St.Thomas, Ont. and Jumbo with a Caboose

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St.Thomas, Ont. and Jumbo with a Caboose
Posted by Miningman on Friday, April 5, 2019 8:55 PM

Note: The statue was erected in 1985 for the centennial of Jumbo's untimely death in St.Thomas, September 15, 1885. 

Jumbo statue stands out more than the caboose! 

Repainted in a more historical appearance with Montmorency orange paint scheme. April 2017 Pam Aggelakos

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Friday, April 5, 2019 9:31 PM

Jumbo's impressive, but that caboose is more so.

It looks considerably older than the CN insignia on its side, and it still has plain bearings.   Any idea how old?

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Posted by Miningman on Friday, April 5, 2019 9:41 PM

All I know is that it was originally Port Stanley Terminal Railway #65. 

That is what it should appear as! The CN noodle is all wrong. 

At the least they should use the 'Serves all Canada'  Maple Leaf

That would be more period authentic although there probably was a few wooden cabeese that got the noodle, but that's not the point. They would have been for some special purpose. 

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Posted by Miningman on Friday, April 5, 2019 10:13 PM

Maybe originally it had this paint scheme 

Or this one :

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Posted by Miningman on Friday, April 5, 2019 11:41 PM
Jumbo doing what he loved to do .. being a celebrity star.

 
 
Jumbo's demise in St. Thomas. He saved his little buddy Tom Thumb hurling him out of harms way. 
( well... at least according to PT Barnum) 
 
 
 
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Posted by Miningman on Saturday, April 6, 2019 1:08 AM

How many elephants get their own autobiography! 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Saturday, April 6, 2019 10:38 AM

Great shot of that preserved CNR caboose!  That's  more like it!

And that's a good story of Jumbo told by his handler.  You know, it's only in relatively recent years people are beginning to realize elephants are a lot more intelligent than they've been given credit for.  Amazing animals.

Then again, most wild animals are more intelligent than people realize.

Soeaking of amazing, I'm still astounded at the things Mike comes up with.  I hope somebody  is taking notice and that sombody  should realize Mikes "exile" is a loss to us all! 

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Posted by Miningman on Saturday, April 6, 2019 11:39 AM

Actually Mike is still with us in several ways but we all know what you mean. 

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Posted by Miningman on Saturday, April 6, 2019 3:46 PM
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Posted by Miningman on Sunday, April 7, 2019 2:19 AM

Some Sunday morning reading with your coffee! 

Madison Square Garden, which was Commodore Vanderbilt's old NY & Harlem station before Grand Central Depot, greatly renovated by P.T Barnum.
 
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Posted by wjstix on Wednesday, April 10, 2019 8:32 AM

Canadian National introduced the 'wet noodle' in 1960, the last year they ran mainline steam. CN still had a fair number of wood cabooses in everyday use during the 1960's and later, and many of them were repainted into that CN scheme.

I notice on this caboose, the herald and reporting marks are mounted on separate pieces attached to the car, rather than just painted on as would normally be the case. I wonder if that was done as part of the restoration, so that the car could easily be adjusted / backdated at some point in the future?

Stix
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Posted by Flintlock76 on Wednesday, April 10, 2019 9:21 AM

I'll tell you, irregardless of when it was introduced that CN "noodle" looks lousy!  More "Sci-fi" than railroady.

No more inspired than Penn Central's "mating worms."

OK, I can understand why it came about, it's more modern-looking and certainly cheaper to apply, but still...

If you're a railroad, LOOK like a railroad!  Pick a classic herald and don't change it!

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Posted by SD70Dude on Wednesday, April 10, 2019 12:00 PM

Flintlock76

If you're a railroad, LOOK like a railroad!  Pick a classic herald and don't change it!

They did, and haven't changed it in nearly 60 years now.  The CN noodle has become a classic logo in its own right, and is a classic story in corporate marketing and industrial design.

https://www.cn.ca/en/stories/20170609-allan-fleming/

But I think writing "www.cn.ca" on the side of locomotives underneath the logo looks tacky.

