Baltimore Streetcars

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Baltimore Streetcars
Posted by daveklepper on Friday, July 12, 2019 6:28 AM

Three Baltimore streetcar pictures, one iconic Brill semi-convertable, with the yellow paint denoting it's one-man front-entrance, and two pictures on the Mt. Washington line, which used both 1931 Brill Peter Witts and PCCs.

Pictures taken Spring 1947, age 15.  John Stern and Bill (Giggles) Watson were the older railfans who had me tag along. We did go by PRR both ways, not driving.

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Posted by rcdrye on Friday, July 12, 2019 6:55 AM

In the photo of 6032 you can really appreciate Baltimore's wide gauge tracks (5' 4 1/2"), the gauge left over from Baltimore's relatively short-lived cable cars.

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Friday, July 12, 2019 10:32 AM

Your new trolley posts were quite timely for me David, I've just finished reading Frank Rowsome's book "Trolley Car Treasury" from 1956!  Fun book!

You're streetcar posts are always fascinating!

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, July 17, 2019 5:32 AM

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, July 18, 2019 5:43 AM

 

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Posted by BaltACD on Thursday, July 18, 2019 10:01 PM

As a kid my family lived in the Catonsville area of Baltimore County.  Every day to go to school I walked down Ingleside Avenue and crossed Frederick Road, upon which the No. 8 streetcar line operated between a loop at Rolling Road in Catonsville to Towson.  Recall many times waiting for the traffic light to change and watching the yellow and cream BTC street cars to pass.  

Frequently my mother would take me to downtown Baltimore to go shopping at the major department stores, Hutzlers, Hoschild-Kohn and Stewarts.  We would have lunch in Hutzlers coffee shop that was in the basement of their building on Howard street and feel the rumbling of B&O train passing through the Howard Street Tunnel.  Returning home we would normally take the No. 23 bus line that operated from a location on North Rolling Road in Catonsville to Middle River - the bus stop was closer to our house and we would be loaded down with our purchases.  We moved from Baltimore in March of 1959 - when I was moved back to Baltimore in 1972 all the street cars were gone.

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Posted by Miningman on Thursday, July 18, 2019 10:35 PM

Great memories! We all experienced something along those lines. 

Civilization is dead now however. 

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Posted by BaltACD on Friday, July 19, 2019 8:55 AM

Miningman
Great memories! We all experienced something along those lines. 

Civilization is dead now however. 

I was invited by my cousin that lived in Towson to attend a Orioles double header against the Red Sox in 1956 with her fiancee.  The 'problem' was I had to go from Catonsville to Towson - the answer the No. 8 streetcar.  As I recall, this was a near two hour journey on a Sunday morning with all the stops going into downtown, the traffic downtown and all the stops from downtown to Towson.  (The Baltimore Beltway didn't open until late 1958 that would have made such a O-D trip possible in about 30 minutes.)  Baltimore weather being what it is - the games got cancelled by rain and my cousin and her fiancee drove me home so I would not have to use the No. 8 in the reverse direction.  I was 9 approaching 10 at the time.

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Posted by daveklepper on Saturday, July 20, 2019 3:08 PM

Sorry about the lack of captions on the last photo postoing.  Keuboard problems.  The PCC and Peter Witt pictures are all on the Mt. Washington Line.  The Brill Semi-Convertable is on either the Union Ave. (or Street) or the Key Avenue shuttle, both lines one-car, one-track short shuttles connecting to the Mt. Washington Line.  All Baltimore photos, Spring 1947.

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, July 21, 2019 1:03 AM

Richard Allman reports that it is the Union Avenue Shuttle.  The area has been "gentrified." And the Mt. Washington Line Bridge crossed the PRR's Baltimore Northern RR, which is now the northern (and first) light rail line, with the line's Mt. Washington Station.

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, July 22, 2019 2:15 AM

Here is the material directly from Richard:

David- interesting to see 5765 in one- man paint scheme. Union Avenue is correct. The west end of it in the Jones Valley near where the current Westbury station of the Central Light Rail Line.
And the Mt. Washington Bridge with the PCC on it- in the lower left, you can see the Northern Central RR. It is the current r-o-w for the Light Rail and very near the current Mt. Washington station. Union Avenue is now gentrified.
The one Witt car is shown on Falls Road coming toward the photographer.
Unfortunately none of the two-man semis were preserved, although in the back of their shop is a nearly identical ex-Norfolk car in very bad condition.
I have two 3-D printed shells of the one-man semis that I will begin working on when I complete my Kansas City air-electric PCC. Narrative about that will be forthcoming in next 1-2 weeks.
One of them I will do in the one-man yellow and cream typical of the one-man cars, the other in the drab NCL scheme,
Attaching photos of what Bob Dietrich and I hope will be the finished product from the 3-D printed shells that are produced by Joe Spinella and Greg King in Australia. Greg is a retired tram operating instructor in Melbourne and an amazingly skilled O-scale modeler, an operator in the heritage operation at Ballarat. He and Joe currently working on an HO scale model of a Brisbane Phoenix car.
For more info on the HO model, check out June 2019 Trolleyville Times. I have an article in there about it (though George did not credit me!) 
Trolleyville Times
https://www.trolleyville.com/tv/times/current/index.shtml

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, July 22, 2019 4:02 AM

Ends:

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, July 22, 2019 4:23 AM

 

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, July 22, 2019 2:00 PM

Frm Richard Allman:

Oops-that very high bridge was not crossing the Northern Central - it was crossing the Ma.  And Pa!! Kelly Avenue bridge crossed and still crosses the old Northern Central - sorry for misinformation!!

