Evidently Murp dosen't know how to cut and paste so let me give you some simple instructions [I was taught how to do this by a 6th grader, IT'S EASY!]
1.-Go to the posting and highlight the address
2.-Right click on the highlighted area and copy
3.-Paste the copied item in your top address bar
4.-Click on the send button
5.-On the page you come to will have the items I offered listed in Black Lettering, scroll down until you come to the download bar, click on the bar
6.-You may have to go about [Above the download bar] reactivating a passport to download, so just type in the numbers from the small box into the empty box and click the ACTIVATE button
The download is close to 8 megabytes, and depending on if you are hooked to Old Fashioned Phone Line Internet, or Basic DSL, it may take awhile. Those of you that have 512 MB DSL or Better, or T-1 will get the download in a flash!
The Texas Madman wrote: kenneo wrote: FM Dave --It is impererative that a regular train adhere to its published rout on its published times. If people don't know (or can't depend on ) where and when the train is going to be, they won't ride it. This is why you operate "demonstration" schedules for 2 or 3 years (at least) prior to any consideration of ending a service.If you end the split at Spokane, and go either to Seattle or Portland, there will be at least a 4 hour extension to the travel time (either to Portland or Seattle). You will lose nearly all of the traffic bound for the destination that is dependant on a CASCADES schedule. That is why the split is there in the first place. About the only way to succesfully eliminate the split would be for daily service of reinstated Trains 25 and 26 - at least through to Denver and preferably on to Kansas City to connect with the Chicago services there and to create a Portland-Spokane-Missoula train. A large percentage of the loadings at Whitefish are from the Clark Fork area. And I am not sure that even this would work because a lot of the traffic out of Montana to the West, about 1/2 goes to Seattle and about 1/2 goes to Portland -- and there is good air service out of Missoula and Kalispell to both Seattle and Portland. The traffic required to go via the CASCADES simply would be lost.Then what would be the feasability of running a link train - Missoula, Helena, Laurel, then up thru Great Falls to Shelby. Just that run back and forth, or do you forsee no real traffic to support such a run?
kenneo wrote: FM Dave --It is impererative that a regular train adhere to its published rout on its published times. If people don't know (or can't depend on ) where and when the train is going to be, they won't ride it. This is why you operate "demonstration" schedules for 2 or 3 years (at least) prior to any consideration of ending a service.If you end the split at Spokane, and go either to Seattle or Portland, there will be at least a 4 hour extension to the travel time (either to Portland or Seattle). You will lose nearly all of the traffic bound for the destination that is dependant on a CASCADES schedule. That is why the split is there in the first place. About the only way to succesfully eliminate the split would be for daily service of reinstated Trains 25 and 26 - at least through to Denver and preferably on to Kansas City to connect with the Chicago services there and to create a Portland-Spokane-Missoula train. A large percentage of the loadings at Whitefish are from the Clark Fork area. And I am not sure that even this would work because a lot of the traffic out of Montana to the West, about 1/2 goes to Seattle and about 1/2 goes to Portland -- and there is good air service out of Missoula and Kalispell to both Seattle and Portland. The traffic required to go via the CASCADES simply would be lost.
FM Dave --
It is impererative that a regular train adhere to its published rout on its published times. If people don't know (or can't depend on ) where and when the train is going to be, they won't ride it. This is why you operate "demonstration" schedules for 2 or 3 years (at least) prior to any consideration of ending a service.
If you end the split at Spokane, and go either to Seattle or Portland, there will be at least a 4 hour extension to the travel time (either to Portland or Seattle). You will lose nearly all of the traffic bound for the destination that is dependant on a CASCADES schedule. That is why the split is there in the first place.
About the only way to succesfully eliminate the split would be for daily service of reinstated Trains 25 and 26 - at least through to Denver and preferably on to Kansas City to connect with the Chicago services there and to create a Portland-Spokane-Missoula train. A large percentage of the loadings at Whitefish are from the Clark Fork area.
And I am not sure that even this would work because a lot of the traffic out of Montana to the West, about 1/2 goes to Seattle and about 1/2 goes to Portland -- and there is good air service out of Missoula and Kalispell to both Seattle and Portland. The traffic required to go via the CASCADES simply would be lost.
