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Self stick roof that did not

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Self stick roof that did not
Posted by John Busby on Friday, July 13, 2007 6:18 AM

Hi guys

HELP!!! ARGH!Sad [:(]

After spending two weeks doing a slate roof using self stick vinyl tiles to cut and stick individual 32mm x 16mm slates to a roof, laid as best I can to the proper way slates are laid.

I have discovered that they have not self stuck properlySign - Oops [#oops]

Some very naughty words where said when I found out.

They where stuck to a sub roof of painted balsa and overlapped just like real slates.

Can anyone suggest what or where I went wrong, and how I can fix it without having to strip the roof and start again

Also what could be done next time to avoid the same problem

There are an awful lot of slates to redo if its back to square one

Once this is sorted does any one know how a Medieval lead ridge cap was done this would be the ideal ridge treatment for the building rather than ridge tiles

regards John

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Posted by GearDrivenSteam on Friday, July 13, 2007 8:34 AM
I don't know about a way to fix it without stripping the roof. My suggestion would be to just bite that bullet and then caulk the tiles back on. Is the roof able to withstand some weight added to the tiles to hold them down until the caulk is cured? If so, then that would ensure that they would adhere properly.
It is enough that Jesus died and that he died for me.
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Posted by vsmith on Friday, July 13, 2007 8:41 AM

John

If you were using self adhesive floor type tiles, they need to be completely pressed flat against the floor so all the adhesive can contact the floor surface in order to get full adherence and so the adhesive can cure correctly. Putting them on at an angle where they are overlapping only gives a small 1/16 max strip of adhesive on two sides which when it cures will not have much holding capacity. I'm not surpised they came off. Best solution likely is to reattach them with a silicon or epoxy to hold them in place, good luck with it!

As for the ridge, tile can still leak, where a metal like lead could be "molded" so to speak to fit the roof solidly, giving a leak free ridge. Lead wad great for roofing, just not so great for the environment around the building with the roof, especially if there was a fire.

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Posted by altterrain on Friday, July 13, 2007 10:06 AM

John,

I would use either a clear silicone or a product like GOOP to stick them on. I do have concern about the use of balsa outdoors. It does not have a good track record outdoors. I would suggest an exterior grade plywood, hardibacker tile board (what I use) or coroplast (corrugated polypropylene) since you are starting over.

 

Here is the roof of my pub using the hardibacker put together with liquid nails and covered with plastic veneers.

-Brian 

 

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Posted by John Busby on Friday, July 13, 2007 10:10 AM

Hi guys

Thanks please pass the virtual tissues I think I need themSad [:(].

Oh! boy I do have a problem the roof will have to be re done by the sounds of things.

But it explains why the first three rows of tiles stuck the best, yes self stick floor tiles

weight cannot be put on the sub roof it is 9" of unsupported in the middle 1.6mm mm balsa which was done so it would give me a visually interesting wavy roof which it did nicely.

It had a nice look to it's just failed to stick properly.

Would running bondcrete at the back of the tile row before the next row is put on work?? the structure walls are foam core board

Foam core don't like the solvents in most of the caulk and silicon products.

Any bright ideas for a temp support while I re-do the roof

Vic

Are you able to provide more info on how the sheets of lead where joined and what was done at the ends to keep the water out.

They did not have silicone roofing sealant at the time the building was supposed to be built

But they knew how to do the lead work which is what I need to replicate with coffee tin seal foil.

And I don't know how it was done, have not been able to find a book that will tell me.

regards John

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Posted by John Busby on Friday, July 13, 2007 10:25 AM

Hi altterrain

This particular building is being built for indoor only use.

The roof should be OK outside if I do it right ie no part of the roof with less than two thickness of tile on it and plenty of paint.

The walls will not last out side being foam core board.

"A pint of Guinness thanks" That is a nice looking pub.

