MP173 wrote: I would say he was a pretty good manager...at least from a distance.I like the way he did innovative stuff. The railroad industry was mired in traditional thinking at that time. The fact that he was willing to try new stuff seemed innovative.About 15 years ago I went to work for a man who started a compnay that was similar to him. In fact he worked in sales/marketing at IC around 1975, so maybe that is where he got some of his management skills. He would absolutely RIP your balls off if you were not prepared or did not understand something he thought you should know. On the other hand, he was brilliant. Made a huge difference in my life. Murphy...where did you read the article? ed
I would say he was a pretty good manager...at least from a distance.
I like the way he did innovative stuff. The railroad industry was mired in traditional thinking at that time. The fact that he was willing to try new stuff seemed innovative.
About 15 years ago I went to work for a man who started a compnay that was similar to him. In fact he worked in sales/marketing at IC around 1975, so maybe that is where he got some of his management skills. He would absolutely RIP your balls off if you were not prepared or did not understand something he thought you should know. On the other hand, he was brilliant. Made a huge difference in my life.
Murphy...where did you read the article?
ed
You are right about Bruce looking good from a distance. He was very good at selling himself as a marketing innovator. If you read the Trains article he wrote about Al Perlman, you will note that Bruce spends as much time talking about himself as he does about Perlman.
About the time Paul Reistrup left the IC Sr. VP Marketing job to go to Amtrak, I got a call from our HR guy who asked me if I might have some ideas for possible candidates for the job. I mentioned others, but from the reputation that Bruce had built for himself, I suggested him. Maybe a year or so ago I was tracking down old acquaintances and spoke to the now retired HR guy. He told me that on their first contact, Bruce said he wondered when he was going to hear from the IC because he had been lobbying for the job from the day it came open.
So Bruce came to the IC.
When I started in the railroad business in the late '50', anyone who had a title was addressed by the rank and file as "Mr." The culture of the 1960s changed that and with the possible exception of the President, CEO or Chairman, the use of first names became the norm. Within a day of Bruce's arrival on the job, word came down that as a Senior Vice President, he expected to be addressed as Mr. Bruce.
My only meeting with him was when he came around to introduce himself to all the staff. I was doing the market research work for the Chemical group. After five years of working on new business projects, I had a pretty good handle on what might or might not make money. As Greyhounds might testify, it took much more than just crunching numbers to get business. There was the matter of recognizing the capability of the producing unit and then convincing the operating department that they could do the job. Bruce asked me if we were looking at some freight moving from "out west". I said that it had not been a focus, because in general traffic we got from the west over Council Bluff did not give us satisfactory revenue. At that time, the IC as well as the other Granger Lines running east of Council Bluffs pretty much took it in the shorts on the division of revenue with the western lines. On top of that, the IC had a relatively high cost for train operations because the ruling grades out of the Missisippi River crossing put a low limit on train trailing weights. (This was pre-DPU).
He didn't say anything, but it was clear from his face that he did not appreciate a "good idea" being dismissed by someone who was probably just stuck in the old ways.
Shortly thereafter I left the IC, and within a month the five year pain in my stomach was gone.
Until Greyhounds mentioned it in his post above, I wasn't aware that a subsequent effort to improve service on the Iowa line failed. Of course, that became part of the big spin-off program that Bruce undertook when he became president of the railroad. Actually, my opinion is that the spin-off program was a good strategy. It did leave the property in good shape for the evential merger/byout by CN and to the best of my knowledge served the railroad shareholders quite well.
"We have met the enemy and he is us." Pogo Possum "We have met the anemone... and he is Russ." Bucky Katt "Prediction is very difficult, especially if it's about the future." Niels Bohr, Nobel laureate in physics
Murphy Siding wrote: Next door to my office, someone is renovating an old warehouse into a trendy furniture store. The general contractor has parked an old semi trailer on the site for storage. On the fron end of the old, beat-up trailer is a big, ol' IC insignia. Was IC in the trucking business at one time too?
You're looking at a former "Pig" (trailer). And the IC(G) owned a lot of those.
Just like a boxcar, when a shipper wanted to move a load 'O freight TOFC, we'd supply the equipment. Pig trailers were in a free running national pool. If we took it to New Orleans it could be reloaded there to LA on the SP. Of course, the SP had to pay us $7.00/day for using our trailer. We returned the favor. An SP load into NOLA could be reloaded out on the IC - then we'd have to pay them $7.00/day. A key to making a buck is to keep the empty miles down.
The absolutely asinine Federal Government restrictions on railroad ownership of trucking companies didn't say the railroads couldn't own trailers.
Please note, restriction is not a synonym for prohibition. The railroads could own trucking companies, but they were greatly restricted in what those trucking companies could do. Why? Who knows. It made no sense. Somebody in Washington probably got paid off.
