Do trains get hit by lighting if so what happens

[Anonymous]

Mookie
There is really no protection for giant electromagnetic wave hits. The currents are just too big. So you try to have sacrificial (cheap) elements burn out to act like house fuses . For aircraft, the electrical sink is the sky around the plane and the currents are not like ground vehicles sitting on a wet earth. Lightning rods are hokum or useful for proviiding false confidence while ... you know this line. You are more likely to be hit by lightning than to win the California Lottery so the risk exposure is small and the occasional rewiring of a locomotive is the best way to go ahead.
Lindsay

[Anonymous]

Mookie
There is really no protection for giant electromagnetic wave hits. The currents are just too big. So you try to have sacrificial (cheap) elements burn out to act like house fuses . For aircraft, the electrical sink is the sky around the plane and the currents are not like ground vehicles sitting on a wet earth. Lightning rods are hokum or useful for proviiding false confidence while ... you know this line. You are more likely to be hit by lightning than to win the California Lottery so the risk exposure is small and the occasional rewiring of a locomotive is the best way to go ahead.
Lindsay

[Anonymous]

Jen, Lighting protection is only as good as the earth ground you send it to. Trains have very poor earth grounds so lighting rods will not help. Railroad tracks have very poor earth ground for they sit on several feet of gravel and rock. Out west in Mountain Home Idaho, I witnessed a strang phenomenon called Ball lighting. A Ball of lighting about the size of a golf ball, rode about 1 inch above the track rails seeking a path to earth ground.
TIM A

[Anonymous]

Jen, Lighting protection is only as good as the earth ground you send it to. Trains have very poor earth grounds so lighting rods will not help. Railroad tracks have very poor earth ground for they sit on several feet of gravel and rock. Out west in Mountain Home Idaho, I witnessed a strang phenomenon called Ball lighting. A Ball of lighting about the size of a golf ball, rode about 1 inch above the track rails seeking a path to earth ground.
TIM A

[Mookie]

Lightning is the one thing that the Mook is afraid of. She lives with tornados, snakes (sorry Ed) and blizzards, but lightning is truly scary. I can' imagine being that close to the lightning when it is all around you or right there in front of you - Makes you feel pretty insignificant!

Mookie

[Mookie]

Lightning is the one thing that the Mook is afraid of. She lives with tornados, snakes (sorry Ed) and blizzards, but lightning is truly scary. I can' imagine being that close to the lightning when it is all around you or right there in front of you - Makes you feel pretty insignificant!

Mookie

[dekemd]

QUOTE: Originally posted by geniusorus

oh you had to tell me that DEKEMD where ever this AC 4400 is that got hit by lightning im sure it is DIT to huntington and I will probably become very well aquainted with it in the near future as for your question mookie i dont know the whole story on how the SD 60 ended up in the river however i know that the mud and ballasts were so thick in this unit they couldnt bar the engine over im guessing they are goign to mark it off as a loss the carbody is demolished and any of the electronics in this unit are in bad shape also.

It was taken to Erwin TN after the strike. It was parked with AC4400 # 491 that had part of the cab destroyed by a tree. Not sure where it went after that.

Derrick

[dekemd]

QUOTE: Originally posted by geniusorus

oh you had to tell me that DEKEMD where ever this AC 4400 is that got hit by lightning im sure it is DIT to huntington and I will probably become very well aquainted with it in the near future as for your question mookie i dont know the whole story on how the SD 60 ended up in the river however i know that the mud and ballasts were so thick in this unit they couldnt bar the engine over im guessing they are goign to mark it off as a loss the carbody is demolished and any of the electronics in this unit are in bad shape also.

It was taken to Erwin TN after the strike. It was parked with AC4400 # 491 that had part of the cab destroyed by a tree. Not sure where it went after that.

Derrick

[Anonymous]

Everyone must Rememebr, Electricity follows the path of least resistance..

