Circus style ramps

[chad thomas]

I was just wondering if there are any circus style TOFC ramps still in use today. I know some of the smaller yards like Klamath Falls had them as recently as the late 80s.

[Murphy Siding]

     I just gotta ask-what's a circus style ramp?

[chad thomas]

A circus style ramp is a ramp at the end of a track that allows a truck (or a hostlers rig) to back a trailer onto the flat car(s) (89' TTX flats) or unload by backing up the ramp and onto the car(s) and driveing the trailer off. Some TTX flats have ramps at either end that can be lowered to provide a continuous surface to go between multiple cars. To (un)load these were time consumeing. If you had say 4 89'TTX cars and were going to load 8 trailers each one would have to be backed across the cars to there spot one at a time. For the first one you would have to back over all 4 cars to get to the first position, that would be close to 400' not includeing the ramp You might have noticed that there is a lip on the outside edges of the 89' flats to help guide the trailer wheels and keep them from turning and falling off the trailer. The fifth wheel connections on the cars fold down and out of the way while doing this.

[Murphy Siding]

     What other style would there be?

[nbrodar]

The only place I've seen circus style loading, is on the Circus Train, and military shipments.  All other trailer traffic is loaded using an overhead or side loader.  (At least in my terminal this is the case)

Nick

[chad thomas]

     What other style would there be?

Murphy, E-mail me your addy and I'l send you a drawing (or anybody else interested)

[e-mail]

[CShaveRR]

I would have to say that there probably aren't any more circus-style ramps any more.  Most of the trailers that you see on pig trains today are loaded on cars that no longer have drive-on/drive-off capability (look for the bridge plates that would be lowered to extend over the gaps between coupled cars--bet you won't find any, even on the old 89-foot piggyback cars that are left).  Just about everything these days is lift-on/lift-off.

[CShaveRR]

Actually, Chad, not all cars had "lips" on the outside.  The little barriers running the length of the car near the center (and protecting the hitches) were a more effective way to keep the trailers on the straight and narrow.  But those guys were good!.

[chad thomas]

Actually, Chad, not all cars had "lips" on the outside.  The little barriers running the length of the car near the center (and protecting the hitches) were a more effective way to keep the trailers on the straight and narrow.  But those guys were good!.

Yea Carl, I kind of figgured they were all gone. Had to ask though. The only one I remember actually seeing in action was in Klamath Falls,Or. They would load mabee 8-10 trailers at a time. The last time I saw it used was in the late 80s. Aside from the lack of equiptment for this kind of loading I imagine it was inefficient and and not very economical. Just a way for the out of the way places without lifts to be able to load trailers. And I thought about the lips after I posted and remembered that some were as you described. Thanks for your input.

[miniwyo]

 pretty sure they have them in Green River for the odd TOFC they get in the yard. I did see some here in Rock Springs in 2003 when they Deployed the 1041st National guard (The First time they just got deployed again on 7 July)  and they drove in equipment from all over the area and loaded it on a train on the South Pass branch one night (too bad... I wanted to get pics).

[tree68]

I work on a military installation and see circus-style loading and unloading all the time.  Despite having to drive down 8-10 cars with the first/last vehicles, it goes quite quickly.  Fortunately, the railroad is kind enough to ensure that the loaded cars they deliver are pointed in the proper direction so the vehicles can be driven off.  I'd hate to have to back a 5 ton military truck with a short single axle trailer over 8 flats....

 

[Anonymous]

     What other style would there be?

(lowbrow joke deleted)

Actually, there is also "elephant style".  To my knowledge such has never been done.  Basically, each trailer is forward loaded one after the other by a specialized parallel tractor.  Since the tractor unit is beside the consist and not actually on it, once the trailer is situated at the hitch (hitchuated?), the tractor simply pulls away and runs back to the next trailer, no need to back down the consist.  Would work great for double and triple combo trailers.

I think CP still uses circus style loading for it's Expressway service.

[Grinandbearit]

CP Expressway Service between Toronto and Montreal uses drive on drive off for the movement of trailers that are not reinforced for lifting. It used to go to Windsor as well but that has been discontinued. Sure helps to get at least some rigs off the 401.

[Murphy Siding]

     Chad: I sent a PM

[greyhounds]

I work on a military installation and see circus-style loading and unloading all the time.  Despite having to drive down 8-10 cars with the first/last vehicles, it goes quite quickly.  Fortunately, the railroad is kind enough to ensure that the loaded cars they deliver are pointed in the proper direction so the vehicles can be driven off.  I'd hate to have to back a 5 ton military truck with a short single axle trailer over 8 flats....

 

Well, somebody backed it on there.

Making sure the cars were facing in the right direction was part of circus ramp operations.  Aparently, it's not a lost art.  If the military tractor is on the car with the trailer, you can get them both off no matter which way the car faces.  But with TOFC, a car facing the wrong direction at a circus ramp would be imposible to unload.  It would have to be turned on a 'Y' or a turntable.

[tree68]

Well, somebody backed it on there.

Nada - At least at our end, there is a wye available.  Regardless of which way the vehicles are pointing when they arrive, they're pointed toward the ramp when all is said and done.  I'm presuming the same may be the case at their destinations.  Drive on, drive off.