 

 
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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, July 23, 2019 1:42 AM

More:

At the end of the Union Avenue line:

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Posted by Miningman on Tuesday, July 23, 2019 2:09 AM

David .. none of the pictures last 3 posts came through. 

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, July 23, 2019 9:37 AM

I'll email them to you as attachments and ask you to post them again!

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Posted by Miningman on Tuesday, July 23, 2019 12:07 PM

Very good.  Be glad to assist.

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Tuesday, July 23, 2019 7:37 PM

Reminds me, next train show I go to I've got to keep my eyes open for an MTH Public Service PCC.  There's one out there somewhere... 

Balt, talk about coincidences!  I have a brother-in-law that lives in Catonsville!  Small world!  Last time there we made an antiques raid down the road to Ellicott City.  Saw the old B&O station museum too!  Neat place!

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Posted by BaltACD on Tuesday, July 23, 2019 9:15 PM

Flintlock76
Reminds me, next train show I go to I've got to keep my eyes open for an MTH Public Service PCC.  There's one out there somewhere... 

Balt, talk about coincidences!  I have a brother-in-law that lives in Catonsville!  Small world!  Last time there we made an antiques raid down the road to Ellicott City.  Saw the old B&O station museum too!  Neat place!

I have lived in a number of locations around Baltimore.  When I was born my parents lived in Linthicum Heights.  Subsequently Dad was transferred to Newark, OH, Garrett, IN, Pittsburgh, PA and then back to Baltimore and we lived in Catonsville.  Transferred back to Garrett, IN then Akron, OH and Washington, IN.  I hired out in Washington, IN in 1965 and subsequently transferred to Pittsburgh and then Akron so I could attend Kent State and work.  Upon graduation I go transferred to Baltimore - lived for several months in an apartment in the Moravia section of Baltimore City then my wife and I bought a house in Reisterstown, subsequently selling it to purchase a house in the Lakeshore area of Pasadena.  Went through the agony of a divorce - she got the house, I got my pension and stock that I owned.  While going through the divorce I roomed with a guy in the Cape St.Claire area of Annapolis - once the divorce was final I cashed in my stock to make the down payment on my house in Sykesville, this time next year the mortgage will have been paid in full.  Six months after I bought the house, I got forced to Jacksonville.  When I looked at selling the house - the bottom had dropped out of the housing market and I would be taking a loss I could not afford if I sold.  In keeping the house, it permitted me to be Dad when I returned for vacations - not som yaahoo living out of a motel room.  The relationships I have with my daughter and son tell me I made the right decision.

In Jacksonville I rented a portion of a condo that the landlord tried to sell out from under me three times.  The third time I bought it, there are 9 years left on that mortgage and it is my snowbird base of operations.

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Tuesday, July 23, 2019 9:32 PM

We've moved four times in the last forty years.  Nothing compared to you, but each time was a pain.  Next time will be the last.  God willing!

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Posted by BaltACD on Tuesday, July 23, 2019 11:03 PM

Flintlock76
We've moved four times in the last forty years.  Nothing compared to you, but each time was a pain.  Next time will be the last.  God willing!

It wasn't until the 5th grade that I attended the same school two years in a row.

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, July 24, 2019 4:12 PM

More from David:

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Posted by BaltACD on Wednesday, July 24, 2019 8:58 PM

Miningman

More from David:

These are of the same car at the same location - appearantly a few seconds apart with the bottom having been taken first.

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Friday, July 26, 2019 11:28 AM

I never fail to be amazed at the sheer scope of electric traction in the old days. 

I should be amazed at its fall, but in the case of the part of the country I grew up in, Northern New Jersey (for those who don't know by now) I can understand why.

The Public Service trolley lines went just about everywhere, but the drop in ridership during the 1930's, plus the advantage of running diesel buses over tax-free public roads as opposed to taxable private right-of-ways made the downfall inevitable, many being abandoned by the start of WW2.

The war gave a brief "stay of execution" to those that were left due to gas and rubber rationing, but eventually they went as well.

Maybe a public-private partnership might have kept a lot of them alive, but nobody thought in those terms years ago.  

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, July 31, 2019 8:32 AM

Inline image

The best photo of the last stop on the Union Avenue shuttle, cleaned up, and a test as to whether or not I found a way to post without using Imgur, which I still cannot access at the Yeshiva.

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, July 31, 2019 11:57 AM

Doesn't work David .. or any of the Jack May pictures either over on trains. 

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, July 31, 2019 3:48 PM

Here is Daves picture 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Wednesday, July 31, 2019 5:48 PM

A little hard to tell, but is there a bit of flooding going on there?

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