It did not meet the 1,000,000 lb 'buff' strength required for US interchange, The same can be said for the Gernam design much of the Acela was based on. Looking great and being able to 'mix' with the rest of the US rail fleet are two different things....
Jim
Modeling BNSF and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin
jrbernier It did not meet the 1,000,000 lb 'buff' strength required for US interchange, The same can be said for the Gernam design much of the Acela was based on. Looking great and being able to 'mix' with the rest of the US rail fleet are two different things.... Jim
You'll have to excuse me, I'm not really up to date on my terminology. What is buff strength?
I can't answer your question but I do know that an Alsom VP told me several years ago that there are a lot of European innovations and technologies that cannot be used or appllied to North American railroading because we need for heavier standards in case of collision or derailment. I would take the term "buff strength" threfore to mean its ability to buffer or withstand collisions and derailments.
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There were many reasons why the X2000 was not retained in the US after the demonstration.
One of the main ones was that that the train belonged to the Swedish State Railways. The train was in the US for what turned onto a two-year demonstration tour. The trour which cost several million dollars was paid for in part by the manufacturer, ABB, and in part by Amtrak, with contributions by the FRA and Canadian Pacific. The tour included three months of running on the NEC during which the train made it between NYP and WAS in as little as 2 hours 23 minutes!! X2000 was permitted to travel at 135mph under a waiver granted by FRA. In its test run between Trenton and New Brunswick, NJ, the tain hit 155mph.
Like other European and Asian equipment, the structural strength requirements differ from those in the US. However, the design of the X2000 lent itself to modifications to comply with "buff strenth" and other requirements. The manufacturer was prepared to undertake the necessary redesigns.
The manufacturer, ABB, simulated the NYP - BOS run and satisfied itself that it could be done INin 3 hours without ever exceeding the train's 135 mph capabilities while still adhering to Metro North's 90 mph speed limit. (Meeting that requirement was then regarded by the manufacturer as a fundamental requirement of the entire NEC improvement project and was mandated by Congress, but ignored even now.)
During the procurement process, FRA also became concerned about safety on the NEC and required that either no passengers be carried in the "driving trailer" (cab car) when the train was in push mode, or that a second power car be placed at the previously non-powered end of the train. The result is that the Acela has 12000 horsepower and two power cars for a six intermediate car consist.
Finally, Amtrak would not consider an "off-the-shelf" trainset. ABB was repeatedly told that the train had to be a unique design for the US.
The train was certainly well-suited to the NEC which is very similar to the Swedish State Rwy's main line between Stockholm and Gothenburg. There is a mix of taffic including regular intercity and commuter trains as well as freight. The line also has many grade crossings and has a very curving roadbed. X2000 cut a near 5 hour travel time down to as little as 2hrs 59 minutes, and captured a large market share of the travel between the two cities.
X2000
x2000 There were many reasons why the X2000 was not retained in the US after the demonstration. One of the main ones was that that the train belonged to the Swedish State Railways. The train was in the US for what turned onto a two-year demonstration tour. The trour which cost several million dollars was paid for in part by the manufacturer, ABB, and in part by Amtrak, with contributions by the FRA and Canadian Pacific. The tour included three months of running on the NEC during which the train made it between NYP and WAS in as little as 2 hours 23 minutes!! X2000 was permitted to travel at 135mph under a waiver granted by FRA. In its test run between Trenton and New Brunswick, NJ, the tain hit 155mph. Like other European and Asian equipment, the structural strength requirements differ from those in the US. However, the design of the X2000 lent itself to modifications to comply with "buff strenth" and other requirements. The manufacturer was prepared to undertake the necessary redesigns. The manufacturer, ABB, simulated the NYP - BOS run and satisfied itself that it could be done INin 3 hours without ever exceeding the train's 135 mph capabilities while still adhering to Metro North's 90 mph speed limit. (Meeting that requirement was then regarded by the manufacturer as a fundamental requirement of the entire NEC improvement project and was mandated by Congress, but ignored even now.) During the procurement process, FRA also became concerned about safety on the NEC and required that either no passengers be carried in the "driving trailer" (cab car) when the train was in push mode, or that a second power car be placed at the previously non-powered end of the train. The result is that the Acela has 12000 horsepower and two power cars for a six intermediate car consist. Finally, Amtrak would not consider an "off-the-shelf" trainset. ABB was repeatedly told that the train had to be a unique design for the US. The train was certainly well-suited to the NEC which is very similar to the Swedish State Rwy's main line between Stockholm and Gothenburg. There is a mix of taffic including regular intercity and commuter trains as well as freight. The line also has many grade crossings and has a very curving roadbed. X2000 cut a near 5 hour travel time down to as little as 2hrs 59 minutes, and captured a large market share of the travel between the two cities. X2000
Okay, that clears up a lot. Thank you.