Anyway, with dereg the restriction was removed. NS bought North American Van Lines (which was then a major general freight hauler) and the UP bought Overnite. (Now part of UPS). At the ICG we just got trucking "authority" in the region we served. That was another way deregulation improved efficiency. We were better able to "balance" our equipment.
Before dereg, if we had a load going into Wisconsin we couldn't take it there. We'd have to give it to another carrier, which produced headaches for the shipper and provided him with another reason to use over the road trucking for the entire move. With dereg we could deliver the load ourselves into Wisconsin by hiring an owner operator to move it from the Chicago ramp. But!
Then we couldn't catch a load out of Wisconsin if it wasn't going to have a subsequent rail movement. Why? It makes no sense. They just make rules up in Washington - that's what they get paid for. They get paid to make rules, not to use good sense.
So we wound up getting the trucking "authority". We could deliver in Wisconsin, catch any available load back in the direction of Chicago, then have the trailer empty at the Chicago ramp and available to take another load south on #51.
Life was good.
MP173 wrote: My guess is it is a piggyback trailer. Is it a 40 footer?ed
My guess is it is a piggyback trailer. Is it a 40 footer?
Yes- 40 footer. I thought the railroads were not allowed to own trucking lines at one time?
Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.
Murphy Siding wrote: I just read an article about Alfred E. Perlman by Harr J. Bruce. He talks about how working under Perlman at Western Pacific taught him many things. He left WP to go to ICG in 1975, and later became CEO of ICG. Did any of Perlman's management ideas come over with him? (Every time I read the name of Alfred E. Perlman, I think of Alfred E. Newman)
I just read an article about Alfred E. Perlman by Harr J. Bruce. He talks about how working under Perlman at Western Pacific taught him many things. He left WP to go to ICG in 1975, and later became CEO of ICG. Did any of Perlman's management ideas come over with him?
(Every time I read the name of Alfred E. Perlman, I think of Alfred E. Newman)
Well, working under Bruce was.....
He was VP Marketing before he became CEO. He would rip open a new one on someone who didn't know their "stuff" (substitue vulgarity for ***). But he let us have our head. We could try new things.
Let's see, under him we:
1) went back into the LCL/LTL business
2) set up shuttle intermodal service between Chicago and St. Louis (275 miles)
3) began (and ended) the first RoadRailer commercial operation. (RoadRailer sucks)
4) concentrated on moving intermodal shipments from dock to dock instead of ramp to ramp - this is key to shorter haul intermodal profitability. It also went against the established "knowledge" that railroads should only haul ramp to ramp.
5) improved service on the Iowa Division to compete with the C&NW (it didn't work)
6) established a dedicated train to handle steel between Chicago and St. Louis (again, diging it out against the trucks at 275 miles.)
7) Hired an opera singer (Bruce loves opera) to give concerts in places like a women's prison in Mississippi
8) did a bunch of other cool stuff, some of which worked, some of which didn't.
I'd say he didn't suffer fools gladly, but if you had your "stuff" together he'd let you give it a shot.
Jeaton:You over that cold yet? I am ready for some early 60's stories.
Mark, I really appreciate your stories of the IC. When were you at Purdue? I will check some old Official Guides to get some trains that were running at that time.
Other name trains for the IC included the "Green Diamond" and the "Southwestern Limited".
I always thought the song "City of New Orleans" was about the best railroad song ever written. Never got the opportunity to ride it, but the song painted quite a picture for me.
I was in Rockford last week and took a drive downtown. The CN (IC) area is pretty nondescript, sort of like the rest of the town...rusted away.
Darned if I didn’t overlook at least three more named IC passenger trains, the Irwin S. Cobb, which ran on the Kentucky Division between Louisville, Paducah and Fulton., The winter only Sunchaser Pullman train which ran for a few years between Chicago and Florida and the Chickasaw which I think was a Memphis-New Orleans train.
The IC’s hotshot freight on the Chi-NO mainline was designated MS-1. In many respects it was similar to the Cotton Belt’s famous Blue Streak. It was a train of about 50 boxcars, a number of which carried LCL freight, headed by a 4-8-2 and ran on a passenger train schedule. In fact MS-1 made the Chi-NO run in less time than did the Louisiane. The cutoff time for freight going south on MS-1 was somewhere around 2-4 in the afternoon. Loaded cars would be picked up from freight houses and shippers all over Chicago and taken to Markham Yard where the train was made up. It’s scheduled departure was around 7:30pm and it was in Memphis early the next morning and arrived in NO that afternoon. On more than one summer evening I’d borrow the family car and head south on 4-lane US-45 to just below Richton Park where the highway began its run right along the railroad through Monee, Peotone, Manteno and almost all the way to Kankakee. This stretch of the IC was 3-tracked at the time and there were manned interlocking towers at each of the towns so trains could be switched from any one to either of the other two tracks. I’d park along the highway waiting for MS-1 and the chase to begin. I’d regularly clock it at 70 mph and at that speed the driving rods on that big Mountain were just a blur. I’d have the car windows down so I could better hear the low, throaty, almost mournful, whistle that was the signature of an IC steamer.
