They weren't NYS&W buses -- I think, and Wayne can check this, that they were Public Service.
The Susquehanna was run by the Erie when Kidde got the Transfer running, and the Northern Branch ran right by North Bergen, so it was a 'natural' for both operations to take advantage of the connection. I have seen a 1959 Northern Branch schedule that shows the period that the buses ran into the Port Authority terminal (so indicated in the timetable as a 'stop') and interestingly one of the six trains did not stop there.
Why the Transfer wasn't a big thing after the Erie quit Pavonia is another matter. Getting into Hoboken was a grand rigmarole of backing and hitching that added a considerable time to the trip, which might have made the 'shortcut' to midtown more attractive... BUT...
even in the late Fifties the grand rivalry between the Public Service and Red and Tan buses was on, which had something like 20-minute headways EACH along much of the Northern Branch route and went straight into the Port Authority terminal without a change. Stilwells towed by RS2s and 3s wasn't much competition for that.
But what are the other two stations with bus connections to name trains?
NYS&W did use Public Service buses, but they were used for NYS&W (and Erie) passengers, using NYS&W tickets.
I remembered the tickets, not the label on the sides of the buses. They may also have haf a different colior scheme than most PSofNJ buses, a color scheme like that of the Suzie-Q's ACF self-propelled cars.
My point was that NYS&W didn't own the buses and didn't employ the drivers. The ticketing reflected the fact that no additional pickup stops were made and the service was an extension of rail fare.
The other two stations did not provide service 'free to ticketholders'; they charged the highly interesting price of 91 cents -- guess why -- and at least in the late Fifties made a point of noting in the timetables that checked baggage would NOT be handled on the motorcoaches. Points to someone who knows where any checked baggage would go for pickup later...
Are these two stations in NY,
or are they relocated transfer points in NJ?
As far as I recollect, the only NYCity stations werefirst vthe Dixiw Hotel Bus Terminal and then the Port Authority Bus Terminal, a move sometime afgter WWII.
The three NJ points would be Erie Terminal, with baggage service for trains that terminated there (not all SuzieQ trains went that far, oarticularly the self-propelled cars that reversed at the main-line trasnsfwe point), and the transfer point on thast main line west of the lincoln Tunnel, and the third on the Erie Northern Branch. Never knew the name of the last, and forgot the name of the second. RC?
The mainline transfer point was just Susquehanna Transfer.
One of the points was Susquehanna Transfer. The others were in New Jersey, and not very far from each other.
As a hint, the bus service from the two ceased the same year as Erie Northern Branch trains could have used Susquehanna Transfer. (I am not sure how long the Northern Branch trains did; the latest schedule I can find easily is from 1959, and does not show that all the six daily trains stopped there even then.)
In what actual geographical location was Susquahanna Transfer located?
North Bergen NJ. Site is where I-495 crosses the Susquehanna.
I recall that many of the self-propelled ACF cars that ran to and from downtown Patterson did not use Erie Terminal but ised Susquuahanna Transfer as an end-point.
daveklepperI recall that many of the self-propelled ACF cars that ran to and from downtown Paterson did not use Erie Terminal but ised Susquehanna Transfer as an end-point.
I have already explained what I think was the reason the Northern Branch trains, even with their ridiculous post-'58 terminal access, didn't make more use of the bus transfer in the same way.
I wasn't there at the time, but I think the construction of the Susquehanna Transfer operation was timed to open when the 'express highway' extending Route 3 across to the helix and the Lincoln Tunnel opened. At that point about 600 buses per day were going through the tunnel!
I wonder whether the exclusive bus lane, which was initiated at the end of 1970, would have proven enough of an 'enhancement' to bus service from Susquehanna Transfer in the mornings to make it more attractive.
I was the first to come up with the SusyQ, but it is possible you really meant the Erie. And RC had details I lacked. I leave vto both of yoy, and I think I can have a question if requested.
The railroad in question was not the Susquehanna, c although I was mistaken (actually misguided by a citation in Wikipedia -- not for the first time -- about the name train-operating road.
The two other stations definitely had name train service met by dedicated coaches, one of which (with names of great antiquity, I believe) was interesting for having a bus connection in one direction but not the other in at least one timetable.
