O gauge R/C conversion (photos & description)

[chadw]

This could work indoors with power coming from the rails instead of a battery. Endless possibilities...

[FJ and G]

Hi SFKent,

I've run the train with the wire on the receiver completely coiled and the antenna on the transmitter completely contracted from a couple hundred yards away. Only this weekend have I uncoiled the wire and extended the antenna. But operations seem about the same. Over the months, I'm going to convert my other locomotives, which won't cost me a dime b/c I already invested $100 in the R/C transmitter/receiver, ESC and battery pak (total cost). No more transformers or track cleaning for me. I like the rails as dirty and grimy as possible for the best traction and most realistic look.

[Anonymous]

A little technical note:

The frequencies that should be used for this activity are all in the 75 MHz band and are called channels 61 thru 90. This is a good quiet band.

Use the antenna the way they recommend it. A full-size 1/4 wavelength antenna is 39 inches long, which is too long for most models. Coiling it up or winding it around the inside of a plastic body works (the more area it covers is better). The transmitter power is good enough that a less than ideal antenna will still have plenty of range.

This is pretty good work, David.... I may look into it myself!

[FJ and G]

Hi John,

Jim is operating some RC boats and planes with his son. He plans to run his trains when the weather cools in the fall.

[jefelectric]

David, How's that for prototypical operation? You even get ballast washouts! How about trying a rotary snow plow this winter? I saw a video posted somewhere showing a G gauge rotary blowing real snow. Should work in O as well. Of course you would need another battery car and R/C set to control the plow. If I had more outdoor space I would be tempted to try this. Sounds like a lot of fun.

By the way, what happened to Jim Duda. Haven't seen him post in quite a while.

[FJ and G]

Thanks Doug,

I haven't yet met anyone in O scale who has converted to R/C. There are a large number of O gauge R/C operators in the UK who model in 1:19 and 1:16 but none who do 1:48 in R/C. I understand, though that someone did the conversion as you mentioned it was in a recent O scale magazine.

[cnw1995]

Great progress, David. In my humble opinion, R/C is the future of model railroading...

[FJ and G]

The making of a battery car…

We start with a Weaver scale bulkhead car…seems OK but would be boring to always run behind the locomotive, so…all components are held in place or on top of each other with velcro strips



We do some slicing and dicing, add some HO rails on the sides for supporting stakes…



Then we load with copper pipes; right over the R/C equipment (all below photos taken this weekend).



Notice that it’s raining out, but I had great operating sessions in the rain.



And here’s the combo… (all track in phase 1 is now layed; but there are some ballast washouts with the 10 inches of rain we had)



Note the air hose connection, which really is the R/C wiring from the battery car to locomotive, encased in shrink tube



The following scenes are a 5% spur; operating on wet rails. The train is going in to pick up some heavy diecast tank cars and a gondola loaded with real steel scrap and will back out of the spur.

Incidentally, the locomotive ran over some ballast that washed over the track and actually made it across. Cool stuff!

I ran up and down this spur; did stop and goes etc; testing the train to the limit. This winter, I’ll try some snow plowing but will need to fashion a plow.

Oh, btw, did you notice that I changed out the copper pipes in the bulkhead flatcar for some lumber? See how flexible the bulkhead flatcar battery car is?

Later, I'll fashion other types of loads like bricks, other colorful plastic covering lumber; odd type loads and loads with tarps.

Some operational scenes…










I took this shot just to show how hard it was raining; see the raindrops!



The sun came out, revealing a ballast washout and some weeds growing over the right of way. Will need to send out the tree trimming train equipment



even dead trees are appealing



Here’s a wide-angle view



Make no bones about it. R/C trains are fundelicious

[FJ and G]

Tim,

I will! (but unlikely to go into business doing this, as not many would likely leave their basements :-) )

Well, I promise, this is the last test for today as I've a heap of gardening to do.

Just finished preparing my battery car, a Williams semi-scale NYC P&LE boxcar. Everything fits nicely inside and there's even room for a second battery pack.

I make it less messy, I taped the ESC and receiver to the boxcar ceiling, as there's no need to touch those. I left out the screws so that I can quickly pull off the top if I need to charge the battery. The ESC/battery switch (on/off) is located near the door so I can open the door and flip the switch. I cut a small hole in the base of the car to allow the motor wires to exit.

BTW, if you think that this is too much work for R/C and that you'd like to get into G scale; forget it. Folks in G scale also have to do this with their R/C components as trains in G are not sold R/C ready-to-run. Strange but true.