Thge human body is like a pack of Resisotrs.. it offers A heck of a lot of ohms Resistance compared to a 5' 11" copper wire wich offers 0.001 Ohms Resistance. Aluminum conducts Electricity at 60% of copper, but if your sitting in your chair The Lightning bolt will most likely not effect you, I have never been in this situation, but i can assure you minimal damage is done.

Water does not conduct Electricity. No it does not. It Requires an additive to do so. Like Pools.. The H2O has Chlorine in it, the more the clorine, the faster Electricity flows throw it.. the less resistance it has..

IF you cut a wire and remove a 1 inch section of it, then put one finger on one end and another finger, (it doesn't matter what hand, you can use seperate ones if you like) you will get an electrical shock, because you leave the Electricity no other option but to flow through you. Howerever if you don't Remove that Wire, and touch the wires an inch apart, you WONT get a shock because it's easier to flow through copper, or aluminum then it is to go through your finger.

Face it Electricity is lazy, taking the easiest path possible.

Factor this in your on a train, going 50 MPH. Lightning usually strikes the highest point.. is a common misconception.. Lighning will strike Whatever gives of a better NEGATIVE magnetic FIELD. a tree, made of wood, does not give of a Strong negfative magnetic field, however a 25 foot MEtallic Aluminum rod sticking 20 feet in the ground gives of an Excellent negative magnetic field.

Remeebr another thing.. Electricity will do anyhting to get through the ground. it would rather not travel through a lighbulb, it would rather go directly to the ground.

Ever notice That when you attach a Black (live wire) and white (common wire(using the 120 volt AC system)) directly sparks fly for about ~1 to 5 secoindes (based on the maker of youre fuse box, i would recomend Square D before anyone else because it takes a fuse 0.5 secondes to blow) after the sparks fly it dies. yet take the same wires attach them to a light bulb holder and place a light bulb in the holder.. turn on the switch... what happens.. the lgiht goes on.. no sparks???!?!!?.. i'll explain that.. the light bulb Fillement inside (made of Carbon) offers the flowing Electricity .. 18.1 Ohms of Resistance.. compared to our direct contact wich offers 0 ohms of resistance.

Kettle runs on the smae principle except there is a thick NICR wire (Nichrome, Nickel chrome) wire inside.. that rather then conduct Electricity perfeclty like copper, it offers ALOT of resistance and as electricity goes through that wire it heats up..

so various wires are used for different things, carbon for light, Nichrome for heat and copper for almost perfect conductance.

Remeber 1983? the first metallic aplliances came out back then.. or the first ones with a triple Grounded Prong. that offers an even easier route for Elec. (Elec now stands for Electricity, because i said so) to pass through, Rememebr the white wire is a Standerdized ground that goes back up to the power lines then down a wire along the side of a telephone poll .. the ground wire (GREEN) is the funky center prong on an outlet.. that offers a Direct route to the ground.. so should one of the wires become lose in your appliance and touch any of the metallic parts.. rather then getting a NASTY shock, the electricity would be much happier travelling through the ground wire.. into..well .. THE GROUND!

how does it do so? check near your fuse box... look on your water pipes.. you may see a bare copper wire attached to one of your water pipes.. these are an excellent source of Grounding

is there a perfect Conductor?

Yes, Solid Gold. Gold wire offers far less Resistance then a copper wire EVER could. But unlike most of you, i cna't afford solid gold wiring yet. so cheap copper will have to do

Don't settle for Aluminum!!

that will, over time, loosen itself from whatever appliance you have attached it to. back in the days.. when they didn't have proper grounding.. it used to loosen itself and fall in the metallic box.. (these days they are grounded) the metaalic box (being attached to a beam) the Elec. would slowly find its way to the ground.. thus making the wood, and the metallic box extremely hot. over a period of 5 years or 10.. the wood would combust, and cathc the house on fire. when i say metallic boxes, i mean the boxes that outlets are attached too. the live wire would slowly over time loosen itself, even though it may have been properly screwed in at the outlet , it would loosen, fall, heat up the box.. 10 years later you got ashes for a house.

