QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed You sound very happy over this! [:p][:p] QUOTE: Originally posted by bryan9664 The news made me jump threw the roof. With Texas Pacifico reopening a line from Presidio to San Angelo Jct. via BNSF to Brownwood. Yes! Finally! The South Orient shall rise agian. In the near future the KCS will see trackage rights over the former SF Dubiln Sub, now owned by Fort Worth and Western, from Fort Worth to Brownwood. The line is planed to reopen in January. A line from Fort Worth to Mexico...... and it will put the Dublin Sub back in action. I knew someday that this would happen. And thank god it did. But the line wont be fully operational untill September 2004.But eather way Im happy. Now the Dublin Sub wont go to waste. Thank you god...... thank you. [:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)]
QUOTE: Originally posted by bryan9664 The news made me jump threw the roof. With Texas Pacifico reopening a line from Presidio to San Angelo Jct. via BNSF to Brownwood. Yes! Finally! The South Orient shall rise agian. In the near future the KCS will see trackage rights over the former SF Dubiln Sub, now owned by Fort Worth and Western, from Fort Worth to Brownwood. The line is planed to reopen in January. A line from Fort Worth to Mexico...... and it will put the Dublin Sub back in action. I knew someday that this would happen. And thank god it did. But the line wont be fully operational untill September 2004.But eather way Im happy. Now the Dublin Sub wont go to waste. Thank you god...... thank you. [:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)]
QUOTE: Originally posted by Murray QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed You sound very happy over this! [:p][:p] QUOTE: Originally posted by bryan9664 The news made me jump threw the roof. With Texas Pacifico reopening a line from Presidio to San Angelo Jct. via BNSF to Brownwood. Yes! Finally! The South Orient shall rise agian. In the near future the KCS will see trackage rights over the former SF Dubiln Sub, now owned by Fort Worth and Western, from Fort Worth to Brownwood. The line is planed to reopen in January. A line from Fort Worth to Mexico...... and it will put the Dublin Sub back in action. I knew someday that this would happen. And thank god it did. But the line wont be fully operational untill September 2004.But eather way Im happy. Now the Dublin Sub wont go to waste. Thank you god...... thank you. [:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)] Its great anytime a line is saved from the brink of abandonment!!! [;)]
QUOTE: Originally posted by CSSHEGEWISCH QUOTE: Originally posted by Murray QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed You sound very happy over this! [:p][:p] QUOTE: Originally posted by bryan9664 The news made me jump threw the roof. With Texas Pacifico reopening a line from Presidio to San Angelo Jct. via BNSF to Brownwood. Yes! Finally! The South Orient shall rise agian. In the near future the KCS will see trackage rights over the former SF Dubiln Sub, now owned by Fort Worth and Western, from Fort Worth to Brownwood. The line is planed to reopen in January. A line from Fort Worth to Mexico...... and it will put the Dublin Sub back in action. I knew someday that this would happen. And thank god it did. But the line wont be fully operational untill September 2004.But eather way Im happy. Now the Dublin Sub wont go to waste. Thank you god...... thank you. [:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)][:)] Its great anytime a line is saved from the brink of abandonment!!! [;)] Not necessarily true. It appears that based on prior postings on this thread that the South Orient has little economic justification for its continued existence.
QUOTE: Originally posted by Murray Originally posted by CSSHEGEWISCH Originally posted by Murray Originally posted by spbed You sound very happy over this! [:p][:p] [i] So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line Reply SALfan Member sinceApril 2002 From: Northern Florida 1,429 posts Posted by SALfan on Friday, March 18, 2005 11:22 AM QUOTE: So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line Any time the state is involved, politicians are involved. Any time politicians are involved, logic or economic justification or anything else involving rational thought go out the window. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 18, 2005 11:36 AM QUOTE: Originally posted by JOdom QUOTE: So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line Any time the state is involved, politicians are involved. Any time politicians are involved, logic or economic justification or anything else involving rational thought go out the window. Well time will tell.......... I tend to think that this operation will work...if for no other reason if helps to ease the border capacity issues at El Paso and Laredo. And as was mentioned earlier by dldance, with Union Pacific's interest in the border crossing at Presidio, this should further enhance the value of the former South Orient line to help allieviate border traffic issues. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 18, 2005 1:15 PM KC, Mexican officials will set up trade corridor Officials from Kansas City and the Mexican city of Lazaro Cardenas will sign an agreement Mar22 to establish a new trans-Pacific trade corridor and establi***he Kansas City area as an inland port. The creation of the trade corridor also is designed to alleviate delays and congestion at West Coast ports. A signing ceremony is scheduled for 18:00 Mar22 at Cathedral Square, 427 W. 12th St. "This signing is an exciting and historic moment for the international trade in the Kansas City region," Kansas City SmartPort President Chris Gutierrez said in a written release. SmartPort was formed to establi***he region as an inland trade processing center. "The partnership with Lazaro Cardenas puts Kansas City in a pivotal position to become the Pacific port's primary U.S. inland port and puts Kansas City another step ahead of our competition for economic growth and job creation," Gutierrez said. Kansas City has won approval to be the site of the Mexican government's first foreign customs clearance facilities sometime this year. In addition, Kansas City recently signed an agreement with the Mexican port city of Manzanillo, the second-largest container port in Mexico. Lazaro Cardenas handles fewer containers, Gutierrez said, but the new agreement is key because it has a lot of room for port expansion and is served by the Mexican railroad, TFM, that Kansas City Southern is buying. A delegation of seven Mexican officials including Eloy Vargas Arreola, secretary of economic development for the state of Michoacan, will be in Kansas City for the signing ceremony. "In terms of opening the Midwest to Asian trade through Mexican ports, this agreement signifies substantial completion of the extensive efforts over the past several years devoted to establishing the political, economic and cultural foundation enabling this trade route to work," Al Figuly, president of Greater Kansas City Foreign Trade Zone Inc., said in the release. "It is a tribute to the successful efforts of many." Local agencies that have been involved in developing the trade corridors between Mexico and Kansas City include SmartPort; the Greater Kansas City Foreign Trade Zone Inc.; the State of Missouri-Mexico Trade and Agricultural Office; the Kansas City, Mo.,-Mexico Trade and Business Initiatives Corp.; and the International Office of Trade and Affairs of Kansas City. Under the new trade agreement, Kansas City and Lazaro Cardenas will work together to promote more freight traffic and address freight security along the corridor. Prior to signing the agreement, Mexican leaders representing government, industrial associations, chambers of commerce and economic development will meet with officials from Kansas City Southern, TranSystems Corp., Bayer Corp., Black & Veatch Solutions and various importers in the region. - The Business Journal of Kansas City, courtesy Larry W. Grant Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 18, 2005 1:18 PM South Texas railroad in tests The long dormant South Orient Railroad is making its first test run across the U.S.-Mexico border, and the first trains are expected to arrive in Fort Worth by the middle of next week, railroad executives said Tuesday. The railroad, which crosses the border at Presidio, is seeking to provide an alternative to shippers struggling with congestion at rail crossings in El Paso and Laredo. Officials also hope it will pump new economic life into struggling West Texas towns along its 382-mile route. The test run started from Torreon in north central Mexico on Monday night and involves 29 rail cars, including four that are carrying calcium carbonate for Dallas-based Texas Industries Inc., said Richard Lesikar, vice president of business development for the Fort Worth & Western Railroad. "It's a big, big deal," he said, noting that many potential shippers are waiting to see how the test runs fare before making a commitment. The South Orient cuts across 11 West Texas counties, connecting with the Fort Worth & Western at San Angelo Junction and with the Mexican railroad Ferromex at Presidio. Grupo Mexico, the Mexican mining giant, is leasing the South Orient rail line from the state of Texas. The South Orient hasn't offered regular service for more than six years. Grupo Mexico is spending millions to repair the track. Rail cars can now travel at an average speed of 25 miles per hour for 154 miles, but must slow down to speeds of 10 miles per hour the rest of the track, said Roy Williams, chief operating officer of Texas Pacifico Transportation Ltd., which operates the South Orient. To support the railroad's customers, the Fort Worth & Western aims to work with developers in Cleburne, Fort Worth and other cities to develop industrial parks, foreign trade zones, enterprise zones and an intermodal facility, Mr. Lesikar said. - Katherine Yung, The Dallas