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How real does it need to be?

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Posted by 54light15 on Sunday, February 28, 2016 7:38 PM

That's a fair thing to say about solid fuel, but I think had railroads continued using steam, they would likely have eventually used a lighter fuel as the technology developed. I've run stationary boilers using #6 fuel, the consistency was like tar and it would not burn at all unless heated to 180F and it's not fun. Water tube boilers they were, built in 1933. On the midnight shift you got to operate the soot blowers. If it was done during the day, people would have screamed! There were people there that operated the boilers on coal up until 1968. Even less fun, according to them.

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Posted by Paul Milenkovic on Sunday, February 28, 2016 6:07 PM

My standard of realism is that it has to burn solid fuel.

You could substitute "bio-coal" as the Minnesota project with an AT&SF 4-6-4 is proposing, but it has to be solid fuel.

Yes, heavy fuel oil was burned as boiler fuel "back in the day", and it was somewhat cheaper than the light oil used in contemporary Diesels.  But the movement is to burn light oil (i.e. Diesel) in steamers because it is much easier to work with and may even be cheaper to operate steam that way rather than buy coal in odd-lot quantities.

But for me, you could burn coal, you could burn wood or wood pellets, you could burn a charcoal made from biowaste, but the essence of external combustion (steam) is that it uses fuels no Diesel engine could ever use.

If GM "killed the electric car", what am I doing standing next to an EV-1, a half a block from the WSOR tracks?

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Posted by Firelock76 on Sunday, February 28, 2016 5:31 PM

With Sierra No. 3 it was a safety issue with the old, original 1891 boiler.  Sierra decided to play it safe and have a new boiler built.

The old one's going to become a static display illustrating 19th Century riveted boiler construction.

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Posted by 54light15 on Sunday, February 28, 2016 2:08 PM

In the U.K. you can buy a new body shell for an E-type Jaguar (for example.) You transfer all of the running gear and so forth from a rusted or wrecked car, transfer the chassis plate and legally, it's the same car. There's body builders there who will built you any kind of car for a price but it must be an exact copy of the original otherwise it can't be registered. So you can own your grandfather's car, even though he never sat in it.

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Posted by tomikawaTT on Sunday, February 28, 2016 12:46 PM

The U.S. Navy maintains a special stand of high-quality oak trees - available for use when new wood is needed to repair USS Constitution.

In Rails to the Rising Sun, Charles small commented that some of the oldest locos in use in Japan shortly after WWII had had so many parts replaced over the years that the only thing remaining of the original machine was the wheel arrangement.

When I visited Jamestown, CA several years ago Sierra #3 (the Petticoat Junction loco) was disassembled for complete overhaul.  I was told that the boiler had been shipped to Sacramento to be used as a template for a brand-new all-welded replacement.

Chuck

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Posted by Firelock76 on Sunday, February 28, 2016 11:01 AM

Interesting, Paul.  Reminds me of Stonewall Jackson's watch.

In it's Civil War exhibit the Virginia Historical Society has on display Stonewall's pocket watch, but there's a bit of a problem.  It was originally an English watch but at some point after the Civil War someone replaced the English movement with an American made Elgin movement, most likely because the English movement failed beyond repair and it was easier to put a newer American movement in it.

For years it was displayed open, but someone must have said something to them about it.  It's now displayed closed.  Problem solved, I suppose.

The story of Theseus' ship reminds me of the "Golden Hind."  After his round the world voyage the Elizabethans decided to preserve Sir Francis Drake's ship "Golden Hind" as a historic artefact, which they did.  However it only lasted (I think) about 75 years or so, it wasn't maintained at all, and so time and rot took it's toll and the ship was scrapped sometime in the 17th Century.  Too bad.

Wayne

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Posted by Paul Milenkovic on Sunday, February 28, 2016 10:52 AM

The Ship of Theseus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus appears to be the original historical preservation of a transportation artifact.

Theseus is the historical-legendary-mythological Greek hero who rescued the Athenian "tributes" -- of which you could say "The Hunger Games" is a modern borrowing.  The ship on which he and his compatriots returned to Athens was for a very long time preserved as a symbol of Athenian heritage, but they had to replace every piece of it until nothing was left of the original woodwork.

The great philosophers starting with Aristotle, apparently, have been "all over" this question.

If GM "killed the electric car", what am I doing standing next to an EV-1, a half a block from the WSOR tracks?

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Posted by Firelock76 on Sunday, February 28, 2016 9:20 AM

I guess there's no good answer to this question.  Reminds me of the joke about the old axe:

"This axe has been in my family for over 200 years!  It's had three new handles and two new heads.  It's real old!"

The paramount thing to me, and should be to everyone else, is safety.  I've got a fear in the back of my mind that the next steam locomotive that has a boiler failure or, God forbid, an explosion, will be the last steam locomotive that turns a wheel for public exhibition and enjoyment.

Do what you have to do to keep them safe and running well.  Everything else is secondary, and as Big Jim said, railroads replaced boilers and other parts all the time in decades past.

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Posted by BigJim on Sunday, February 28, 2016 7:35 AM

What little research that I have done on British steam locomotives seems to say that complete boiler replacement was a common thing back when they were in revenue service.

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How real does it need to be?
Posted by Enzoamps on Sunday, February 28, 2016 3:10 AM

March issue, Preservation.  Story of #9.  I read they gave her a new boiler, then replaced the frame.  I had to wonder, not much is left of the original, so just how much of a locomotive needs to be original before it is no longer a restoration, but is now a replica?

I mean it is great the locomotive is running, but is it now restored or replaced?

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