Just timed a DMU through Cedar Park at a little bit better than 15 seconds per quarter mile. Gates and flashers all activating properly. The things look pretty good when they're moving at a higher rate of speed.....
Sorry Al:
This is the first time I have looked at this thread.
LYNX has had higher than predicted ridership since day one. The parking problems at the I-485 park and ride have been reduced by leasing an under used parking lot from an adjacent restaurant, and they are just putting the finishing touches on a new ground level lot just outside the underpass entrance to the 1120 space parking deck. The plans for the Blue Line Extension includes 300 foot platforms and upgrading from 200 to 300 on the existing Blue Line. Of course, 300 feet was the original plan, but the Feds made them cut it to 200 as a condition of the funding assistance.
LYNX should get a workout this week because the "Speed Street" festival is in city center. This is NASCAR race weeks in Charlotte. Incidentally, the new NASCAR Hall of Fame is on the Blue Line. It's not open yet, but it is very far along in the construction.
I agree that Austin waitng for demand to dictate non rush hour service will probably be counter productive. Sort of a "chicken or the egg" senario. Reduced service would be better than no service during the slow periods. Governments seldom consider that they might have to expand one day. They just worry about what it costs right now. It usually bites them sometime down the road.
I have never been to Austin, so my opinion is based solely on my experience here.
Dave
Lackawanna Route of the Phoebe Snow
pkazmirI appreciate the interesting replies and discussion. Hopefully Cap Metro will be able to add off-peak trips soon. But...anyone know about that signal? Today it was blinking yellow over yellow. (I know what blinking yellow means, and yellow, but both??). Does anyone know what that second signal means? I've also noticed that the signals appear to be lit in only one direction when there is a train only on one side of the signals in question, which I thought was a no-no. I also watched a train stop and apparently get permission to run the red signal west bound past Leander (into dark territory). -Peter The 'yellow' over 'yellow' signal may be 'approach diverging' - it indicates the train will take diverging route at the next signal (this is probably for the DMU's - freights and the steam train will probably use the main track.) The dispatcher can give authority to a train to pass a stop indication at the control point after the train has stopped. However, since TWC begins west of Leander, that train must have its warrant before proceeding west (this is a problem on the UP also - a train can get a clear signal at the end of CTC right before TWC starts. Better have that warrant!) Don't know about the signals being lit in one direction. My guess is that Cap Metro will start commuter service sometime this summer - they probably won't give a specific date until right before it starts. Crossing gates seem to be the big issue to be resolved.
I appreciate the interesting replies and discussion. Hopefully Cap Metro will be able to add off-peak trips soon.
But...anyone know about that signal? Today it was blinking yellow over yellow. (I know what blinking yellow means, and yellow, but both??). Does anyone know what that second signal means?
I've also noticed that the signals appear to be lit in only one direction when there is a train only on one side of the signals in question, which I thought was a no-no. I also watched a train stop and apparently get permission to run the red signal west bound past Leander (into dark territory).
-Peter
The 'yellow' over 'yellow' signal may be 'approach diverging' - it indicates the train will take diverging route at the next signal (this is probably for the DMU's - freights and the steam train will probably use the main track.) The dispatcher can give authority to a train to pass a stop indication at the control point after the train has stopped. However, since TWC begins west of Leander, that train must have its warrant before proceeding west (this is a problem on the UP also - a train can get a clear signal at the end of CTC right before TWC starts. Better have that warrant!) Don't know about the signals being lit in one direction.
My guess is that Cap Metro will start commuter service sometime this summer - they probably won't give a specific date until right before it starts. Crossing gates seem to be the big issue to be resolved.
pkazmir I appreciate the interesting replies and discussion. Hopefully Cap Metro will be able to add off-peak trips soon. But...anyone know about that signal? Today it was blinking yellow over yellow. (I know what blinking yellow means, and yellow, but both??). Does anyone know what that second signal means? I've also noticed that the signals appear to be lit in only one direction when there is a train only on one side of the signals in question, which I thought was a no-no. I also watched a train stop and apparently get permission to run the red signal west bound past Leander (into dark territory). -Peter
This is the reason CapMetro Rail is not up and running yet ! Signals,gates and personnel not working properly or trained properly !
