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Then and Now in Europe

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Posted by McKey on Friday, February 7, 2014 1:16 PM

I think all their locos are named after movie characters, like Bond and Moneypenny that I'm going to publish a picture of later. In Sweden it is a custom to name all locomotives, except for the government owned operators who seem to avoid this nice custom.

There is some more movie characters here:
http://4rail.net/reference_sweden_locomotives_electric1.php#hector

carnej1

Who names these units? 

According to this:

http://www.hectorrail.com/docs/br141-12.pdf

The first 3 are named after the female protagonists of the films "Alien", "Kill Bill" and "The Silence of the Lambs"?!

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Posted by Overmod on Friday, February 7, 2014 5:40 PM

McKey
I think all their locos are named after movie characters, like Bond and Moneypenny that I'm going to publish a picture of later.

But "Galore" is NOT only half a name...   ;-}

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Posted by McKey on Saturday, February 8, 2014 12:49 AM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pussy_Galore

Looks like all the names are single words, except for “R2D2” and “C-3PO”. I wonder what the "Chewbacca" sounds like on the train radio, when they do everyday communication... :)

Going off topic here is a picture of 3CPO TRAXX AC2 (not copper colored but gray) with Eurosprinter ES64F4 called "Cyborg". TRAXX AC2 "Bond" is for the moment on my picture editing queue so we'll see it in a little while.

Another angle to the 3CPO, they've really changed a lot of android robot parts this time to get this look...
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Posted by NorthWest on Saturday, February 8, 2014 12:52 AM

The practice of naming locomotives seems to give them a more human character. I understand why most locomotives aren't named in North America. Try finding names for all of the  2000+ C44-9Ws! 

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Posted by McKey on Saturday, February 8, 2014 1:09 AM

How true! Big Smile

Or could it be done?

MTAB names their Iocos after important locations, U.S. being full of importand locations this might work...?

Here are IOREs "Björnfjell" and "Krookvik" towing a rake of South African built ore cars (that work poorly in the cold, icy and snowy climate) in Saväst, Sweden on Malmbana.These are the most powerful electric locomotives in Europe, even Russia with its Western allies Siemens and Alstom can't compare with these.

Since it sthis thread, this goes to category "Now".

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Posted by McKey on Saturday, February 8, 2014 1:15 AM

And here is "Then", the old style for IOREs.

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Posted by NorthWest on Sunday, February 9, 2014 11:26 AM

Very nice! The IOREs are such impressive locomotives. It appears that they are using a type of knuckle coupler, of what type? 

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Posted by McKey on Monday, February 10, 2014 1:20 PM

NorthWest

Very nice! The IOREs are such impressive locomotives. It appears that they are using a type of knuckle coupler, of what type? 

Yes, excellent question! It is the most formidable of the couplers, the SA3. Actually the knuckle is in its mouth in this model. It can hold up to 8000 metric ton trains, around 17 650 000 U.S. lbs. The SA type coupler was invented in the U.K. and is now the standard model for all of the ex. Soviet Empire, plus some applications in Finland and Sweden in the Nordic. Looks like Norway is following the suite this year too with Grana Gruber (iron ore mine) new ore cars.

Ok, here are a few more pictures on SA3 attached to IOREs. The original idea was to use the American knuckle couplers, but the MTAB came to their senses before installing these. Having several different coupler types just would make things very complicated. The SA3 can be coupled to any hook-and-screw standard European coupler with a small adapter iron. I'm not sure if a similar adapter would be available for the knuckle couplers. 

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Posted by M636C on Monday, February 17, 2014 4:22 AM

McKey

Ok, here are a few more pictures on SA3 attached to IOREs. The original idea was to use the American knuckle couplers, but the MTAB came to their senses before installing these. Having several different coupler types just would make things very complicated. The SA3 can be coupled to any hook-and-screw standard European coupler with a small adapter iron. I'm not sure if a similar adapter would be available for the knuckle couplers. 

Outside Russia, the SA3 coupler is usually known by the name of its American inventor "Willison".

It is not used in the USA because the knuckle coupler based on a design by Janney was so well established. While the Willison is a little stronger, if it were to break the very large and expensive coupler body would have to be replaced, while with the Janney and its successors, the knuckle usually breaks. Not only is the knuckle smaller and cheaper but it is easy to carry a spare to replace when a knuckle breaks.