So proper grounding came in..

Rememebr the WOODEN rule .. if you expose wood to a 250 degree temperature for an extended period of time( lets say 5-10 years), if one day after that period of time, the temperature should rise to 260 degrees, the wood will cath fire, even though it's normal combustian temperature is 600 degrees or so.

those are some golden rules.. the actual chances of a train being struck by lightning is about
0.00000000000000000133

don't mind cabforward, he wore aluminum diapers as a child, which significantly lowered his Resistance to lightning and must have been struck based on his foolish statements.

those are low ods.. you do have a chance of winning the lottery 8.5 times before being struck by lightning in a train

Because rails already have a posotive charg flowing through them, they offer a significantly LOWER negative charge then any other object around the tracks, such as a house.. or a funky wind thing that are made of metal.. this possotive charge that triggers the block signaling systewm or the RR lgihts, actually in a twisted way prevents the tracks from being struck more often.

the top power line on a poll offers a charge of 7500-25000 Volts. it almsot never gets struck, because it already carries a possotive charge.

Lightning is not attracted to possotive charges.. it is attracted to the strongest negatinve charge it can get from the ground. like a metallic ROD that is grounded... a tree if it has a lot of sap because sap conducts electricity and so on, but you must get the point os ill shut up.

sorry for all the SPelling Errors.

[Anonymous]

Everyone must Rememebr, Electricity follows the path of least resistance..

Thge human body is like a pack of Resisotrs.. it offers A heck of a lot of ohms Resistance compared to a 5' 11" copper wire wich offers 0.001 Ohms Resistance. Aluminum conducts Electricity at 60% of copper, but if your sitting in your chair The Lightning bolt will most likely not effect you, I have never been in this situation, but i can assure you minimal damage is done.

Water does not conduct Electricity. No it does not. It Requires an additive to do so. Like Pools.. The H2O has Chlorine in it, the more the clorine, the faster Electricity flows throw it.. the less resistance it has..

IF you cut a wire and remove a 1 inch section of it, then put one finger on one end and another finger, (it doesn't matter what hand, you can use seperate ones if you like) you will get an electrical shock, because you leave the Electricity no other option but to flow through you. Howerever if you don't Remove that Wire, and touch the wires an inch apart, you WONT get a shock because it's easier to flow through copper, or aluminum then it is to go through your finger.

Face it Electricity is lazy, taking the easiest path possible.

Factor this in your on a train, going 50 MPH. Lightning usually strikes the highest point.. is a common misconception.. Lighning will strike Whatever gives of a better NEGATIVE magnetic FIELD. a tree, made of wood, does not give of a Strong negfative magnetic field, however a 25 foot MEtallic Aluminum rod sticking 20 feet in the ground gives of an Excellent negative magnetic field.

Remeebr another thing.. Electricity will do anyhting to get through the ground. it would rather not travel through a lighbulb, it would rather go directly to the ground.

Ever notice That when you attach a Black (live wire) and white (common wire(using the 120 volt AC system)) directly sparks fly for about ~1 to 5 secoindes (based on the maker of youre fuse box, i would recomend Square D before anyone else because it takes a fuse 0.5 secondes to blow) after the sparks fly it dies. yet take the same wires attach them to a light bulb holder and place a light bulb in the holder.. turn on the switch... what happens.. the lgiht goes on.. no sparks???!?!!?.. i'll explain that.. the light bulb Fillement inside (made of Carbon) offers the flowing Electricity .. 18.1 Ohms of Resistance.. compared to our direct contact wich offers 0 ohms of resistance.

Kettle runs on the smae principle except there is a thick NICR wire (Nichrome, Nickel chrome) wire inside.. that rather then conduct Electricity perfeclty like copper, it offers ALOT of resistance and as electricity goes through that wire it heats up..

so various wires are used for different things, carbon for light, Nichrome for heat and copper for almost perfect conductance.