Morning News, courtesy Larry W. Grant Reply Edit brazos87 Member sinceJanuary 2005 45 posts Posted by brazos87 on Saturday, March 19, 2005 2:55 PM Capacity is @ a premium in Texas and many other places. UP and others can use this reopened line for lower priority and less time sensitive shipments, which in turn, will free up a bit of the congestion. I look for them (UP and others) to use the line for "Dead Freights" (a Milwaukee Road term). Reply dldance Member sinceAugust 2003 From: Near Promentory UT 1,590 posts Posted by dldance on Saturday, March 19, 2005 4:38 PM I don't expect UP to use the South Orient as they are controlling interest in most of the capacity issues -- but I do expect BNSF and KCS to take advantage of the opportunities when the reliability of the operation is proven. dd Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, March 23, 2005 6:22 PM Here's another good article on the Texas Pacifico. Check out page 6. http://www.dot.state.tx.us/env/pdf/envisionpdf/26sum03.pdf You'll notice that there is in fact a reference to Union Pacific and their desire to use the Texas Pacifico's border crossing at Presidio, Texas. Enjoy!!!!! Reply Edit brazos87 Member sinceJanuary 2005 45 posts Posted by brazos87 on Thursday, March 24, 2005 1:16 AM Low priority freight, southbound empties and low value loads make up a good percentage of US traffic moving into Mexico. Conversely, high dollar and high value goods make up a large percentage of the traffic moving into the US (auto parts and vehicles for example) from Mexico. UP's lines into Mexico are already above their current realistic capacity, even with so-called streamlined Customs Inspections. With levels of current traffic, UP would be very short sighted not to seek relief from using this corridor. It wouldn't really matter to the UP if a scrap load sat @ Presidio, as long as it freed up Laredo for Northbound autos or other high value shipments. All carloads are not equal in terms of revenue or importance, (see revenue). 10 boxcars of scrap paper sitting idle are less likely to incur wrath than a single container of auto parts which is delayed. Should we shutdown an assembly plant which employs 4,000, or should we make a recycler store bales in his yard? This is a nature of the commodities themselves. If it pays well, it should move well. My 2 cents (certainly not adjusted for inflation!). Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Thursday, March 24, 2005 6:21 AM [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply brazos87 Member sinceJanuary 2005 45 posts Posted by brazos87 on Thursday, March 24, 2005 11:02 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 25, 2005 6:26 AM Here's two more articles on Texas Pacifico's cross-border test train. Enjoy: http://www.marfatx.com/uploadedfiles/PRESIDIO%20Train%20Arrival.html http://www.dmtimes.net/blog/News/_archives/2005/3/24/468484.html Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, March 26, 2005 11:35 AM And still more news on the cross-border test train: http://www.brownwoodbulletin.com/ar...news/news01.txt Anyone get any shots of her as she passed to Ft. Worth???? Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, June 9, 2005 9:00 AM There is a brand new website for the Texas Pacifico. It can be found at http://www.txpf.com/ Some interesting information in it so far. Looks like in time they will add to it. Regards! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 12:17 PM Here's the latest news on the activity of the Texas Pacifico: http://www.fwbusinesspress.com/display.php?id=3840 Reply Edit csmith9474 Member sinceApril 2005 From: Colorado Springs, CO 3,590 posts Posted by csmith9474 on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 12:31 PM I am just as excited as the OP. I had the opportunity to operate a motor car, ex Santa Fe MT-19, from Presidio north. Awesome run. I spent a lot of time in that area in 1993 and was able to see everything from Ft. Stockton to Presidio. It is amazing to go through some of the old structures. It is as if Santa Fe just left everything as it was. I haven't been to the Ft Stockton depot since the Chanber of Commerce moved in. I hope they didn't screwit up too bad. Paisano Pass is going to present some great photo opps. Smitty Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 7:32 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by csmith9474 I am just as excited as the OP. I had the opportunity to operate a motor car, ex Santa Fe MT-19, from Presidio north. Awesome run. I spent a lot of time in that area in 1993 and was able to see everything from Ft. Stockton to Presidio. It is amazing to go through some of the old structures. It is as if Santa Fe just left everything as it was. I haven't been to the Ft Stockton depot since the Chanber of Commerce moved in. I hope they didn't screwit up too bad. Paisano Pass is going to present some great photo opps. It is indeed a line with a lot of potential. I am especially pleased with the consistent carloads that are moving from the upper midwest and interchanging with Fort Worth & Western and then on to Texas Pacifico. I can only begin to imagine the possibilitites once they bring the ROW up to a point to allow faster operating speeds. Reply Edit samfp1943 Member sinceJune 2003 From: South Central,Ks 7,170 posts Posted by samfp1943 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 12:34 PM A new outlet for grain from the upper midwest would be a blessing..The conjestion at Laredo, and El Paso, at times can be intolerable. Any new crossing would certainly be a blessing. KCS seems to have capacity on their line NOrth/South. From what I have read the East /West through Dallas and Ft Worth is a problem with transit times, but they might welcome a new routing down to Mexico for their NAFTA railroad concept. This will be an interesting operation to follow as it develops. Reply csmith9474 Member sinceApril 2005 From: Colorado Springs, CO 3,590 posts Posted by csmith9474 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 2:14 PM Can't wait for those onion trains out of Presidio. And BTW, the motor car run was legal. The "station master" at the time said that I could run the motor car whenever I wanted as long as I provided a battery and gas. He didn't even know how to operate the thing. I just had to check in with him to make sure there weren't any trains that day. I definately wanted to be sure on that one! MT-19A vs GP-9, News at 6. I was also offered a hi-rail ride from Alpine to Presidio, but never took the offer. What the hell was I thinking. I wouldn't imagine you are missing much between Paisano Pass and Presidio. Smitty Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 11:31 AM More Texas Pacifico News: http://www.wacotrib.com/news/content/gen/ap/TX_South_Orient_Railroad.html Reply Edit dldance Member sinceAugust 2003 From: Near Promentory UT 1,590 posts Posted by dldance on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:04 PM When I was through Ft Stockton, about 2 months ago, it was hard to tell the rails from the ROW due to weeds. They better plan on a lot of sand. dd Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:36 PM Bryan, you mean to tell me that the South Orient line goes from Fort Worth to Brownwood? I thought that it was the BNSF line (formerly Santa Fe) that went through there but I guess that I was wrong, I think that the South Orient Railroad is an underrated railroad that deserves more recognition. [ Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, October 21, 2005 9:05 PM yes, its a former santa fe line the was sold to the south orient in 1993. its is now ft. worth and western rr. i live on this line and im seeing some bnsf trains run through here occasionally. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 22, 2005 8:46 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by brazos87 QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Yes, except MRL is soley subservient to BNSF, while it appears the South Orient will be able to interchange with a nice triopoly of BNSF, UP, and KCS. In fact, BNSF has shown it will go out of it's way to keep MRL in a virtual chastity belt, spending millions of dollars to buy the otherwise non-descript Montana Western. Gotta keep that Montana Monopoly to pay for the upkeep on the Chicago-LA speedway! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 22, 2005 10:55 PM Actually it is the Forth Worth and Western from Ft. Worth to San Angelo Jct (Browood Tx), about 100 miles east of San Angelo, From San Angelo Jct to Presidio it is Texas Pacifico, the subsidiary company run by FerroMex. They have a 40 year lease form the state of Texas to operate this line. Here is their website: http://www.txpf.com Hope this info helps! Reply Edit 123 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