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Wednesday, April 10, 2019 12:40 PM

What you say is true 'Dude, can't argue with it, but compare the "noodle" with the classic herald on the caboose in Miningman's post of April 5th.

Which one would you rather see, or have?   

You see, I remember back in 1970 or so when a lot of American corporations updated logos they'd had since the 1920's-1930's to ones that were more sleek and modern.  It was a PR disaster!  The public hated them!  The then-existing Bell Telephone System's new "Bell" logo was compared to a Nazi helmet, for example.

Most, if not all, very quietly reverted to the old logos.

Of course, if the CN "noodle" is all most people remember it's another matter, but still... 

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, April 10, 2019 12:41 PM

I stand 100% with Flintlock.

Even as a kid I saw that the route between the end of the C and far top of the N was nor served well by going all over the place like that and that it was a straight line and much shorter route. So I thought ' maybe there's a mountain or a lake in the way, but there couldn't be that many mountains and lakes'. 

I loved the green and gold and the Maple Leaf ' Serves all Canada'. That held up well especially on passenger cars and were very iconic and spoke of railroads.

Imagine if the Union Pacific went the wormy route and abandoned tradition and colours. Went all moderernized marketing wise. Thankfully they resisted all that pressure to do so and are perhaps the only one to stick with it.

Strangely enough I did like the CPR's multimark. Probably because of the colour coding on freight cars and applying it to everything, hotels, ships, trucks, communications, planes, you name it. Orange is beautiful, used to sing it all day long. 

Even they have seen the light and reverted somewhat to the Beaver even if it dosent show all that well. There is hope. 

The www on CN locomotives is ridiculous. We know, we know, we got it, a long time ago. Embarrassing really. 60 years now and still don't like the noodle. A pox on the noodle. Feh, bletch, pzzzz.

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Wednesday, April 10, 2019 12:49 PM

Thanks Vince!

You know, some things you change some things you don't.  Most people like a constant, some thing that's a "rock in the whirlpool" they can hold onto in a rapidly changing, confusing world.  It can be anything from a corporate logo of a brand (of anything) you like to that burger and ice cream place you went to as a kid and, God be praised, is STILL there when you go home to your old stompin' grounds.

"Progress is change, but change isn't always progress."

Imagine Santa Claus re-imaged into a clean-shaven Dockers-wearing urbanite who uses Amazon for deliveries instead of the sleigh. Or instead of a sleigh he uses an ATV and his bags are made by Gucci.  See where I'm coming from?

Wayne

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, April 10, 2019 1:00 PM

Don't give Bezos any ideas! He could buy Santa, lock, stock and barrel. 

Just think if UP went the CN and Penn Central route maybe they wouldn't have the steam program at all. These things have power to them. 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Wednesday, April 10, 2019 1:20 PM

Don't worry about Santa, he could buy and sell Bezos ten times over.

I have it on best authority, my grandmother went to school with him!

And she NEVER would have lied to me about something that important!  Wink

My God, don't even THINK about UP without a steam program!  But of course, the scary thing is, it could happen, it all depends who's fanny is in the CEO's seat.

Probably won't happen though, UP's been around since 1862 and still going strong, there aren't many companies here in the US that can say as much.  UP's proud of that, and steam's part of the heritage.

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, April 10, 2019 7:06 PM
The link to CN logo evolution says CN's second hundredth anniversary is coming up exactly 75 years after D-Day.
 
1919: Canadian National Railways
The name “Canadian National Railways” first appeared officially on December 20, 1918, when the Government authorised that term as a descriptive name for the various properties that made up Canadian Government Railways — principally, Canadian Northern, National Transcontinental and Intercolonial.
 
Six months later, on June 6, 1919, Parliament passed legislation to incorporate the Canadian National Railway Company Limited — and CN was born. The following year, the Grand Trunk Pacific was added to the line-up, giving the new railroad two transcontinental networks.
 