Upon graduation from high school I spent two years at Purdue in Lafayette, IN which was quite a railroad town situated on the mainlines of the Big Four’s Indiana Division, the Wabash’s Detroit-St. line (route of the crack overnight Cannonball - which existed in fact not just in song), the Nickel Plate’s Peoria line and the Monon’s Chi-Louisville main. The Monon’s locomotive and car shops were located on the north edge of town along the Wabash River. These shops were the source of Purdue’s nickname, the Boilermakers, but that is another story. The Monon was unique in that it ran through Lafayette right down the middle of 5th Street. It was interesting to see their passenger train, the Thoroughbred, stopped in the middle of the street in front of a hotel whose lobby also housed the Monon ticket office and waiting room. Local authorities at that time winked at the laws prohibiting prostitution and more than one house up and down the Monon along 5th Street sported a red porch light. But that too is the subject of another story. After two years and way too many nights and weekends spent at depots, yard offices, switchman’s shanties and interlocking towers my grades had deteriorated to the point my parents decided they had wasted enough money on my education and I was returned home.
After a year working construction jobs I returned to commuting on the IC, to attend the Univ. of Illinois Chicago Branch which at the time was located downtown on Navy Pier. My schedule was such that I got to ride the one morning train which after leaving Homewood bypassed Hazelcrest, stopped at Harvey then ran non-stop the rest of the way to Central Station. I usually stood at the front door of the first car right next to the motorman’s compartment. This was a 60mph trip with the horn blowing at every station to warn waiting commuters we were non-stop and to stand well back of the platform’s edge.
During my teens and early 20’s I made probably six trips to and from Florida, three on the City of Miami, two on the Southwind (PRR/ L&N/ACL) and one on the Dixie Flagler (C&EI/L&N/NC&StL/ACL). Each of these trains alternated running only every third day on exactly the same schedule departing Chicago in the morning, arriving Jacksonville the next morning then running down the FEC to arrive in Miami late that afternoon. I spent most of the daylight hours in the observation cars. Carbondale was always a high point because after stopping at the station an IC 0-6-0 would couple onto the observation car and pull it and several coaches onto an adjacent track then it would pick up from another track the through cars that had come on a connecting train from St. Louis and move this cut of cars forward coupling them to the front cars of the City. It was back again to get the observation car and its several coaches and reunite them with the rest of the train. During this time car knockers would bang on every wheel with their hammers listening for the telltale sound of a crack. After a standing air brake test we were on our way again all of this taking about 15 minutes. The same procedure took place at Carbondale for the City of New Orleans and possibly, but I’m not sure, for the Panama Limited.
Crossing the Ohio River on the high bridge at Cairo was another highpoint of the trip. The IC shared this bridge with the GM&O and if lucky we’d pass one of their waiting trains on one side or the other of the bridge. It was then on to Fulton, KY where the City of Miami left the Chicago-New Orleans main and ran on the single track speedway to Birmingham.
When the City of New Orleans went in service the IC added a connecting train whose through coaches from Louisville were added to the CNO at Fulton. This connection was unique since it was headed by a semi-streamlined 4-6-2, No.1146, because initially there were no diesel servicing facilities on the Kentucky Division between Fulton and Louisville. As far as I know this was the only steam engine the IC ever streamlined and a photo of it can be seen on George Elwood’s site (gelwood,railfan,net). Look under the topic Illinois Central - Diesel Locomotives and scroll down the listing and click on “Steam Locomotives”. Scads of IC steam photos of all vintage are shown on this site. More later.
Mark
greyhounds wrote:No Mark, you didn't bore me.
Absolutely not! At this stage of the game some of us greybeards do as much railfanning in our heads and hearts, as on the ground, with memories like old friends.
Just a P.S. to my last post. I forgot another named IC passenger train, the Illini. This coach train ran between Chicago and Carbondale. South of Champaign it made flag stops in addition to regularly scheduled station stops at just about every town along the way to Carbondale. I believe it was in the days just before or maybe just after the advent of Amtrak that it ran for a while as the Shawnee. Surprisingly it still runs to this day as an Amtrak operation with its original name, the Illini. I understand there are plans to add another Amtrak train to this route which will be partially subsidized by the State of Illinois.
Some more of my IC memories. The strawberry trains were one of the IC's more interesting operations. Each spring carloads of strawberries would be shipped from Hammond, LA to Chicago in wooden sided Railway Express reefers. At the start and again at the tail end of the harvest season one or two of these cars a day would run on either the Louisiane or the Creole. However during the peak of the strawberry season. whole trainloads of 8 and up to 12 cars would be dispatched as an extra behind high stepping Pacifics in the 1100 series. IIRC these trains ran on an 18 (or less) hour schedule, stopping only for crew and engine changes, and were the fastest train on the Chi-NO main line except for the Panama Limited and later on the City of NO.