Peter A. Kazmir - Leander, TexasMopac isn't just a freeway in Austin!
Sunk costs are those that have been incurred. Generally, the term refers to costs incurred for capital items, i.e. equipment, plant, real improvements, etc., although the term is sometimes associated with operating costs.
A sunk cost tells management, creditors, investors, etc. what costs the entity has incurred. It is not a basis for deciding what to do. A future course of action should be a function of what is the best alternative. Sometimes the best course of action is to junk the item that incurred the sunk cost, i.e. equipment, plant, etc.
All costs are variable in the long run. However, in the short run the cost of railway equipment, which has been capitalized as opposed to expensed and is being depreciated, would be a fixed cost. The labor to run the equipment, as well as a portion of the maintenance and the consumables, would be a variable cost.
Running railway equipment that does not cover its variable costs increases a loss or reduces profit. As a rule, businesses avoid doing so. On the other hand, running railway equipment that covers the variable costs and contributes something to the fix costs increases profit or reduces the loss. This assumes that most of the time the operation is able to cover all of its costs, and in the case of a business, earn a return for the investors.
Given Capital Metro's cost structure and pricing constraints, running the Red Line trains during the day or after hours will acerbate the losses. Moreover, due to the sinking economy, it would not be a good idea. Also, during the day, as well as after hours, when the trains are not running, Capital Metro will be running express buses or local buses between most of the stations served by the rail line and downtown Austin.
oltmannd gardendancebut if I remember my accounting classes equipment shoud be considered a fixed cost. I'm no accountant, so proper terminology is way out of my realm! I did have a pretty decent course in Engineering Ecomonics way back when.... Off peak service may act more like insurance than useful service. The point was that adding off peak service can be pretty cheap and that, after adding off peak service, the riders may show up predominently on the PEAK trains..... (so it can be misleading to calculate the peak vs. off-peak subsidy per rider....)
gardendancebut if I remember my accounting classes equipment shoud be considered a fixed cost.
I'm no accountant, so proper terminology is way out of my realm! I did have a pretty decent course in Engineering Ecomonics way back when....
Off peak service may act more like insurance than useful service.
The point was that adding off peak service can be pretty cheap and that, after adding off peak service, the riders may show up predominently on the PEAK trains..... (so it can be misleading to calculate the peak vs. off-peak subsidy per rider....)
Phoebe Vet, correct me if I am wrong, but early in LYNX's history I think I remember that the number of white-collar commuters was a little less than anticipated, but larger-than-anticipated crowds have been taking CATS to get to league sports events. Also that the bus-route "spokes" are working well to feed the rail and there are more people than anticipated taking LYNX to and from intermediate stations, neither to the parking-deck terminus or downtown. I think in Austin's case starting off with an austerity budget is inefficient. How can it be jusified? Someone somewhere will probably try to say that, if the trains don't run in the middle of the day, they are "waiting for ridership to emerge" or something like that. Analyze that sentence and it doesn't make a bit of sense. The question is not where to emerge, but when. - a.s.
oltmannd Off peak service may act more like insurance than useful service. The point was that adding off peak service can be pretty cheap and that, after adding off peak service, the riders may show up predominently on the PEAK trains..... (so it can be misleading to calculate the peak vs. off-peak subsidy per rider....)
-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/)
I think Sam1 has claimed to be an accountant, so maybe she has more to say, but if I remember my accounting classes equipment shoud be considered a fixed cost.
A sunk cost would be which you have already obligated yourself to pay whose cost then you should not consider when making decisions about if you should replace it. I guess it's a subset of fixed costs. If you have some fuel guzzler locomotives with top speed 30mph, the fact that you paid $3 million each for them last year should have no bearing on your decision this year to replace them with fuel efficient locomotives with top speed 70mph that cost $1 million each.
