What happened to the E-unit used in this movie

[AntonioFP45]

recently I saw the cool, late 60s classic movie: IN THE HEAT OF THE NIGHT; with Sidney Poitier and Rod Steiger. Rod and Sidney deliver outstanding performances. For those not aware, Ray Charles sings the theme song in the background.

Regarding the train:
In paying attention to the details, the beautiful looking GM&O locomotive hauling the short passenger train is an E7!! Very clean.[8D]

I had read before that other than the Pennsy E7a in the Strasburg Museum, all other E7s in the U.S were scrapped. Since this movie was made around 1968 or 69, I find it incredible that this unit could have been scrapped. Of course, if this was one of the locomotives that went to Amtrak in 1971, then anything was possible as many of the well meaning bueracrats and bean counters didn't have a clue, sad to say.[V]

Does anyone here know the history of this GM&O E7? I know that there are some ICG, IC and GM&O fans on this forum.[:D][;)]

Thanks!

[Anonymous]

As late as 1982, i tried to persuade "one of the most respected railroad museums in the country" to grab one of the ROCK ISLAND E7s, then stored at Silvis Illinois. The response was something like: "We don't see a need to save an example of EACH AND EVERY model produced" or something like that.
Sometime later, that same museum approached the powers that be in Silvis, but the E7s were, by that time, long gone.
If you were referring to a GM&O engine as that in the movie, several GM&O units did make it into Amtrak service in the 1970s, but none were purchased by Amtrak.
All E-7s except the PRR 4201 are scrapped, and the "saving" of 4201 was a miracle in itself.
Two other E-7s (one B&M, one other PRR unit) were preserved briefly but later went to the scrap torch.
Diesel preservation really didn't reach any respectable maturity until the 1980s and by that time it was too late for many units we lost. Yesterday's generation was still busy throwing temper tantrums over the loss of their precious steam locos and when us Baby Boomers tried to speak up on behalf of endangered 1st generation diesels, we were told "Children should be seen and not heard", and that steamers had character and soul, but diesels were as bland and lifeless as dead fish.
That's why so many models of diesels are extinct today.

[AntonioFP45]

Thanks, Penn Central.

I was around back in the 70s and do remember that the general idea of preserving 1st generations diesels was more or less scoffed at as the emphasis was on steamers. I still remember the outcry when the last Alco PAs in existence were sold by Santa Fe to a Mexican railroad. It's a miracle that at least one has survived and is supposedly being restored.

One very good thing to see was that at least Santa Fe officials had the foresight to save some of their F-units as well as donating some of the FP45s instead of trading them in for scrap. I believe Rio Grande "stored" a couple of their California Zephyr F units as well. I hope they're still around as UP would be the owner now.

Thanks!

[Anonymous]

The CZ F units were saved, cosmetically restored, and are on display in a museum.

[CBQ_Guy]

Don't forget the NZ's E5 unit preserved at IRM:

http://tinyurl.com/48so9

[espeefoamer]

The Rio Grande F9s, One A, and one B, are in the Colorado Railroad Museum in Golden,CO[:)].

[M636C]

As I recall, Amtrak decided in 1971 that they would only operate E9s and E8s, and that the older units were too much trouble (which of course was true), just as they decided to keep only stainless steel passenger cars.

So without long haul passenger traffic, the E7s were immediately out of a job.

Rock Island were still running them in 1977, and I think there were a few Conrail units around, still in Penn Central black but not in use.

Peter

[AntonioFP45]

Hey Peter,

I'm actually surprised! Makes me feel good to know that there were E7s still operating in 1977 when I was a teen. Again, so saddening that the attitude to preserve them wasn't a high priority as I'm sure E7s were considered as "a dime a dozen" old, worn out passenger diesels that were maintenance intensive.

It's just as today that few seem to be paying attention that the SD40-2s ranks, while still significant in number, are starting to thin quickly as the new AC and ACE units hit the rails. Yet the SD40-2 has been the most popular 6 axle freight diesel EMD has ever released. Hopefully when they're mostly retired within the next 5 years, some will be preserved.

