Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
Modeling the B&M Railroad during the transition era in Lowell, MA
Remember its your railroad
Allan
Track to the BRVRR Website: http://www.brvrr.com/
I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.
I don't have a leg to stand on.
Originally posted by HAZMAT9 Hi all: I'm at the point of getting ready to purchase track .... I'm wondering if I could somehow purchase a bulk of Code 83 flex and go about it this way... a way to figure out how much flex track I need based on an Atlas sectional track plan if I decide to go this way? Lastly, does anyone have an example of cost comparisons of using sectional versus flex.... Steve To directly address your cost exercise you have to do what any consumer does- work out the 'price gaps' and advantages to be gained. You've been given the technical reasons by others. I dont have the book or know the plan- however as these are usually scaled in 1' squares (or section sizes are 'known" lengths [i.e. 5" straight] then you will have to 'guestimate' the approximate sectional length you'll want to replace with flex. Once you know that, add up all switches and special track sections required (or discard any you dont want)- then cost these at retail, or net prices for what you can get. The total cost of this is specials plus flex versus the 'layout kit' should give you the answers you want. How much the kit/s are discounted by and what value that represents (could be anywhere from retail less 5%- 25%) depending where you get them, is the decision you must make. Since every plan is different, and sizes may vary depending on your changes, then the cost benefit is going to shift every time a 'change' is made. If you have more time than money then it is worthwhile to do- if time is also a problem you may be better starting simply with the kits. Regards, davew Reply Edit HAZMAT9 Member sinceDecember 2004 From: The Great American Southwest 403 posts Posted by HAZMAT9 on Wednesday, February 9, 2005 4:04 PM No prob. I'll keep you up on the progress. Once I cookie-cutter and get the track down, I'll post some pics. I'm theming it quite different from the original and may go with chaparel/coastal theme. I plan to add some good sized hills and split the layout w/ ocean on one side with an oil refinery and two small towns in between. The layout will also have a major switching yard in which I'm adding an additional 1X10 feet and an added main line with a wider radius for passenger. Essentially the wider main line will be for passenger with the rest of the layout and tighter radius for freight. This will be HO scale and will be emphasizing SP Railroad 1950-70's era and many "Black Widow" engines both passenger and freight. Passenger will be "Daylight" and freight "Overnight." Steve [:D] Steve "SP Lives On " (UP is just hiding their cars) 2007 Tank Car Specialist Graduate Reply HAZMAT9 Member sinceDecember 2004 From: The Great American Southwest 403 posts Posted by HAZMAT9 on Wednesday, February 9, 2005 4:10 PM Thanks Dave; I'm probably going with Flex 83 although I'm questioning the Atlas 83 switches....heard some negative things about them. Do you or anyone else know other switches that I can use w/o having to do customizing...just straight use w/ the Atlas Flex 83 track? Anyhow, I'll look at the plan and estimate pieces that I need in flex....believe it, it's a lot easier to obtain on sale at places like Ebay! Many Thanks....Steve [:)] Steve "SP Lives On " (UP is just hiding their cars) 2007 Tank Car Specialist Graduate Reply rrinker Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Reading, PA 30,002 posts Posted by rrinker on Wednesday, February 9, 2005 4:47 PM People can say all the negative things they want about Atlas Code 83 urnouts, but I haven't had any problem with them so far. I've run anything we can get through them, forwards and backwards - including an old brass 4-8-4 and a BLI M1A. No derailments. The cars that 'bounce' goign throught he frogs? A quick check with the NMRA gauge showed that EVERY SINGLE wheeleset that bounced was TOO TIGHT in back-to-back gauge. The ones that could be adjusted, once adjusted, ran fine - but all plastic wheels will be banished anyway, just have to refit slowly, as we can afford more stuff. Sure those new Peco US-style Code 83 turnouts have much more detail on them - they are also more than double the price, and I'm not Donald Trump. --Randy Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, February 10, 2005 3:40 AM Originally posted by HAZMAT9 Thanks Dave; I'm probably going with Flex 83 although I'm questioning the Atlas 83 switches....heard some negative things about them. [:(][:(] Sorry Steve I dont.. [B)] Reply Edit rlbeetle Member sinceJanuary 2005 From: Middle Tennessee 42 posts Posted by rlbeetle on Friday, February 25, 2005 8:09 AM Just finished my first layout. I bought an Atlas layout kit to learn and learned a lot. I used the code 83 track and the layout has 12 turnouts. So far out of the 12, two turnouts are starting to derail my trains as they come through them. And two of the solenoids to switch the turnouts have quit working in one direction. I am ready to start another layout and was wondering if I would be better off using a different brand of switch or maybe use code 100 track. One advantage of code 100 track is my lhs