I set up a new test track indoors and still running off the same battery I started with. I discovered that when the ESC is run in reverse, operations are much, much smoother. Reverse doesn't necessarily mean your train is going backwards either. Just turn the loco around and hook the leads up the other way. It appears that the ESC works BEST when it is drawing more amps from the battery. I attribute this to the probability that R/C boat owners usually run their boats flat out and besides, the boats draw way many more amps than the train. Also, slow operations were much improved when the ESC is used in reverse.

BTW, although the ESC is rated at just 12 v max, it can accommodate 30 amps in forward and 20 in reverse.

[Anonymous]

Dave, This has endless possibilities. When you start selling stock, put me at the top of the list........Tim

[choochin3]

Thank you Guys,
You have all been most helpful!

Carl T.

[FJ and G]

Hi Bill,

I'll be up your way April 8. I'll give you some advanced notice.

Outdoors modelers who model with styrene say that paint gives UV protection. Carl, you could pose this question on the Garden forum. The plastic in Realtrax is a lot thicker than styrene. If conductivity presents a problem down the road, the fix would simply be to solder jumpers between rails (1st clean off the oxidation).
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Some more R/C notes:

Another tip: use bag tie-downs to bundle your wires.

there are 2-channels in the transmitter. I haven't even tried both channels but if some kid is operating a car (or boat) in your area, you or he can switch channels. If you want to run other trains, you could get another transmitter and use a different channel. I believe that 30 channels are available with transmitters.

I've pondered the animation idea. That was a B&M RS-3. Read about it in a book as well as a magazine a number of years ago. You could do that easily with one of the two servos (windmill-looking devices shown in one of my photos). The servos are controlled by the right (and left) toggle switch on the transmitter, so since you are not using the right toggle for anything, then that could control the animation. When you throttle one way, the servo turns a quarter turn and when you throttle the other way, the servo windmill turns a quarter turn in the other direction. This extra toggle and servo or some other electrical device instead of the servo, could be used, I'm assuming, to power your bell or whistle, as I believe you are transmitting a positive or negative half-wave current.

[jefelectric]

choochin3,

The main problems with Realtrax outside would be the UV rays effect on the plastic and the connections between joints.

I don't know, but doubt if the Realtrax has any UV protection. I noticed that on the new Atlas boxes they state that it is UV safe.

Definitely don't believe you could depend on the contacts in the Realtrax to last outdoors. If you do try it, be sure to use the anti-corrosion paste sold by LGB on the contacts as you put it together. The garden railway guys recommend it highly. I even used it on my indoor track.

Just my opinion for what it's worth.

Dave, I was wondering what had happened to this thread. Glad you got back to it. Somethng different and very interesting.

[FJ and G]

Here's complete parts list and instructions:


1. R/C car battery pack and charger 7.2 V Ni-Cd 2000mAH
From Radio Shack.
$20

Or, you could go to an R/C hobby shop and get a 7.2V NiMh 38000, as it'll last even longer (though I've been on my single battery for hours now.

2. ProBoat Waterproof ESC (Electronic Speed Control with Reverse
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=PRB2314
$40

3. Ranger II HiTec Radio transmitter/receiver (order any channel)
http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXARP0**&P=0
$40

Total = $100

Plus, you'll need connectors and you might want a 10Amp fast blow fuse.

Instructions:

1. Prepare some test track

2. Open loco shell and remove rollers

3. If you're not familiar with electronics, cut all wires from the motors except the 2 power wires (the blue and yellow shown in the diagram at the top of this post).

4. Wire your loco so that the yellow wire connects both motors and a tether for the battery car (if you choose to use a battery car). Do the same for the blue wire. That is all the wiring you'll be doing inside the loco, the rest of the wiring will take place in your battery car.

5. After charging your Radio Shack (or other) battery, connect it to the ESC plug (only one plug will work with it).

6. Connect the ESC 3-prong black plug into channel 2 of the Hi-Tech reciever (small red box). The plug fits only one way so don't try to force it the wrong way in! That is the only plug you'll be using in the receiver. No need to uncoil the antenna that is attached to the receiver.

7. The ESC's remaining 2 wires will connect to the yellow and blue wires that go to your motors, which I already mentioned. You can wire the fuse into one of the wires if you so choose. I found that the train still operates if the wires from the ESC to the motors are flipped or flopped.

