D9-40 CW

[Anonymous]

I see these loco's on NS-EMD or GE? Compare/Contrast to the competition's equivalent.

[wabash1]

The d9-40cw or dash 9 as we call them is a engine produced by ge and is not the best road unit to have. they load slow, when pulling a hill they wont load any amps to maintain track speed. only enough to keep it rolling until you get down to 15mph or less tthen they start pulling and will pull hard. the traction on these units ( the newer ones at least) are better the first units we have from the dash 8 and 9s as soon as it had the slightest wheel slip would drop its load. I have been noticing the newer engines 9500 series on wont do this as much. In road use the dash 9 is not a very good engine as it wont try to maintain track speed. On the other hand the sd70 will not only maintain speed it will pull hard at any time you call on it. the sd 70 will for most part maintain track speed or wont drop as much speed when pulling a hill. the dash 9 is not as loud as the 70. Ge engines make transition smoother than the emd units do. in the ride they are very close but haft to give it to the emd sd70. the bottom line in my opinoin is both are good engines the reliablity of the dash 9 is not good. both will get the job done. but the sd 70 will get you there quicker. i prefer the sd 70 as it allowes me to control the slack action in the train easier than a dash 9. the dash 9 has the best dynamic brake i have ever seen. Now if someone would build a engine that has the power of a sd70 and throttle respones match that with the dynamic of a dash 9 that would be the best engine around.

[Anonymous]

Practically every NS train I see here in Atlanta is lead by these units. Did NS buy a lot of these, or are they just concentrated here in the Southeast?

[wabash1]

Back in the power crunch when the ns took their share of the conrail they needed power so they bought a bunch of these engines . at the time they could buy 2 dash 9 for the price of 1 sd 70. the dash 9 is concetrated all over the system but the ge engines still dont out number the emd units we still have more emd units than ge.

[Anonymous]

Just an observation, it appears that the EMD product was built with the idea that it is going to be around for a long while and the GE product was built with the idea that soon this model of locomotive was going to go obsolete. EMD therefore put much more into their design and build quality where as GE took the stance that it would be foolhardy to build a product that won't be around that long. Like I said, just an observation.

[edblysard]

Yes, and EMD has been designing locomotives longer, when they get a good idea, they stick with it. EMD also seems to have designed the cabs with people in mind, the controls are where the engineer can use them comfortably, the seat adjust all ways, the overhead lights are where they need to be, so forth, even down to the steps, EMDs are so much easier to get on and off, GEs feel like you climbing a ladder, not steps. I am a conductoer/switchman/engine foreman, not a engineer, but most of the hoggers where I work perfer EMDs, they like the pulling power and the fact that they load up quick.
GE entered to locomotive market when railroads were power hungry, and realized thay could offer a "cheaper" alternative than EMD. Note GE used to make the traction motors and generators/alternators and cab wiring for EMD under contract, they also made them for Alco and Baldwin. Yes, GEs ride great, but a great ride wont get you butt over the hill...
GE hit paydirt when EMD when through a internal restructuring problem in the late 70s and early 80s, they offered trade-ins on EMD, or just about anything that looked like a locomotive.
Trade in your 20 year old sd40, with a few million miles on it, and for half the price of a SD70, you can have a new Dash 9?
You bet they sold a lot of locomotives!
Ed

[Anonymous]

Thanks Ed. I have noticed the steep angle of the GE steps and I for one wouldn't like to do a days worth of on and off work. I get a kick about the EMD cabs. I understand that the early SD60M with 3 windows and the GP60M don't hold quite true to the "designed for the engineer" theory. And hey, GE must of took a 'what ever it takes' approach to selling. GE is a massive company and I'm sure they had their share of incentives, just like EMD and GM did. Another thing I get a kick out of is some of the troops who state they are engineers don't know the difference between the two but always bad mouth the GE. Makes me wonder. How can they tell? I'm not in the business and I can tell them apart and quite easily. Like I said, it makes me wonder.

[edblysard]

Ride eight to twelve hours in one. Watch your engineer rub the small of his back, or strain his neck trying to look out the back door windows, underneath the radiator wings, looking for signals, or put band aids on your shins after the "steps" on the dash nine bit you again.
Try to get in the toilet with out triping. Sit in one for a few hours waiting for the shop crew to come and tell you why, every time the engineer notches out the throttle, the diesel reves, but nothing else happens, or my favorite, every brake application results in an emergency application, and be the poor slob who now has to walk the train, both side, making sure all the wheels are on the rail, and none slid flat. Or be in cab when that happens, gets old real quick.
Try to sit in the rear seat for the brakeman, you cant if someone over 5' is sitting in the front seat, the guy in back has to sit sideways in a seat that dosnt adjust, except to move forwards or back. I dont need to have a license to run one to tell the diffrence, all I have to do is look at my engineer, who cant straighten up after a shift in one. Ge did take the whatever it takes approach, it served them well, the sell a lot of motors. But if I have a choice on what motors we use, I will pick a old, beat up pair of SD40-2 over a new set of Dash 9s anyday. You just about cant kill an SD40, I know, we try all the time.
Stay frosty,
Ed

[Anonymous]

Hello group almost all of the engineers I have been over the road with would rather have an all EMD lash up just for the pulling power. Them herky jerky dash 8`s & 9`s do not like to load worth a hoot as someone said earler just a little bit of wheel slip and they start to unload where as the old worn out sd 40-2 just keeps on loading. I was on pusher service in Iowa when we had to go push a 100 car grain train over the hill they had 3 dash 9`s on the point and only got about half way up the hill 2 odl sd 40-2`s shoved them over the hill. There horse power per ton was 1.4 they still died them old EMD`s just dug in and started the shove. Rodney

[Anonymous]

Ed, what a hoot! I wonder what the Russian's have? Maybe the idea was to tortue everyone to death to get out of paying retirement.

It aisn't frosty here,
Dan

[wabash1]

Ed the sd 40s are great engines but they are loud. be on one of them for 8-12 hours and see how good your hearing is.

[edblysard]

Dan, look in Trains magazine, in the photo section I think, they had a photo a yera or two ago of the six locomotives the Russians traded to Cargil for grain. They are stores on the Brown lead at jacintoport, in a siding. We serve the industry that leases the siding. Climbed up inside. Controls look like something copied from a old geep, pedestal seats for four, peaked in the engine compartment, looked like they had a old dodge flathead in there. C C trucks, one brake cylinder per side per truck. Word is they can get them up to FRA standards, so they cant even move them to the grain elevator they were suppost to serve. Things are built like, well, a locomotive. Almost everything is cast steel, and oversized, it all looks like pre 1950 designing.
Forgot to add to the gripe list on GE's, bring your dramimine, the things rock back and forth sideways so much you get seasick.
Lucky you, no frost.
Ed

[edblysard]

Speak up,. I just got off work....
Ed

[Anonymous]

Thanks.