Remeber 1983? the first metallic aplliances came out back then.. or the first ones with a triple Grounded Prong. that offers an even easier route for Elec. (Elec now stands for Electricity, because i said so) to pass through, Rememebr the white wire is a Standerdized ground that goes back up to the power lines then down a wire along the side of a telephone poll .. the ground wire (GREEN) is the funky center prong on an outlet.. that offers a Direct route to the ground.. so should one of the wires become lose in your appliance and touch any of the metallic parts.. rather then getting a NASTY shock, the electricity would be much happier travelling through the ground wire.. into..well .. THE GROUND!

how does it do so? check near your fuse box... look on your water pipes.. you may see a bare copper wire attached to one of your water pipes.. these are an excellent source of Grounding

is there a perfect Conductor?

Yes, Solid Gold. Gold wire offers far less Resistance then a copper wire EVER could. But unlike most of you, i cna't afford solid gold wiring yet. so cheap copper will have to do

Don't settle for Aluminum!!

that will, over time, loosen itself from whatever appliance you have attached it to. back in the days.. when they didn't have proper grounding.. it used to loosen itself and fall in the metallic box.. (these days they are grounded) the metaalic box (being attached to a beam) the Elec. would slowly find its way to the ground.. thus making the wood, and the metallic box extremely hot. over a period of 5 years or 10.. the wood would combust, and cathc the house on fire. when i say metallic boxes, i mean the boxes that outlets are attached too. the live wire would slowly over time loosen itself, even though it may have been properly screwed in at the outlet , it would loosen, fall, heat up the box.. 10 years later you got ashes for a house.

So proper grounding came in..

Rememebr the WOODEN rule .. if you expose wood to a 250 degree temperature for an extended period of time( lets say 5-10 years), if one day after that period of time, the temperature should rise to 260 degrees, the wood will cath fire, even though it's normal combustian temperature is 600 degrees or so.

those are some golden rules.. the actual chances of a train being struck by lightning is about
0.00000000000000000133

don't mind cabforward, he wore aluminum diapers as a child, which significantly lowered his Resistance to lightning and must have been struck based on his foolish statements.

those are low ods.. you do have a chance of winning the lottery 8.5 times before being struck by lightning in a train

Because rails already have a posotive charg flowing through them, they offer a significantly LOWER negative charge then any other object around the tracks, such as a house.. or a funky wind thing that are made of metal.. this possotive charge that triggers the block signaling systewm or the RR lgihts, actually in a twisted way prevents the tracks from being struck more often.

the top power line on a poll offers a charge of 7500-25000 Volts. it almsot never gets struck, because it already carries a possotive charge.

Lightning is not attracted to possotive charges.. it is attracted to the strongest negatinve charge it can get from the ground. like a metallic ROD that is grounded... a tree if it has a lot of sap because sap conducts electricity and so on, but you must get the point os ill shut up.

sorry for all the SPelling Errors.

[Modelcar]

....Kevin, enjoyed your lengthy description of Current paths...where and why.

[Modelcar]

....Kevin, enjoyed your lengthy description of Current paths...where and why.

[Mookie]

I have so much gold in my mouth - I guess I don't have to worry about lightning!

Mookie

[Mookie]

I have so much gold in my mouth - I guess I don't have to worry about lightning!

Mookie

[zardoz]

Just a little fyi:
Lightning does not always "look" for a negative discharge; some lightning IS negatively charged and "looks" for a positive outlet. Negatively charged lightning is not that common in cloud-to-ground discharges, although it is much more frequent in cloud-to-cloud lightning. There are many factors that determine how lightning forms.

And nevermind all those odds quoted above; lightning kills more people each year (on average) than ANY other weather-related event, including tornados, hurricanes, or floods.

[zardoz]

Just a little fyi:
Lightning does not always "look" for a negative discharge; some lightning IS negatively charged and "looks" for a positive outlet. Negatively charged lightning is not that common in cloud-to-ground discharges, although it is much more frequent in cloud-to-cloud lightning. There are many factors that determine how lightning forms.

