I vaguely remember driving on the highway that paralled the TP&W from Gilman through Effner sometime in the latter half of the 1950's. There was no yard or engine service facilities not even a town there as I recall, only sign along the track stating that this was Effner. I think there was a siding off of which a Wye for turning engines branched but I'm pretty hazy on this detail. I do remember distinctly the contrast between the ROW's of the two railroads. The TP&W was well ballasted and maintained and looked like a mainline. The Pennsy to the east on the otherhand was sparsely ballasted and weed grown.
Mark
KCSfan wrote:I vaguely remember driving on the highway that paralled the TP&W from Gilman through Effner sometime in the latter half of the 1950's. There was no yard or engine service facilities not even a town there as I recall, only sign along the track stating that this was Effner. I think there was a siding off of which a Wye for turning engines branched but I'm pretty hazy on this detail. I do remember distinctly the contrast between the ROW's of the two railroads. The TP&W was well ballasted and maintained and looked like a mainline. The Pennsy to the east on the otherhand was sparsely ballasted and weed grown. Mark
Well Ed, do you happen to have the July and September 1983 Railfan and Railroad ? Lloyd Rinehart has a pretty throrough article on the TP&W in them.
He mentions that until December 1980 the Pennsylvania Railroad still owned half of the TP&W. I wonder if he meant Penn Central.
During 1983 they ran from East Peoria to Logansport on Sundays, Tuesdays and Thursdays, returning the following days. There was also a local from EP to Effner on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays, returning on the following days. Previously there was a local between Logansport and Effner, presumably running during 1980.
MP173 wrote:NS already has a dandy Chicago cut off in place and that is the ex Wabash line from Kansas city up thru Ft Wayne. I dont know how close to capacity the line is, but with single line ctc and probably short sidings I would guess it is close to capacity.TPW is there for the fixing up. However, the BNSF already has the Streator cut off in place. I believe they only run one thru train daily to the NS. The coal traffic comes up from Galesburg thru Mendota and then thru the heart of Chicago, or around on the J. It could reroute via the TPW in some cases, but that would require major work to the line, and sharing the revenue.I think at some point the line will be valuable. When? No idea.ed
TheAntiGates wrote: KCSfan wrote: I vaguely remember driving on the highway that paralled the TP&W from Gilman through Effner sometime in the latter half of the 1950's. There was no yard or engine service facilities not even a town there as I recall, only sign along the track stating that this was Effner. I think there was a siding off of which a Wye for turning engines branched but I'm pretty hazy on this detail. I do remember distinctly the contrast between the ROW's of the two railroads. The TP&W was well ballasted and maintained and looked like a mainline. The Pennsy to the east on the otherhand was sparsely ballasted and weed grown. Mark Time has caught up with the Illinois half. Was the Highway weigh station there at the state line when you drove through?I've always had the impression that if the weigh station was not there, nothing else would be, either.Let me ask you this, how many trains did you see during your trip alongside the rails? I spent the better part of an afternoon in may 2003 driving from Peoria to Logansport,. and never did see a train on that line. Just mile after mile of rusty ribbons punctuated with a desolate looking grain elevator from time to time.The surprise was in getting to Remington In, and seeing the (relatively) new, and nearly abandoned BNSF transload facility sitting there, with the yard lights burning bright at 5 pm, a good 4 hours before nightfall. Not a train or human in sight. Then following the PRR half of it on into Logansport, never saw a train on that end, either.You hear all the bellyaching about the smothering congestion in Chicago...and it's likely true.What's not true is any claim that the RR's don't have reasonable alternatives.Chicago is congested because the RR's want to go there. Alternately they could use this TP&W line and then NS from Logansport to Toledo, for a handy Chicago bypass if the RR's REALLY wanted one.
KCSfan wrote: I vaguely remember driving on the highway that paralled the TP&W from Gilman through Effner sometime in the latter half of the 1950's. There was no yard or engine service facilities not even a town there as I recall, only sign along the track stating that this was Effner. I think there was a siding off of which a Wye for turning engines branched but I'm pretty hazy on this detail. I do remember distinctly the contrast between the ROW's of the two railroads. The TP&W was well ballasted and maintained and looked like a mainline. The Pennsy to the east on the otherhand was sparsely ballasted and weed grown. Mark
Don't recall a highway weigh station there but Effner wasn't even a wide spot in the road - nothing at all there just the trackside sign - I don't remember even a single house. I never saw a single TP&W train either there or around Gilman which I drove through many times and also rode through a bunch of times on the IC. Though I didn't drive much further east of Effner what little I saw of it confirms your observation about the sorry apperance of the PRR trackage on that line.