Then what would be the feasability of running a link train - Missoula, Helena, Laurel, then up thru Great Falls to Shelby. Just that run back and forth, or do you forsee no real traffic to support such a run?
1st, you won't want to include Laurel. That would add something like 6-8 hours and not do much more than go in a circle.
2nd, to make a connection with the Builder, this would need to be a night train and to make it convenient, you would have to park cars at Helena and Great Falls for occupancy. And, you could not make a connection with a train from the West at Missoula since you would need to depart several hours prior to its possible arrival.
3rd, you can't schedule a connection to connect at Spokane and at Shelby because the running time over the High Line is less than through the Clark Fork Valley. You might be able to make a Laurel-Helena-Great Falls-Shelby schedule work with the eastbound Builder in the morning, laying over for the westbound Builder in the PM with Chicago being the intended end point instead of Portland/Seattle, perhaps splitting the train at Helena with a Missoula connection.
4th, a good percentage of traffic on such a train(s) would likely be long haul East, so careful consideration should be given to operating a "thruway" bus between Great Falls and Helena and operating the train East down the Yellowstone to, perhaps, Fargo, to connect with the Builder to and from the East.
Yes, I should amend this as a Billings-Bozeman-Helena-Great Falls-Shelby run, although I was wondering how Amtrak would be able to service Missoula too. There may not be the ridership in Missoula that would support an x-tra, but didn't BNSF close down the Trackage between Helena and Great Falls? Last time I remember going up that route [when it was still the BN] it was quite curvy, lotsa' low clearance areas, and a couple of low clearance tunnels, it seems it would be QUITE A JOB to operate it at a faster speed, even if the trackage could be straightened more.
Still it's something to try for, possibly get a Historical Group to build a Station along the tracks in Great Falls, or aid in renovation of the Milwaukee Road Station for passenger purposes!
Great Falls to Shelby could easily run at speed and Amtrak could make up for lost time coming up from Helena!
Bergie wrote: The Texas Madman wrote: BUT I ABSOLUTELY REFUSE TO BE ANYBODYS WHIPPING DOG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! At some point, you guys have to agree to disagree without getting into these juvenile arguments. The bickering gets old, and the tough man competition isn't held on this site. This goes for everyone, not just Texas.Bergie
The Texas Madman wrote: BUT I ABSOLUTELY REFUSE TO BE ANYBODYS WHIPPING DOG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BUT I ABSOLUTELY REFUSE TO BE ANYBODYS WHIPPING DOG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
At some point, you guys have to agree to disagree without getting into these juvenile arguments. The bickering gets old, and the tough man competition isn't held on this site. This goes for everyone, not just Texas.
Bergie
I could go for that if it were just his opinions. However, his statements that MRL operates or has some sort of haulage or deliver rights beyond the limits of the railroad, the claim the state of Montana has run deficiets for 15 years when such a budget is strictly prohibited by the state constitution and finally that Montana has somehow managed to borrow funds from two other states are just preposterous. They have no foundation in fact. I have a very hard time agreeing to disagree with that which is completely and totally false.
Alan
State Senator Jim Elliott (D-Trout Creek) reportedly told the Associated Press that he "doubted a southern passenger route would be financially feasible...‘I believe that Amtrak is kind of like an ugly dog that comes to your door and you don't have the heart to turn it away and you don't have the guts to destroy it, so you feed it.'"
Regardless of how you feel about the issue, this guy knows how to make a point!
futuremodal wrote:Hey Bergie - If you want to axe this thread, you'll get no argument from me!
This is the AAR list of all railroads operating in North Dakota-
http://www.aar.org/PubCommon/Documents/AboutTheIndustry/RRState_ND.pdf?states=RRState_ND.pdf
MRL is not there.
Yes I went to the site described, the problem I have with this is that it only shows Railroads with OWNED TRACKAGE, not TRACKAGE/DELIVERY RIGHTS!
An example of this is the State RR Map of Illinois, Kankakee Beaverville and Southern RR is mapped with the trackage that they own, what is not shown is that KB&S operates [Under TRACKAGE/DELIVERY RIGHTS] 131 miles of CN/IC to Harvey Illinois, 39 miles of CSX to Bedford Park Illinois, and into Belt Rwy of Chicago's CLEARING Yard.