This thread will get printed so your advice for out door roofs will be noted

Is hardibacker a fiber cement product?? if so we probably call it something else but at least I will know what I am looking for.

regards John

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Posted by altterrain on Friday, July 13, 2007 10:43 AM

Yes, that's it! It comes in 1/4" and 1/2" (6-7mm and 12-13mm) thickness here. The thinner sheets work well for building projects and cuts pretty well with a hand held carbide tipped cutter.

a close up of the pub window 

 

 

-Brian 

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Posted by vsmith on Friday, July 13, 2007 11:22 AM
 John Busby wrote:

Hi guys

Thanks please pass the virtual tissues I think I need themSad [:(].

Oh! boy I do have a problem the roof will have to be re done by the sounds of things.

But it explains why the first three rows of tiles stuck the best, yes self stick floor tiles

weight cannot be put on the sub roof it is 9" of unsupported in the middle 1.6mm mm balsa which was done so it would give me a visually interesting wavy roof which it did nicely.

It had a nice look to it's just failed to stick properly.

Would running bondcrete at the back of the tile row before the next row is put on work?? the structure walls are foam core board

Foam core don't like the solvents in most of the caulk and silicon products.

Any bright ideas for a temp support while I re-do the roof

Vic

Are you able to provide more info on how the sheets of lead where joined and what was done at the ends to keep the water out.

They did not have silicone roofing sealant at the time the building was supposed to be built

But they knew how to do the lead work which is what I need to replicate with coffee tin seal foil.

And I don't know how it was done, have not been able to find a book that will tell me.

regards John

If you can find it, theres a book called "Construction Before Mechanization" which cronicles Medeavil construction technics that were used right up to the 19th century.

In real buildings, lead roof sheet joints were often sealed with molten lead! poured into the gaps. or they were formed with interlocking lips that were hammered together to create a close to waterproof joint. End caps were preformed on the ground and then installed the same as the sheets. Remember this is a medeavil technology were talking about here. For a model, I would suggest Soft Aluminum sheets from KS Engineering here in the States, and try using regular soldier to sell edges or if you can find a product called Liquid Soldier which is similar to Liquid Nails, that dries like an aluminized adhesive caulking.

I was suggesting using silicon or epoxy as an adhesive to adhere the loose tiles to the backing, not as a caulking method.

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Posted by cacole on Friday, July 13, 2007 2:12 PM

If you can get the loose tiles properly aligned, you might try putting some type of clear acrylic coating over the entire roof to seal everything instead of having to take it all off and starting over.  I have seen products at local building supply houses for sealing concrete, wood, etc. that may be less work.

 

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Posted by John Busby on Sunday, July 15, 2007 5:08 AM

Hi guys

Before I run this through the printer does any one have anything to add to the topic

To all thanks for the help and thoughts.

regards John

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Posted by toenailridgesl on Sunday, July 15, 2007 5:21 AM
John, since the building is to be inside rather than out in the snow, sleet, tornadoes & blizzards of W Aust (Oops! HEHEHEHEHEHE!), press the self-stick tiles down as best you can, then go along with super-glue (the cheap-shop runny stuff) & run it along all of the seams & joins. It should last decades.
Phil Creer, The Toenail Ridge Shortline,  Adelaide Sth Oz http://www.trainweb.org/toenailridge toparo ergo sum
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Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, July 15, 2007 3:00 PM

The book Vic advised about I hope:

http://www.amazon.com/Building-Construction-Before-Mechanization-Fitchen/dp/0262061023

Enjoy.

Let me know if you need any thing.

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Posted by John Busby on Monday, July 16, 2007 3:09 AM

Hi guys

Thread printed and Book ordered

regards John

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Posted by vsmith on Monday, July 16, 2007 10:53 AM
Yes that is the book.

   Have fun with your trains

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Posted by John Busby on Tuesday, July 17, 2007 4:23 AM

Hi Phil

No sleet snow tornadoes or blizzards.

Just giants and monstrous creatures to deal with

We won't mention the builder, who has knocked it off the table twiceSad [:(] fortunately before the roof went on

regards John

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