Most kids ride school buses but not us. We rode the IC commuter trains from Flossmoor to Harvey where we attended Thornton Twp. HS. When I was 16 my family moved to Homewood and I continued to ride the train to school. Our house in Homewood was about two city blocks from the Markham Yard roundhouse. This was a huge facility (32 engine stalls if IIRC) with road engines heading out to their trains on the southbound yard lead tracks all hours of the day and night. Long after diesels started appearing on the passenger trains all freight on the IC ran behind steam. I believe it was around 1955 when the first all black GP's sporting their green diamond started appearing to replace steam in freight service. Up till then main line freight was headed by heavy 4-8-2's in the 2500 and 2600 number series. I may have it backwards but I believe the 2500's were built in the IC's own Paducah shops and the 2600's were built by Lima. The 2500's had smaller tenders with 4-wheel trucks and usually ran with an auxiliary water tender. The 2600's had massive 6-wheel truck tenders which eliminated the need for the auxiliary. Only the "Kankakee Turn" (daily M-F from Markham Yard to Kankakee) rated a different type engine, a 2-8-2, which was the standard freight motive power on the IC's secondary and branch lines.
Speaking of roundhouses there was a second one at 23rd St., about 1-1/2 miles south of Central Station, where passenger engines were serviced. In the steam days the lighter passenger trains were headed by 1100 series Pacifics and the longer trains such as the Louisiane by a light 4-8-2 in the 2400 series. Chesapeake & Ohio Cincy-Chicago line freight engines were also serviced by the IC at the 23rd St. roundhouse. It was always interesting to see one of the "foreign" C&O mikados with their smokebox mounted air pumps.
It must have been around 1948 when the City of New Orleans was inaugurated and the IC standardized on the familiar chocolate brown, orange and yellow passenger livery. I think the Panama Limited had been streamlined in this color scheme a short time before. Traffic on the St. Louis line had outgrown the original Green Diamond and it was replaced by an all new non-articulated streamliner with a twin train replacing the Daylight's heavyweight steam powered consist. The articulated original Green Diamond headed south where it ran out its remaining days as the Miss Lou on the Jackson, MS to New Orleans run. About this time the streamlined Land 'o Corn went into service on the Iowa Division between Chicago and Freeport (or was it Waterloo?). It replaced a gas electric doodle bug and single coach train of the same name which locals often referred to as the "Can of Corn".
This completed the IC's fleet of streamlined light weight passenger trains. The other name trains; the Seminole (Chi-Jax), the Planter (Memphis-NO), the Hawkeye (Chi-Omaha) the Northwestern/Southwestern Limited (Shreveport, LA-Meridian, MS), the Night Diamond (Chi-St.L) and the Louisiane, Creole and Southern Express (Chi-NO); all remained as heavyweights for the rest of their days. However the heavyweight cars regularly assigned to these trains were rebuilt with new lighting and reclining seats and were repainted in the streamliner colors. The Seminole was unique in that in addition to IC equipment, it regularly ran with Central of Georgia and Atlantic Coast Line coaches painted in IC colors.
By this time I'm tired of writing and you're probably tired of reading so I'll stop and pick up with another installment of my IC memories at a later date.
There Rebulid program was impressive!
That there is a IC GP10 or GP11, can't remeber which. Its on display at Monticello Railway Museum in Monticello, IL if you want to look at it.
Reading your posts has brought back a flood of memories. I was born in 1932 and lived for my first 16 years in Flossmoor, IL with just a street between my home and the IC's 6 track mainline. My earliest memories are of the IC's big 4-8-2's blasting by as they got their trains rolling after leaving Markham Yard. You could stand in my yard and when the wind was from the east the fly ash from their barking exhausts would rain down on your head. This was particularly annoying to my mother if this happend on a Monday when she had the family wash hanging out to dry.
Two of the six tracks were for the electic MU commuter trains which both my Dad and old maid Aunt who lived with us rode daily to work in Chicago. The ROW was grade separated all the 30 or so miles from Matteson to the end of track at South Water Street in downtown Chicago. The railroad embankment was the closest thing we had to a hill, so after each Winter snow every kid in town would be sliding down them on their sleds. The commuter stops all had wooden elevated platforms located between the north and southbound tracks and since I only lived a block from the station this was one of my favorite boyhood haunts to sit and watch the constant parade of trains.
I believe it was 1940 when the City of Miami in its original orange/green painted 8 car consist of coaches, diner and observation lounge was inaugarated. The IC had sponsored a contest to name the train and my Aunt was disappointed when her entry, the "Bird of Paradise", was not chosen. I remember just like it was yesterday standing at trackside waving as the City went by on its first southbound run. I was thrilled to get two short horn blasts from the engineer. At that time the only other diesel powered train was the original articulated, green painted Green Diamond to St. Louis. I never thought it was particularly pretty and it brought to my mind one of those fat green tomato worms with a hook on its head.