[broncoman]

 I think DODX 89 footers are the only ones left with the oppsing ramps at each end of the car.  I haven't seen a regular TTX 89' car with ramps in a while.  This would go along with the post from above.  I know this is a little off topic, but does anyone know how they load tanks?  Do they use a crane or is it circus style?

Dave

[CatFoodFlambe]

Norfolk Southern has a "sort of " circus ramp in the little Hilliard storage yard just north of Buckeye Yard here in the Columbus area.   They use it to move prefab MOW housing units on and off of flatcars!

[greyhounds]

Well, somebody backed it on there.

Nada - At least at our end, there is a wye available.  Regardless of which way the vehicles are pointing when they arrive, they're pointed toward the ramp when all is said and done.  I'm presuming the same may be the case at their destinations.  Drive on, drive off.

OK, am I getting into a "discussion" with a sargent?  I never won one of those.  And I was a lieutenant.

But unless the tractor stays with the trailer, you gotta' back it on.

[tree68]

Well, somebody backed it on there.

Nada - At least at our end, there is a wye available.  Regardless of which way the vehicles are pointing when they arrive, they're pointed toward the ramp when all is said and done.  I'm presuming the same may be the case at their destinations.  Drive on, drive off.

OK, am I getting into a "discussion" with a sargent?  I never won one of those.  And I was a lieutenant.

I was a sergeant - in USAF.  Civilian now.

But unless the tractor stays with the trailer, you gotta' back it on.

Usually the tractor is going too...

[SALfan]

 I think DODX 89 footers are the only ones left with the oppsing ramps at each end of the car.  I haven't seen a regular TTX 89' car with ramps in a while.  This would go along with the post from above.  I know this is a little off topic, but does anyone know how they load tanks?  Do they use a crane or is it circus style?

Dave

At least in the few places I've seen, tanks are loaded circus-style, driven on from the ramp to the end of the string of flatcars.  An M1 Abrams tank weighs close to 70 tons fueled and loaded; maybe someone else knows, but I don't think the tracks would take kindly to having forklift forks jammed under them and slid out from under them.  Besides, it would take a heck of a forklift to lift an Abrams.

During the buildup to Gulf War I, CSX shuttled two or three trainsets of flatcars from Ft. Stewart, GA to the state docks in Savannah (distance of about 30 miles from loading to unloading point), for days on end.  Ft. Stewart was then the home of the 24th (Mechanized) Infantry Div., with quantities of tanks, trucks and other heavy equipment.  I would have loved to have watched the loading/unloading operations, but didn't have the chance.  However, I did see USNS Bellatrix sailing down the Savannah River leaving for the Middle East.  The city there is atop a bluff that is probably 20+ feet tall, and the side of the ship looked like a 3 or 4 story tall gray wall going past.  Quite a sight!

[broncoman]

But unless the tractor stays with the trailer, you gotta' back it on.

 

It was cool to see the tractors with the backwards facing cabs (windshield faces the fifth wheel) so they could see as they were backing up.  Still staying that straight for 4 or 5 car lengths had to be pretty hard.

 

[CShaveRR]

Fortunately, when the "Proviso Piggyback Plaza" was a circus ramp, they had tracks for trailers loaded in either direction.  Which side they used to load the trailers depended on how they had to face at their offloading point.  This was eventually replaced with a Piggypacker operation, and later by Global 2, which has a number of cranes and handles containers.

One time I (who knew what was coming) asked a pinpuller which ramp he would spot a particular car at.  He had a definite answer, based on the hitch at the east end of the car.  But I was waiting for the look on his face when he saw the hitch facing the other way on the opposite end of the car!  I wasn't disappointed.

 

[Anonymous]

I'm not sure, b/c my familiarity with this type of device is FAR lower than the rest of you here, but I think something of this sort exists on the UP line a few miles W of Riverside, CA, just E of the I-15.  There's a small yard around there that has a small spur snaking out on the south side, with what looks (vaguely) like a ramp structure at the end of the spur.  Any other CA railfanners out there, correct me if I'm wrong...

Riprap

[Anonymous]

Thanks chad for the emailed drawing--was what i thought be.

[Anonymous]

I'm not sure, b/c my familiarity with this type of device is FAR lower than the rest of you here, but I think something of this sort exists on the UP line a few miles W of Riverside, CA, just E of the I-15.  There's a small yard around there that has a small spur snaking out on the south side, with what looks (vaguely) like a ramp structure at the end of the spur.  Any other CA railfanners out there, correct me if I'm wrong...

Riprap

  Isnt that Colton or a corona? I mite be wrong also. gees i should know it as lived in la for number of years. Maybe even fontana.

[dldance]

Watched a construction company unload earthmovers from conventional flats one day.  They had some steel plates which they shuffled around with a forklift for bridging between flat cars.  Drive-on / drive-off -- very slowly as the earthmover is slightly wider than the flat car deck.

dd

[Anonymous]

Yeah, I think that could be Corona, not Fontana tho, Fontana is NE of there on the way to Vegas....Chino is the W of Corona.

[beaulieu]

CP loads its Expressway circus style. The train runs between Montreal and Torontoand it does not require the trailers to be modified for Piggyback service (no reinforced kingpin) as there is no slack in the train, the only couplers are to the locomotives.