This is one example - give me time, I'll pull up several examples across the US, My question to you is if MRL only runs trains on the trackage they own, then why do I sit in Yardley yard in Spookaloo hearing MRL Call Numbers on my Scanner, and seeing MRL Posted Crew trucks picking up crews?, or sit in Dilworth Mn. listening to MRL Call Numbers, and Seeing MRL Crew Trucks [clearly posted on the sides of the trucks mentioned in both instances] picking up the crews? Also why in the Dilworth instances do the MRL Units come off, and the BNSF go on the train? Or the same unit changing that I watch done in Spookaloo?
If the figuring is right that you insist then there should be NO MRL UNITS coming in on a train fom the west into Dilworth, or east into Spookaloo!
The Texas Madman wrote: Evidently Murp dosen't know how to cut and paste so let me give you some simple instructions [I was taught how to do this by a 6th grader, IT'S EASY!]1.-Go to the posting and highlight the address2.-Right click on the highlighted area and copy3.-Paste the copied item in your top address bar4.-Click on the send button5.-On the page you come to will have the items I offered listed in Black Lettering, scroll down until you come to the download bar, click on the bar6.-You may have to go about [Above the download bar] reactivating a passport to download, so just type in the numbers from the small box into the empty box and click the ACTIVATE buttonThe download is close to 8 megabytes, and depending on if you are hooked to Old Fashioned Phone Line Internet, or Basic DSL, it may take awhile. Those of you that have 512 MB DSL or Better, or T-1 will get the download in a flash!
spokyone wrote: The Texas Madman wrote: Evidently Murp dosen't know how to cut and paste so let me give you some simple instructions [I was taught how to do this by a 6th grader, IT'S EASY!]1.-Go to the posting and highlight the address2.-Right click on the highlighted area and copy3.-Paste the copied item in your top address bar4.-Click on the send button5.-On the page you come to will have the items I offered listed in Black Lettering, scroll down until you come to the download bar, click on the bar6.-You may have to go about [Above the download bar] reactivating a passport to download, so just type in the numbers from the small box into the empty box and click the ACTIVATE buttonThe download is close to 8 megabytes, and depending on if you are hooked to Old Fashioned Phone Line Internet, or Basic DSL, it may take awhile. Those of you that have 512 MB DSL or Better, or T-1 will get the download in a flash! Tex. Could you go over this again? I'm not Bill Gates you know!
I've walked you thru as much as I can, the rest you'll have to try, If you can't figure it out by my directions - OH WELL!!!
I uploaded some audio and video footage to the same site for BBC Radio-4 to use in one of their braodcasts last year and the reporter had no trouble in retrieving it!
The Texas Madman wrote: My question to you is if MRL only runs trains on the trackage they own, then why do I sit in Yardley yard in Spookaloo hearing MRL Call Numbers on my Scanner, and seeing MRL Posted Crew trucks picking up crews?,
No one said they did.
MRL operates on trackage rights (BNSF), Spokane to Sandpoint, on lease trackage from Sandpoint to Garrison Jct, on trackage rights Garrison Jct to Helena (BNSF) -- if I am recalling that one correctly -- on lease trackage Helena to Laurel, Montana, on BNSF trackage rights Laurel to Huntley (Jones Jct.).
MichaelSol wrote: The Texas Madman wrote: My question to you is if MRL only runs trains on the trackage they own, then why do I sit in Yardley yard in Spookaloo hearing MRL Call Numbers on my Scanner, and seeing MRL Posted Crew trucks picking up crews?, No one said they did.MRL operates on trackage rights (BNSF), Spokane to Sandpoint, on lease trackage from Sandpoint to Garrison Jct, on trackage rights Garrison Jct to Helena (BNSF) -- if I am recalling that one correctly -- on lease trackage Helena to Laurel, Montana, on BNSF trackage rights Laurel to Huntley (Jones Jct.).
MichaelSol wrote:MRL leases 114 locomotives to other railroads, and uses 58 units on its own lines. The majority of the MRL fleet is used off-property by other railroads. I have no doubt you can see MRL locomotives and equipment off-property. That's where most of the fleet is.
