Midwest High Speed Rail

[Anonymous]

  That worried me until I realized that nobody gives a ...

 

FWIW, it sounds like a great system, and you have a good point about people USUALLY not giving a crud, about who we are as individuals.

 But one just never knows , and I think that going "belly up" on personal privacy issues, makes little sense.

 

Some day a bag of money might just fall off that Brinks truck,  and with my luck an observation camera at an ATM will see me pick it up and get into the green pickup truck, the RFID toll device will track me to my suburb, a redlight camera will just happen to glance my plate while recording someone else's violation, and those homeland security computers (designed to make me "safe") will put all the pieces together , and some one will come knocking at my door.

 

Moral of the story: eventually all those tiny incremental encroachments upon our annonymity become  aggregate.  For better or for worse.

[jeaton]

You can open your I-PASS account using a credit card or check. When you open your account you are issued a small device called a "transponder". This transponder communicates through radio signals with the toll plazas as you drive through them. Account information is sent back and forth between your transponder and the plaza and your prepaid toll balance is debited.

The transponder mounts to your vehicle's windshield, right behind the rearview mirror. It mounts on dualock (velcro like) strips and is removable and can be moved from car to car. Make sure to register all vehicles when establishing your account so you get the correct amount of mounting strips.
So that makes it RFID

 

Thanks for the info. I wonder how many get swiped? 

I believe it is a passive transponder.  The reader probably doesn't do anything but pick an account number with a check digit off the chip.  The processing of the charge is handled by the central computer and I can use a password to get to my account and see where I have been.  Guess that would be handy for someone that has a lot of black outs. The unit is about 2.5"x2.5"x1/2", probably just sized for the user's convenience.  I suppose they get swiped from time to time but all it takes is a call or an order on line to cancel the account. Then if it is used at a regular toll stop, the gate won't respond.  If it is a gateless check point and it reads a canceled unit, the ole digital camera goes to work.

Actually the Europeans think we are nuts on this one.  There you can buy the transponder, fund the account with cash and leave no identy information.  I am with the folks who decry the loss of privacy, but I have given up on trying to beat the system.  So now my life is an open book.  That worried me until I realized that nobody gives a ...

[Modelcar]

 

                         ......Step into the 21th century.....

[Anonymous]

You can open your I-PASS account using a credit card or check. When you open your account you are issued a small device called a "transponder". This transponder communicates through radio signals with the toll plazas as you drive through them. Account information is sent back and forth between your transponder and the plaza and your prepaid toll balance is debited.

The transponder mounts to your vehicle's windshield, right behind the rearview mirror. It mounts on dualock (velcro like) strips and is removable and can be moved from car to car. Make sure to register all vehicles when establishing your account so you get the correct amount of mounting strips.
So that makes it RFID

 

Thanks for the info. I wonder how many get swiped? 

[spokyone]

No.  It is part of Illinois "open road tolling".  It automaticatly deducts the toll from your account without you having to stop or slow down.  Those that have it also only pay half of the toll that is charged for those that pay cash.

 

Bert

 

So how do folkssetup with it? Do they give you some doo-dad to plug into your cigarette lighter socket, or have they taken RFID tags to the next level? 

Right from the illinois tollway website

You can open your I-PASS account using a credit card or check. When you open your account you are issued a small device called a "transponder". This transponder communicates through radio signals with the toll plazas as you drive through them. Account information is sent back and forth between your transponder and the plaza and your prepaid toll balance is debited.

The transponder mounts to your vehicle's windshield, right behind the rearview mirror. It mounts on dualock (velcro like) strips and is removable and can be moved from car to car. Make sure to register all vehicles when establishing your account so you get the correct amount of mounting strips.
So that makes it RFID

[Anonymous]

No.  It is part of Illinois "open road tolling".  It automaticatly deducts the toll from your account without you having to stop or slow down.  Those that have it also only pay half of the toll that is charged for those that pay cash.

 

Bert

 

So how do folkssetup with it? Do they give you some doo-dad to plug into your cigarette lighter socket, or have they taken RFID tags to the next level? 

[n012944]

You guys sneaking around?  Going places you're not supposed to go?

 

 The "I Pass" thing you speak of, is that one of those boxes that spit out info about truck loading, weight, owner ID, etc.. to the highway weigh stations, so that  the operator can bypass them?

 

  

No.  It is part of Illinois "open road tolling".  It automaticatly deducts the toll from your account without you having to stop or slow down.  Those that have it also only pay half of the toll that is charged for those that pay cash.

 

Bert

[spokyone]

You guys sneaking around?  Going places you're not supposed to go?

 

I know I know, "so long as I'm not doing anything wrong.." etc etc

 

Well I'm NOT doing anything wrong  , but just incase I ever decide I might wanna start, I'd like to be able to start without prejudice.....

 The "I Pass" thing you speak of, is that one of those boxes that spit out info about truck loading, weight, owner ID, etc.. to the highway weigh stations, so that  the operator can bypass them?

