detailed modelling for several months, but tonight I decided to apply some yellow decal film to the glass on top of the wall sconce that I hope will mimic a rising or setting sun. The fixture came with warm white LEDs but I wanted more of a yellow tone.
I discovered that my hands now shake badly. I had shakey hands previously but it wasn't serious. It has apparently been made worse by my liver problems. It puts into question whether or not I will be able to do any finely detailed modelling in the future.
There are ways to compensate, like bracing my hand against something solid or using one hand to steady the other, but those won't work in all situations. I'll have to learn to cope.
The idea of a plug mounted in the floor has evolved a bit. Rather than cutting a trench several inches deep to make room for the conduit, I'm going to cut a shallow trench that will be just deep enough to allow a 20 amp extension cord or wire and necessary conduit to fit in the trench. There will be a 1/8" steel plate cover level with the floor. The steel plate will be held in place with 1 1/2" magnets so the cord/wire can be accessed easily. I will use a multiple outlet commercial power bar mounted under the layout. There will be a dedicated 20 amp circuit for the power bar with a wall mounted switch.
Sounds more complicated than it is. I have to check with the electrician to make sure it is legal. Using an extension cord may not pass muster.
The electrician will visit towards the end of August. I'll be able to tell you if my plan is legal then.
hon30critterHave you considered putting in a false drywall ceiling with LED low profile lights?
I think if I was younger I might consider it. Right now, I think I'm more concerned with working on some things on the layout. I don't think I want to spend the time and money on something I'm not sure about if I really want it.
While I'm thinking about it, how did your plug in the garage floor ever work out? I remember reading some of your ideas.