One summer during WWII there was a freight derailment at Matteson which blocked the 4 through freight and passenger train tracks. The trains couldn't stop so everything was run over the two commuter tracks between Matteson and Homewood which was the next interlocking point. I spent the best rail fanning day of my life on the platform at Flossmoor watching everything from the Markham big hook wreck train to troop trains. It was awesome to stand on that platfrorm and have Mountains and Pacifics pass by at about 10mph just inches from me. I could literally feel the heat on my face from their boilers and fireboxes and to add to the thrill they whistled continuously to warn everyone to stand back from the platform edge.
It was also about this time that I first visited the cab of a live steam locomotive.No. 3606 was one of 5 0-10-0's that the IC inherited when it acquired the Gulf & Ship Island RR. They were originally oil burners and were used by the G&SI in moving freight cars onto and off of the barges that plied between Gulfport and Ship Island in Mississippi.The IC converted them to coal burners and brought them north to work the Markham Yard humps.They were never successful as hump engines because as coal burners they lacked sufficient grate area to keep enough steam up for hump service. These five engines were unique in that they were the only ICRR locomotives to my knowledge that had Vanderbilt type tenders.But back to my tale. The 3606 was switching a car into a coal and lumber yard on the far south side of Homewood. The spur curved off the mainline and was too sharp for that 0-10-0's rigid wheelbase. She had jumped the track shortly before I passed by on my bike and was awaiting another engine from Markham Yard to asssist in re-railing her. Needless to say I parked my bike and watched the scene from up close. The engine crew invited me into the cab and between the two of them answered my questions about every lever, valve and gauge on the backhead of that locomotive.
I believe I was 13 years old when I wrote an open letter to IC headquarters addressed to Central Station, Chicago requesting an employee timetable for the Illinois Division. Imagine my surprise to receive a personal reply from Wayne Johnston, President of the ICRR. Mr. Johnston explained that ETT's were only available to employees but he gave me his home phone number and INVITED me to his house which was within bike riding distance! I called, made an appointment and spent a most enjoyable 3 hours on a Saturday afternnoon with Mr. Johnston explaining the ETT to me and just the two of us - a 13 year old boy and the President of the Illinois Central - discussing railroading. UNBELIEVABLE BUT TRUE! He encourgaged me to go to college and assured me of a career with the IC upon greaduation. Wayne Johnston was the epitome of a railroad man so unlike the bean counters that later were in control and emasculated the once great Illinois Central.
Big Four trains on the Cincy-Indianapolis-Chicago line all ran over the the IC from Kankakee northward. Well into the 50's the Big Four accounted for 6 passenger trains per day in each direction. The NYC engines were dropped at Kankakee and the Big Four trains were all pulled by IC motive power the last 50 or so miles into Chicago. That was until about 1948 when the Big Four inaugarated the James Whitcomb Riley. Prior to dieselization the Riley was headed by a streamlined NYC Pacific making it the only Big Four train to run all the way into Chicago behind an NYC engine.
I have probably by this time bored many of you so will save my later IC memories for another day.
Mark Foster
Below is an account of my childhood and the IC Railroad.
Camp would start in March or April with phone calls between friends. The same question would be asked, “Are you going to Camp this summer?”. If the answer was yes then the planning would begin for our trip North to Chicago and all the waiting other campers. The next step would be when my mother started sewing in the name tags that identified me as to who I was in the clothing I was going to take to camp. This was neatly placed in a wooden or metal foot locker. This would be shipped to camp by REA-Xpress two weeks prior to our departing from Memphis.
On the evening of departure we, all the campers from the Memphis area and our families, arrived at Central Station at the corner of South Main St. and Calhoun Av. in downtown Memphis, Tennessee. We were waiting for the north bound arrival of The Louisiane. This was the local that departed Memphis at 07:30 PM and arrived in Chicago at 07:00 AM the next morning.
The campers from New Orleans, LA and Jackson, MS road the Panama Limited and arrived in Chicago at 09:00 AM.
The Louisiane was not a star in the Green Diamond fleet of the Illinois Central but just a work horse local. The consist was about half coach and half Pullman. The nice thing about The Louisiane was that it left early enough from Memphis that we got to watch West Tennessee and West Kentucky go to sleep as we passed through the small towns along the I.C.’s double track main line. The highlight of the trip was around 11:00 PM when the train climbed the Ohio River Bridge between Wickliffe, Ky. and North Cairo, Il. The climb begins as you leave Wickliffe and continues along a slow curve to the North until you are suspended over the Ohio River. If you were in the last car of the train you could see the entire train out of the window. Not long after the crossing and the subsequent station stop in North Cairo we would settle down and fall asleep as we made our way to Chicago.
Our arrival at Chicago’s Central Station was very uneventful. The assembly point for all the boys would be the LaSalle Hotel were boys from all over the United States would arrive all day long. Boys from Denver would come in on the CB&Q. Boys from Cleveland would come in on the NYC. The St Louis boys would arrive on the GM&O and the boys from Florida would come in on the CE&I-L&N combination trains.