There are a number of schemes for coupling knuckle couplers to European screw couplers.

In Australia on the standard gauge, the screw couplers are (where still fitted, usually on museum vehicles) at the European height of 3 feet (914 mm) while the knuckle couplers are at the US height of 2 feet 9 inches (839 mm). This allows the screw coupler to be "hooked" on a cast projection on the top of the coupler (called a "bollard") and screwed tight.

In England, both the Knuckle and the screw coupler are centred at 3 feet.. In this case the knuckle head is arranged to drop down, and a coupler hook is located behind the knuckle.

On the narrow gauge in Queensland in Australia, both the knuckle and screw coupler were at 2 feet 9 inches. In this case a hinged link was hung under the knuckle. To use it, the link is lifted into the coupler and locked in place by closing and locking the knuckle. A screw coupler was attached to the link and coupled to the hook on the adjacent wagon.

In all these cases the vehicle with the knuckle coupler still had to have buffers (as on the IORE locomotives illustrated above).

M636C

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Posted by McKey on Monday, February 17, 2014 6:56 AM

Thank you M636 for the additional info and correcting me on the inventor being Willison!

Every word true you say in your text. Hopefully the era of screw type couplers in Europe is nearing its end, because the configuration with those including double buffers is highly dangerous to the train crews. Acquaintance of mine lost his father in one of those accidents years ago, squeezed between the locomotive and the train after just one misstep.

The spacing between the cars still works better on freight cars, but trying for example to attach a passenger loco in Finland equipped with SA3 couplers to passenger coach with all kinds of lines running from the end is hideous. Hardly any space left between the two vehicles. And then you need to fit the small adapter iron just in the right place between the two... 

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Posted by NorthWest on Monday, February 17, 2014 12:00 PM

Buffer locking is a huge issue as well!

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Posted by McKey on Tuesday, February 18, 2014 1:44 AM

Please explain closer, I'm not familiar with this term.

NorthWest

Buffer locking is a huge issue as well!

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Posted by Overmod on Tuesday, February 18, 2014 5:36 AM

My take on this: Imagine you have two adjacent cars on a curve sharp enough that the buffers on the car ends can slide past each other instead of 'buffering up' face to face.  IF you now push these cars off the sharp curve, the buffer structures will jam laterally against each other, and the edges of the buffers will be locked together in a way that cannot be released.  Pulling in either car, in this condition, yanks on one or both buffers, or bends their stems or edges; pushing on the car jams the mounts and edges laterally.  Neither is a good situation, especially if the locomotive can access only one end of the cut...

One way to get around this is to extend the face of the buffer 'laterally' so you have a more oval or 'racetrack' shape with the long axis horizontal. 

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Posted by NorthWest on Tuesday, February 18, 2014 7:45 PM

A relatively good illustration: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ueberpufferung.png

Imagine that at speed... 

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Posted by McKey on Wednesday, February 19, 2014 1:44 AM

Right! I took a look at some of the 10'000 or so pictures at 4rail.net and was a bit surprised: instead of being an old phenomenon that side buffers are of wide type it actually looks like there must still be maybe 100'000 ftreight cars with more or less roundish buffers out there. So this phenomenon is still around! 

Below the MTAS (part ot the LKAB mining company) T44 with modern square buffers switching in Narvik, Norway. Some of the tracks here are not electrified, so there is still use for the diesel motive power despite IOREs doing themselves all the switching for the super heavy ore trains. If you take a careful look at the coupler here, this unit has both the SA3 center coupler and side buffers but not the semiautomatic hook-and-screw coupler normally used with similar switchers.  

Here is another switcher from VR-Yhtyma in Finland. The class Dv12 has all SA3 + semiautomatic hook-and-srew + side buffers. And will also carry semiautomatic knuckle coupler if the need ever arises. Finns are brilliant in engineering and so any combination of couplers can be adapted to locos and cars. Semiautomatic btw. means that the airline has to be manually coupled and uncoupled, connecting and unconnecting the actual coupler are fully automatic / remote controlled. The class Dv12 is seen here in Oulu, in the Northern Finland and is switching one of the autocarriers from the around 8 night trains stopping here.