And nevermind all those odds quoted above; lightning kills more people each year (on average) than ANY other weather-related event, including tornados, hurricanes, or floods.

[dharmon]

Aircraft get strcuk by lightning all the time. Planes themselves build up a healthly static charge while passing through the air, which is discharged through static wicks located at the ends of the control surfaces on the wings and tail. If you've ever seen little black tabs that look like long candle wicks, that's them. At night, in areas on high humidity you can even see them glow sometimes. In the cockpit, going through clouds you frequently experience st elmo's fire on the windshield, which is just static building up. When lightning strikes a plane, it SHOULD pass through and out the static wicks, along the path of least resistance, however, I have seen it blow wicks off in the process (happens all the time) and occasionally scorch the paint at point of impact and departure. Equipment that is poorly grounded can be damaged and happens from time to time. Radar antennas seem to be particularly prone to this. Also, if you've ever watched videos of helicopter rescues (particularly at sea) the rescue swimmer from the helicopter will allow the hoist cable to enter the water and ground before they touch it. Helicopters create intense, sometime fatal amounts of static because of the rotors. Not much point to surviving until the rescue guys get there only to be electrocuted by the rescuer.

[dharmon]

Aircraft get strcuk by lightning all the time. Planes themselves build up a healthly static charge while passing through the air, which is discharged through static wicks located at the ends of the control surfaces on the wings and tail. If you've ever seen little black tabs that look like long candle wicks, that's them. At night, in areas on high humidity you can even see them glow sometimes. In the cockpit, going through clouds you frequently experience st elmo's fire on the windshield, which is just static building up. When lightning strikes a plane, it SHOULD pass through and out the static wicks, along the path of least resistance, however, I have seen it blow wicks off in the process (happens all the time) and occasionally scorch the paint at point of impact and departure. Equipment that is poorly grounded can be damaged and happens from time to time. Radar antennas seem to be particularly prone to this. Also, if you've ever watched videos of helicopter rescues (particularly at sea) the rescue swimmer from the helicopter will allow the hoist cable to enter the water and ground before they touch it. Helicopters create intense, sometime fatal amounts of static because of the rotors. Not much point to surviving until the rescue guys get there only to be electrocuted by the rescuer.

[Mookie]

As usual, I am getting quite an education!

Jen

[Mookie]

As usual, I am getting quite an education!

Jen

[Anonymous]

Either way.. Lightning would msot likely not strike a Train Because:

Let's say the lighning is postivively charged:

A) the train tracks are positively charged, therfore the magnetic field it emits is Posotive and putting 2 posotives together is like putting to magnets together at points S and S .. what happens.. they repel each other.. so Lightning would NOT, as I previously stated) be attracted to Tracks

Let's say the lightning is Negatively charged:

The current travellign through a rail.. is.. i'm not quite sure of the EXACT I/E ( I = Current intensity, AKA amperage, E = Volts) however, opposite poles ARE attracted to each other, but the low voltage travalling through the tracks (I'm assuming it's a low voltage, if it isn't, then it's the LOW amperage) either one of those factors, the LOW E, or the LOW I, cause a very weak Magnetic field, and the lightning would much rather come into contact with A higher, more prodominant, metallic object, such as a powerline (If the lightning Charge is Negative)

Negative lighning charges are rare, You are surrently sitting, on the negative battery if the world was one giant battery, everyhting would be negative.. thats why power lines are in the air, or under ground insulated From the ground.. Negative lightning Rarely strikes ground because of

(-)(-) the TWO negative charges! rememebr same poles Repel each other.

Now, in as much electrical studies i have done, everyone knows that they have 3 wires comming from the power lines
the black one: 120 V
The red one: 120 V
The bare one: the Standerdized ground (AKA white wire)
note: lots of power companies don't color code them on the telephone poles black and red, they are mostly black and black.

