HOW CAN THE GOVERNMENT DO THIS TO AMTRAK EMPLOYEES

[jockellis]

Nathan, I had a feeling when you stated that AMTRAK wouldn't be "taken seriously until we are paying $4-5 for gas" indicated that you wre a youngster and I was correct. That same statement was made back in the '70s when gas was less than 50¢ a gallon and "experts" were saying gas needed to get to $2 a gallon before people would start to seek other means of travel than the auto. Well, now they are saying $5 and when it gets to that, it will be $10. People are going to have to be given a new form of travel which is actually old (rail) and a means of changing their lives by designing everything around a station so tha they can get breakfast, take their clothes to the cleaners and get anything else they want before boarding the train. Otherwise, p[eople are going to continue to drive cars, one person per car, even when fuel gets to $10 a gallon. I just hope AMTRAK is around when this new paradigm is begun. Why is my screen so wide that I have to move from one side to the other?
Jock Ellis

[jwinter]

Is Amtrak any different than any other rail transportation system in any other country? Don't they all get funding from their governements? Seems that's the hurdle to get over. These countries have come to the conclusion that is they want an effective passenger rail system, they have to pay for it. Oour government hasn't figured that ot yet. They are still dumping money into planes and highways. Time to think outside the box.

Of course we can't completely compare Amtrak with other systems since the good old USA is a much bigger country than Japan, Germany, France and others. So we have to deal with or decide what we are going to do with long haul passenger service, but I believe some sort of long distance rail service needs to be maintained. But extablishing these regional passenger services like around Chicago, the Pacific NW, LA, etc. I believe is a must.

[Anonymous]

Johnsouza:
Relax, If you like your present position (LSA in the Corridor), you are going to be doing it for a long time.
If your crew base was elswhere in the USA and you were working on the Southwest Chief or the Empire Builder, you might possibly be looking at future employment as a Matre D' at a Mexican restaurant or as the assistant manager of a Radio Shack. You are in the Corridor which is relatively safe. There is a RAPID turnover in your department so your seniority will accumulate quickly, and also as I see, although senior employees from around the country CAN come and bump you if and when their trains are abolished, most wont. Years ago, the so called "boomers" hit the trail when work dried up. These days, people are more likely to hold on to their homes, keep their kids in school and stay put, even if it means leaving the railroad.
b.t.w., rwhen the Acela First Class is on the front of the train, don't be a stranger on the head end. Coffee keeps us Engineers awake, but we don't like to be a pain in the butt & keep asking.
Happy New Year

[Modelcar]

"not getting anything in return".....I believe we all could agree Amtrak in this country is not a money making venture and never will be. Don't we all know by now it's a service...a transprotation service {one of them}, for this nation....By triming costs and improving service....I'd say Amtrak is, and has been operating on down to the bone budgets for some time now...Service is not going to get better with the broken down facialities they operate with...
We either support a viable rail service in this country or stop it completely...This half way operation has been in place too long now...It's completely ridicules to banner back and forth each fiscal year of "subsidity for Amtrak".....turning our heads to all the other transportation subsidies like they don't exist....Lets come to a decision point and settle it once and for all.

[jabrown1971]

The government wants Amtrak to turn a profit. It doesn't see a dime on it's investment.......if you were running a business and just feeding it money and not getting anything in return, what would you do? I support Amtrak and hope it is always around. Every year the government finds money to run this railroad, and they still need more. Maybe Amtrak should take a long hard look at where they can trim costs, but not eliminate service and make rail travel appealing to all. I would love to ride the train more, but most of my travels are too time sensitive to try and get there are on the train. I live in Indianapolis-a city that has one train a day to Chicago and three times a week to the east coast. Amtrak is not an option unless I want to go to Chicago first! Better service on RELIABLE schedules and competive routes is the way to go for the whole country, not just the NEC or Pacific Northwest. Reform is the way to go, maybe SOME privitization is in order. States already shoulder costs for some trains. It's not rocket science, but if Amtrak were a business and not a full government ward, maybe everyone would better see a GREEN signal ahead.

[jeaton]

As I have said before, Amtrak runs the average taxpayer maybe twenty bucks a year or so. For those of you who think that this is a big confiscation of your personal wealth, send me an e-mail. We can work something out. Of course, I am interested in having someone pick up my share of the cost of establishing democracy every where in the world.

Jay

[conrailman]

To: Futuremodal
The Airplane people get 7 to 10 Billion every year from congress. They got over 300 billion over 30 years and Highways gets 35 Billion a year from Congress to Amtrak 37 Billion over 30 Years. So Futuremodal what do you say about that the airlines and highways get alot more money than Amtrak?[?]

[jeaton]

If you think it is tough now, wait intil the FY 2006 budget hits the street. Hang in there Dan, convential wisdom has it that the military will be pretty much left alone. Well at least procurement. After all, there is a whole bunch of high tech stuff in the pipeline so that we can very swiftly into a trouble area, win a war and establish democracy in 45 to 90 days. That is not counting the 9 bill to deploy a missle defence system.

While I have suggested to johnsousa not to panic now, the hit on domestic programs may go beyond Amtrak and actually start to cut, heaven forbid, highway funding. Who knows, next thing the congressional operating budget might get cut. Then we have a real employment problem. How do you retrain a congressional staffer.

Oh well, we got our tax cuts.

Jay

[greyhounds]

Yes, it's spending restraint time for the US Government - and the squeals are predicatble. "Oh, for God's Sake, they can't reduce the rate of spending growth on MY program(s)."