When I see MRL [we used to call it Monkeys Running Loose] locos in tandem with other locos on other RR's what I see is 1, maybe 2 locos in a supporting position. What I'm Talking about in the places I quoted in my earlier post is ALL MRL LOCOS coming in for the CC, THEN the crew vans [picking up crews] that are clearly marked MONTANA RAIL LINK SYSTEM on the drivers, and passenger side doors. and [Once AGAIN] I've seen this [Not just the all MRL Loco Trains, but the Crew Vans Too Clearly Posted MONTANA RAIL LINK SYSTEM] in Dickinson [which according to Murphsiding is supposed to be BNSF], Mandan [which according to Murph is supposed to be BNSF], and Dilworth [Also supposed to be BNSF].
Also if the trains are BNSF instead of MRL the radio chatter in those places should sound like "......................BNSF train Number #*****.............", but what I hear in those places is".........................MRL Train #*****............."
Ok, here we go, one point at a time.
This is one example - give me time, I'll pull up several examples across the US
Forget "across the US". MRL is between Jones Jct, MT. and Sandpoint, ID. MRL, as a railroad is NO WHERE else.
, My question to you is if MRL only runs trains on the trackage they own,
MRL does not own any of the mainline between Jones Jct and Sandpoint. This trackage is leased from the BN/BNSF for 60 years beginning 10/31/87. All of the branch lines to Whitehall, Harrison, Montana City, Polson, Darby and Phillipsburg are owned out right by the Washington Corporations.
then why do I sit in Yardley yard in Spookaloo
MRL trains and crews have trackage rights on the BNSF between Sandpoint and Spokane. This saves the BN/BNSF from instituting a short pool for the 60+ miles between these two points to move the interchange trains. This would be frightfully expensive for the BNSF. The same thing happens between Jones Jct. The BN/BNSF trains have trackage rights on the trackage leased by the MRL so MRL does not have to have a short pool established to move these trains a short distance.
hearing MRL Call Numbers on my Scanner, and seeing MRL Posted Crew trucks picking up crews?,
The MRL train "call numbers" are BNSF designations. These are all BNSF trains run by MRL crews between Laurel and Spokane. MRL does not have any drivers nor vehicles in Spokane or Hauser to drive crews. They never have. BN/BNSF drivers will take crews off the trains in the yards and deliver them to the yard offices where a company called Express Shuttle, part of Coach USA, formerly Pixley Transport out of Gillette, WY takes the crews to the motel. The drivers are not MRL employees nor are the vans owned by the MRL and they are clearly labeled Express Shuttle. The BNSF vehicles are plainly marked BNSF.
or sit in Dilworth Mn. listening to MRL Call Numbers, and Seeing MRL Crew Trucks [clearly posted on the sides of the trucks mentioned in both instances] picking up the crews?
No, there have never been MRL crews in Dilworth. There have never, NEVER been MRL crew trucks in Dilworth. The only places where there ever have been MRL vehicles hauling crews to trains are Laurel, Helena and Missoula. Perhaps an MRL van has been used to dogcatch crews online but never east of Jones Jct nor west of Sandpoint, probably not west of Paradise.
Also why in the Dilworth instances do the MRL Units come off, and the BNSF go on the train? Or the same unit changing that I watch done in Spookaloo?
As Michael Sol has pointed out, MRL has leased a number of diesels to the BN/BNSF. All units from the BNSF have been returned at this point but some units have been on BNSF property for more than three years. The BNSF uses them like their own and builds them into their own consists as well as sending them off line to pay back horsepower hours to other railroads such as CSX, NS and UP.
Locomotives are a commodity. Whoever pays the lease to MRL gets to do what they want with them. MRL does not have a train which regularly runs between Laurel and Spokane or any other point on the BNSF. There is one train which runs between Laurel and Spokane but that is a BNSF train and it runs with BNSF power.
I might also add, MRL does not seem to have any strong opposition to having AMTK on the route. They hosted the Montana Rockies Daylight trains for a number of summers and carry AOE charters over the system each season. AMTK has detoured #7 and #8 a couple of times. Unless AMTK made some outrageous demands I would believe MRL would provide service on the mainline and do everything possible to provide on time performance.