Between the Black and the ground, or the red and the ground you get 120 Volts.
Between the black and the Red you get 240 Volts, for heating Devices, stoves.. blah blah.. all major appliances.

now, i already posted this paragraph, but if the black or red wire come into contact with the Ground, you get a "Ground out" and the fuse blows.
done that a LOT of times.

in all my years, ive never contacted the 2 live wires directly.. if anyone has, please share your expierience, i'd love to know what happens.

Heres a quick fact.. let's say you have an oven that runs on 30 Amps, 240 Volts... if you were to take the same oven and run it on.. 120 volts, it would need 60 amps to operate.. it's simple. half the voltage, twice the amperage (AC ccurrent)

[Anonymous]

Either way.. Lightning would msot likely not strike a Train Because:

Let's say the lighning is postivively charged:

A) the train tracks are positively charged, therfore the magnetic field it emits is Posotive and putting 2 posotives together is like putting to magnets together at points S and S .. what happens.. they repel each other.. so Lightning would NOT, as I previously stated) be attracted to Tracks

Let's say the lightning is Negatively charged:

The current travellign through a rail.. is.. i'm not quite sure of the EXACT I/E ( I = Current intensity, AKA amperage, E = Volts) however, opposite poles ARE attracted to each other, but the low voltage travalling through the tracks (I'm assuming it's a low voltage, if it isn't, then it's the LOW amperage) either one of those factors, the LOW E, or the LOW I, cause a very weak Magnetic field, and the lightning would much rather come into contact with A higher, more prodominant, metallic object, such as a powerline (If the lightning Charge is Negative)

Negative lighning charges are rare, You are surrently sitting, on the negative battery if the world was one giant battery, everyhting would be negative.. thats why power lines are in the air, or under ground insulated From the ground.. Negative lightning Rarely strikes ground because of

(-)(-) the TWO negative charges! rememebr same poles Repel each other.

Now, in as much electrical studies i have done, everyone knows that they have 3 wires comming from the power lines
the black one: 120 V
The red one: 120 V
The bare one: the Standerdized ground (AKA white wire)
note: lots of power companies don't color code them on the telephone poles black and red, they are mostly black and black.

Between the Black and the ground, or the red and the ground you get 120 Volts.
Between the black and the Red you get 240 Volts, for heating Devices, stoves.. blah blah.. all major appliances.

now, i already posted this paragraph, but if the black or red wire come into contact with the Ground, you get a "Ground out" and the fuse blows.
done that a LOT of times.

in all my years, ive never contacted the 2 live wires directly.. if anyone has, please share your expierience, i'd love to know what happens.

Heres a quick fact.. let's say you have an oven that runs on 30 Amps, 240 Volts... if you were to take the same oven and run it on.. 120 volts, it would need 60 amps to operate.. it's simple. half the voltage, twice the amperage (AC ccurrent)

[Anonymous]

It's not about "magnetic" charges - it's "static" electricity - electrical potential - voltage differences - between the cloud and ground.

The voltage necessary to generate that huge (3 times hotter than the sun) arc discharge between cloud and ground is hundreds of thousands (or even millions) of volts.

Power lines are indeed struck with some frequency - they are often higher than the surrounding conductors, and regardless of what charge the power company puts on them (which is by the way AC not DC so it's neither always positive nor always negative) they are close to ground compared to the charge the cloud is unleashing. They have spark-gap lightning arresters which arc over and take the brunt of the strike to ground (so most of it does not end up coming into everyone's house).

Tracks might as well be ground. Whatever signal-activating voltage is there is low (24 volts or less is my guess - kids don't get electrocuted shorting tracks together with a length of wire to see the crossing signals go on) and is not relevant to the attractiveness of them as a ground-like target. They have 6" metal spikes driven into the dirty and wet (it's raining, remember) ties sitting on dirty and wet ballast sitting on ground. It may not exactly be zero ohms from the point of contact on the rail to earth, but the rails conduct and those spikes and ties up and down several hundred yards of the line make a pretty good ground. The lightning struck through a few thousand feet of air so that last few inches of ties and ballast looks pretty good as a conductor by comparison. Put a metal, 16-foot-high, steel-wheeled train on those rails and in open areas it's a juicy target.