 Doubtlessly a good idea, but way beyond anything I'd ever have a need for

  

The system that lets trucks by pass the scales is different. VMI comes to mind. And it works just like you said. The better the company's safety record, the more free passes they get.

[Anonymous]

Of course, if you have your cell phone on, you are carrying your own personal beacon.....

 

True, but I don't use one .

 

Not for that reason  though,  I got tired of the thing always ringing, and having other people disguised under the mask of friendship, try to persuade me that what I was doing was not as important as what they thought I should be doing.

 

People see that cell phone hanging there on my belt and always ask for the number, and  then act hurt unless they got it. 

 

So, the day I hung up for the last time was in effect the day that I promoted myself to master of my own destiny. 

[Anonymous]

You guys sneaking around?  Going places you're not supposed to go?

 

I know I know, "so long as I'm not doing anything wrong.." etc etc

 

Well I'm NOT doing anything wrong  , but just incase I ever decide I might wanna start, I'd like to be able to start without prejudice.....

 The "I Pass" thing you speak of, is that one of those boxes that spit out info about truck loading, weight, owner ID, etc.. to the highway weigh stations, so that  the operator can bypass them?

 Doubtlessly a good idea, but way beyond anything I'd ever have a need for

  

[jeaton]

(*ahem*)

 

if it's all the same to you all, I'd rather not put a blinking "beacon" on my car that tells the man where I can be found.

And, of course, all of the toll roads that you have taken, and when you took them.  All recorded for posterity. 

Big Brother knows this. So he doubled the tolls for cash customers and reduced the lanes available, making for long lines. ( I-90 into Wisconsin comes to mind.)

Bob

Word has it that the new toll collection points were designed by some people in Wisconsin who don't want Illinois vacationers coming in anyway.  Fortunately, clearer heads over ruled the idea of starting a civilian border patrol. 

Just kidding.  Actually it was set up so that I could feel good when I can pass a car that blew by me doing 90 and then is stuck in a long line at the manual gate.

[zardoz]

We have some trouble funding Amtrak here in Illinois unless it is between Springfield and Chicago.

well, it is the home of the simpsons.

I thought the Simpsons came from Springfield, Missouri.
Or was it Springfield, Oregon.
Or perhaps Springfield, Massachusetts.
Or was it Springfield, Ohio.
Perhaps Springfield, New Jersey.
Springfield, Georgia?
Springfield, Kentucky?
Springfield, Michigan?
Could it be Springfield, Minnesota?
Maybe Springfield, Colorado?
Springfield, Pennsylvannia?
I know: It's Springfield, Wisconsin!!!

[spokyone]

(*ahem*)

 

if it's all the same to you all, I'd rather not put a blinking "beacon" on my car that tells the man where I can be found.

And, of course, all of the toll roads that you have taken, and when you took them.  All recorded for posterity. 

Big Brother knows this. So he doubled the tolls for cash customers and reduced the lanes available, making for long lines. ( I-90 into Wisconsin comes to mind.)

[zardoz]

(*ahem*)

 

if it's all the same to you all, I'd rather not put a blinking "beacon" on my car that tells the man where I can be found.

  

Of course, if you have your cell phone on, you are carrying your own personal beacon.....

[jeaton]

(*ahem*)

 

if it's all the same to you all, I'd rather not put a blinking "beacon" on my car that tells the man where I can be found.

And, of course, all of the toll roads that you have taken, and when you took them.  All recorded for posterity. 

You guys sneaking around?  Going places you're not supposed to go?

[Datafever]

(*ahem*)

 

if it's all the same to you all, I'd rather not put a blinking "beacon" on my car that tells the man where I can be found.

And, of course, all of the toll roads that you have taken, and when you took them.  All recorded for posterity. 

[Anonymous]

(*ahem*)

 

if it's all the same to you all, I'd rather not put a blinking "beacon" on my car that tells the man where I can be found.

  

[jeaton]

Toll roads?  No, I am not generally in favor of toll roads - the create congestion at the point of entry.  Perhaps as technology to auto-deduct toll fees becomes wide-spread enough, toll fees would work.

 

 

That would be real swell, that way you couldn't drive without a credit card account  to track the charges to.

Illinois IPass system takes debit cards, or you can prepay with cash.

 

Bert

Actually the I-Pass and other similar deals are in wide use on tollways.  On my trip out to New England last fall my I-Pass worked on tollways in every state except (fanfare) Indiana and Ohio.  The Illinois Tollway has installed a system where it picks up the transponder codes from a bridge over the highway lanes.  No gates, don't even have to slow down below the regular speed limit.  The technology is there, just a matter of spreading it all around.

[n012944]

Toll roads?  No, I am not generally in favor of toll roads - the create congestion at the point of entry.  Perhaps as technology to auto-deduct toll fees becomes wide-spread enough, toll fees would work.