The Texas Madman wrote: I've seen this [Not just the all MRL Loco Trains, but the Crew Vans Too Clearly Posted MONTANA RAIL LINK SYSTEM] in Dickinson [which according to Murphsiding is supposed to be BNSF], Mandan [which according to Murph is supposed to be BNSF], and Dilworth [Also supposed to be BNSF].
I've seen this [Not just the all MRL Loco Trains, but the Crew Vans Too Clearly Posted MONTANA RAIL LINK SYSTEM] in Dickinson [which according to Murphsiding is supposed to be BNSF], Mandan [which according to Murph is supposed to be BNSF], and Dilworth [Also supposed to be BNSF].
Well, it's not just according to Murph ... BNSF thinks so too.
My thoughts on the matter are that your comments on this thread suggest you are an unreliable reporter of what you see, and you jump to conclusions about what you think you see.
The best I can suggest is, it's all news to MRL ... and BNSF as well.
When I see MRL [we used to call it Monkeys Running Loose]
What a personal insult. I came to the MRL with 10 years experience and 6 years behind the throttle. We had engineers with as much or even more experience from across the country. Some of the Milwaukee veterans I worked with were some of the finest railroaders I have ever worked with. Shame on you for refering to them as monkeys.
locos in tandem with other locos on other RR's what I see is 1, maybe 2 locos in a supporting position. What I'm Talking about in the places I quoted in my earlier post is ALL MRL LOCOS coming in for the CC,
When the BNSF leases forty or more MRL units at a time, one could expect there may be times when a full consist would be leased power in matching MRL blue. Again MRL trains do not operate off line. Let go of that fantasy.
THEN the crew vans [picking up crews] that are clearly marked MONTANA RAIL LINK SYSTEM on the drivers, and passenger side doors.
Perhaps you have been too far into the Mad Dog 20/20 at these times. MRL had NEVER, NEVER, NEVER labeled any vehicle, either on track or off track like a rubber tired vehicle as Montana Rail Link System. I have been on the property since day 1. It just is not true. Let go of this fantasy as well.
and [Once AGAIN] I've seen this [Not just the all MRL Loco Trains, but the Crew Vans Too Clearly Posted MONTANA RAIL LINK SYSTEM] in Dickinson [which according to Murphsiding is supposed to be BNSF], Mandan [which according to Murph is supposed to be BNSF], and Dilworth [Also supposed to be BNSF].
The stations you have mentioned in North Dakota are indeed on the BNSF system. Any train leaving Montana would have to leave through Glendive. Now why would the personnel in ND refer to trains coming through their terminal as MRL when they are two crew districts away? A BNSF crew took the trains east of Laurel, east of Forsyth and east of Glendive. There are no, NO, MRL personnel operating thru trains east of Laurel. Let go of the fantasy.
Simply put, YOU DID NOT HEAR any of this. Lay off the sauce on your next travels. Kinda hurts coming from a monkey, eh?
MichaelSol wrote:My thoughts on the matter are that your comments on this thread suggest you are an unreliable reporter of what you see, and you jump to conclusions about what you think you see.
Next time I go out that way to Railfan [which will be in 1 month] I'll be sure to take a digital recorder with me so I can upload filmed evidence of what I'm saying on-line. And NO, It's not that I like to argue, but what most are statine and what I'm seeing and hearing are 2 different things, will also take a chance and talk to the crews to see if they are BNSF or MRL.
Be that as it may - as far as Amtrak running on MRL, or even the "Low Line" [former NP] I still can't see where the ridership might come from operating a full train thru from Helena to Fargo!
I can see more ridership in a Link-Train from Billings to Helena to Great Falls to Shelby!
Careful arbfbe [or is that Barfy?] Murph was edited for being insulting, besides that's better that the nickname we used when MRL was first formed. The We used to call it;
MAJOR REPAIR LINE!
I guess if I go, you go as well.
Major repair line? I take that as a bit of a compliment. Yes, MRL has done a lot of repairs over the last 20 years. We now have CTC on all the main tracks instead of ABS with train orders between Frenchtown and Paradise. The 10 mph mainline curves between Rivulet and Superior have been upgraded to 25 mph. All new rail is 141 # welded replacing 112 # jointed. Yes, the lines needed some major repairs since the BN did not hand it over in the most stellar of conditions.