The camp owners can’t keep 200+ young boys cooped up in a hotel ballroom all day. Some of the boys made arrangements to go to a baseball game. Some of the boys went to the Chicago Theater to see a first run movie and a stage show. My choice was always the same. The Chicago Museum of Science and Industry. Here I could spend all day in one place and never get board. There was the U-505 captured German Submarine, the human heart you could walk through, the coal mine you could go down in and of course the largest model train exhibit I had ever seen. In four summers of going to the museum I always found something I had never seen before. Many years later I was in Chicago on business and I had some free time and I went out to the museum again. It was just as much fun some 35 later as it was when I was 12.
Around five in the afternoon we were all rounded up in the hotel’s ballroom and given our dinner arrangements. This was normally a hamburger and french fries in the hotels coffee shop. After dinner we were all shuttled over to the Chicago and Northwestern station to board our charted train to camp. All of the boys parents were instructed to buy our tickets from our home station. Every one had a round trip ticket from there home to Hawthorne, Wisconsin. Hawthorne was just an at grade crossing with a general store and post office but that was our destination. Hawthorne was the closest C&NW station to camp and the place were we would board borrowed school busses for the seven mile trip to camp.
All summer long we would keep occupied participating in a number of camp activities. Some of the activities were wood craft, camping, canoeing, sailing and rifle range. We also had team sports and days of major group competition. As the summer started to wind down we were reminded that we had to gather all of our clothes, and any extra gear we had and to place them in our suitcase or footlocker. The footlockers were stacked up in front of our cabins and a flatbed truck came buy and picked them up. They would be loaded into a baggage car that was on our southbound train and we would be ready to head for Chicago.
Most years the train departed Hawthorne around dinner time. This meant that all 200+ boys were to be fed in a 60 seat dinner. The youngest boys went first then the older in order. The meal was again the hamburger, french fries and apple pie al-mode for dessert. I don’t know what it is but to me food on a train is always superior to food served in a non mobile restaurant. We arrived at the C&NW station before 07:00 AM. This was not hard for the railroad to accomplish because the trip was only 450 + miles and they had about 12 hours to do it in.
When we arrived in Chicago we would transfer by Parmelee Service to Central Station in preparation for the 07:45 AM departure to Memphis on the City Of New Orleans. “The City” was the great migration train of middle of America. Many people who had relatives in the big cities of the north or relatives in the delta of the Mississippi Valley would use “The City” as there main mode of transportation. The Illinois Centrals slogan “Main Line Of Mid-America” was a well deserved moniker. This train was an all coach train. It would have one or two baggage cars, rail post office, double dinner, café-lounge mid train, and a round end observation car carrying the drumhead on the rear.
The first thing all of us did after getting settled in our coach seat was make a bee line for the dinner. Here the Illinois Central would out shine any restaurant in Memphis or Chicago as far as I was concerned when it came to breakfast. The item I would wait all summer for was the “IC” french toast.
This was six diamond shaped sliced of New Orleans french bread, with the crust trimmed off, that had been dipped in batter then deep fried to a golden brown. This was served with crisp bacon and fresh squeezed orange juice. Many years later I was talking with a former camper who also remembered the “IC” french toast and how he also looked forward to that breakfast.
The engineers on “The City” were so good that if you did not look out the window when the train was started you would not feel a thing. I remember sitting in the dinner at Homewood many a morning and not feeling that we were moving until we reached 20 miles per hour or better.
What made the trip south on “The City” memorable, other than breakfast, was the Illinois countryside and the speed with which we traversed it. There was a section of the trip between Champaign and Centralia were it felt like we were flying. The cars on parallel US 51 could not keep up. It seamed like the faster we went the smoother the ride. In the March 1966 issue of Trains Magazine the article 100 mph aboard an E9 talked about how every day “The City” would attain 100 miles per hour to keep to its published running time.
Some of my “first” were aboard “The City” . I learned to play gin. I had my first caned soft drink. I spent a long afternoon sitting in the round end observation car watching the miles roll buy. I met many nice people and staff of the railroad. I never new how well a person knew there railroad until one afternoon in Western Tennessee. The rear brakeman was sitting in the end of the train listing to me rattle on about trains. He had placed a full soft drink can on the window sill of the observation car as we sped along. The tracks through this section were fairly straight. All of a sudden the brakeman, with out looking, reached up and grabbed his soft drink just before the train whipped around a sharp curve. At that point I understood that this man knew every foot of the division he was responsible for.
Our arrival in Memphis was always on time at 05:03 PM. As we unloaded from the “The City” I would turn and say a fond fair well to a friend who had brought me home and I would look forward to the trip the next year.
When I get over my cold and have some more energy, I'll add a story or two about the IC in the early 60's.