That's not to say that it wouldn't have been prudent last year to consider the possibility that an improved locomotive might be available in the future before having bought those fuel guzzlers.
Patrick Boylan
Free yacht rides, 27' sailboat, zip code 19114 Delaware River, get great Delair bridge photos from the river. Send me a private message
The availability of an off peak ride home can be a key factor in getting the peak rush hour riders to make transit their regular ride to work - even if they rarely or never use it. It doesn't have to be the same mode - many "guaranteed ride home" programs involve refundable taxi fare.
Depending on the crew agreement, off peak service can be fairly inexpensive to operate. If you aren't allowed split shifts, you just fill out the day's work with off-peak runs for some crews. Equipment is a sunk cost, so incremental cost is fuel and wear and tear.
pkazmir Does anyone know why there are double signals (like one would usually see when approaching the entrance to a siding) just to the northwest of the Crystal Falls road crossing? There's no siding there, and it's been bugging me trying to figure out why the second signal. The next block up does protect a siding and it also has two signals. Okay, railfan question aside, I have to say I'm very disappointed with the implementation of Austin's light rail so far, most notably in the schedule. In a town that prides itself in downtown night life, and has it's light rail station two blocks from the epicenter of that scene, there's no light rail at night? On weekends? Seriously? And in addition to that, I wanted to take the train downtown (I live in Leander) for a conference that's going to be at the convention center...but I'll have to leave my home 45 minutes earlier than if I were to drive (because the train frequency is so low). I don't know enough about the history of the light rail in Austin to do anything by speculate, but it seems like a) sharing the rails with the freight trains is hamstringing light rail in Austin, and b) someone watered down the proposal so that they could make the price tag small enough and then realized they watered it down too much and was stuck. (Another example is 6 trainsets for 5 schedule slots.) Well, my two cents. I'm still excited about it coming online finally, and I will end up riding the train at some point, I'm sure. And I hope that it's successful enough to expand and blossom into what it truly could be.
Does anyone know why there are double signals (like one would usually see when approaching the entrance to a siding) just to the northwest of the Crystal Falls road crossing? There's no siding there, and it's been bugging me trying to figure out why the second signal. The next block up does protect a siding and it also has two signals.
Okay, railfan question aside, I have to say I'm very disappointed with the implementation of Austin's light rail so far, most notably in the schedule. In a town that prides itself in downtown night life, and has it's light rail station two blocks from the epicenter of that scene, there's no light rail at night? On weekends? Seriously? And in addition to that, I wanted to take the train downtown (I live in Leander) for a conference that's going to be at the convention center...but I'll have to leave my home 45 minutes earlier than if I were to drive (because the train frequency is so low).
I don't know enough about the history of the light rail in Austin to do anything by speculate, but it seems like a) sharing the rails with the freight trains is hamstringing light rail in Austin, and b) someone watered down the proposal so that they could make the price tag small enough and then realized they watered it down too much and was stuck. (Another example is 6 trainsets for 5 schedule slots.)
Well, my two cents. I'm still excited about it coming online finally, and I will end up riding the train at some point, I'm sure. And I hope that it's successful enough to expand and blossom into what it truly could be.
Capital Metro will only run the commuter trains during the morning and evening rush hours because of demand and cost constraints. The demand for commuter rail in Texas, outside of the rush hours, is low. Hopefully, as more people in the Austin area come to view commuter rail as a viable option to go downtown or to other points served by the rail line, they will create a demand for expanding the service.
Although the equipment is different, the Capital Metro Red Line (Austin to Leander) is similar to the Trinity Railway Express (TRE) operation between Dallas and Fort Worth. It too started with a limited schedule, which was expanded as the market demand for the service grew. The TRE has trains in the evening and on Saturdays, with special trains to events scheduled for the American Airlines Center near downtown Dallas.