So have fun railfanning soon. I will be interested in seeing how many MRL crew members you find in the Dakotas or Yardley. Perhaps I should mention, most BNSF trains now fuel at Hauser. Then they blast through Yardley at track speed so if you plan on detraining there you better plan ahead.
Call me what you want, just don't call me late for dinner, so the line goes. Such a wit, I feel like I am dueling with an unarmed man.
The Texas Madman wrote: arbfbe wrote: Ok, here we go, one point at a time.This is one example - give me time, I'll pull up several examples across the USForget "across the US". MRL is between Jones Jct, MT. and Sandpoint, ID. MRL, as a railroad is NO WHERE else. , My question to you is if MRL only runs trains on the trackage they own, MRL does not own any of the mainline between Jones Jct and Sandpoint. This trackage is leased from the BN/BNSF for 60 years beginning 10/31/87. All of the branch lines to Whitehall, Harrison, Montana City, Polson, Darby and Phillipsburg are owned out right by the Washington Corporations. then why do I sit in Yardley yard in Spookaloo MRL trains and crews have trackage rights on the BNSF between Sandpoint and Spokane. This saves the BN/BNSF from instituting a short pool for the 60+ miles between these two points to move the interchange trains. This would be frightfully expensive for the BNSF. The same thing happens between Jones Jct. The BN/BNSF trains have trackage rights on the trackage leased by the MRL so MRL does not have to have a short pool established to move these trains a short distance. hearing MRL Call Numbers on my Scanner, and seeing MRL Posted Crew trucks picking up crews?, The MRL train "call numbers" are BNSF designations. These are all BNSF trains run by MRL crews between Laurel and Spokane. MRL does not have any drivers nor vehicles in Spokane or Hauser to drive crews. They never have. BN/BNSF drivers will take crews off the trains in the yards and deliver them to the yard offices where a company called Express Shuttle, part of Coach USA, formerly Pixley Transport out of Gillette, WY takes the crews to the motel. The drivers are not MRL employees nor are the vans owned by the MRL and they are clearly labeled Express Shuttle. The BNSF vehicles are plainly marked BNSF. or sit in Dilworth Mn. listening to MRL Call Numbers, and Seeing MRL Crew Trucks [clearly posted on the sides of the trucks mentioned in both instances] picking up the crews? No, there have never been MRL crews in Dilworth. There have never, NEVER been MRL crew trucks in Dilworth. The only places where there ever have been MRL vehicles hauling crews to trains are Laurel, Helena and Missoula. Perhaps an MRL van has been used to dogcatch crews online but never east of Jones Jct nor west of Sandpoint, probably not west of Paradise. Also why in the Dilworth instances do the MRL Units come off, and the BNSF go on the train? Or the same unit changing that I watch done in Spookaloo?As Michael Sol has pointed out, MRL has leased a number of diesels to the BN/BNSF. All units from the BNSF have been returned at this point but some units have been on BNSF property for more than three years. The BNSF uses them like their own and builds them into their own consists as well as sending them off line to pay back horsepower hours to other railroads such as CSX, NS and UP.If the figuring is right that you insist then there should be NO MRL UNITS coming in on a train fom the west into Dilworth, or east into Spookaloo!Locomotives are a commodity. Whoever pays the lease to MRL gets to do what they want with them. MRL does not have a train which regularly runs between Laurel and Spokane or any other point on the BNSF. There is one train which runs between Laurel and Spokane but that is a BNSF train and it runs with BNSF power. I might also add, MRL does not seem to have any strong opposition to having AMTK on the route. They hosted the Montana Rockies Daylight trains for a number of summers and carry AOE charters over the system each season. AMTK has detoured #7 and #8 a couple of times. Unless AMTK made some outrageous demands I would believe MRL would provide service on the mainline and do everything possible to provide on time performance. Careful arbfbe [or is that Barfy?] Murph was edited for being insulting, besides that's better that the nickname we used when MRL was first formed. The We used to call it; MAJOR REPAIR LINE!