Meanwhile, I might suggest a membership in the IC Historical Society. For about $25 a year, membership includes the Quarterly Green Diamond magazine. About a year or so ago, they substantially upgraded the print quality of the magazines and photo reproduction is quite good. The June 2006 issue was 52 pages including covers and the only "ads" are reproductions of ads for the IC's freight and passenger service.
Something seems to have happened to the web site, but the snail mail address is PO Box 288, Paxton, IL 60957. The old Paxton depot is the HQ for the organization. I believe that back issues of the magazine are available for a price to non-members.
Jay
greyhounds wrote: gabe wrote: greyhounds wrote: How 'bout Brown and Orange back to back E's with Green Diamonds in the weeds on the Havana branch on May 14, 1966. One of them is the #4023, the other appears to be an E6 (can't make out the number) with a banged up nose/Green Diamond. Photos in Havana, Mason City, Lincoln and Clinton. Railfan excursion that I managed to talk my parents into allowing me to ride. Greyhounds, You have my undivided attention. IC's Havahna line has always interested me--although at first, I have to admit, I was like "Havahna, the Chicago, Illinois and Midland serves Havahna not the IC. Then I remembered that IC once had an East-West line serving Havahna. Surely it did not have passenger service? What was the freight service like? When was it pulled? What lines did it work in conjunction with? Did it primarily serve as a feeder the the Chi-NO main? Or did it primarily work of the Gilman main? Or the Peoria main? That line and the Bloomer line--which fortunately still exists under different ownership--have always had a certain interest for me that I just never got around to fully exploring. Gabe P.S. That would be an interesting picture. Why are you putting an "H" in Havana? I know those of us from central Illinois put an "R" in wash. We say "warsh". It's not Washington, IL, it's "Warshington, IL". But I've never come across this "H" thing before. The IC's Havana branch was served by a tri-weekly local. Out of Clinton, I recall. Back then, the small towns still received things like lumber and ag chemicals by rail. The IC local delivered that stuff. Grain produced in that area went out by Illinois River barges and the IC "served" power plant in Havana received its coal by barge. (Now it gets it coal from the Poweder River Basin delivered courtesy of the I&M) The passenger train to Havana was a railfan charter. If I can ever figure out how to post pictures here, I'll post the shots of the IC E's in Havana. The last regular passenger service in Mason County died with the GM&O motor cars between Bloomington and Kansas City around 1960. The 69 MPH freight train ride was on our Iowa Division, and the Iowa Division was a different animal. There is such a thing as "The Midwestern Work Ethic". The guys on that line had it. They knew how to "railroad". (Using "railroad" as a verb.) And equally important, they wanted to "railroad". If a train was in Waterloo and it was going to Freeport, they'd take it there and not fool around doing it. There was a noticeable difference in their approach to work vis a vis the people in the South. I've been through the tunnel at E. Dubuque on the locomotives. It's on a curve. The line goes through the tunnel on a curve, comes out crossing the BNSF, then immediately goes on to the Mississippi River Bridge. Nice memories.
gabe wrote: greyhounds wrote: How 'bout Brown and Orange back to back E's with Green Diamonds in the weeds on the Havana branch on May 14, 1966. One of them is the #4023, the other appears to be an E6 (can't make out the number) with a banged up nose/Green Diamond. Photos in Havana, Mason City, Lincoln and Clinton. Railfan excursion that I managed to talk my parents into allowing me to ride. Greyhounds, You have my undivided attention. IC's Havahna line has always interested me--although at first, I have to admit, I was like "Havahna, the Chicago, Illinois and Midland serves Havahna not the IC. Then I remembered that IC once had an East-West line serving Havahna. Surely it did not have passenger service? What was the freight service like? When was it pulled? What lines did it work in conjunction with? Did it primarily serve as a feeder the the Chi-NO main? Or did it primarily work of the Gilman main? Or the Peoria main? That line and the Bloomer line--which fortunately still exists under different ownership--have always had a certain interest for me that I just never got around to fully exploring. Gabe P.S. That would be an interesting picture.
greyhounds wrote: How 'bout Brown and Orange back to back E's with Green Diamonds in the weeds on the Havana branch on May 14, 1966. One of them is the #4023, the other appears to be an E6 (can't make out the number) with a banged up nose/Green Diamond. Photos in Havana, Mason City, Lincoln and Clinton. Railfan excursion that I managed to talk my parents into allowing me to ride.
How 'bout Brown and Orange back to back E's with Green Diamonds in the weeds on the Havana branch on May 14, 1966.
One of them is the #4023, the other appears to be an E6 (can't make out the number) with a banged up nose/Green Diamond. Photos in Havana, Mason City, Lincoln and Clinton.
Railfan excursion that I managed to talk my parents into allowing me to ride.
Greyhounds,
You have my undivided attention. IC's Havahna line has always interested me--although at first, I have to admit, I was like "Havahna, the Chicago, Illinois and Midland serves Havahna not the IC. Then I remembered that IC once had an East-West line serving Havahna.