I find it almost incomprehensible that rcdrye hasn't jumped on this.
Or on my other active question, which yes, is related...
The Atlantic and Pacific Expresses dated back to 1885. The bus connections started after WWII, and moved with the Erie to DL&W's Hoboken Terminal. Based on where they were going in New York, the Lincoln Tunnel makes the most sense. The bus destinations are listed with the other question.
The answer to the other question was the Erie. Not this one.
Give you another hint: the length of time the bus service was offered for the name train in question was probably less than half a decade.
I certain was not aware of it, but did the DL&W ever offer bus coinnectioins for vthe Pheobe Snow?
Dave got to it before I could...
ERIE TABLE1 19610625 - Phoebe Snow (train) - Wikipedia
The locations are the same as those served by the Erie's buses before the E-L merger, and were probably the same buses.
It appears to me that the "DL&W" did not offer motor-coach connection even after the Erie moved to Hoboken. The 1960 schedule I saw does not mention it.
However, by the Erie-Lackawanna schedule of 1962, the Phoebe Snow has its own bus entry, with the note that it is a 'trainside connection'.
Gone by April of 1966.
Considering that the Erie/E-L's route between the New York area and Chicago was long, slow, and missed major metropolitan areas, they competed fairly well, not dropping the final train until 1970. The Phoebe Snow's post-merger life was fairly short. It was really more of an Erie train than a DL&W train.
rcdrye Considering that the Erie/E-L's route between the New York area and Chicago was long, slow, and missed major metropolitan areas, they competed fairly well, not dropping the final train until 1970. The Phoebe Snow's post-merger life was fairly short. It was really more of an Erie train than a DL&W train.
CSSHEGEWISCH...the fact that Erie missed most of the major traffic sources except for Youngstown was a major reason why Erie's passenger service held up as well as it did.
"Smaller" cities may have considerable high-end travel demand...
1. Should I ask the next question?
2. Did the new Pheobe Snow operate via Scranton or Port Jervis?
3. I rode the Lake Cities before the Hoboken-Youngstown sleeper was drpped. It ran via Scranton. Coach-only west of Youngstown.
Phoebe Snow (E-L version) ran via Scranton. Dave came up with the Lackawanna, even though the answer was Erie-Lackawanna.
A Class-I Railroad built a standard-gauge line, later converted it to narrow-gauge, and never converted it back to standard gauge.
Railroad? Line end-points? Why standard? Why converted to narrow and never back? What type of freight kept the line operational in the final years of its operation? Describe with as much information as you can the locomotives used on this line in its final years. Where was freight transferred between standard and narrow?
D&RGW built its line from Durango CO to Farmington NH as standard gauge in 1905, mostly for the same mining and ranching traffic carried by the rest of the San Juan line. Apparently the thought was that the San Juan extension from Antonito could be converted to standard gauge with only minor realignment. Once they got tired of transshipping in Durango (around 1923), the line was converted to narrow gauge just in time for an oil boom. Enough equipment,pipe, and oil traffic remained to keep the branch (and, really, the entire San Juan extension) alive until 1968. I believe the line had heavy enough rail to use any of the D&RGW's narrow-gauge steam locomotives.
By all means ask the next questionm, but:
The line was built to standard gauge because the AT&SF had planned a branch to Farmington. It was converted to narrow after it was obvious the AT&SF would not be building their branch.
Any of the four types narrow-gauge 2-8-2s could be used, but the type frequent on the branch was the type rebuilt from standard-gauge 2-8-0s.
The post-WWII narrow-gauge traffic was interchanged with standard-gauge at Alamosa, despite a third rail for standard gauge extending to Antonito.
Despite operating on a track layout poorly suited for single-ended cars, the North Shore Line had several brass-railed parlor-observations. They were assigned to trains like the Badger Limited and Eastern Limited, advertising direct connections with New York Central trains, including the 20th Century Limited. Northbound trips for trains making these connections were two miles longer than southbound trips. Explain the reason.
Northbound trips started at 63rd & Dorchester while southbound trains terminated at Roosevelt Rd.
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