Instant roadbed? Sounds like a neat idea...

[Anonymous]

Walt,

Brian and his friend Curt were here on the 20th. We had a great time and Brian is a really nice guy with a wonderful sense of humor as was his frind Curt. Brian won't be home for several more days.

OLD DAD

[grandpopswalt]

Brian,

I heard a story that Werner VonBraun, the father of the American space program, had his whole yard covered with Astroturf because he felt that constantly cutting grass was a terrible waste of time. You can't argue with a guy who's smart enough to get us to the moon.

BTW, how was your visit to OLD DAD's RR?

Grandpopswalt

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Jim Duda

Man, I could throw some green paint into the cement, mix 'er up, spread it around, and voila!...no yard maintenance...I love it, eh!!!

I'll go somewhere between 18 - 24 inches...still undecided.

http://www.btcomm.com/trains/primer/roadbed/ladder1.htm - I'm likin' it A LOT!!!

JD

Hay Jim,
I've built my entire layout on a similar type of spline roadbed and I like the system very much.
I first used the spline system when helping to build an HO club layout back in the sixties (spline roadbed has been in use on small scale layouts for about 50 years). This is where I got the idea to use spline roadbed outdoors.

The system I just saw on your link is better than the one I devised because it has fewer parts to deal with.

Spline roadbed is great even at ground level since you will not have to worry about your track sinking or shifting due to the dirt settling underneath.

Go for it.... OLD DAD

[bman36]

Jim,
Don't laugh....there is an old school teacher of mine here in Wpg. who did just that. No trains to play with...just hated lawn work. OOOOOOkay!!! Anyhow that is a neat system to use! Opens up all kinds of possibilities for ya'. Later eh...Brian.

[Jim Duda]

Man, I could throw some green paint into the cement, mix 'er up, spread it around, and voila!...no yard maintenance...I love it, eh!!!

I'll go somewhere between 18 - 24 inches...still undecided.

http://www.btcomm.com/trains/primer/roadbed/ladder1.htm - I'm likin' it A LOT!!!

JD

[bman36]

Jim,
How high do you plan on going? There are several ways to go elevated. I was under the impression you planned on laying it out on the ground? Yes? No? I have seen in GR a layout where saving the trees was necessary so it was all elevated on wood posts topped with boards cut to suit. Wanna' go real simple? Have someone come in and pave your yard***GRIN*** and then lay out the track. No lawn to cut just trains to watch. Later eh...Brian.
[:o)] [:o)] [:o)]

[Jim Duda]

Kim, Ian, and all - the BIG advantage to me of an elevated system is that you DON'T have to excavate (terraform) your space...the pipe/poles/supports under the roadbed take care of all that. And some of us old pharts (me) don't like to bend over or get down on our kness to putz around with this stuff. Hell, I'm not even gonna backfill under mine...won't look proto but I could care less. I just wanna see the train chase itself (and the squirrels) in the backyard while I relax in the swing. I'll let my imagination supply all the scenery and structures...

JD

[Anonymous]

Hi guys,
It's 'sod cutting time' this Saturday as construction starts on the 'K&G RR'. That's Kim & Gail and it's cleverly disguised as Rio Grande. Let's face it guys, there aint nothing instant in roadbeds. I've seen adverts for concrete sectional roadbeds, steel roadbeds but you still have to terraform the planet and get all your levels sorted etc before you even put the track on it! You may as well do it the old fashioned way or, as Ian says, put it on the grass.
Cheers,
Kim
[tup]

Now indoors, that's a different thing.............................

[Anonymous]

Why not cut some strips from a (several) 4x8' - 3/4" plywood?
There are alot of options out there you are right about that!
I know I have been researching mine (GR) for 3 yrs.

[Anonymous]

Jimbo that matter of roadbed made out of three lots of electrical conduit is on page 126 of a Kambach publication "The Large-Scale Model Railroading Handbook".

Rgs Ian

[Jim Duda]

Thanks for the heads up! I'm in a holding pattern until Buckeye gets his stuff straightened out. But the longer I wait the more I learn about other great options. Tom's recycled polyethylene board link above also looks very doable.