A major stumbling block to expanding the service is cost. I don't have the numbers for the Red Line, but the TRE numbers are probably a good indicator of the costs associated with the Red Line. TRE riders required an average subsidy of $6.33 per trip in FY08. The subsidy for rush hour commuters would have been less; the subsidy for off-hours users would have been more. In any case, the required subsidy is high and will constrain expanding the service, especially in a tough economy.
Several years ago I was able to get DART to give me the rider figures for the TRE. They probably have changed since then, but the results confirmed that the trains are heavily patronized during the rush hours, but lightly used during off-hours. The load factor from CenterPoint to Dallas during the rush hours was more than 80 per cent, but overall the load factor was approximately 35 per cent. Some of the early morning and late night trains had a load factor of less than 10 per cent.
sunbeamCTC is up and running on the Capital Metro RR Central Subdivision as of this morning (National Train Day!) At least one DMU was running, and 'testing' the signals (Hill Country Flyer went through CTC on it's trip west to Burnet later on.) Still have some crossing signal problems to fix in the downtown area. One step closer to commuter service...
That's great to hear ! If it ever stops raining on the w/end and the skies clear up I'll come down and rail fan it...Already got cloudy day pix of it ,dont need anymore !
I got back into town late Monday night around 1130P or so and a crew was working south of Crystal Falls Parkway. They had the right of way lit up like a New York Christmas Tree. Next morning I saw that they had replaced a section of rail, probably around 65-70 feet or so. Bet the residents along the track liked having their world lit up late at night like that.
The red cars were working the line on Tuesday, and crossing protection was working at Crystal Falls Parkway. First time I have heard them blow a regular grade crossing signal, for the dirt crossing at the church. Usually it is just a single blast.
We're back to signal testing, I guess. The block signal masts are still turned sideways, and are lit, generally between dusk and daybreak or shortly thereafter.
sunbeam Cap Metro has a rail grinder working between downtown Austin and Leander. I guess the idea is to make the rail head match the wheel profile of the DMU's. Maybe this will help the signal system 'see' the DMU's. Veolia is still running tests on DMU's and training of engineers (I believe they're ex-UP employees.)
Cap Metro has a rail grinder working between downtown Austin and Leander. I guess the idea is to make the rail head match the wheel profile of the DMU's. Maybe this will help the signal system 'see' the DMU's.
Veolia is still running tests on DMU's and training of engineers (I believe they're ex-UP employees.)
I saw the rail grinder this morning just before 11:00 a.m. whilst I was waiting at the Leander Park & Ride to catch my bus to UT. It had crossed U.S. 183 and was working north of the highway crossing. I also saw the train running back and forth through the P&R crossing. The gates and lights appeared to be working. The train was still working the crossing when I got back to the P&R at 3:45 p.m. Either they had not worked out the bugs or they were stress testing the lights, gates, and signals.
Last week I saw a couple Cap Metro folks working on the ticket machines at the Leander station. This did not impress me inasmuch as no one, as far as I know, has been using them. Clearly, the riding public has not been using them.
I hate to think how much the delay issues are costing Capital Metro, which of course is a cover for saying the local taxpayers, since they pay for approximately 90 per cent of Capital Metro's costs. I suspect it will be in the hundreds of thousands of dollars if not more.
Danny:
What is the status when the Austin is going start operations?
Did NJT have this kind of trouble when it set up the River Line between Camden and Trenton? Their units are also diesel-electric LRT's. - a.s.
Don't know about the UP train, but it is likely you will see more and more night operations taking place.
After talking with some AWRR emploees,Im under the impression that AWRR is also handling this run thru and UP gives them a 3hr turn time,UP crews do run on Capmetrorail tracks...
Agreed about the mismanagement, but in more ways than one. Veolia has gummed things up as a final kick in the pants to those who truly want good, reliable commute service in the Austin area.