 
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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, April 10, 2019 7:30 PM

Leave it to Mike to find 'the napkin'... 

https://www.logodesignlove.com/cn-logo-evolution

 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Wednesday, April 10, 2019 7:54 PM

Oh, so THAT's what you meant by the "napkin!"  I was wondering.

Still, the evolution was interesting, but I like the old "Maple Leaf" herald the best.  The old, old herald with the moose is pretty cool too!

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, May 8, 2019 7:19 PM

Found this fine old picture of a Grand Trunk 4-4-0 in St. Thomas. Long lean and lankey. Way back in the day.

CNR predecessor roads. 

GTR Standard 4-4-0 Added 340 in St.Thomas. 

 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Wednesday, May 8, 2019 7:25 PM

The "Grand Trunk!" 

That's one way of returning the topic to Jumbo!  Whistling

I'm sorry, I'll go quietly...

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, May 8, 2019 7:34 PM

But even with all the change hype, it does have to be said I am somewhat in awe of a Canadian numismatic community that knows, and cites, the difference between an ES44DC and ES44AC on coinage.

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Posted by Miningman on Wednesday, May 8, 2019 7:44 PM

Yeah.. The Grand Trunk.  You know Canadian National could do a really smart thing and rename themselves the Grand Trunk Railway ( or Railroad) system wide. In this case that name means something, and the rose would smell sweeter. 

I imagine the Dude would object but I'll suggest the name change with a caveat just for him .. that a major captive mainline contained within Alberta and Saskatchewan be named the Canadian Northern, locomotives, cars and all, a wholly owned subsidiary of the Grand Trunk and a nod to history and free markets. 

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Wednesday, May 8, 2019 10:21 PM

And you know, the "Grand Trunk Railway" just sounds so "Imperial."

Even though some wags have said "The sun never set on the British Empire because God didn't trust 'em with the lights out!"   Wink

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Posted by SD70Dude on Thursday, May 9, 2019 12:30 AM

Miningman

Yeah.. The Grand Trunk.  You know Canadian National could do a really smart thing and rename themselves the Grand Trunk Railway ( or Railroad) system wide. In this case that name means something, and the rose would smell sweeter. 

I imagine the Dude would object but I'll suggest the name change with a caveat just for him .. that a major captive mainline contained within Alberta and Saskatchewan be named the Canadian Northern, locomotives, cars and all, a wholly owned subsidiary of the Grand Trunk and a nod to history and free markets. 

Throw in internal shortlines named Northern Alberta and Edmonton, Yukon & Pacific and we just might have a deal!

Seriously though, one of the government's conditions of CN's privatization was that the name must remain "Canadian National Railway Company".

Greetings from Alberta

-an Articulate Malcontent

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Posted by Miningman on Thursday, May 9, 2019 1:13 AM

Interesting. Or else what? The shares are on the free market. Theoretically the company could be bought by a series of shell companies ... aww never mind.

Some day they will see the light. 

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Posted by Overmod on Thursday, May 9, 2019 8:01 AM

SD70Dude
Seriously though, one of the government's conditions of CN's privatization was that the name must remain "Canadian National Railway Company".

Yet another reason why my beloved "Great White Northern" renaming will not see the light of day.

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Posted by Miningman on Thursday, May 9, 2019 10:39 AM

Well there is precident with the White Pass and Yukon, and the Great White North made famous by Bob and Doug McKenzie is iconic, but the howls from the numerous politically correct crowd would make this an impossibility. 

OK name for a home pike but I wouldn't brag about it too much, least your home be torched. 

I will say what everyone is thinking though and that is Canadian National running down the centre of the USA down to the Gulf and elsewhere is a bit of a poke in the eye, a bit brash. Even though privatized now for some time it still has that association with government heavy handed ownership ( many Canukleheads still think it's government owned). 

Grand Trunk it should be, reflecting Railroading itself, sort of in the fine tradition of Union Pacific, with no ties to anything government. 

Now what to do with Canadian Pacific .. some kind of CanAm or AmCan or Pan- something but after a merger, if that's possible. 

Too much thinking. 

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