carries it if I need some in a hurry. Reply HAZMAT9 Member sinceDecember 2004 From: The Great American Southwest 403 posts Posted by HAZMAT9 on Friday, February 25, 2005 9:31 AM Seems the consensus here rlbeetle is to go with flex track. I've asked quite a bit about switches as well and comments were that Atlas were just fine, although I'm going with the Tortoise switch machines since a has a slower response time and puts less stress on the solenoids as compared to the snap switches. Anyone else can chime in, I'm just a returning junkie....don't know much about how things have changed in the last 20 yrs.....but learning. Steve Steve "SP Lives On " (UP is just hiding their cars) 2007 Tank Car Specialist Graduate Reply rrinker Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Reading, PA 30,002 posts Posted by rrinker on Friday, February 25, 2005 10:33 AM QUOTE: Originally posted by rlbeetle Just finished my first layout. I bought an Atlas layout kit to learn and learned a lot. I used the code 83 track and the layout has 12 turnouts. So far out of the 12, two turnouts are starting to derail my trains as they come through them. And two of the solenoids to switch the turnouts have quit working in one direction. I am ready to start another layout and was wondering if I would be better off using a different brand of switch or maybe use code 100 track. One advantage of code 100 track is my lhs carries it if I need some in a hurry. There is a big difference between Atlas Snap-Track turnouts and the Custom Line ones. The Custom Line ones are MUCH better, but they don't come with switch machines - thus the references you see to using Tortoise switch machines, which move slow and are more gentle (and prototypical) than the fast hard snap of the solenoids. If you can get it, I would stick with the 83, I think it looks better - both size and detail -wise. If you are having derailments - after had enough track down to test run some equipment, I found a lot of cars would have problems over the switches, bouncing and sometimes derailing. A check of the wheels showed them binding up in the switch frogs and popping out. Did a check with an NMRA gauge - the wheels that had problems were too tight in back-to-back gauge. Ones that rolled through smoothly matched the gauge exactly. Some kinds can be adjusted, but plastic ones I'm replacing anyway. The moral of the story is, it's not always the switch that's at fault. --Randy Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more. Reply rlbeetle Member sinceJanuary 2005 From: Middle Tennessee 42 posts Posted by rlbeetle on Friday, February 25, 2005 7:17 PM Randy, On the first switch that was giving me trouble I spent some time checking it out and it is bouncing when it hits the frogs. I just assumed it was the switch since it was the only one doing it but your post got me thinking. Only one set of wheels is having trouble and the other set goes through the switch just fine. Right now I only have one engine converted for DCC so it could be a problem in the wheels. I have to get a NMRA gauge, I have two friends that got me in the hobby and both have told me I need one. I will check the wheels. On my next layout I was going to look into the Tortoise switch machines. Don't they have contacts that can be used for switch position indication. I bought some latch relays to use on my atlas switches for indication lights decided not to use them. Thanks again. Beetle Reply FThunder11 Member sinceJune 2003 From: Colorado Springs 728 posts Posted by FThunder11 on Friday, February 25, 2005 9:35 PM In the end you'll be happier with flextrack, eaiser to use Kevin Farlow Colorado Springs Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, February 26, 2005 3:00 PM On my small layout, I put the track plan down full size with magic marker on foam, and then used one piece of flextrack, laying it down by hand without fastening it, marking where it ended, and then going from that point, marking the ending point again, etc, repeating that process and keeping count until I had covered the whole plan. When I bought the rest of the flextrack at the local hobby shop, I found I had made a perfect estimate of the 17 pieces needed. Just a suggestion if you're low budget as I am and don't want to waste any track. Reply Edit Subscriber & Member Login Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more! Login Register Users Online There are no community member online Search the Community ADVERTISEMENT ADVERTISEMENT ADVERTISEMENT Model Railroader Newsletter See all Sign up for our FREE e-newsletter and get model railroad news in your inbox! Sign up