The fundamental concept of buff strength is that European railways are designed for crash avoidance; we need designs for crash survival. Even in the days of steam, British locomotives did not need headlights.
This is why we cannot assume that other nations will innovate for us--there is little usable "off-the-shelf" technology.
"Make no little plans; they have no magic to stir men's blood." Daniel Burnham
Maglev The fundamental concept of buff strength is that European railways are designed for crash avoidance; we need designs for crash survival. Even in the days of steam, British locomotives did not need headlights. This is why we cannot assume that other nations will innovate for us--there is little usable "off-the-shelf" technology.
That's not quite true. The Frech Turbos were an adaptation of a European design. Acela shares a lot with TGV, but it's a bit of a stretch to call it an adaptation. Propusion, suspension, ROW, catenary, maintenance practice, etc. are all available "off the shelf". It would take some structural redesign to get the buff strength needed for mixed service. A "clean sheet of paper" HSR line could likely be built w/o meeting FRA buff strength requirements.
-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/)
You missed the big thing.
In selecting the Canadian "Acela" design (with help from France), they were able to give "cash straped" Amtrak much better finance terms.
Don U. TCA 73-5735
The "Made in USA" thing...
If our Air Force buys tankers from Boeing or Airbus, is there really a difference in the number of American USA jobs? Like it or not, this is a GLOBAL economy.
Washington State almost lost $60 million in Stimulus money for our beleaguered ferry system because of a requirement that new boats be manufactured in-state. Due to problems with 80-year old hulls, workers have had trouble commuting to one of the most important military bases for guarding the Pacific; our ferry shortage is a NATIONAL problem. (Washington State Ferries carries about as many passengers annually as Amtrak)
But I always thought it was odd to look out the front window of a NEC train to see a Swedish eagle on an AEM-7. I have been out of work since October; only one month mortgage in the bank; yesterday looked into hawking the sterling the N. O. & M. Division gave my great -grandfather. It would probably get melted, sent to India, made into cheap jewelry, and wind up being sold at Walmart.
Where am I going here? What we need is to re-tool our manufacturing and economy to more durable goods and higher quality service. We need to build more trains and fewer automobiles. We need to be served in restaurants, not handed our rations through a window.
Yes, we should have kept the X2000; ran it until it broke and then built new ones that wouldn't break that way. We should be on our third or fourth generation of NEC high-speed trains now.
Maglev The "Made in USA" thing... If our Air Force buys tankers from Boeing or Airbus, is there really a difference in the number of American USA jobs? Like it or not, this is a GLOBAL economy. Washington State almost lost $60 million in Stimulus money for our beleaguered ferry system because of a requirement that new boats be manufactured in-state. Due to problems with 80-year old hulls, workers have had trouble commuting to one of the most important military bases for guarding the Pacific; our ferry shortage is a NATIONAL problem. (Washington State Ferries carries about as many passengers annually as Amtrak) But I always thought it was odd to look out the front window of a NEC train to see a Swedish eagle on an AEM-7. I have been out of work since October; only one month mortgage in the bank; yesterday looked into hawking the sterling the N. O. & M. Division gave my great -grandfather. It would probably get melted, sent to India, made into cheap jewelry, and wind up being sold at Walmart. Where am I going here? What we need is to re-tool our manufacturing and economy to more durable goods and higher quality service. We need to build more trains and fewer automobiles. We need to be served in restaurants, not handed our rations through a window. Yes, we should have kept the X2000; ran it until it broke and then built new ones that wouldn't break that way. We should be on our third or fourth generation of NEC high-speed trains now.