 

 

That would be real swell, that way you couldn't drive without a credit card account  to track the charges to.

Illinois IPass system takes debit cards, or you can prepay with cash.

 

Bert

[Suburban Station]

There are many opportunities to relocate stations onto bypass lines thus eliminating the slow approaches to old downtown depots in decaying areas of the cities which are often stub ended and must be backed into. The airlines don't fly into downtown airports but into ones that are most often located in the boondocks; why doesn't AMTRAK do the same. For years now businesses have been fleeing high tax downtown areas in favor of campus locations in the suburbs so mid-city to mid-city service is no longer the asset it once was.

the airlines can't fly nto downtown depots. Indeed, the strenght of trains is in serving downtown depots. out east, these once decaying areas are seeing renewed interest.  IMO, Trains are a poor way to serve sprawl. People aren't going to take trains where they get dropped off on the side of a highway. a Good route will have a combination of these stops. however, these depots are in small locations perhaps they should be skipped and a stop added jsut outside the town. However, would it really be a good idea to stop just outside of chicago and not downtown? Probably not. 

 Aside form that, I like your common sense approach. Running on time is the way to go, and getting running speeds up to the

I could see an HSR from NYP to Chicago via Phily, Pitt, Cleveland, fort Wayne. Indeed, I wouldn't mind seeing the Lake Shore scrapped in favor of such a routing today.

[Anonymous]

Toll roads?  No, I am not generally in favor of toll roads - the create congestion at the point of entry.  Perhaps as technology to auto-deduct toll fees becomes wide-spread enough, toll fees would work.

 

 

That would be real swell, that way you couldn't drive without a credit card account  to track the charges to.

[spokyone]

KCS had a post about a cheaper way. Let's just concentrate on Amtrak being reliable. Once that is accomplished, then let's see if HSR would have an advantage.
  I have seen over and over in all layers of government, we can appropriate money for a  new project but never seem to have enough money to operate it properly. It starts out OK but then budget constraints mandate less service and less maintenence.

[Suburban Station]

OK thanks. The State subsidizes the  San Joaquins, correct?

I don't believe it is possible to operate any intercity scheduled passenger train in America other than Amtrak's Auto Train without a subsidy.

actually, the most profitable trains to run are on the NYP-WAS corridor not the auto train. the auto train requires it's own facilities.

At any rate, Extending the Pennsylvanian would be expensive without improving travel speeds since Amtrak woudl need new facilities in Cleveland. Perhaps it could go on to buffalow (existing facility). Perhaps you'd be better off with a new route, Toronto-Pitt via Buffalo, Erie, Cleveland. Higher speeds from Harrisburg to Chicago woudl mean a higher speed corridor from chicago to nyp.

[Datafever]

There is an answer. 

Well, considering you asked me  I gave you my answer .

Toll roads everywhere? That is your answer?  repealing the gas tax too?  Or I suppose you want to keep the gas tax in place to fund the restoration of heritage steam, and the reconstruction of coal docks along the transcons?  

Toll roads?  No, I am not generally in favor of toll roads - the create congestion at the point of entry.  Perhaps as technology to auto-deduct toll fees becomes wide-spread enough, toll fees would work.

Repeal the gas tax?  Good heavens!  What for?  Quite frankly, it would probably be possible to raise sufficient revenue for all road projects (city streets, county roads, highways, interstates, etc.) through the use of gas taxes.  Of course, that might leave gas at $5.00 a gallon or so... 

[Anonymous]

There is an answer. 

 

Well, considering you asked me  I gave you my answer .

 

Toll roads everywhere? That is your answer?  repealing the gas tax too?  Or I suppose you want to keep the gas tax in place to fund the restoration of heritage steam, and the reconstruction of coal docks along the transcons?  

[Datafever]

why can't we charge the users of rail a fair price that covers the cost of their use?

 Because they will refuse to pay, and use the highways instead?

 There is your answer.

There is an answer. 

Another solution would be to charge highway users the full cost of maintenance and building new roads.  Toll roads come to mind.  That would probably drive enough commuters off of the highways and onto trains, even if they had to pay the full cost of trains.  Of course, with more train travellers, the cost per passenger mile would be less than it is now. 

[Anonymous]

why can't we charge the users of rail a fair price that covers the cost of their use?

 Because they will refuse to pay, and use the highways instead?

 There is your answer. 

 

[Datafever]

Well then, I'd probably be in favor of NO additional trains that required a subsidy to remain in operation

Ft Wayne to Indy or FW to Chicago. 

So you would prefer that the subsidy be used to build more roads instead? 

[Anonymous]

Well then, I'd probably be in favor of NO additional trains that required a subsidy to remain in operation

Ft Wayne to Indy or FW to Chicago. 

 

[nanaimo73]

OK thanks. The State subsidizes the  San Joaquins, correct?

I don't believe it is possible to operate any intercity scheduled passenger train in America other than Amtrak's Auto Train without a subsidy.