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Originally posted by HAZMAT9 Thanks Dave; I'm probably going with Flex 83 although I'm questioning the Atlas 83 switches....heard some negative things about them. [:(][:(] Sorry Steve I dont.. [B)] Reply Edit rlbeetle Member sinceJanuary 2005 From: Middle Tennessee 42 posts Posted by rlbeetle on Friday, February 25, 2005 8:09 AM Just finished my first layout. I bought an Atlas layout kit to learn and learned a lot. I used the code 83 track and the layout has 12 turnouts. So far out of the 12, two turnouts are starting to derail my trains as they come through them. And two of the solenoids to switch the turnouts have quit working in one direction. I am ready to start another layout and was wondering if I would be better off using a different brand of switch or maybe use code 100 track. One advantage of code 100 track is my lhs carries it if I need some in a hurry. Reply HAZMAT9 Member sinceDecember 2004 From: The Great American Southwest 403 posts Posted by HAZMAT9 on Friday, February 25, 2005 9:31 AM Seems the consensus here rlbeetle is to go with flex track. I've asked quite a bit about switches as well and comments were that Atlas were just fine, although I'm going with the Tortoise switch machines since a has a slower response time and puts less stress on the solenoids as compared to the snap switches. Anyone else can chime in, I'm just a returning junkie....don't know much about how things have changed in the last 20 yrs.....but learning. Steve Steve "SP Lives On " (UP is just hiding their cars) 2007 Tank Car Specialist Graduate Reply rrinker Member sinceFebruary 2002 From: Reading, PA 30,002 posts Posted by rrinker on Friday, February 25, 2005 10:33 AM QUOTE: Originally posted by rlbeetle Just finished my first layout. I bought an Atlas layout kit to learn and learned a lot. I used the code 83 track and the layout has 12 turnouts. So far out of the 12, two turnouts are starting to derail my trains as they come through them. And two of the solenoids to switch the turnouts have quit working in one direction. I am ready to start another layout and was wondering if I would be better off using a different brand of switch or maybe use code 100 track. One advantage of code 100 track is my lhs carries it if I need some in a hurry. There is a big difference between Atlas Snap-Track turnouts and the Custom Line ones. The Custom Line ones are MUCH better, but they don't come with switch machines - thus the references you see to using Tortoise switch machines, which move slow and are more gentle (and prototypical) than the fast hard snap of the solenoids. If you can get it, I would stick with the 83, I think it looks better - both size and detail -wise. If you are having derailments - after had enough track down to test run some equipment, I found a lot of cars would have problems over the switches, bouncing and sometimes derailing. A check of the wheels showed them binding up in the switch frogs and popping out. Did a check with an NMRA gauge - the wheels that had problems were too tight in back-to-back gauge. Ones that rolled through smoothly matched the gauge exactly. Some kinds can be adjusted, but plastic ones I'm replacing anyway. The moral of the story is, it's not always the switch that's at fault. --Randy Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more. Reply rlbeetle Member sinceJanuary 2005 From: Middle Tennessee 42 posts Posted by rlbeetle on Friday, February 25, 2005 7:17 PM Randy, On the first switch that was giving me trouble I spent some time checking it out and it is bouncing when it hits the frogs. I just assumed it was the switch since it was the only one doing it but your post got me thinking. Only one set of wheels is having trouble and the other set goes through the switch just fine. Right now I only have one engine converted for DCC so it could be a problem in the wheels. I have to get a NMRA gauge, I have two friends that got me in the hobby and both have told me I need one. I will check the wheels. On my next layout I was going to look into the Tortoise switch machines. Don't they have contacts that can be used for switch position indication. I bought some latch relays to use on my atlas switches for indication lights decided not to use them. Thanks again. Beetle Reply FThunder11 Member sinceJune 2003 From: Colorado Springs 728 posts Posted by FThunder11 on Friday, February 25, 2005 9:35 PM In the end you'll be happier with flextrack, eaiser to use Kevin Farlow Colorado Springs Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, February 26, 2005 3:00 PM On my small layout, I put the track plan down full size with magic marker on foam, and then used one piece of flextrack, laying it down by hand without fastening it, marking where it ended, and then going from that point, marking the ending point again, etc, repeating that process and keeping count until I had covered the whole plan. When I bought the rest of the flextrack at the local hobby shop, I found I had made a perfect estimate of the 17 pieces needed. Just a suggestion if you're low budget as I am and don't want to waste any track. Reply Edit Subscriber & Member Login Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more! Login Register Users Online There are no community member online Search the Community ADVERTISEMENT ADVERTISEMENT ADVERTISEMENT Model Railroader Newsletter See all Sign up for our FREE e-newsletter and get model railroad news in your inbox! Sign up
QUOTE: Originally posted by rlbeetle Just finished my first layout. I bought an Atlas layout kit to learn and learned a lot. I used the code 83 track and the layout has 12 turnouts. So far out of the 12, two turnouts are starting to derail my trains as they come through them. And two of the solenoids to switch the turnouts have quit working in one direction. I am ready to start another layout and was wondering if I would be better off using a different brand of switch or maybe use code 100 track. One advantage of code 100 track is my lhs carries it if I need some in a hurry.