The anecdotes 2 or 3 others have posted here about lightning-struck engines in their shops within the last few months would seem to indicate it happens a bit more frequently than lottery winning. From NASA... "Typically, more than 2,000 thunderstorms are active throughout the world at a given moment, producing on the order of 100 flashes per second."

Clouds are usually negative and the ground under them becomes positive in response so the strokes are "down" but a non-trivial minority of strokes are between positive cloud tops and correspondingly negative ground below.

Two good references follow. The first is long but thorough - the 2nd of its 4 pages is particularly descriptive. The second reference is shorter if you don't have patience for the first.

---

http://thunder.msfc.nasa.gov/primer/

http://www.lightningsafety.noaa.gov/science.htm

---

- Chuck Somerville

[Anonymous]

It's not about "magnetic" charges - it's "static" electricity - electrical potential - voltage differences - between the cloud and ground.

The voltage necessary to generate that huge (3 times hotter than the sun) arc discharge between cloud and ground is hundreds of thousands (or even millions) of volts.

Power lines are indeed struck with some frequency - they are often higher than the surrounding conductors, and regardless of what charge the power company puts on them (which is by the way AC not DC so it's neither always positive nor always negative) they are close to ground compared to the charge the cloud is unleashing. They have spark-gap lightning arresters which arc over and take the brunt of the strike to ground (so most of it does not end up coming into everyone's house).

Tracks might as well be ground. Whatever signal-activating voltage is there is low (24 volts or less is my guess - kids don't get electrocuted shorting tracks together with a length of wire to see the crossing signals go on) and is not relevant to the attractiveness of them as a ground-like target. They have 6" metal spikes driven into the dirty and wet (it's raining, remember) ties sitting on dirty and wet ballast sitting on ground. It may not exactly be zero ohms from the point of contact on the rail to earth, but the rails conduct and those spikes and ties up and down several hundred yards of the line make a pretty good ground. The lightning struck through a few thousand feet of air so that last few inches of ties and ballast looks pretty good as a conductor by comparison. Put a metal, 16-foot-high, steel-wheeled train on those rails and in open areas it's a juicy target.

The anecdotes 2 or 3 others have posted here about lightning-struck engines in their shops within the last few months would seem to indicate it happens a bit more frequently than lottery winning. From NASA... "Typically, more than 2,000 thunderstorms are active throughout the world at a given moment, producing on the order of 100 flashes per second."

Clouds are usually negative and the ground under them becomes positive in response so the strokes are "down" but a non-trivial minority of strokes are between positive cloud tops and correspondingly negative ground below.

Two good references follow. The first is long but thorough - the 2nd of its 4 pages is particularly descriptive. The second reference is shorter if you don't have patience for the first.

---

http://thunder.msfc.nasa.gov/primer/

http://www.lightningsafety.noaa.gov/science.htm

---

- Chuck Somerville

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by csomervi

It's not about "magnetic" charges - it's "static" electricity - electrical potential - voltage differences - between the cloud and ground.

The voltage necessary to generate that huge (3 times hotter than the sun) arc discharge between cloud and ground is hundreds of thousands (or even millions) of volts.

Three times hotter then the sun? Never heard that before evn on the discovery channel!

QUOTE:

Power lines are indeed struck with some frequency - they are often higher than the surrounding conductors, and regardless of what charge the power company puts on them (which is by the way AC not DC so it's neither always positive nor always negative)

top line emeits a magnetic field, and whats this Bull about a static electricity, which plays no role, FOR THE RECORD, power lines are the least likely to get struck by lightning

QUOTE:

Tracks might as well be ground. Whatever signal-activating voltage is there is low (24 volts or less is my guess - kids don't get electrocuted shorting tracks together with a length of wire to see the crossing signals go on)

Wow, that is Stupid, see Trains have Axels, and the wheel one one track is connected to the wheel on the other track, if those were opposite charges, we'ed be crap out of luck and be shorting everyhting out every time a train goes over the tracks.. Wow, obviously not troubled with the smarts are we?

