April Fool?

[johncolley]

Hey, guy's, I know it's the april issue, so I'll bite...how many units does it take to pull the grade on a 7,000 mile high mountain?

[CSXrules4eva]

um let me see . ...... . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .I'm all out of ideas on this one :( but, if any locomotive were to be on this grade pulling a train it would make some serious headlines!!!!! LOL

[Modelcar]

....Well, you only have to look on the original Sante Fe heading into Flagstaff, Az. as that city is at the 7000' elevation. Mainline goes right through there.....and they sure do it wih class moving freight up that elevation. In reference: Kingman, 165 miles to the west is about 3400 ' so that is the elevation they must gain in that distance.

[CSXrules4eva]

I guess that train made headlines Modelcar. lol

[dharmon]

It's all about tractive effort....

[Modelcar]

...Go just a bit farther back down {west}, to Topock, Az. and I believe it's about 450' elevation and it's about 45 miles or so from Kingman so from Topock to Flagstaff we're talking about a notable size increase in elevation.....making it up to 7000'....!

[jeaton]

Would drop-outs from the astronaut program be qualified for train service on that division?

[Modelcar]

....They probably could squeeze them in...

[locomutt]

QUOTE: Originally posted by johncolley

Hey, guy's, I know it's the april issue, so I'll bite...how many units does it take to pull the grade on a 7,000 mile high mountain?

Is that like "Space Mountain"?

[Modelcar]

....Hey guys, I know we're kicking around the "April Fools" thing but seriously, this main line route...{double track}, is a reality....I have always wondered about them taking the main line up that high through there but this is a looooong grade so they have milage to attain that elevation....Kingman, Az. as I mentioned previously is about 165 miles west and I'm familiar somewhat with that area and the track climbs up out of the bottom desert at that location and uses about a 2.2% grade to get up through Kingman and I suspect the route gets by on it's way to Flagstaff by no steeper grades than that although I don't know the exact figures out through that area. I simply know Flagstaff is at 7000' and the track passes through there on it's way east...

[spbed]

Yes I saw BNSF at Kingman & Flagstaff when I visited the G. Canyon 2 years ago. You are so high up that the thin air makes it difficult to sleep. But when you look at it it is almost a straight shot from LAX to the Kingman/Flagstaff area. Coming back from the G.Canyon we found a BNSF train going WB in the Mojave desert.. Tried catching it but could not & I was doing 80MPH. I only passed it when it reached a caution signal & had to slow. I saw it again at Dagget going like the wind towards Barstow.

[Modelcar]

...That is interesting country to rail fan. I worked on a project in that area for a while many years ago and had time to do some railfanning. Just east of Kingman one can see out over the desert and down through a long dip for 20 some miles...and at night observing the block signals out across the distance is interesting....And more so to watch a train progress east and turn the signals red as it moves and then back to green as it passes is unique and a real treat...!

[spbed]

Actually what you saw interests me greatly watching the signals turn. You can see that at Colton on the west track past the underpass of the freeway their is a signal & all I had to watch was that signal & know when it lit a train would be by shortly. You can also get a good view of the UPRR signals by looking west from the diamond so you know when they are allowing the UPRR to cross the BNSF tracks. Actually all my rail fanning trips have being from Chicago westward but I live only 8 miles from the Atlantic ocean. End May Yellowstone is on the agenda thru Salt Lake City so I will get to see the UPRR in action from SLC to Ogden & north to Pocatello. When we exit the park will go south to Granger then thru Weber & Echo canyons. Hopeful of renting a boat to get pix of the UPRR crossing the great Salt Lake also. [:)]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Modelcar

...That is interesting country to rail fan. I worked on a project in that area for a while many years ago and had time to do some railfanning. Just east of Kingman one can see out over the desert and down through a long dip for 20 some miles...and at night observing the block signals out across the distance is interesting....And more so to watch a train progress east and turn the signals red as it moves and then back to green as it passes is unique and a real treat...!

[locomutt]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Modelcar

....Hey guys, I know we're kicking around the "April Fools" thing but seriously, this main line route...{double track}, is a reality....I have always wondered about them taking the main line up that high through there but this is a looooong grade so they have milage to attain that elevation....Kingman, Az. as I mentioned previously is about 165 miles west and I'm familiar somewhat with that area and the track climbs up out of the bottom desert at that location and uses about a 2.2% grade to get up through Kingman and I suspect the route gets by on it's way to Flagstaff by no steeper grades than that although I don't know the exact figures out through that area. I simply know Flagstaff is at 7000' and the track passes through there on it's way east...

Check the original post. It says 7,000 'miles',not feet.

I'm sure that route is very important to that area,and does have
quite a few grades.

[Modelcar]

....Yea, Locomutt I did overlook the miles vers. feet, but suppose I just put some reality to the subject.....What I've been talking about is real stuff, it is an interesting piece of railroading and pretty high quality main line stuff too. Former main line of the east / west Sante Fe....now BNSF.
As a side bar to this subject: I once witnessed a train passing up through Kingman headed east that had the power of 12 ENGINES on it...!! Some of them were located mid train.

[CANADIANPACIFIC2816]

At an altitude of 7000 miles there would not be any oxygen for combustion of fuel...........so you can forget about that one!!

[CopCarSS]

QUOTE: Originally posted by johncolley

Hey, guy's, I know it's the april issue, so I'll bite...how many units does it take to pull the grade on a 7,000 mile high mountain?

Hmmmm...and I thought the air was a little thin when I climbed Mt. Elbert (14,440 FEET above MSL). 7,000 miles? I hope the train crew brings their oxygen tanks...for them and their engines! [;)]

Chris
Denver, CO

[Puckdropper]

Except for the need of extra oxygen, I'd imagine going up 7000 miles is like going up 7000 feet: It depends on the train itself... As any modeler who's built a helix knows, if you have a coupler failure and the brakes don't set, think airplane...

[spbed]

Do you mean 7,000' not 7,000 miles? If it is 7.000' ft you could use as a guidleine that I have seen 3 engines pull d/ stacks or a/rack trains up Cajon pass whuch is about 4,500' peak. I would suspect that trailing weight would be a key factor to how much HP is required to get it over the summit. To give you a example I saw helpers being added to a UPRR train at Victorville because I guess that the trailing weight was to much for just the 3 head end locos to handle. 2 pushers were added & now even with 5 locos it was really struggling trying to ascend Hesperia hill on its way to the Cajon summit.

Originally posted by johncolley
[

Living nearby to MP 186 of the UPRR  Austin TX Sub

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