Surely it did not have passenger service? What was the freight service like? When was it pulled? What lines did it work in conjunction with? Did it primarily serve as a feeder the the Chi-NO main? Or did it primarily work of the Gilman main? Or the Peoria main? That line and the Bloomer line--which fortunately still exists under different ownership--have always had a certain interest for me that I just never got around to fully exploring.
Gabe
P.S. That would be an interesting picture.
Why are you putting an "H" in Havana? I know those of us from central Illinois put an "R" in wash. We say "warsh". It's not Washington, IL, it's "Warshington, IL". But I've never come across this "H" thing before.
The IC's Havana branch was served by a tri-weekly local. Out of Clinton, I recall. Back then, the small towns still received things like lumber and ag chemicals by rail. The IC local delivered that stuff. Grain produced in that area went out by Illinois River barges and the IC "served" power plant in Havana received its coal by barge. (Now it gets it coal from the Poweder River Basin delivered courtesy of the I&M)
The passenger train to Havana was a railfan charter. If I can ever figure out how to post pictures here, I'll post the shots of the IC E's in Havana. The last regular passenger service in Mason County died with the GM&O motor cars between Bloomington and Kansas City around 1960.
The 69 MPH freight train ride was on our Iowa Division, and the Iowa Division was a different animal. There is such a thing as "The Midwestern Work Ethic". The guys on that line had it. They knew how to "railroad". (Using "railroad" as a verb.) And equally important, they wanted to "railroad". If a train was in Waterloo and it was going to Freeport, they'd take it there and not fool around doing it. There was a noticeable difference in their approach to work vis a vis the people in the South.
I've been through the tunnel at E. Dubuque on the locomotives. It's on a curve. The line goes through the tunnel on a curve, comes out crossing the BNSF, then immediately goes on to the Mississippi River Bridge.
Nice memories.
It has taken me years just to get to the point where I did not include an "r" in wash 75% of the time.
greyhounds wrote: And, I'll add my favoite ICG experience. I was a young management (marketing) guy learning the ropes. I was riding CC-6 east from Waterloo to Chicago. The engineer was an elderly man with, if I recall correctly, nine trips left until retirement. I just said hello to the head end crew and went back to the 2nd Geep. We came out of Waterloo with a decent sized train of about 70 cars of mixed freight and four Geeps. It was night. I just settled in with my thermous of coffee and expected nothing out of the ordinay. I don't know how many times that engineer had been back and forth between Waterloo and Freeport, but he sure knew what he was doing. He took us up to 69 MPH with that freight train. The wheel slip light in the 2nd Geep came on and I figured we were going to wreck. I thought an axle had locked up, the wheels were sliding, and we were headed for the ditch. Nope. As I understand things, the engines were governed at that speed and would cut out at 69 MPH. So our speed would drop to 67, the engines would come back on line, and we'd go right back up to 69. The wheel slip light came on when all this happened. This was for mile after mile through the Iowa night He just kept the locomotives wide open. He didn't slow down until he had to descend the hill into Dubuque. Then we climbed out of the Mississippi River sag and rolled through Galena in the full moon. I'd never seen Galena before. It's an old town, built before the Civil War (U.S. Grant called it home) and it remains somewhat as it was. The rail line is on a ridge, somewhat above the center of town. It was a nice ending to a wild ride. The rest of the trip into Chicago was unevenful.
And, I'll add my favoite ICG experience.
I was a young management (marketing) guy learning the ropes. I was riding CC-6 east from Waterloo to Chicago.
The engineer was an elderly man with, if I recall correctly, nine trips left until retirement. I just said hello to the head end crew and went back to the 2nd Geep. We came out of Waterloo with a decent sized train of about 70 cars of mixed freight and four Geeps. It was night. I just settled in with my thermous of coffee and expected nothing out of the ordinay.
I don't know how many times that engineer had been back and forth between Waterloo and Freeport, but he sure knew what he was doing. He took us up to 69 MPH with that freight train. The wheel slip light in the 2nd Geep came on and I figured we were going to wreck. I thought an axle had locked up, the wheels were sliding, and we were headed for the ditch. Nope. As I understand things, the engines were governed at that speed and would cut out at 69 MPH. So our speed would drop to 67, the engines would come back on line, and we'd go right back up to 69. The wheel slip light came on when all this happened.
This was for mile after mile through the Iowa night He just kept the locomotives wide open. He didn't slow down until he had to descend the hill into Dubuque. Then we climbed out of the Mississippi River sag and rolled through Galena in the full moon. I'd never seen Galena before. It's an old town, built before the Civil War (U.S. Grant called it home) and it remains somewhat as it was. The rail line is on a ridge, somewhat above the center of town. It was a nice ending to a wild ride.
The rest of the trip into Chicago was unevenful.
Wow, the IC once had rails that would support 69mph freights? That must have been back in the black/green diamond days rather than the orange and white days that I vaguely recall.Gabe
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