According to the proposed schedules, the 330PM westbound that you saw (I've seen them too) would easily make the yard at McNeil before the first northbound evening commute departure of the day reached that point, sometime around 430PM. CapMetro states on their site that freight operations are currently limited to 445AM daily. I think the jobs you and I both have seen are extra jobs. I am sure that the operations window will be set in stone when MetroRail gets their act together.
Lastly, Veolia is STILL looking to replace their Safety Director, and I seriously doubt operations will commence without that position being filled. Don't look for any "for real" operations before June 1 at the very best.
Last week on my way home from UT I saw at approximately 3:30 p.m. on three separate days freight trains headed towards Austin. They were just south of the Leander Park & Ride. They could very well have been unusual movements.
This project has been mismanaged, which is my main point. It is more than a year behind schedule, and it is over budget, although management is pretending that it is within budget. Their claim ignores some questionable cost accounting practices, i.e. many of the upgrades were charged to freight operations when it appears that the pending commuter service drove the charges.
Sam1,
The freights on the west end are already for the most part, night operations. The fact that there is a gap during the day between AM and PM commute operations, at least for a while, will permit freight operations to take place during that window if need be. Don't know about the downtown switching or east end operations.
Also, the block signal heads have now been turned to be in alignment with the track instead of perpendicular to it, and once turned, they were bagged to indicate "out of service". This is generally the final step before service activation. Once approved for service, the bags come off and they are officially placed in service.
Crossing protection in Leander appears to be functioning as it should for both DMU's and freights.
I agree. I presume once they get the signal system working, the simulated timetable will be run, and without further hitches the service will start.
Stadler could have build FRA compliant railcars. But they would have been heavier, thus consuming more fuel and more wear on the track.
Other systems using light railcar during the day and diesel freiight at night inlcude the last mile or so of the Newark Citiy subway, Salt Lake City's light rail system, and possibly one of the San Diego lines. These light rail cars are all electric, from catenary overhead, which has to be high enouigh for freight car clearance.
Sam1 Awesome! daveklepper If the Swiss firm Stadler built the diesel mu's, then I am sure that the problem is in the signal system, and not the mu's. The Stadler mu's work fine on the New Jersey Transit River Line and in Ottawa. My opinion is that Stadler is the very best railcar manufacturer in the World at the present time, and their equpment is put together with all the care of a Swiss watch. But a signal system has to be designed for the trains it controls. Taking something that works on a normal freight or Amtrak passenger railroad and assuming it is going to work for lighter transit equipment is simply not a good way of approaching safety. The light weight of the Stadler equpment contributes to their economical operation and fuel efficiency. I thought it was more the construction with the street signals than the Swiss cars. How come did Austin Capital when with European company instead of Budd or american company? I understand that the problem is with the signals. It is not the railcars per se. In fact, yesterday I observed a set running back and forth through a roadway crossing just north of the Domain. Apparently they were adjusting the signal system. The cars have been a problem from a regulatory point of view. Capital Metro had to get more than 10 exemptions from the FRA to use the equipment. In fact, it had to reclassify the units. In addition, it has been required to quarantine its freight operations when the commuter units are running. This is likely to lead to higher labor costs for the freight operations since they will take place during the night instead of during the day. According to the Stadler webpage, it has sold 26 vehicles in the U.S. Six went to Capital Metro and 20 went to New Jersey Transit for use on a 57 km route between Trenton and Camden. When starting a new business or operation, it is a good idea to see what others in the same business or operation are doing. If you are doing something really different, i.e. operating significantly different equipment, or there are only one or two others using the same equipment, it is an equally good idea to ask yourself what you know that most of the others don't know.