JD

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Jim Duda

Guys - I'll have to admit, the Mainline Enterprises PVC preformed pieces supported by 3/4" PVC pipe looks VERY promising for my needs. I would spray it with a flat brown primer to blend it better with the environment, though...Has anyone used it and would care to comment on it?

You might want to hold off ordering for now.

Another thread poster, Buckeye Riveter is having problems with his order, sounds like the owner of Mailine has been layed up medicaly and has backed up his orders.

[bman36]

Tom,
Welcome to the forum! Glad to have ya'. That sure was'nt cheap was it??? Lumber prices are just plain stupid right now. Priced out cedar for a deck and walked out with my mouth hanging open. Managed to find some seconds that were quite decent. Also half the price. Enjoy the forum! Later eh...Brian.

[Anonymous]

Hi Guys - I'm new to this but am planning on trying the recycled polyethelene boards shown in the link. I bought 50 feet of the boards but haven't started laying track yet. It looks like the way to go for some of the situations above. Make reasonable length pieces, join together with a bolt and wingnut, and instant portable roadbed. I'm going to use it to span gullies and around the pond.

http://www.btcomm.com/trains/primer/roadbed/ladder1.htm

The 2x4's cost me $2.20 a foot, so it's not real cheap.

By the way, thanks for all the help. I've been reading here for a while and have learned a lot.

Tom

[Jim Duda]

Guys - I'll have to admit, the Mainline Enterprises PVC preformed pieces supported by 3/4" PVC pipe looks VERY promising for my needs. I would spray it with a flat brown primer to blend it better with the environment, though...Has anyone used it and would care to comment on it?

[Anonymous]

I got the railplaque and it can be painted different colors. It looks like it could hold up outside over the years. I heard that the Aristo roadbed sucked big time.

[Jim Duda]

vsmith said,

QUOTE: Wouldnt something like this be usefull only to those like me, doing an indoor layout? I cant see how instant roadbed would work outside?

What if it was made from Delrin or Polyurethane or something COMPLETELY weatherproof and thick enough to support the track, even between trestles? Man, I would think it would have a market...

JD

I just re-read Mr. Smith's suggestion above...yes, it does look interesting...
http://home.comcast.net/~peterpica/

[Anonymous]

Jim

How right you are about wives , how right; my wife is all of that but instead of working two jobs, she became the Financial Controller of a fairly big corporation, even better.

You know I love my Vegemite but i think you have to grow up with it; nearly all Americans I know of don't like it, too salty i think, the Poms have their Marrmite as well similar but inferior.

I can tell you now that Maddona and George (President Bush, everyone gets called by their first name here) didn't like it, neither did Lamb Chop. I think Frank Sinatra didn't like it either and he had trouble with the Unions over here because of this very matter, so there.

On to that matter of the electrical conduit, I have the article here somewhere and if I canget my scanner fixed, will send you a copy; at the least I will tell you which magazine i saw it in, it was a Kalmbach publication. I am looking for something for Nicholas so I will try to find them both together By the way I am really bad at finding things, so i'll try to get my better half to have a look.

Ian Kawana Island tropical railway.

[Jim Duda]

The Polyurethane preformed pieces are pretty much what I was thinking...but you're right - VERY expensive! Too bad they didn't come up with universal tie depressions so other brands of track could be used with it. Good...eh?

Ian - REAL men eat Vegemite sandwiches and not only have their wives dig the trench, haul and distribute the ballast, and do the wiring, but work two jobs so they can purchase ALL the train stuff their husbands want! At least that's how it is in TexASS!

Actually, the plastic electical conduit method might work just fine - the two top pipes would have to be just large enough to provide a stable platform for the ties, so 2 inch sounds right.

Does anyone have the article or know how to contact the guy?

...thinkin' about the Vegemite is making me hungry...!!!

Jim (ALL men in OZ are real!) Duda

[Anonymous]

Jimbo

"Real Men" just lay their track on the grass for temporary measure suggest you do the same.