Originally posted by CSSHEGEWISCH Originally posted by Murray Originally posted by spbed You sound very happy over this! [:p][:p] [i] So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line Reply SALfan Member sinceApril 2002 From: Northern Florida 1,429 posts Posted by SALfan on Friday, March 18, 2005 11:22 AM QUOTE: So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line Any time the state is involved, politicians are involved. Any time politicians are involved, logic or economic justification or anything else involving rational thought go out the window. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 18, 2005 11:36 AM QUOTE: Originally posted by JOdom QUOTE: So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line Any time the state is involved, politicians are involved. Any time politicians are involved, logic or economic justification or anything else involving rational thought go out the window. Well time will tell.......... I tend to think that this operation will work...if for no other reason if helps to ease the border capacity issues at El Paso and Laredo. And as was mentioned earlier by dldance, with Union Pacific's interest in the border crossing at Presidio, this should further enhance the value of the former South Orient line to help allieviate border traffic issues. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 18, 2005 1:15 PM KC, Mexican officials will set up trade corridor Officials from Kansas City and the Mexican city of Lazaro Cardenas will sign an agreement Mar22 to establish a new trans-Pacific trade corridor and establi***he Kansas City area as an inland port. The creation of the trade corridor also is designed to alleviate delays and congestion at West Coast ports. A signing ceremony is scheduled for 18:00 Mar22 at Cathedral Square, 427 W. 12th St. "This signing is an exciting and historic moment for the international trade in the Kansas City region," Kansas City SmartPort President Chris Gutierrez said in a written release. SmartPort was formed to establi***he region as an inland trade processing center. "The partnership with Lazaro Cardenas puts Kansas City in a pivotal position to become the Pacific port's primary U.S. inland port and puts Kansas City another step ahead of our competition for economic growth and job creation," Gutierrez said. Kansas City has won approval to be the site of the Mexican government's first foreign customs clearance facilities sometime this year. In addition, Kansas City recently signed an agreement with the Mexican port city of Manzanillo, the second-largest container port in Mexico. Lazaro Cardenas handles fewer containers, Gutierrez said, but the new agreement is key because it has a lot of room for port expansion and is served by the Mexican railroad, TFM, that Kansas City Southern is buying. A delegation of seven Mexican officials including Eloy Vargas Arreola, secretary of economic development for the state of Michoacan, will be in Kansas City for the signing ceremony. "In terms of opening the Midwest to Asian trade through Mexican ports, this agreement signifies substantial completion of the extensive efforts over the past several years devoted to establishing the political, economic and cultural foundation enabling this trade route to work," Al Figuly, president of Greater Kansas City Foreign Trade Zone Inc., said in the release. "It is a tribute to the successful efforts of many." Local agencies that have been involved in developing the trade corridors between Mexico and Kansas City include SmartPort; the Greater Kansas City Foreign Trade Zone Inc.; the State of Missouri-Mexico Trade and Agricultural Office; the Kansas City, Mo.,-Mexico Trade and Business Initiatives Corp.; and the International Office of Trade and Affairs of Kansas City. Under the new trade agreement, Kansas City and Lazaro Cardenas will work together to promote more freight traffic and address freight security along the corridor. Prior to signing the agreement, Mexican leaders representing government, industrial associations, chambers of commerce and economic development will meet with officials from Kansas City Southern, TranSystems Corp., Bayer Corp., Black & Veatch Solutions and various importers in the region. - The Business Journal of Kansas City, courtesy Larry W. Grant Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 18, 2005 1:18 PM South Texas railroad in tests The long dormant South Orient Railroad is making its first test run across the U.S.-Mexico border, and the first trains are expected to arrive in Fort Worth by the middle of next week, railroad executives said Tuesday. The railroad, which crosses the border at Presidio, is seeking to provide an alternative to shippers struggling with congestion at rail crossings in El Paso and Laredo. Officials also hope it will pump new economic life into struggling West Texas towns along its 382-mile route. The test run started from Torreon in north central Mexico on Monday night and involves 29 rail cars, including four that are carrying calcium carbonate for Dallas-based Texas Industries Inc., said Richard Lesikar, vice president of business development for the Fort Worth & Western Railroad. "It's a big, big deal," he said, noting that many potential shippers are waiting to see how the test runs fare before making a commitment. The South Orient cuts across 11 West Texas counties, connecting with the Fort Worth & Western at San Angelo Junction and with the Mexican railroad Ferromex at Presidio. Grupo Mexico, the Mexican mining giant, is leasing the South Orient rail line from the state of Texas. The South Orient hasn't offered regular service for more than six years. Grupo Mexico is spending millions to repair the track. Rail cars can now travel at an average speed of 25 miles per hour for 154 miles, but must slow down to speeds of 10 miles per hour the rest of the track, said Roy Williams, chief operating officer of Texas Pacifico Transportation Ltd., which operates the South Orient. To support the railroad's customers, the Fort Worth & Western aims to work with developers in Cleburne, Fort Worth and other cities to develop industrial parks, foreign trade zones, enterprise zones and an intermodal facility, Mr. Lesikar said. - Katherine Yung, The Dallas Morning News, courtesy Larry W. Grant Reply Edit brazos87 Member sinceJanuary 2005 45 posts Posted by brazos87 on Saturday, March 19, 2005 2:55 PM Capacity is @ a premium in Texas and many other places. UP and others can use this reopened line for lower priority and less time sensitive shipments, which in turn, will free up a bit of the congestion. I look for them (UP and others) to use the line for "Dead Freights" (a Milwaukee Road term). Reply dldance Member sinceAugust 2003 From: Near Promentory UT 1,590 posts Posted by dldance on Saturday, March 19, 2005 4:38 PM I don't expect UP to use the South Orient as they are controlling interest in most of the capacity issues -- but I do expect BNSF and KCS to take advantage of the opportunities when the reliability of the operation is proven. dd Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, March 23, 2005 6:22 PM Here's another good article on the Texas Pacifico. Check out page 6. http://www.dot.state.tx.us/env/pdf/envisionpdf/26sum03.pdf You'll notice that there is in fact a reference to Union Pacific and their desire to use the Texas Pacifico's border crossing at Presidio, Texas. Enjoy!!!!! Reply Edit brazos87 Member sinceJanuary 2005 45 posts Posted by brazos87 on Thursday, March 24, 2005 1:16 AM Low priority freight, southbound empties and low value loads make up a good percentage of US traffic moving into Mexico. Conversely, high dollar and high value goods make up a large percentage of the traffic moving into the US (auto parts and vehicles for example) from Mexico. UP's lines into Mexico are already above their current realistic capacity, even with so-called streamlined Customs Inspections. With levels of current traffic, UP would be very short sighted not to seek relief from using this corridor. It wouldn't really matter to the UP if a scrap load sat @ Presidio, as long as it freed up Laredo for Northbound autos or other high value shipments. All carloads are not equal in terms of revenue or importance, (see revenue). 10 boxcars of scrap paper sitting idle are less likely to incur wrath than a single container of auto parts which is delayed. Should we shutdown an assembly plant which employs 4,000, or should we make a recycler store bales in his yard? This is a nature of the commodities themselves. If it pays well, it should move well. My 2 cents (certainly not adjusted for inflation!). Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Thursday, March 24, 2005 6:21 AM [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply brazos87 Member sinceJanuary 2005 45 posts Posted by brazos87 on Thursday, March 24, 2005 11:02 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 25, 2005 6:26 AM Here's two more articles on Texas Pacifico's cross-border test train. Enjoy: http://www.marfatx.com/uploadedfiles/PRESIDIO%20Train%20Arrival.html http://www.dmtimes.net/blog/News/_archives/2005/3/24/468484.html Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, March 26, 2005 11:35 AM And still more news on the cross-border test train: http://www.brownwoodbulletin.com/ar...news/news01.txt Anyone get any shots of her as she passed to Ft. Worth???? Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, June 9, 2005 9:00 AM There is a brand new website for the Texas Pacifico. It can be found at http://www.txpf.com/ Some interesting information in it so far. Looks like in time they will add to it. Regards! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 12:17 PM Here's the latest news on the activity of the Texas Pacifico: http://www.fwbusinesspress.com/display.php?id=3840 Reply Edit csmith9474 Member sinceApril 2005 From: Colorado Springs, CO 3,590 posts Posted by csmith9474 on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 12:31 PM I am just as excited as the OP. I had the opportunity to operate a motor car, ex Santa Fe MT-19, from Presidio north. Awesome run. I spent a lot of time in that area in 1993 and was able to see everything from Ft. Stockton to Presidio. It is amazing to go through some of the old structures. It is as if Santa Fe just left everything as it was. I haven't been to the Ft Stockton depot since the Chanber of Commerce moved in. I hope they didn't screwit up too bad. Paisano Pass is going to present some great photo opps. Smitty Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 7:32 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by csmith9474 I am just as excited as the OP. I had the opportunity to operate a motor car, ex Santa Fe MT-19, from Presidio north. Awesome run. I spent a lot of time in that area in 1993 and was able to see everything from Ft. Stockton to Presidio. It is amazing to go through some of the old structures. It is as if Santa Fe just left everything as it was. I haven't been to the Ft Stockton depot since the Chanber of Commerce moved in. I hope they didn't screwit up too bad. Paisano Pass is going to present some great photo opps. It is indeed a line with a lot of potential. I am especially pleased with the consistent carloads that are moving from the upper