QUOTE:

The anecdotes 2 or 3 others have posted here about lightning-struck engines in their shops within the last few months would seem to indicate it happens a bit more frequently than lottery winning. From NASA... "Typically, more than 2,000 thunderstorms are active throughout the world at a given moment, producing on the order of 100 flashes per second."

[red] you know, i may not like Cabforward a heck of alot, but what Him and I do know is that the chances of a train being struck by lightning are slim to none, okay jack sprat?

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by csomervi

It's not about "magnetic" charges - it's "static" electricity - electrical potential - voltage differences - between the cloud and ground.

The voltage necessary to generate that huge (3 times hotter than the sun) arc discharge between cloud and ground is hundreds of thousands (or even millions) of volts.

Three times hotter then the sun? Never heard that before evn on the discovery channel!

QUOTE:

Power lines are indeed struck with some frequency - they are often higher than the surrounding conductors, and regardless of what charge the power company puts on them (which is by the way AC not DC so it's neither always positive nor always negative)

top line emeits a magnetic field, and whats this Bull about a static electricity, which plays no role, FOR THE RECORD, power lines are the least likely to get struck by lightning

QUOTE:

Tracks might as well be ground. Whatever signal-activating voltage is there is low (24 volts or less is my guess - kids don't get electrocuted shorting tracks together with a length of wire to see the crossing signals go on)

Wow, that is Stupid, see Trains have Axels, and the wheel one one track is connected to the wheel on the other track, if those were opposite charges, we'ed be crap out of luck and be shorting everyhting out every time a train goes over the tracks.. Wow, obviously not troubled with the smarts are we?

QUOTE:

The anecdotes 2 or 3 others have posted here about lightning-struck engines in their shops within the last few months would seem to indicate it happens a bit more frequently than lottery winning. From NASA... "Typically, more than 2,000 thunderstorms are active throughout the world at a given moment, producing on the order of 100 flashes per second."

[red] you know, i may not like Cabforward a heck of alot, but what Him and I do know is that the chances of a train being struck by lightning are slim to none, okay jack sprat?

[zardoz]

Kevin-
FYI
Regarding the temperature of lightning, the statement about lightning being three times hotter than the sun is a conservative number. The surface of the sun averages about 10,000 degrees Farenheit, whereas the temperature of lightning can reach 50,000 degrees Farenheit, FIVE times hotter than the surface of the sun.


And your derogatory comments directed towards the other posts that you quoted are quite unnecessary and are not welcome. [V]

Come on Kevin, you've done some quality posts and comments before, why resort to name calling?

[zardoz]

Kevin-
FYI
Regarding the temperature of lightning, the statement about lightning being three times hotter than the sun is a conservative number. The surface of the sun averages about 10,000 degrees Farenheit, whereas the temperature of lightning can reach 50,000 degrees Farenheit, FIVE times hotter than the surface of the sun.


And your derogatory comments directed towards the other posts that you quoted are quite unnecessary and are not welcome. [V]

Come on Kevin, you've done some quality posts and comments before, why resort to name calling?

[dekemd]

QUOTE: Originally posted by kevinstheRRman
[ top line emeits a magnetic field, and whats this Bull about a static electricity, which plays no role, FOR THE RECORD, power lines are the least likely to get struck by lightning

Lightning is static electricity. It's like walking across carpet then getting zapped by the door knob, just on a much, much larger scale.

Derrick

[dekemd]

QUOTE: Originally posted by kevinstheRRman
[ top line emeits a magnetic field, and whats this Bull about a static electricity, which plays no role, FOR THE RECORD, power lines are the least likely to get struck by lightning

Lightning is static electricity. It's like walking across carpet then getting zapped by the door knob, just on a much, much larger scale.

Derrick