arbfbe wrote: Ok, here we go, one point at a time.This is one example - give me time, I'll pull up several examples across the USForget "across the US". MRL is between Jones Jct, MT. and Sandpoint, ID. MRL, as a railroad is NO WHERE else. , My question to you is if MRL only runs trains on the trackage they own, MRL does not own any of the mainline between Jones Jct and Sandpoint. This trackage is leased from the BN/BNSF for 60 years beginning 10/31/87. All of the branch lines to Whitehall, Harrison, Montana City, Polson, Darby and Phillipsburg are owned out right by the Washington Corporations. then why do I sit in Yardley yard in Spookaloo MRL trains and crews have trackage rights on the BNSF between Sandpoint and Spokane. This saves the BN/BNSF from instituting a short pool for the 60+ miles between these two points to move the interchange trains. This would be frightfully expensive for the BNSF. The same thing happens between Jones Jct. The BN/BNSF trains have trackage rights on the trackage leased by the MRL so MRL does not have to have a short pool established to move these trains a short distance. hearing MRL Call Numbers on my Scanner, and seeing MRL Posted Crew trucks picking up crews?, The MRL train "call numbers" are BNSF designations. These are all BNSF trains run by MRL crews between Laurel and Spokane. MRL does not have any drivers nor vehicles in Spokane or Hauser to drive crews. They never have. BN/BNSF drivers will take crews off the trains in the yards and deliver them to the yard offices where a company called Express Shuttle, part of Coach USA, formerly Pixley Transport out of Gillette, WY takes the crews to the motel. The drivers are not MRL employees nor are the vans owned by the MRL and they are clearly labeled Express Shuttle. The BNSF vehicles are plainly marked BNSF. or sit in Dilworth Mn. listening to MRL Call Numbers, and Seeing MRL Crew Trucks [clearly posted on the sides of the trucks mentioned in both instances] picking up the crews? No, there have never been MRL crews in Dilworth. There have never, NEVER been MRL crew trucks in Dilworth. The only places where there ever have been MRL vehicles hauling crews to trains are Laurel, Helena and Missoula. Perhaps an MRL van has been used to dogcatch crews online but never east of Jones Jct nor west of Sandpoint, probably not west of Paradise. Also why in the Dilworth instances do the MRL Units come off, and the BNSF go on the train? Or the same unit changing that I watch done in Spookaloo?As Michael Sol has pointed out, MRL has leased a number of diesels to the BN/BNSF. All units from the BNSF have been returned at this point but some units have been on BNSF property for more than three years. The BNSF uses them like their own and builds them into their own consists as well as sending them off line to pay back horsepower hours to other railroads such as CSX, NS and UP.If the figuring is right that you insist then there should be NO MRL UNITS coming in on a train fom the west into Dilworth, or east into Spookaloo!Locomotives are a commodity. Whoever pays the lease to MRL gets to do what they want with them. MRL does not have a train which regularly runs between Laurel and Spokane or any other point on the BNSF. There is one train which runs between Laurel and Spokane but that is a BNSF train and it runs with BNSF power. I might also add, MRL does not seem to have any strong opposition to having AMTK on the route. They hosted the Montana Rockies Daylight trains for a number of summers and carry AOE charters over the system each season. AMTK has detoured #7 and #8 a couple of times. Unless AMTK made some outrageous demands I would believe MRL would provide service on the mainline and do everything possible to provide on time performance.
Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.
arbfbe wrote:MAJOR REPAIR LINE!
The MONKEYS RUNNING LOOSE nickname came from a incident in the late 1990's when 2 engineers took to fighting over who would operate a train into Bozeman, while they were fighting the train [no units hooked to it] lost e-brake air pressure and rolled downhill derailing in the west side of Helena. When the Station Officer in Helena was asked by the Helena Newspaper about what caused this to happen he was quoted as saying " It was because of the Monkeys Running Loose."
No, as you can see this is not a Hobo-Deraugatory Comment, The Helena Newspaper Website has this in their archives, and you can get a copy of that issue as long as you pay the required fee!
The Texas Madman wrote: arbfbe wrote: MAJOR REPAIR LINE!The MONKEYS RUNNING LOOSE nickname came from a incident in the late 1990's when 2 engineers took to fighting over who would operate a train into Bozeman, while they were fighting the train [no units hooked to it] lost e-brake air pressure and rolled downhill derailing in the west side of Helena. When the Station Officer in Helena was asked by the Helena Newspaper about what caused this to happen he was quoted as saying " It was because of the Monkeys Running Loose."No, as you can see this is not a Hobo-Deraugatory Comment, The Helena Newspaper Website has this in their archives, and you can get a copy of that issue as long as you pay the required fee!
arbfbe wrote: MAJOR REPAIR LINE!