midwest and interchanging with Fort Worth & Western and then on to Texas Pacifico. I can only begin to imagine the possibilitites once they bring the ROW up to a point to allow faster operating speeds. Reply Edit samfp1943 Member sinceJune 2003 From: South Central,Ks 7,170 posts Posted by samfp1943 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 12:34 PM A new outlet for grain from the upper midwest would be a blessing..The conjestion at Laredo, and El Paso, at times can be intolerable. Any new crossing would certainly be a blessing. KCS seems to have capacity on their line NOrth/South. From what I have read the East /West through Dallas and Ft Worth is a problem with transit times, but they might welcome a new routing down to Mexico for their NAFTA railroad concept. This will be an interesting operation to follow as it develops. Reply csmith9474 Member sinceApril 2005 From: Colorado Springs, CO 3,590 posts Posted by csmith9474 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 2:14 PM Can't wait for those onion trains out of Presidio. And BTW, the motor car run was legal. The "station master" at the time said that I could run the motor car whenever I wanted as long as I provided a battery and gas. He didn't even know how to operate the thing. I just had to check in with him to make sure there weren't any trains that day. I definately wanted to be sure on that one! MT-19A vs GP-9, News at 6. I was also offered a hi-rail ride from Alpine to Presidio, but never took the offer. What the hell was I thinking. I wouldn't imagine you are missing much between Paisano Pass and Presidio. Smitty Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 11:31 AM More Texas Pacifico News: http://www.wacotrib.com/news/content/gen/ap/TX_South_Orient_Railroad.html Reply Edit dldance Member sinceAugust 2003 From: Near Promentory UT 1,590 posts Posted by dldance on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:04 PM When I was through Ft Stockton, about 2 months ago, it was hard to tell the rails from the ROW due to weeds. They better plan on a lot of sand. dd Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:36 PM Bryan, you mean to tell me that the South Orient line goes from Fort Worth to Brownwood? I thought that it was the BNSF line (formerly Santa Fe) that went through there but I guess that I was wrong, I think that the South Orient Railroad is an underrated railroad that deserves more recognition. [ Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, October 21, 2005 9:05 PM yes, its a former santa fe line the was sold to the south orient in 1993. its is now ft. worth and western rr. i live on this line and im seeing some bnsf trains run through here occasionally. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 22, 2005 8:46 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by brazos87 QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Yes, except MRL is soley subservient to BNSF, while it appears the South Orient will be able to interchange with a nice triopoly of BNSF, UP, and KCS. In fact, BNSF has shown it will go out of it's way to keep MRL in a virtual chastity belt, spending millions of dollars to buy the otherwise non-descript Montana Western. Gotta keep that Montana Monopoly to pay for the upkeep on the Chicago-LA speedway! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 22, 2005 10:55 PM Actually it is the Forth Worth and Western from Ft. Worth to San Angelo Jct (Browood Tx), about 100 miles east of San Angelo, From San Angelo Jct to Presidio it is Texas Pacifico, the subsidiary company run by FerroMex. They have a 40 year lease form the state of Texas to operate this line. Here is their website: http://www.txpf.com Hope this info helps! Reply Edit 123 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
Originally posted by Murray Originally posted by spbed You sound very happy over this! [:p][:p] [i] So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line Reply SALfan Member sinceApril 2002 From: Northern Florida 1,429 posts Posted by SALfan on Friday, March 18, 2005 11:22 AM QUOTE: So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line Any time the state is involved, politicians are involved. Any time politicians are involved, logic or economic justification or anything else involving rational thought go out the window. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 18, 2005 11:36 AM QUOTE: Originally posted by JOdom QUOTE: So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line Any time the state is involved, politicians are involved. Any time politicians are involved, logic or economic justification or anything else involving rational thought go out the window. Well time will tell.......... I tend to think that this operation will work...if for no other reason if helps to ease the border capacity issues at El Paso and Laredo. And as was mentioned earlier by dldance, with Union Pacific's interest in the border crossing at Presidio, this should further enhance the value of the former South Orient line to help allieviate border traffic issues. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 18, 2005 1:15 PM KC, Mexican officials will set up trade corridor Officials from Kansas City and the Mexican city of Lazaro Cardenas will sign an agreement Mar22 to establish a new trans-Pacific trade corridor and establi***he Kansas City area as an inland port. The creation of the trade corridor also is designed to alleviate delays and congestion at West Coast ports. A signing ceremony is scheduled for 18:00 Mar22 at Cathedral Square, 427 W. 12th St. "This signing is an exciting and historic moment for the international trade in the Kansas City region," Kansas City SmartPort President Chris Gutierrez said in a written release. SmartPort was formed to establi***he region as an inland trade processing center. "The partnership with Lazaro Cardenas puts Kansas City in a pivotal position to become the Pacific port's primary U.S. inland port and puts Kansas City another step ahead of our competition for economic growth and job creation," Gutierrez said. Kansas City has won approval to be the site of the Mexican government's first foreign customs clearance facilities sometime this year. In addition, Kansas City recently signed an agreement with the Mexican port city of Manzanillo, the second-largest container port in Mexico. Lazaro Cardenas handles fewer containers, Gutierrez said, but the new agreement is key because it has a lot of room for port expansion and is served by the Mexican railroad, TFM, that Kansas City Southern is buying. A delegation of seven Mexican officials including Eloy Vargas Arreola, secretary of economic development for the state of Michoacan, will be in Kansas City for the signing ceremony. "In terms of opening the Midwest to Asian trade through Mexican ports, this agreement signifies substantial completion of the extensive efforts over the past several years devoted to establishing the political, economic and cultural foundation enabling this trade route to work," Al Figuly, president of Greater Kansas City Foreign Trade Zone Inc., said in the release. "It is a tribute to the successful efforts of many." Local agencies that have been involved in developing the trade corridors between Mexico and Kansas City include SmartPort; the Greater Kansas City Foreign Trade Zone Inc.; the State of Missouri-Mexico Trade and Agricultural Office; the Kansas City, Mo.,-Mexico Trade and Business Initiatives Corp.; and the International Office of Trade and Affairs of Kansas City. Under the new trade agreement, Kansas City and Lazaro Cardenas will work together to promote more freight traffic and address freight security along the corridor. Prior to signing the agreement, Mexican leaders representing government, industrial associations, chambers of commerce and economic development will meet with officials from Kansas City Southern, TranSystems Corp., Bayer Corp., Black & Veatch Solutions and various importers in the region. - The Business Journal of Kansas City, courtesy Larry W. Grant Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 18, 2005 1:18 PM South Texas railroad in tests The long dormant South Orient Railroad is making its first test run across the U.S.-Mexico border, and the first trains are expected to arrive in Fort Worth by the middle of next week, railroad executives said Tuesday. The railroad, which crosses the border at Presidio, is seeking to provide an alternative to shippers struggling with congestion at rail crossings in El Paso and Laredo. Officials also hope it will pump new economic life into struggling West Texas towns along its 382-mile route. The test run started from Torreon in north central Mexico on Monday night and involves 29 rail cars, including four that are carrying calcium carbonate for Dallas-based Texas Industries Inc., said Richard Lesikar, vice president of business development for the Fort Worth & Western Railroad. "It's a big, big deal," he said, noting that many potential shippers are waiting to see how the test runs fare before making a commitment. The South Orient cuts across 11 West Texas counties, connecting with the Fort Worth & Western at San Angelo Junction and with the Mexican railroad Ferromex at Presidio. Grupo Mexico, the Mexican mining giant, is leasing the South Orient rail line from the state of Texas. The South Orient hasn't offered regular service for more than six years. Grupo Mexico is spending millions to repair the track. Rail cars can now travel at an average speed of 25 miles per hour for 154 miles, but must slow down to speeds of 10 miles per hour the rest of the track, said Roy Williams, chief operating officer of Texas Pacifico Transportation Ltd., which operates the South Orient. To support the railroad's customers, the Fort Worth & Western aims to work with developers in Cleburne, Fort Worth and other cities to develop industrial parks, foreign trade zones, enterprise zones and an intermodal facility, Mr. Lesikar said. - Katherine Yung, The Dallas Morning News, courtesy Larry W. Grant Reply