Awesome! daveklepper If the Swiss firm Stadler built the diesel mu's, then I am sure that the problem is in the signal system, and not the mu's. The Stadler mu's work fine on the New Jersey Transit River Line and in Ottawa. My opinion is that Stadler is the very best railcar manufacturer in the World at the present time, and their equpment is put together with all the care of a Swiss watch. But a signal system has to be designed for the trains it controls. Taking something that works on a normal freight or Amtrak passenger railroad and assuming it is going to work for lighter transit equipment is simply not a good way of approaching safety. The light weight of the Stadler equpment contributes to their economical operation and fuel efficiency. I thought it was more the construction with the street signals than the Swiss cars. How come did Austin Capital when with European company instead of Budd or american company?
daveklepper If the Swiss firm Stadler built the diesel mu's, then I am sure that the problem is in the signal system, and not the mu's. The Stadler mu's work fine on the New Jersey Transit River Line and in Ottawa. My opinion is that Stadler is the very best railcar manufacturer in the World at the present time, and their equpment is put together with all the care of a Swiss watch. But a signal system has to be designed for the trains it controls. Taking something that works on a normal freight or Amtrak passenger railroad and assuming it is going to work for lighter transit equipment is simply not a good way of approaching safety. The light weight of the Stadler equpment contributes to their economical operation and fuel efficiency.
If the Swiss firm Stadler built the diesel mu's, then I am sure that the problem is in the signal system, and not the mu's. The Stadler mu's work fine on the New Jersey Transit River Line and in Ottawa. My opinion is that Stadler is the very best railcar manufacturer in the World at the present time, and their equpment is put together with all the care of a Swiss watch.
But a signal system has to be designed for the trains it controls. Taking something that works on a normal freight or Amtrak passenger railroad and assuming it is going to work for lighter transit equipment is simply not a good way of approaching safety. The light weight of the Stadler equpment contributes to their economical operation and fuel efficiency.
I thought it was more the construction with the street signals than the Swiss cars. How come did Austin Capital when with European company instead of Budd or american company?
I understand that the problem is with the signals. It is not the railcars per se. In fact, yesterday I observed a set running back and forth through a roadway crossing just north of the Domain. Apparently they were adjusting the signal system.
The cars have been a problem from a regulatory point of view. Capital Metro had to get more than 10 exemptions from the FRA to use the equipment. In fact, it had to reclassify the units. In addition, it has been required to quarantine its freight operations when the commuter units are running. This is likely to lead to higher labor costs for the freight operations since they will take place during the night instead of during the day.
According to the Stadler webpage, it has sold 26 vehicles in the U.S. Six went to Capital Metro and 20 went to New Jersey Transit for use on a 57 km route between Trenton and Camden.
When starting a new business or operation, it is a good idea to see what others in the same business or operation are doing. If you are doing something really different, i.e. operating significantly different equipment, or there are only one or two others using the same equipment, it is an equally good idea to ask yourself what you know that most of the others don't know.
I though they have the equipment approved already. How come the delays?
videomaker Remember, for the most part, we're talking about bus operators becoming railroaders, so there will be bumps in the system for a while. 4merrr4man, The guys I talked to on Sat. had several yrs experience,1engineer in paticular had 40 ! He drove the car out to Leander and back along with another fellow who was in charge of keeping freight and passenger seperated..I dont recall the engineer's name but he had worked for UP until he came to Metro or Austin Western,I think Metro may be using Austin Western engineers,he did say that Capital Metro least the freight ops to AW and that UP dose not have tarckage rights as I had heard from someone else...UP turns thier train over to A&W and they have a time limit on getting it back to UP...
Remember, for the most part, we're talking about bus operators becoming railroaders, so there will be bumps in the system for a while.
4merrr4man,
The guys I talked to on Sat. had several yrs experience,1engineer in paticular had 40 ! He drove the car out to Leander and back along with another fellow who was in charge of keeping freight and passenger seperated..I dont recall the engineer's name but he had worked for UP until he came to Metro or Austin Western,I think Metro may be using Austin Western engineers,he did say that Capital Metro least the freight ops to AW and that UP dose not have tarckage rights as I had heard from someone else...UP turns thier train over to A&W and they have a time limit on getting it back to UP...
How many engineers does Metro have? Are you telling me you have bus drivers as well. Oh boy!
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