Tank cars are where you would think the safety is maximized. Well, what do you think about these tiny looking side buffers?This is a Green Cargo class Zacns for refined oil products car in Gävle, Sweden. I think the use is to carry aviation fuels to Arlanda airport near Stockholm. 

And finally, the side buffers that are actually not used since all the EMUs use their fully automatic heavy duty coupler. This is a Stadler brand new FLIRT1 EMU seen in Vantaa, Finland. The train is Financed and owned by Junakalusto Oy, operated by VR-Yhtymä and operations ordered and financed by HSL (Metropolitan Helsinki Transportation Authority). Next tendering for operations will be in 2018, so it might be Arriva or someone else operating these later. Picture by Hannu Peltola.

NorthWest

A relatively good illustration: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ueberpufferung.png

Imagine that at speed... 

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Posted by M636C on Friday, February 21, 2014 4:52 AM

NorthWest

Buffer locking is a huge issue as well!

Not that serious a problem in my personal experience.
At least not when the whole train is on the rails.....
However, in a derailment, buffers can complicate matters.
 I recall an occasion where a mixed freight on its way West from Rockhampton derailed on an embankment some miles East of Emerald. There were six tank wagons loaded with high octane gasoline which ended up thoroughly entangled. We had a big crane from the open cut coal mines nearby, and after pumping as much fuel out as the little local road tanker could hold, the fire brigade sprayed foam on the track and around the buffers before we had a Caterpillar tractor haul the West end tanker clear. The crane then lifted it clear of the track. The crane operator misjudged the radius and the crane toppled over as the tank car approached the ground. Fortunately the crane stopped tilting as the car hit the ground, and the operator allowed the crane to return to its stabilising jacks by paying out some cable. I watched some of this looking over my shoulder while running away, at least until the tank car hit the ground.
On the same line we had an entirely different derailment, caused by the buffers themselves. At Bluff one night somebody decided that he would store an empty coal train of empty lightweight aluminium hopper cars on a spur track at the end of a wye. So the train was backed around the wye but never made it, derailing on the sharp curve of the wye itself. I had to investigate the cause, so the train couldn't be moved until I (and the track maintenance engineer)  worked out what happened. Of course Bluff is a small town but happens to be on the Capricorn Highway  and of course, the wye crosses the highway. Even in the middle of the night (as these things always happen at night) the traffic was beginning to build up, so after a quick check we uncoupled the derailed car, rerailed it and cleared the road.
These VAO class wagons had knuckle couplers but buffers and the "transition link" I described earlier. The buffers were designed to sit one quarter of an inch back from the coupler mating line so the buffers were nominally half an inch apart. On normal main lines the buffers would never contact.. On the sharp curve of the wye the buffers contacted, maybe for the first time. These were miniature rubber draft gears that had never been compressed. Here they were being forced together against the tension of the couplers putting a resultant flange force on the outside rail and around the middle of the train, one truck left the track (on the pavement, fortunately). After this we removed the buffers from coal wagons, since they rarely operated in other than block trains.
M636C
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Posted by Carsten Frank on Monday, March 31, 2014 9:21 AM

WW2-bunker in front of Emden main station

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Posted by NorthWest on Sunday, April 6, 2014 1:12 PM

Good to see some activity on this thread! If I have time I'll post some more photos, but that is unlikely until next weekend. McKey, where are you?

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Posted by owlsroost on Thursday, April 10, 2014 3:42 AM

NorthWest

Buffer locking is a huge issue as well!

In 40 years of European train watching, I've never even seen this mentioned as a issue, so it's certainly not a big issue.

A long time ago (40 years maybe) there was a proposal to adopt a European-wide standard auto-coupler, but it never got enough support to make it happen.

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Posted by McKey on Thursday, May 8, 2014 8:35 AM

Looking a the older rolling stock this might still be something to consider. I included a picture below of the to me quite typical older freight car with side buffers that might make the phenomenon possible.

Never seen this happening with any newer rolling stock though.

owlsroost

NorthWest

Buffer locking is a huge issue as well!

In 40 years of European train watching, I've never even seen this mentioned as a issue, so it's certainly not a big issue.

A long time ago (40 years maybe) there was a proposal to adopt a European-wide standard auto-coupler, but it never got enough support to make it happen.

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