Edit brazos87 Member sinceJanuary 2005 45 posts Posted by brazos87 on Saturday, March 19, 2005 2:55 PM Capacity is @ a premium in Texas and many other places. UP and others can use this reopened line for lower priority and less time sensitive shipments, which in turn, will free up a bit of the congestion. I look for them (UP and others) to use the line for "Dead Freights" (a Milwaukee Road term). Reply dldance Member sinceAugust 2003 From: Near Promentory UT 1,590 posts Posted by dldance on Saturday, March 19, 2005 4:38 PM I don't expect UP to use the South Orient as they are controlling interest in most of the capacity issues -- but I do expect BNSF and KCS to take advantage of the opportunities when the reliability of the operation is proven. dd Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, March 23, 2005 6:22 PM Here's another good article on the Texas Pacifico. Check out page 6. http://www.dot.state.tx.us/env/pdf/envisionpdf/26sum03.pdf You'll notice that there is in fact a reference to Union Pacific and their desire to use the Texas Pacifico's border crossing at Presidio, Texas. Enjoy!!!!! Reply Edit brazos87 Member sinceJanuary 2005 45 posts Posted by brazos87 on Thursday, March 24, 2005 1:16 AM Low priority freight, southbound empties and low value loads make up a good percentage of US traffic moving into Mexico. Conversely, high dollar and high value goods make up a large percentage of the traffic moving into the US (auto parts and vehicles for example) from Mexico. UP's lines into Mexico are already above their current realistic capacity, even with so-called streamlined Customs Inspections. With levels of current traffic, UP would be very short sighted not to seek relief from using this corridor. It wouldn't really matter to the UP if a scrap load sat @ Presidio, as long as it freed up Laredo for Northbound autos or other high value shipments. All carloads are not equal in terms of revenue or importance, (see revenue). 10 boxcars of scrap paper sitting idle are less likely to incur wrath than a single container of auto parts which is delayed. Should we shutdown an assembly plant which employs 4,000, or should we make a recycler store bales in his yard? This is a nature of the commodities themselves. If it pays well, it should move well. My 2 cents (certainly not adjusted for inflation!). Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Thursday, March 24, 2005 6:21 AM [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply brazos87 Member sinceJanuary 2005 45 posts Posted by brazos87 on Thursday, March 24, 2005 11:02 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 25, 2005 6:26 AM Here's two more articles on Texas Pacifico's cross-border test train. Enjoy: http://www.marfatx.com/uploadedfiles/PRESIDIO%20Train%20Arrival.html http://www.dmtimes.net/blog/News/_archives/2005/3/24/468484.html Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, March 26, 2005 11:35 AM And still more news on the cross-border test train: http://www.brownwoodbulletin.com/ar...news/news01.txt Anyone get any shots of her as she passed to Ft. Worth???? Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, June 9, 2005 9:00 AM There is a brand new website for the Texas Pacifico. It can be found at http://www.txpf.com/ Some interesting information in it so far. Looks like in time they will add to it. Regards! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 12:17 PM Here's the latest news on the activity of the Texas Pacifico: http://www.fwbusinesspress.com/display.php?id=3840 Reply Edit csmith9474 Member sinceApril 2005 From: Colorado Springs, CO 3,590 posts Posted by csmith9474 on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 12:31 PM I am just as excited as the OP. I had the opportunity to operate a motor car, ex Santa Fe MT-19, from Presidio north. Awesome run. I spent a lot of time in that area in 1993 and was able to see everything from Ft. Stockton to Presidio. It is amazing to go through some of the old structures. It is as if Santa Fe just left everything as it was. I haven't been to the Ft Stockton depot since the Chanber of Commerce moved in. I hope they didn't screwit up too bad. Paisano Pass is going to present some great photo opps. Smitty Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 7:32 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by csmith9474 I am just as excited as the OP. I had the opportunity to operate a motor car, ex Santa Fe MT-19, from Presidio north. Awesome run. I spent a lot of time in that area in 1993 and was able to see everything from Ft. Stockton to Presidio. It is amazing to go through some of the old structures. It is as if Santa Fe just left everything as it was. I haven't been to the Ft Stockton depot since the Chanber of Commerce moved in. I hope they didn't screwit up too bad. Paisano Pass is going to present some great photo opps. It is indeed a line with a lot of potential. I am especially pleased with the consistent carloads that are moving from the upper midwest and interchanging with Fort Worth & Western and then on to Texas Pacifico. I can only begin to imagine the possibilitites once they bring the ROW up to a point to allow faster operating speeds. Reply Edit samfp1943 Member sinceJune 2003 From: South Central,Ks 7,170 posts Posted by samfp1943 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 12:34 PM A new outlet for grain from the upper midwest would be a blessing..The conjestion at Laredo, and El Paso, at times can be intolerable. Any new crossing would certainly be a blessing. KCS seems to have capacity on their line NOrth/South. From what I have read the East /West through Dallas and Ft Worth is a problem with transit times, but they might welcome a new routing down to Mexico for their NAFTA railroad concept. This will be an interesting operation to follow as it develops. Reply csmith9474 Member sinceApril 2005 From: Colorado Springs, CO 3,590 posts Posted by csmith9474 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 2:14 PM Can't wait for those onion trains out of Presidio. And BTW, the motor car run was legal. The "station master" at the time said that I could run the motor car whenever I wanted as long as I provided a battery and gas. He didn't even know how to operate the thing. I just had to check in with him to make sure there weren't any trains that day. I definately wanted to be sure on that one! MT-19A vs GP-9, News at 6. I was also offered a hi-rail ride from Alpine to Presidio, but never took the offer. What the hell was I thinking. I wouldn't imagine you are missing much between Paisano Pass and Presidio. Smitty Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 11:31 AM More Texas Pacifico News: http://www.wacotrib.com/news/content/gen/ap/TX_South_Orient_Railroad.html Reply Edit dldance Member sinceAugust 2003 From: Near Promentory UT 1,590 posts Posted by dldance on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:04 PM When I was through Ft Stockton, about 2 months ago, it was hard to tell the rails from the ROW due to weeds. They better plan on a lot of sand. dd Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:36 PM Bryan, you mean to tell me that the South Orient line goes from Fort Worth to Brownwood? I thought that it was the BNSF line (formerly Santa Fe) that went through there but I guess that I was wrong, I think that the South Orient Railroad is an underrated railroad that deserves more recognition. [ Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, October 21, 2005 9:05 PM yes, its a former santa fe line the was sold to the south orient in 1993. its is now ft. worth and western rr. i live on this line and im seeing some bnsf trains run through here occasionally. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 22, 2005 8:46 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by brazos87 QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Yes, except MRL is soley subservient to BNSF, while it appears the South Orient will be able to interchange with a nice triopoly of BNSF, UP, and KCS. In fact, BNSF has shown it will go out of it's way to keep MRL in a virtual chastity belt, spending millions of dollars to buy the otherwise non-descript Montana Western. Gotta keep that Montana Monopoly to pay for the upkeep on the Chicago-LA speedway! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 22, 2005 10:55 PM Actually it is the Forth Worth and Western from Ft. Worth to San Angelo Jct (Browood Tx), about 100 miles east of San Angelo, From San Angelo Jct to Presidio it is Texas Pacifico, the subsidiary company run by FerroMex. They have a 40 year lease form the state of Texas to operate this line. Here is their website: http://www.txpf.com Hope this info helps! Reply Edit 123 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