TM,
Sigh, please post the link from the Helena Independant Record to the event @ Helena. No, that did not happen either. There was an event where cars of a train ran down the hill into Helena but no company official referred to the crew members as monkeys running loose. I should also note it is uphill from Bozeman to Helena. Winston Hill which lies between the two cities is quite and impediment to a westbound runaway. MRL sends helpers to Toston to help grain trains and coal trains up the grade into Helena from the east. Geography also makes it hard for an eastbound to runaway into the west side of Helena.
Say, the next time you refer to the government or AAR map giving MRL delivery rights into ND, please post the government document number. You will find it on the face down near the lower left corner. Then we can all get to look at it.
OK, this has gone on long enough. The only reason I decided to post to the first of TM's wild claims was because none of them were factually true. His following posts are just as erroneous as the first. I am sure he has shown us all that either his posts are based on fantasy or his memories of events are so flawed they are unreliable. In any event I believe I have shown his postings have been spurious. TM, I don't see how anyone can respect you after the claims you have made.
So I hope everyone has learned something about the MRL. The next time someone comes in to post something off the wall about the MRL anyone who has read this thread should have a sound basis for evaluating what is included in the new thread. If I have accompolished that then it has been worth it.
So far as TM goes, ka-ching! His name is now in my list of posters not to read on this forum. Never again. So do not bother, TM, to respond to this post since I do not read any of your inputs, there is nothing I can learn from any of them. Toodles.
My apologies to Bergie.
arbfbe wrote:Toodles.
Toodles.
GREAT, now I can get back to asking questions for my own information purposes [regardless of how argumentative they sound] instead of having to deal with someone who wants to instigate me into a FEUD!
Why do you suppose that any genuinely knowledgeable person would care to take their time and energy to answer them?
Please reflect on what you did to this thread and the insults you hurled at anyone that even tried to answer your ... "questions".
MichaelSol wrote:Why do you suppose that any genuinely knowledgeable person would care to take their time and energy to answer them?
Oh I believe there are folks that will answer, not everyone is a part of this "Private Club" mentality that kinda' permeates the few who've tried to feud with me!
The Texas Madman wrote: MichaelSol wrote:Why do you suppose that any genuinely knowledgeable person would care to take their time and energy to answer them?Oh I believe there are folks that will answer, not everyone is a part of this "Private Club" mentality that kinda' permeates the few who've tried to feud with me!
And why do you suppose "their" answers would be any different?
MichaelSol wrote:And why do you suppose "their" answers would be any different?
Why do you bother to answer my posts which are in the form of Questions?, your earlier statement which was in the form of a question relates to me that you felt that anything I had to ask was "Persona-non-Grata", and not worthy of your time, and effort. But Now you are answering me, even with your own pointed questions.
This is contrary to you attitude!
The Texas Madman wrote: MichaelSol wrote:And why do you suppose "their" answers would be any different? Why do you bother to answer my posts which are in the form of Questions?, your earlier statement which was in the form of a question relates to me that you felt that anything I had to ask was "Persona-non-Grata", and not worthy of your time, and effort. But Now you are answering me, even with your own pointed questions. This is contrary to you attitude!
Good grief.
Good luck ...
As a clarification, the MRL system is comprised as follows, from one of the previously mentioned sources:
MRL leases the main line from Jones Jct (east of Huntley) to Helena and Phosphate to Sandpoint and purchased the branch lines-including the abandoned (but track in place) Shields River Line (Wilsall) and the Anceny Line right of way (the track had been removed). In 1992, the so-called "Gap" between Helena and Phosphate was leased to MRL and MRL acquired the line from Whitehall to MP 51 on the Butte Line to access the ballast quarry at Pipestone. BNSF has trackage rights between Huntley and Jones Jct and Laurel and MRL has trackage rights over BNSF between Sandpoint and Spokane. The MRL lease was for 66 years starting 10/31/1987.
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