How about moving to a growing but poorly educated part of the country and teaching math and/or science so that we'll have a workforce that can actually design and build things!
There is a real need for good math and science teachers in many areas. GA, AL, MS and AR, to name a few, are way behind the curve!
Buy American does work at times.
The AEM-7 is a 7,000 hp locomotive first designed for the Swedish State Railway by Asea (ABB). This rigid frame electric locomotive could haul a "Metroliner" at 125 + mph and had a "Buy American" contract clause. A=Asea E=Electro M=Motive --built by Genenal Motors ElectroMotive Division with ABB designed electrical componates made in the USA.
Bombardier of Montreal Canada built the 20 Acela Train Sets to Amtrak specs. Most of the electrical gear was American built and the final assembly was in Barrie Vermont. Bombardier developed from the Amtrak spec. a design that included the most wanted features from the X2000, TEE, and TGV.
Remember, the rest of the world has had a 50 year head start while we waited for the "for profit" companies to get interested in a money loosing enterprise that is really a public service..
Don-
Our local high school was seeking environmental science speakers. Since I could present a high-school level class on anything from planetary geology to soil science, I contacted the teacher. He asked me to meet him at the tavern after school (strike one: I avoid that place). This was in January, he told me that there was no way he could schedule me for this semester (strike two; I am out of work now, and hope to have a job next fall). Then he said that kids today are into cell phones, iPods, and instant gratification; they do not need to know about the future (strike three; what good is a futurist?).
In other threads here, it has become clear that even high-speed rail supporters have had their hopes and dreams stifled by an economic / political system that denies the existence of a future. Maglev should be the future, the X2000 should be now, yet the extra Cascades train that should have started last summer is dead because of a petty customs squabble.
MaglevThe fundamental concept of buff strength is that European railways are designed for crash avoidance; we need designs for crash survival. Even in the days of steam, British locomotives did not need headlights. This is why we cannot assume that other nations will innovate for us--there is little usable "off-the-shelf" technology.
The Crash Survival strategy worked so well in the latest Metrolink crash, that the NTSB again recommended a crash avoidance system. Even if the passenger coach isn't telescoped the passengers cannot withstand a collision at a much higher speed.
Maglev Don- Our local high school was seeking environmental science speakers. Since I could present a high-school level class on anything from planetary geology to soil science, I contacted the teacher. He asked me to meet him at the tavern after school (strike one: I avoid that place). This was in January, he told me that there was no way he could schedule me for this semester (strike two; I am out of work now, and hope to have a job next fall). Then he said that kids today are into cell phones, iPods, and instant gratification; they do not need to know about the future (strike three; what good is a futurist?).
A perfect example of a lousy teacher....and why you and others need to take up the trade. Not all HS kids are as he described.
The X2000 used elastomeric shear pad primary suspension with vertical-lateral shock absorbers ostensibly for radial steering; but this absorbed lateral shock as well as vertical for a very smooth ride that I was personally fortunate to experience if only up to 79 mph.
My question is why does the next-generation tilting truck have all-coil springs with no apparent radial steering or lateral motion control at the journals, increasing the lateral/rotational unsprung mass of the truck to wheel forces?
HarveyK400 The X2000 used elastomeric shear pad primary suspension with vertical-lateral shock absorbers ostensibly for radial steering; but this absorbed lateral shock as well as vertical for a very smooth ride that I was personally fortunate to experience if only up to 79 mph. My question is why does the next-generation tilting truck have all-coil springs with no apparent radial steering or lateral motion control at the journals, increasing the lateral/rotational unsprung mass of the truck to wheel forces?
The Amtrak "Acela" uses "Air Springs". Each air bag is monitored on a TV screen, both in the cab and at the Conductor's Station in the food servive car.
I would grade the ride of the "Acela" at 150mph about the same as in the Amfleet cars at 90mph. The Acela locomotive rides hard, you know you are moving fast.
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