But in the long run I just love my ballst and the way we have made it look really nice with decorative gravel and small stones. My wife does all the gravel work, so I have found it really easy mate.

However I have read an article in one of Kalmback books about a guy over there in America who is an electrician and he makes his own track support out of three lengths of plastic electrical conduit. He makes a delta out of them with two side by side and the third underneath.

From this he can bend them either around curves or up and down and even support them in mid air easily. I have no idea what size he used I would gues at 50 mm (2") but this is only a guess. Yyou get them to shape before you tie them or even glue them together and then they will retain that shape.


Reagrds



Ian; Kawana etc.

[bman36]

Jim,
Saw an ad in GR (Dec. 2003) for roadbed. The website is www.railplaque.com. Checked it out...very expensive but formed to fit LGB track. Did'nt see on the website what was available for radius but it looked like a lot was available. Check it out. Later eh...Brian.

[Jim Duda]

Maybe the PVC system would be OK for elevated track, but let's say I want to lay track on bare ground that has been levelled and filled in, or directly on grass. What I'm looking for are straight sections about 6 in. wide, bevelled on the edges. And preformed curves in popular diameters. Preferable they would interlock like tubular track does, or snap together, but made out of an impervious material to withstand the rigors of weather. How does polyethylene hold up to weather? There has to be some material that would work for our application, yet be affordable...fingers crossed! Is ballast the only option we have to lay our track on?

[vsmith]

Mainline Enterprises sells a PVC based "sub-roadbed" support system that looks pretty interesting.

http://home.comcast.net/~peterpica/

It uses PVC pipes to hold up a PVC roadbed supprt system one the track is secured to it just berm the ground up to it. is this more what you were looking for?

[vsmith]

I'm pretty sure that "vacu-formed" roadbed is intended for indoor use. It looks like sheet styrene thats molded around a form. If its really vacu formed then its like the old vacu-formed aircraft kits and is hollow undernieth. Being styrene it wil deteriorate rather fast exposed to the sun.

[Jim Duda]

Good! I get a chance to express my ignorance...

First, I presume this stuff is fairly rigid and weather proof. Presuming level terrain, I would first put a support under the roadbed sections where they join so it is fairly rigid; then lay the roadbed on the grass or dirt or bark chips, etc., then lay the track on the roadbed, and that would fini***he installation! Quick and easy! Personally, I don't need the realism of ballast and the appearance would suit me just fine. But heck, I might even spray the roadbed to achieve the color I want.

But for you guys that do shows, wouldn't something like this be the ticket, allowing you to place it directly on grass, giving you a nice barrier between the track and preventing the blades of grass from poking up between the ties?

I still have lots of questions about it, but the principle sure sounds like some of us would love this stuff! HAS ANYONE USED IT? Comments???

You can see a sample of it in the catalog section on www.aristocraft.com It is called "Vacu-Formed Roadbed".

JD

[vsmith]

Wouldnt something like this be usefull only to those like me, doing an indoor layout? I cant see how instant roadbed would work outside?

[Marty Cozad]

Check out Aristo Crafts site. I think they are coming out with something.

[Jim Duda]

I searched for "instant roadbed", and "vinyl roadbed" but came up empty. Anyway, several manufacturers offer this in 3 rail, but does anyone have anything like this in Large Scale? Specifically, pre-curved sections for the popular diameter curves - 8 - 12 - 15 - 20 foot, etc. I know if I could find some for a 15' and/or 20' circle I'd get some. Just lay it on the ground, throw your track on it and presto! You're ready to roll!

For what it's worth, I know Lionel is betting the farm on their Fast Track system but the 3 rail guys are upset about the noise level and limited selection for switches, curve diameters, and a more robust product offering, all of which have been promised by Lionel. I'm not sure if track with integral roadbed would be accepted by you folks, but I do see a market for separate roadbed for those of us who don't necessarily need the realism of ballast.

Is there such a product for Garden Gauge and how do I learn about it?

Jim Duda