Originally posted by spbed You sound very happy over this! [:p][:p] [i] So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line Reply SALfan Member sinceApril 2002 From: Northern Florida 1,429 posts Posted by SALfan on Friday, March 18, 2005 11:22 AM QUOTE: So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line Any time the state is involved, politicians are involved. Any time politicians are involved, logic or economic justification or anything else involving rational thought go out the window. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 18, 2005 11:36 AM QUOTE: Originally posted by JOdom QUOTE: So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line Any time the state is involved, politicians are involved. Any time politicians are involved, logic or economic justification or anything else involving rational thought go out the window. Well time will tell.......... I tend to think that this operation will work...if for no other reason if helps to ease the border capacity issues at El Paso and Laredo. And as was mentioned earlier by dldance, with Union Pacific's interest in the border crossing at Presidio, this should further enhance the value of the former South Orient line to help allieviate border traffic issues. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 18, 2005 1:15 PM KC, Mexican officials will set up trade corridor Officials from Kansas City and the Mexican city of Lazaro Cardenas will sign an agreement Mar22 to establish a new trans-Pacific trade corridor and establi***he Kansas City area as an inland port. The creation of the trade corridor also is designed to alleviate delays and congestion at West Coast ports. A signing ceremony is scheduled for 18:00 Mar22 at Cathedral Square, 427 W. 12th St. "This signing is an exciting and historic moment for the international trade in the Kansas City region," Kansas City SmartPort President Chris Gutierrez said in a written release. SmartPort was formed to establi***he region as an inland trade processing center. "The partnership with Lazaro Cardenas puts Kansas City in a pivotal position to become the Pacific port's primary U.S. inland port and puts Kansas City another step ahead of our competition for economic growth and job creation," Gutierrez said. Kansas City has won approval to be the site of the Mexican government's first foreign customs clearance facilities sometime this year. In addition, Kansas City recently signed an agreement with the Mexican port city of Manzanillo, the second-largest container port in Mexico. Lazaro Cardenas handles fewer containers, Gutierrez said, but the new agreement is key because it has a lot of room for port expansion and is served by the Mexican railroad, TFM, that Kansas City Southern is buying. A delegation of seven Mexican officials including Eloy Vargas Arreola, secretary of economic development for the state of Michoacan, will be in Kansas City for the signing ceremony. "In terms of opening the Midwest to Asian trade through Mexican ports, this agreement signifies substantial completion of the extensive efforts over the past several years devoted to establishing the political, economic and cultural foundation enabling this trade route to work," Al Figuly, president of Greater Kansas City Foreign Trade Zone Inc., said in the release. "It is a tribute to the successful efforts of many." Local agencies that have been involved in developing the trade corridors between Mexico and Kansas City include SmartPort; the Greater Kansas City Foreign Trade Zone Inc.; the State of Missouri-Mexico Trade and Agricultural Office; the Kansas City, Mo.,-Mexico Trade and Business Initiatives Corp.; and the International Office of Trade and Affairs of Kansas City. Under the new trade agreement, Kansas City and Lazaro Cardenas will work together to promote more freight traffic and address freight security along the corridor. Prior to signing the agreement, Mexican leaders representing government, industrial associations, chambers of commerce and economic development will meet with officials from Kansas City Southern, TranSystems Corp., Bayer Corp., Black & Veatch Solutions and various importers in the region. - The Business Journal of Kansas City, courtesy Larry W. Grant Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 18, 2005 1:18 PM South Texas railroad in tests The long dormant South Orient Railroad is making its first test run across the U.S.-Mexico border, and the first trains are expected to arrive in Fort Worth by the middle of next week, railroad executives said Tuesday. The railroad, which crosses the border at Presidio, is seeking to provide an alternative to shippers struggling with congestion at rail crossings in El Paso and Laredo. Officials also hope it will pump new economic life into struggling West Texas towns along its 382-mile route. The test run started from Torreon in north central Mexico on Monday night and involves 29 rail cars, including four that are carrying calcium carbonate for Dallas-based Texas Industries Inc., said Richard Lesikar, vice president of business development for the Fort Worth & Western Railroad. "It's a big, big deal," he said, noting that many potential shippers are waiting to see how the test runs fare before making a commitment. The South Orient cuts across 11 West Texas counties, connecting with the Fort Worth & Western at San Angelo Junction and with the Mexican railroad Ferromex at Presidio. Grupo Mexico, the Mexican mining giant, is leasing the South Orient rail line from the state of Texas. The South Orient hasn't offered regular service for more than six years. Grupo Mexico is spending millions to repair the track. Rail cars can now travel at an average speed of 25 miles per hour for 154 miles, but must slow down to speeds of 10 miles per hour the rest of the track, said Roy Williams, chief operating officer of Texas Pacifico Transportation Ltd., which operates the South Orient. To support the railroad's customers, the Fort Worth & Western aims to work with developers in Cleburne, Fort Worth and other cities to develop industrial parks, foreign trade zones, enterprise zones and an intermodal facility, Mr. Lesikar said. - Katherine Yung, The Dallas Morning News, courtesy Larry W. Grant Reply Edit brazos87 Member sinceJanuary 2005 45 posts Posted by brazos87 on Saturday, March 19, 2005 2:55 PM Capacity is @ a premium in Texas and many other places. UP and others can use this reopened line for lower priority and less time sensitive shipments, which in turn, will free up a bit of the congestion. I look for them (UP and others) to use the line for "Dead Freights" (a Milwaukee Road term). Reply dldance Member sinceAugust 2003 From: Near Promentory UT 1,590 posts Posted by dldance on Saturday, March 19, 2005 4:38 PM I don't expect UP to use the South Orient as they are controlling interest in most of the capacity issues -- but I do expect BNSF and KCS to take advantage of the opportunities when the reliability of the operation is proven. dd Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, March 23, 2005 6:22 PM Here's another good article on the Texas Pacifico. Check out page 6. http://www.dot.state.tx.us/env/pdf/envisionpdf/26sum03.pdf You'll notice that there is in fact a reference to Union Pacific and their desire to use the Texas Pacifico's border crossing at Presidio, Texas. Enjoy!!!!! Reply Edit brazos87 Member sinceJanuary 2005 45 posts Posted by brazos87 on Thursday, March 24, 2005 1:16 AM Low priority freight, southbound empties and low value loads make up a good percentage of US traffic moving into Mexico. Conversely, high dollar and high value goods make up a large percentage of the traffic moving into the US (auto parts and vehicles for example) from Mexico. UP's lines into Mexico are already above their current realistic capacity, even with so-called streamlined Customs Inspections. With levels of current traffic, UP would be very short sighted not to seek relief from using this corridor. It wouldn't really matter to the UP if a scrap load sat @ Presidio, as long as it freed up Laredo for Northbound autos or other high value shipments. All carloads are not equal in terms of revenue or importance, (see revenue). 10 boxcars of scrap paper sitting idle are less likely to incur wrath than a single container of auto parts which is delayed. Should we shutdown an assembly plant which employs 4,000, or should we make a recycler store bales in his yard? This is a nature of the commodities themselves. If it pays well, it should move well. My 2 cents (certainly not adjusted for inflation!). Reply spbed Member sinceDecember 2001 From: Austin TX 4,941 posts Posted by spbed on Thursday, March 24, 2005 6:21 AM [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply brazos87 Member sinceJanuary 2005 45 posts Posted by brazos87 on Thursday, March 24, 2005 11:02 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 25, 2005 6:26 AM Here's two more articles on Texas Pacifico's cross-border test train. Enjoy: http://www.marfatx.com/uploadedfiles/PRESIDIO%20Train%20Arrival.html http://www.dmtimes.net/blog/News/_archives/2005/3/24/468484.html Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, March 26, 2005 11:35 AM And still more news on the cross-border test train: http://www.brownwoodbulletin.com/ar...news/news01.txt Anyone get any shots of her as she passed to Ft. Worth???? Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, June 9, 2005 9:00 AM There is a brand new website for the Texas Pacifico. It can be found at http://www.txpf.com/ Some interesting information in it so far. Looks like in time they will add to it. Regards! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 12:17 PM Here's the latest news on the activity of the Texas Pacifico: http://www.fwbusinesspress.com/display.php?id=3840 Reply Edit csmith9474 Member sinceApril 2005 From: Colorado Springs, CO 3,590 posts Posted by csmith9474 on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 12:31 PM I am just as excited as the OP. I had the opportunity to operate a motor car, ex Santa Fe MT-19, from Presidio north. Awesome run. I spent a lot of time in that area in 1993 and was able to see everything from Ft. Stockton to Presidio. It is amazing to go through some of the old structures. It is as if Santa Fe just left everything as it was. I haven't been to the Ft Stockton depot since the Chanber of Commerce moved in. I hope they didn't screwit up too bad. Paisano Pass is going to present some great photo opps. Smitty Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 7:32 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by csmith9474 I am just as excited as the OP. I had the opportunity to operate a motor car, ex Santa Fe MT-19, from Presidio north. Awesome run. I spent a lot of time in that area in 1993 and was able to see everything from Ft. Stockton to Presidio. It is amazing to go through some of the old structures. It is as if Santa Fe just left everything as it was. I haven't been to the Ft Stockton depot since the Chanber of Commerce moved in. I hope they didn't screwit up too bad. Paisano Pass is going to present some great photo opps. It is indeed a line with a lot of potential. I am especially pleased with the consistent carloads that are moving from the upper midwest and interchanging with Fort Worth & Western and then on to Texas