TheAntiGates wrote: MP173 wrote:NS already has a dandy Chicago cut off in place and that is the ex Wabash line from Kansas city up thru Ft Wayne. I dont know how close to capacity the line is, but with single line ctc and probably short sidings I would guess it is close to capacity.TPW is there for the fixing up. However, the BNSF already has the Streator cut off in place. I believe they only run one thru train daily to the NS. The coal traffic comes up from Galesburg thru Mendota and then thru the heart of Chicago, or around on the J. It could reroute via the TPW in some cases, but that would require major work to the line, and sharing the revenue.I think at some point the line will be valuable. When? No idea.edNot claiming any expertise, just going by what i've read, but I think itis the big western roads that dictate eastbound traffic not being handed off in KC, they want the mileage to haul it on eastward, as far as possible.The TP&W on the otherhand (once a BNSF property) seems a candidate to let the western RR's have their cake and eat it someplace other than Chicago too.Suprised that the big boys out west haven't swooped down on some of the abandoned and/or shortlined routes in the midwest, and used them as a means to get even longer hauls further into the east, and avoiding Chicago as a bonus.Bet there would be a lot of popular support among the communities that lost rail service all together, if an Uncle Pete or BNSF offered to retrack an abandoned and forgotten right of way through their town. Nimbies in Rochester notwithstanding.
Actually The TPW was sold off in the early 90's before the BN-ATSF merger. I think it was '91 or '92 thta the line was sold to the same company that ran the NYSW. Which sold it to someone else and is now a Railamerica property.
Carl
Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)
CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)
neil300 wrote:Actually The TPW was sold off in the early 90's before the BN-ATSF merger. I think it was '91 or '92 thta the line was sold to the same company that ran the NYSW. Which sold it to someone else and is now a Railamerica property.
FWIW: The following link, dated October, 2004, states that the TP&W 'is controlled by RailAmerica, Inc. (RailAmerica)'. The KJRY is trying to force RailAmerica to sell off a portion of the line and the TP&W is objecting.
http://www.stb.dot.gov/decisions/ReadingRoom.nsf/UNID/3BACCF758E5DF0A285256F3B006EF7D6/$file/34581.htm
Art
The deal went through. KJRY now owns the trackage.
This is from Pioneer web site.
The Company's feeder line application on file with the Surface Transportation Board (STB) to acquire the assets of the west end of the Toledo Peoria and Western Railway (TPW) was granted on October 28, 2004. The Company completed the acquisition on February 11, 2005 which added 76 miles from LaHarpe to Peoria, Illinois.
Bob
Didn't see that one. Hope the customers are happy. Later found another post that RailAmerica had changed hands. Hard to keep up with things.
artschlosser wrote: Bob Didn't see that one. Hope the customers are happy. Later found another post that RailAmerica had changed hands. Hard to keep up with things. Art
If you are interested, here is a video taken at Good Hope IL with Pioneer power. Marvin says the trains from Keokuk and Canton meet here sometimes and trade cars, then return. Good Audio.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6XWAZbOdZa0#BgLs19gXvew
TheAntiGates wrote: neil300 wrote:Actually The TPW was sold off in the early 90's before the BN-ATSF merger. I think it was '91 or '92 thta the line was sold to the same company that ran the NYSW. Which sold it to someone else and is now a Railamerica property. Yet oddly enough, the sign at the main entrance to the transload facility in Remington clearly stated BNSF.
"He mentions that until December 1980 the Pennsylvania Railroad still owned half of the TP&W. I wonder if he meant Penn Central."
Santa Fe received permission to control Penn Central's TP&W shares on March 1981, after having bought them in 1979.
neil300 wrote: TPW was sold off in the early 90's before the BN-ATSF merger. I think it was '91 or '92 thta the line was sold to the same company that ran the NYSW. Which sold it to someone else and is now a Railamerica property.
TPW was sold off in the early 90's before the BN-ATSF merger. I think it was '91 or '92 thta the line was sold to the same company that ran the NYSW. Which sold it to someone else and is now a Railamerica property.
TP&W was reborn on February 3, 1989 after having been operated as part of the Santa Fe for five years. The NYS&W's owner, Delaware Otsego acquired a 40% stake in the TP&W in January 1996. CSXT and Norfolk Southern also owned part of the TP&W. These firms and others sold their interests to RailAmerica in September 1999.
"Also, the transload was a joint ATSF-TP&W operation, which passed to BNSF-TP&W. TP&W itself was never part of BNSF."
After TP&W's rebirth in February 1989, an agreement was signed with Burlington Northern to jointly market intermodal traffic through the Hoosierlift, which BN called their "Indiana Hub Center." As part of the agreement, TP&W granted BN haulage rights between Bushnell, Illinois and the Hoosierlift. This apparently lasted no later than the BNSF merger in 1995. That fall, I recall seeing Burlington Northern's "Peoria Local" handling double stacks loaded with blue Hanjin containers in addition to the heavy the Norfolk Southern interchange traffic that began at the same time. Apparently, interchange at Bushnell was troublesome and the connection in town was not in the best condition either.
I am told that if you want to see TPW action, you better go looking at night.
Gabe
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