8. Turn on the main power switch on your handheld transmitter (center slide button). Then turn on the switch on the ESC. (when you are done, always turn off the ESC switch, then the transmitter; the reason for this procedure is so that no extraneous signals are picked up by the locomotive from a remote source)

9. To operate the train, use the toggle switch on the left side. It is spring loaded so if you let go of it, the train goes into neutral. If you push up, the train goes forward (or reverse if you wired the ESC to motors backwards); and if you toggle down, the train goes the other way.

The little button beside it on the right reverses the directions (in case you wired the ESC to the motors backwards).

The little sliding button beside the toggle on the right lets you go in forward or reverse at any speed you choose without holding the toggle switch. In other words, you can set the transmitter down and let the train run without holding it.

10. To run 2 locomotives, connect all 4 yellow to 4 motors and all 4 blue to 4 motors.

Tip: use connectors that don't require too much energy to pull apart.

Tip: use screw caps to connect your wires inside the loco shell. Then you don't have to solder or crimp and you can easily unscrew the cap (caps come in different sizes, indicated by their colors; you can get these in home depot)

Tip: wire a male and female connector at each end so you can tell which wire fits which if double-heading.

Tip: the 4-battery battery pack that comes with the radio unit can be used separately to power your loco lights. It is NOT used in the remote control setup I described. The 2 servos also are NOT used.

Tip: I've just scratched the surface of R/C. Over time, I'll know a lot more. For example, the other channel of the receiver might be used for some other function. Also, I believe the addition of a capacitor in the circuit would improve performance somewhat, but I need to investigate further and ask my electronic friends. I'm hoping some of you with more knowledge than I will do this procedure so that you can give me additional tips.

Tip: If you're using a battery car, this is all the R/C stuff you'll ever need to power all of your trains. If you wi***o use 2 locos operating separately on a track, purchase another radio in a different channel.

[FJ and G]

Carl,

I've had a stick of Realtrax outside now for about 8 months and it's holding up really well. The rails are pretty clean and the plastic roadbed would probably take years if not decades to become brittle; still, I'd just go over the roadbed with some paint just for added protection.

If I were using realtrax outside, I'd likely have gone with electric thru the rails; but my thinner profile rails are a bit harder to clean.

My only concern would be expansion/contraction. I'm not sure how or if Realtrax expands or contracts but I'm guessing it wouldn't be a problem.

[choochin3]

Speaking of running trains outdoors.
Do any of youse guys know if MTH Realtrax will hold up outside.
I am going to screw this track around the outside perimeter of my deck.

Thanks,
Carl T.

[FJ and G]

Ok, the garden had to wait...more experiments and success!

Successfully wired my Williams U-boat up to the SD-45 and got both locos (4 motors, 2 each), going simultaneously with just one 7.2 V battery!

It passed the torture course. About the only difference I found was that it ran slightly slower but had all the pulling power needed and seemed to be a bit smoother with 4 motors going at once.

Interestingly, before I hooked both up, I reversed wires on the one loco and it still operated both ways. However, I didn't try any experiments with the dual-powered lashup, instead, continuing the parallel wiring of yellow to yellow, blue to blue. If it were wired backwards, I don't know what would happen and don't know enough about electricity to want to find out.

Eventually, I'll wire 3 locos up.

But for now, it's back to gardening and BB the beagle needs walking.

Eventually, I'll publish more experiments here including the use of infrared and converting DCS to R/C-DCS, but I'm all experimented out for a while and it may be some time before I add to this.

Incidentally, the wiring for both Williams locos is identical to the diagram at the beginning of this post.

[FJ and G]

Today I'm testing for loading on one 7.2 V battery pak. Several heavy die-cast cars, 3 gondolas filled with steel bars

(one of which derailed due to bad trackwork--track pins missing). Using non-weighted cars, would be about a 16-car train

(now 8-car).

Still testing with Williams SD-45 loco; same battery, ESC hookup as previously described.

THe patio grade is approximately 4%, using mix of 042, 054, 072 curves--one or two pieces is extremely pitted with rust.

RESULTS: 7.2 is more than adequate power.

Operationally, the train seems to run better on the upgrade. On the downgrade, I found a few spots where the loco jerked

somewhat so I lowered my speed some. Over time, it seemed to smooth out a bit but operations going downhill are not as

smooth as uphill.

I'll be conducting more tests, hooking up the single battery pak with another locomotive. Actually, lots more testing but

I have a pickup truck full of mulch and have some garden and fencing work to do today and tomorrow so may have to report

back later.

Jim Duda has assisted greatly with this project and just wanted to thank him again.

BTW, it is below freezing outside so BB the beagle and I are indoors, operating the trains remotely as we look thru the

sliding glass door. I've got some big band music playing so we're chillin.