Pacifico. I can only begin to imagine the possibilitites once they bring the ROW up to a point to allow faster operating speeds. Reply Edit samfp1943 Member sinceJune 2003 From: South Central,Ks 7,170 posts Posted by samfp1943 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 12:34 PM A new outlet for grain from the upper midwest would be a blessing..The conjestion at Laredo, and El Paso, at times can be intolerable. Any new crossing would certainly be a blessing. KCS seems to have capacity on their line NOrth/South. From what I have read the East /West through Dallas and Ft Worth is a problem with transit times, but they might welcome a new routing down to Mexico for their NAFTA railroad concept. This will be an interesting operation to follow as it develops. Reply csmith9474 Member sinceApril 2005 From: Colorado Springs, CO 3,590 posts Posted by csmith9474 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 2:14 PM Can't wait for those onion trains out of Presidio. And BTW, the motor car run was legal. The "station master" at the time said that I could run the motor car whenever I wanted as long as I provided a battery and gas. He didn't even know how to operate the thing. I just had to check in with him to make sure there weren't any trains that day. I definately wanted to be sure on that one! MT-19A vs GP-9, News at 6. I was also offered a hi-rail ride from Alpine to Presidio, but never took the offer. What the hell was I thinking. I wouldn't imagine you are missing much between Paisano Pass and Presidio. Smitty Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 11:31 AM More Texas Pacifico News: http://www.wacotrib.com/news/content/gen/ap/TX_South_Orient_Railroad.html Reply Edit dldance Member sinceAugust 2003 From: Near Promentory UT 1,590 posts Posted by dldance on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:04 PM When I was through Ft Stockton, about 2 months ago, it was hard to tell the rails from the ROW due to weeds. They better plan on a lot of sand. dd Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:36 PM Bryan, you mean to tell me that the South Orient line goes from Fort Worth to Brownwood? I thought that it was the BNSF line (formerly Santa Fe) that went through there but I guess that I was wrong, I think that the South Orient Railroad is an underrated railroad that deserves more recognition. [ Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, October 21, 2005 9:05 PM yes, its a former santa fe line the was sold to the south orient in 1993. its is now ft. worth and western rr. i live on this line and im seeing some bnsf trains run through here occasionally. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 22, 2005 8:46 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by brazos87 QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Yes, except MRL is soley subservient to BNSF, while it appears the South Orient will be able to interchange with a nice triopoly of BNSF, UP, and KCS. In fact, BNSF has shown it will go out of it's way to keep MRL in a virtual chastity belt, spending millions of dollars to buy the otherwise non-descript Montana Western. Gotta keep that Montana Monopoly to pay for the upkeep on the Chicago-LA speedway! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 22, 2005 10:55 PM Actually it is the Forth Worth and Western from Ft. Worth to San Angelo Jct (Browood Tx), about 100 miles east of San Angelo, From San Angelo Jct to Presidio it is Texas Pacifico, the subsidiary company run by FerroMex. They have a 40 year lease form the state of Texas to operate this line. Here is their website: http://www.txpf.com Hope this info helps! Reply Edit 123 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
[i] So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line
QUOTE: So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line
QUOTE: Originally posted by JOdom QUOTE: So that would explain why the State of Texas invested to date over 7 million dollars toward the restoration of this line and gave FerroMex a 40 year operating lease to operate trains as "Texas Pacifico"??? It may also interest you to know that Union Pacific now recognized the border crossing at Presidio as one one of its gateway entrance points. You can see this on their latest maps. So I believe there is new life breathed back into this line Any time the state is involved, politicians are involved. Any time politicians are involved, logic or economic justification or anything else involving rational thought go out the window.
Originally posted by brazos87 Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub Reply brazos87 Member sinceJanuary 2005 45 posts Posted by brazos87 on Thursday, March 24, 2005 11:02 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 25, 2005 6:26 AM Here's two more articles on Texas Pacifico's cross-border test train. Enjoy: http://www.marfatx.com/uploadedfiles/PRESIDIO%20Train%20Arrival.html http://www.dmtimes.net/blog/News/_archives/2005/3/24/468484.html Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, March 26, 2005 11:35 AM And still more news on the cross-border test train: http://www.brownwoodbulletin.com/ar...news/news01.txt Anyone get any shots of her as she passed to Ft. Worth???? Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, June 9, 2005 9:00 AM There is a brand new website for the Texas Pacifico. It can be found at http://www.txpf.com/ Some interesting information in it so far. Looks like in time they will add to it. Regards! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 12:17 PM Here's the latest news on the activity of the Texas Pacifico: http://www.fwbusinesspress.com/display.php?id=3840 Reply Edit csmith9474 Member sinceApril 2005 From: Colorado Springs, CO 3,590 posts Posted by csmith9474 on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 12:31 PM I am just as excited as the OP. I had the opportunity to operate a motor car, ex Santa Fe MT-19, from Presidio north. Awesome run. I spent a lot of time in that area in 1993 and was able to see everything from Ft. Stockton to Presidio. It is amazing to go through some of the old structures. It is as if Santa Fe just left everything as it was. I haven't been to the Ft Stockton depot since the Chanber of Commerce moved in. I hope they didn't screwit up too bad. Paisano Pass is going to present some great photo opps. Smitty Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 7:32 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by csmith9474 I am just as excited as the OP. I had the opportunity to operate a motor car, ex Santa Fe MT-19, from Presidio north. Awesome run. I spent a lot of time in that area in 1993 and was able to see everything from Ft. Stockton to Presidio. It is amazing to go through some of the old structures. It is as if Santa Fe just left everything as it was. I haven't been to the Ft Stockton depot since the Chanber of Commerce moved in. I hope they didn't screwit up too bad. Paisano Pass is going to present some great photo opps. It is indeed a line with a lot of potential. I am especially pleased with the consistent carloads that are moving from the upper midwest and interchanging with Fort Worth & Western and then on to Texas Pacifico. I can only begin to imagine the possibilitites once they bring the ROW up to a point to allow faster operating speeds. Reply Edit samfp1943 Member sinceJune 2003 From: South Central,Ks 7,170 posts Posted by samfp1943 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 12:34 PM A new outlet for grain from the upper midwest would be a blessing..The conjestion at Laredo, and El Paso, at times can be intolerable. Any new crossing would certainly be a blessing. KCS seems to have capacity on their line NOrth/South. From what I have read the East /West through Dallas and Ft Worth is a problem with transit times, but they might welcome a new routing down to Mexico for their NAFTA railroad concept. This will be an interesting operation to follow as it develops. Reply csmith9474 Member sinceApril 2005 From: Colorado Springs, CO 3,590 posts Posted by csmith9474 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 2:14 PM Can't wait for those onion trains out of Presidio. And BTW, the motor car run was legal. The "station master" at the time said that I could run the motor car whenever I wanted as long as I provided a battery and gas. He didn't even know how to operate the thing. I just had to check in with him to make sure there weren't any trains that day. I definately wanted to be sure on that one! MT-19A vs GP-9, News at 6. I was also offered a hi-rail ride from Alpine to Presidio, but never took the offer. What the hell was I thinking. I wouldn't imagine you are missing much between Paisano Pass and Presidio. Smitty Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 11:31 AM More Texas Pacifico News: http://www.wacotrib.com/news/content/gen/ap/TX_South_Orient_Railroad.html Reply Edit dldance Member sinceAugust 2003 From: Near Promentory UT 1,590 posts Posted by dldance on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:04 PM When I was through Ft Stockton, about 2 months ago, it was hard to tell the rails from the ROW due to weeds. They better plan on a lot of sand. dd Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:36 PM Bryan, you mean to tell me that the South Orient line goes from Fort Worth to Brownwood? I thought that it was the BNSF line (formerly Santa Fe) that went through there but I guess that I was wrong, I think that the South Orient Railroad is an underrated railroad that deserves more recognition. [ Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, October 21, 2005 9:05 PM yes, its a former santa fe line the was sold to the south orient in 1993. its is now ft. worth and western rr. i live on this line and im seeing some bnsf trains run through here occasionally. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 22, 2005 8:46 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by brazos87 QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Yes, except MRL is soley subservient to BNSF, while it appears the South Orient will be able to interchange with a nice triopoly of BNSF, UP, and KCS. In fact, BNSF has shown it will go out of it's way to keep MRL in a virtual chastity belt, spending millions of dollars to buy the otherwise non-descript Montana Western. Gotta keep that Montana Monopoly to pay for the upkeep on the Chicago-LA speedway! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 22, 2005 10:55 PM Actually it is the Forth Worth and Western from Ft. Worth to San Angelo Jct (Browood Tx), about 100 miles east of San Angelo, From San Angelo Jct to Presidio it is Texas Pacifico, the subsidiary company run by FerroMex. They have a 40 year lease form the state of Texas to operate this line. Here is their website: http://www.txpf.com Hope this info helps! Reply Edit 123 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR Austin TX Sub
QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, March 25, 2005 6:26 AM Here's two more articles on Texas Pacifico's cross-border test train. Enjoy: http://www.marfatx.com/uploadedfiles/PRESIDIO%20Train%20Arrival.html http://www.dmtimes.net/blog/News/_archives/2005/3/24/468484.html Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, March 26, 2005 11:35 AM And still more news on the cross-border test train: http://www.brownwoodbulletin.com/ar...news/news01.txt Anyone get any shots of her as she passed to Ft. Worth???? Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, June 9, 2005 9:00 AM There is a brand new website for the Texas Pacifico. It can be found at http://www.txpf.com/ Some interesting information in it so far. Looks like in time they will add to it. Regards! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 12:17 PM Here's the latest news on the activity of the Texas Pacifico: http://www.fwbusinesspress.com/display.php?id=3840 Reply Edit csmith9474 Member sinceApril 2005 From: Colorado Springs, CO 3,590 posts Posted by csmith9474 on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 12:31 PM I am just as excited as the OP. I had the opportunity to operate a motor car, ex Santa Fe MT-19, from Presidio north. Awesome run. I spent a lot of time in that area in 1993 and was able to see everything from Ft. Stockton to Presidio. It is amazing to go through some of the old structures. It is as if Santa Fe just left everything as it was. I haven't been to the Ft Stockton depot since the Chanber of Commerce moved in. I hope they didn't screwit up too bad. Paisano Pass is going to present some great photo opps. Smitty Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 7:32 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by csmith9474 I am just as excited as the OP. I had the opportunity to operate a motor car, ex Santa Fe MT-19, from Presidio north. Awesome run. I spent a lot of time in that area in 1993 and was able to see everything from Ft. Stockton to Presidio. It is amazing to go through some of the old structures. It is as if Santa Fe just left everything as it was. I haven't been to the Ft Stockton depot since the Chanber of Commerce moved in. I hope they didn't screwit up too bad. Paisano Pass is going to present some great photo opps. It is indeed a line with a lot of potential. I am especially pleased with the consistent carloads that are moving from the upper midwest and interchanging with Fort Worth & Western and then on to Texas Pacifico. I can only begin to imagine the possibilitites once they bring the ROW up to a point to allow faster operating speeds. Reply Edit samfp1943 Member sinceJune 2003 From: South Central,Ks 7,170 posts Posted by samfp1943 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 12:34 PM A new outlet for grain from the upper midwest would be a blessing..The conjestion at Laredo, and El Paso, at times can be intolerable. Any new crossing would certainly be a blessing. KCS seems to have capacity on their line NOrth/South. From what I have read the East /West through Dallas and Ft Worth is a problem with transit times, but they might welcome a new routing down to Mexico for their NAFTA railroad concept. This will be an interesting operation to follow as it develops. Reply csmith9474 Member sinceApril 2005 From: Colorado Springs, CO 3,590 posts Posted by csmith9474 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 2:14 PM Can't wait for those onion trains out of Presidio. And BTW, the motor car run was legal. The "station master" at the time said that I could run the motor car whenever I wanted as long as I provided a battery and gas. He didn't even know how to operate the thing. I just had to check in with him to make sure there weren't any trains that day. I definately wanted to be sure on that one! MT-19A vs GP-9, News at 6. I was also offered a hi-rail ride from Alpine to Presidio, but never took the offer. What the hell was I thinking. I wouldn't imagine you are missing much between Paisano Pass and Presidio. Smitty Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 11:31 AM More Texas Pacifico News: http://www.wacotrib.com/news/content/gen/ap/TX_South_Orient_Railroad.html Reply Edit dldance Member sinceAugust 2003 From: Near Promentory UT 1,590 posts Posted by dldance on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:04 PM When I was through Ft Stockton, about 2 months ago, it was hard to tell the rails from the ROW due to weeds. They better plan on a lot of sand. dd Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:36 PM Bryan, you mean to tell me that the South Orient line goes from Fort Worth to Brownwood? I thought that it was the BNSF line (formerly Santa Fe) that went through there but I guess that I was wrong, I think that the South Orient Railroad is an underrated railroad that deserves more recognition. [ Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Friday, October 21, 2005 9:05 PM yes, its a former santa fe line the was sold to the south orient in 1993. its is now ft. worth and western rr. i live on this line and im seeing some bnsf trains run through here occasionally. Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 22, 2005 8:46 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by brazos87 QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Yes, except MRL is soley subservient to BNSF, while it appears the South Orient will be able to interchange with a nice triopoly of BNSF, UP, and KCS. In fact, BNSF has shown it will go out of it's way to keep MRL in a virtual chastity belt, spending millions of dollars to buy the otherwise non-descript Montana Western. Gotta keep that Montana Monopoly to pay for the upkeep on the Chicago-LA speedway! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 22, 2005 10:55 PM Actually it is the Forth Worth and Western from Ft. Worth to San Angelo Jct (Browood Tx), about 100 miles east of San Angelo, From San Angelo Jct to Presidio it is Texas Pacifico, the subsidiary company run by FerroMex. They have a 40 year lease form the state of Texas to operate this line. Here is their website: http://www.txpf.com Hope this info helps! Reply Edit 123 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
Originally posted by brazos87
QUOTE: Originally posted by csmith9474 I am just as excited as the OP. I had the opportunity to operate a motor car, ex Santa Fe MT-19, from Presidio north. Awesome run. I spent a lot of time in that area in 1993 and was able to see everything from Ft. Stockton to Presidio. It is amazing to go through some of the old structures. It is as if Santa Fe just left everything as it was. I haven't been to the Ft Stockton depot since the Chanber of Commerce moved in. I hope they didn't screwit up too bad. Paisano Pass is going to present some great photo opps.
QUOTE: Originally posted by brazos87 QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87 Yes, except MRL is soley subservient to BNSF, while it appears the South Orient will be able to interchange with a nice triopoly of BNSF, UP, and KCS. In fact, BNSF has shown it will go out of it's way to keep MRL in a virtual chastity belt, spending millions of dollars to buy the otherwise non-descript Montana Western. Gotta keep that Montana Monopoly to pay for the upkeep on the Chicago-LA speedway! Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, October 22, 2005 10:55 PM Actually it is the Forth Worth and Western from Ft. Worth to San Angelo Jct (Browood Tx), about 100 miles east of San Angelo, From San Angelo Jct to Presidio it is Texas Pacifico, the subsidiary company run by FerroMex. They have a 40 year lease form the state of Texas to operate this line. Here is their website: http://www.txpf.com Hope this info helps! Reply Edit 123 Join our Community! Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account. Login » Register » Search the Community Newsletter Sign-Up By signing up you may also receive occasional reader surveys and special offers from Trains magazine.Please view our privacy policy More great sites from Kalmbach Media Terms Of Use | Privacy Policy | Copyright Policy
QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed [:)]My only observation is that if the UPRR or BNSF or KSC thought that this route would give them a advantage they would just buy it! [:D]Think Montana Rail Link--BN looked to shed trackage in the late 1980's. Although they sold/leased? the former NP lines to MRL, they had an agreement for overhead traffic to be run by MRL crews. This saved the BN from having to maintain, crew, or dispatch trains, over this line. The BN still had an outlet for excess traffic or detours, without all the associated costs of track maintenance, dispatching, et al. UP, BNSF, or KCS would pay Texas Pacifico to run their freight without having to pay to maintain the line themselves. Let Texas Pacifico worry about crew availability, and all the other issues of running the traffic. The Class 1's mentioned could use this line to relieve some stress on their systems without having to do too much other than hammer out an agreement with Texas Pacifico.[:D] Originally posted by brazos87
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