[M636C]

The real problem with the E-7 was that it still had the old belt driven cooling fans, since it was no more than an E-3 with some engineering improvements (mostly in the engines themselves) and a new cab shape. The E-8 was almost a clean sheet design with AC motor driven fans and an entirely new layout with the engines facing eachother with the generators together in the centre of the unit. The trucks and the cab were the same, but the rest was really a new design. The older E units "rebuilt" to E-8 or E-9 were new units, sometimes with the old generators , motors and trucks. Southern Pacific, on the other hand, rebuilt a former "City of San Francisco" E-2 as an E-7, because everything was still in the same place from 1937 up until the end of E-7 production. The radiator intakes did change from the Winton engine units to the early 567 units, however, but the frame and floor layout were the same.This SP rebuild happened while EMD were "rebuilding" ATSF EA units into E-8s, and for a while I wondered why SP hadn't done the same. Without a new frame, you couldn't!

Peter

[Anonymous]

As I recall a story about the filming of "In the Heat," the train sequence was filmed south of St Louis in southern Illinois. They used extra equipment out of St Louis.

Mitch

[AntonioFP45]

Peter,

Thanks. I can see why now a railroad would not have wanted to invest into overhauling an E7. To me, though, it was amazing that during their "prime years" these babies hauled passenger trains consistently at high speeds. From your info, the E8s were a big improvement.

Art, thanks. I was wondering if that train was a regularly scheduled train since when Hollywood directors film passenger train sequences at stations, it could actually take a few hours. So it made sense to use or "rent" a train. Still a trajedy that the beautiful E unit wasn't saved.
10-4!

[cnw1995]

Speaking of passenger engines, It was interesting here in Chicago to see a few F40Cs pulled out of storage last week to replace about six MP36s that went down with relay problems allegedly due to the blowing snow.

[AntonioFP45]

QUOTE: Originally posted by cnw1995

Speaking of passenger engines, It was interesting here in Chicago to see a few F40Cs pulled out of storage last week to replace about six MP36s that went down with relay problems allegedly due to the blowing snow.

Now That's Poetic Justice!![:D][swg][tup]

[espeefoamer]

While BNSF preserved a few FP45s,no F45s were preserved.At least one is still in service,on Montana Rail Link.I don't know how many more are still around.I hope someone steps in and saves one.

[eolafan]

QUOTE: Originally posted by espeefoamer

While BNSF preserved a few FP45s,no F45s were preserved.At least one is still in service,on Montana Rail Link.I don't know how many more are still around.I hope someone steps in and saves one.

I believe I remember hearing that Ed Burkhartdt who owned WCRR and now owns a regional out east has some of the old WCRR F45 units there. Correct?

[railman]

It is amazing to think that out of the thousands produced, how few survive. Hopefully the SD40-2 doesn't fall into the same fate.

[AntonioFP45]

There was a Wisconsin Central FP45 that went to Larry's Truck & Electric. Unfortunately it was scrapped. I've also seen a few pictures of BN F45s being cut up for scrap.

Interesting thing is that some of the BN F45 cabs winded up on other locomotives. On the Tri-Rail commuter line ( Miami to West Palm Beach), at least one of the F40PH locomotives has an F45 cab on it. Easily recognizable.

If I'm not mistaken, a couple of MARC Commuter Geeps also have BN F45 cabs on them too, though I think these units are slated for retirement if they haven't been retired already.

So in a sense "A Piece" of the F45s have lived on longer.

[BaltACD]

The B&O Meuseum has the original carbody and trucks from the B&O's original EA No. 51.....the internals were traded into EMD for an E8M (carbody of an E8 and the horsepower of and E7)

[tatans]

Who's Ray Charles????

[Anonymous]

Where is the UP Centennial?

[AntonioFP45]

QUOTE: Originally posted by tatans

Who's Ray Charles????

Famous and popular American singer who died just last year. Refused to let blindness hold him back from achieving success. Played a wide variety of music styles that appealed to people of various races and cultures. Of course most of us know the song that he's become synonymous with: GEORGIA.

He even played some Spanish styled m The movie: "Ray" has been playing for a while. Worth seeing, regardless of your musical preferences.