Some points of interests:

--do not place sections of track under your track like I did, b/c if you're using track power, it'll short your track :-)

--with wind gusts today at perhaps 20-25 mph, I've seen G gauge trains flip over because they present more "sail"

surface. The advantage with O scale outdoors is that it is harder to blow them over!

--note: I forgot to edit a couple of photos. When you get to those, turn your computer monitor 90 degrees to view.

--still haven't charged the original battery; lost track of # hours it's running

Cheers.

[Jim Duda]

If you want the lamps powered by your radio battery pack to be brighter, just put AA alkalines in the holder since they will give you a full 6 Volts (4 X 1.5V). The NiMh you have in there now are outputting about 4.8 volts (4 X 1.2V).

When the original power battery runs down, you have a 2nd battery to continue operations - probably 8 - 12 hours total...you can drink a lot of beers in that time...(wink)

[FJ and G]

Progress continues. Used the circuitry that Jim D describes above for light bulbs and it works really fine.

Also, operations were much smoother today with the one battery pak. I think it was eratic the other day b/c of the jumble of wires interfering with the rotation of the motors. I need to bundle up the wires now and tidy up!

Tested the loco and short train on curved grade of about 3%. Stopped and started the train several times on the ruling slope. No problems at all pulling. Instead of upping the voltage, I may now just use the one pack unless circumstances dictate otherwise (perhaps plowing heavy snow or something).

BTW, I'm still using the same charged battery pack and haven't yet had to recharge. Total running time now is around 3.5 hours. I'm beginning to wonder when I'll need to do a recharge!

I likely won't do too much testing in next several weeks as I've ordered some additonal connectors and will be in Austin Texas this week and next. So probably won't be adding much if anything to this post for a while.

Needless to say, the beta test went better than my wildest imagination.

[darianj]

Looks like a great project. Far beyond my skill level at this time. Thanks for sharing.

[Boyd]

Another way this could be done is to run constant voltage to the track,, then run the power through the RC system (as long as it is DC) then to the engines motor/motors.

[FJ and G]

OK, TMCC, I'll be there. I'm still experimenting with perhaps some slightly higher voltage lock-nut connectors etc, and when I get the optimal parts list together, I'll email you and you can purchase them and have them ready. The only soldering I did, btw, was on the fuse. The rest are connectors. The only tools I used were tiny screwdrivers to remove the shell of the loco and the rollers. The black wire connecting the bottom of the motors appears to be some sort of a ground. It is connected with a nut to a metal ring. I used a tiny wrachet set to remove the nut, but had to hold the other side with needle-nose pliers. I could bring along my tools. Oh, and wire strippers and crimper if going that route.

Never been to a garden meet so REALLY looking forward. Was actually working on the garden and doing new roadbed today as the weather warmed up.

[tmcc man]

Good news Dave,
I will be there. It is from April 7th to April 9th. Directions to come. I will try to remember to give them to you.

[wrmcclellan]

Dave,

Nice accomplishment! Certainly opens a few doors for variety!

Keep it up!
Roy

[tmcc man]

Dave, a good idea for us to meet would probably be at the East Coast Hobby Show, in Ft. Washington, right near my house. I am checking the dates right now, because I might be there with the Garden RR club.

[lyle_styles]

Now this is amazing. The applications of R/C is endless.

Dave, give yourself an atta boy for taking the time to post all this information for the rest of us to enjoy and learn from.

I recently was looking over some feedback on E-Bay and one had really caught my attention. It was from a seller who posted feedback that went something like this, "Model train people are the nicest people around"

Not sure if I could find it again but thought it was so relevant to what I have seen here in the forum from so many people.

I too will be keeping an eye on this post.

Thanks Dave,
Lyle R Ehlers

[csxt30]

Dave : a great accomplishment there !! With a few investors, you may become the President of a very large Corporation ! This could revolutinize the hobby !!
Looks like a really lot of fun ! I've flown a few of R/C helis, but landing on a moving flat car is probably beyond my capabilities !! [:D][:D] Now take offs would be ok ! A good idea by Mr. Duda, I might say !! [:D] How about the Missle
& Exploding boxcar ? ! You could blow up a boxcar sitting in a siding somewhere ! The kids would really like that, too !
Thanks,

[Jim Duda]

HA! You can put a new twist to the old "Helicopter Car"...have one of your R/C buddies that flies those mini electric helos mount his bird on one of your flats. He'll control it with his own transmitter so he can take off an land on your flat...betcha' that would turn some heads!!!

The possibilities, as they say, are endless...