All the suplicants never get as much as they want - because they never, ever have enough. As the above post stated, the armed services are suffering significant cuts, even the Army saw its Comanche helicopter program and Crusader artillery system chopped off. (The Army is bearing the brunt of the war and that is being supported with funds. But they need MP Batallions, not high tech cannon sytems. Artillerymen are being retrained to be MP's.)

This brings us back to Trent Lott and his unfortunate Amtrak ride. Mr. Lott is not one of my favorite Republicans - he's way too much into providing pork. Good Republicans are penny pinchers that spend public funds like Scrooge before Christmas Eve. My kind of folks. Lott ain't like that.

He's got a big ole shipyard in his state, a shipyard that makes a lot 'o money and employes a lot 'o people building ships for the US Navy. And that big ole shipyard is seeing its future orders go bye-bye as the US Navy shrinks and then shrinks some more.

Now if Senator Lott can't protect his shipyard, and he can't, what do you expect him to do for Amtrak. I'm sure he'd just love to confiscate more of our money and pass it out to Amtrak OBS workers, shipyard workers, future political contributors, etc. Hell, it's not comming out of his pocket. And he'd receive praise and adulation for this legalized theft. Kind of a Robin Hood thingy.

But he's now got to deal with Preident Bush, who I see as a man of great principle. Now, you might disagree strongly with his principle's - but he seems to act on principle, unlike Lott. (Bush doesn't have to deal with Social Security - it will not crash while he is in office. But he wants to solve the problem - not let it fester. As I said, a man of principle. He's also going to allow imports of Canadian beef, which will PO a lot of US ranchers and farmers, but will be good for the general population of consumers. Again, he's acting on principle.)

Bush won't confiscate people's income to build destroyers just for the sake of building destroyers, nor will he confiscate their income to run trains just for the sake of running trains.

I have yet to see anyone make a solid case for the continued Federal funding of Amtrak. I have seen a lot of folks simply say: "We need it". There is zero evidence that nationwide Amtrak reduces, or could possibly reduce, our dependance on foriegn oil or that it creates a net gain in employment. (I am certain there is a net loss of employment due to the funding of Amtrak.)

You know, 35 years at the Federal trough is enough. Let's just set May 1, 2006 as the day all Federal $$$ stop flowing into Amtrak. Set up some transition programs for the empoyees so they can switch over to other jobs in the railroad/hopitality industries. Sounds like a plan to me.

[Junctionfan]

What I can't figure out is why congress hates Amtrak so much that they want it to fail but can't do it right away and official? What is the point that they are trying to make if any?

[dharmon]

Man o' man.....let's see.....two employees of the US Government so to speak...one can say anything he likes about politics and me, who can't. .......anyway........

.......Unfortunately here's the deal and it sucks. All government agencies are taking a hit, and it hurts. What does it mean to me? Well, I get fewer warm bodies to fill the slots I have and I get less money to operate with, which means doing as much as we can with less. And you can't do more, or even the same with less for very long. This may not make you fell any better, but it's not just Amtrak. The services are downsizing again to save bucks (except for the Army..hmmm), that means more folks, one of them mine, hitting the streets. I appreciate your frustration and hope the best for you.

[Modelcar]

...It is the leadership we have now....not the leaders in the past that can do something about Amtrak funding. I believe we all know which way it will go now....

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by n_stephenson

Hey, the Freight RR's are hiring, might as well use your experience and get in the door before you lose even more seniority. As talked about in great volume on this forum, Amtrak is a huge mess and there is no EASY solution. Honesty, Amtrak won't be taken seriously until we are paying 4-5 dollars a gallon for gasoline; then things are going to change.

I cannot say that I agree with you all the time, but this time I think you are right on target - Well said - Piouslion

[Anonymous]

Hey, the Freight RR's are hiring, might as well use your experience and get in the door before you lose even more seniority. As talked about in great volume on this forum, Amtrak is a huge mess and there is no EASY solution. Honesty, Amtrak won't be taken seriously until we are paying 4-5 dollars a gallon for gasoline; then things are going to change.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by johnsousa

FIRST OF ALL I WOULD LIKE TO SAY HAPPY HOLIDAYS ,
NOW I AM A NEW AMTRAK ( OBS ) EMPLOYEE, AND I JUST FOUND OUT THAT THE REPUBLICAN CONGRESS DID NOT GIVE US OUR ANNUAL
FUNDING, SO THAT MEANS THAT ALL AMTRAK EMPLOYEES (THE EMPLOYEES WITH LESS THAN 2 YEARS SENOIRITY) WILL BE SOON GETTING PINK SLIPS,
WELL THAT MAKES ME VERY UPSET THAT THIS IS GOING TO HAPPEN,
BUT THE REPUBLICAN IDIOTS WHO RIDE OUR TRAINS IN THE FIRST CLASS ACELA FOR FREE ON OUR TAXPAYERS DOLLARS WHICH WE KNOW WHO THEY ARE --MR SEN. TRENT LOTT OF MISSISSIPPI, WHO RECENTLY RODE ON MY TRAIN IN FIRST CLASS ACELA WITH HIS ( WIFE ? ) AND BODYGUARDS SAT AND ENJOYED EVERYTHING THAT WE HAD TO OFFER, THEN UPON EXITING THE TRAIN IN WASHINGTON D.C .
@UNION STATION I LOOKED HIM RIGHT IN THE EYE WITH A BIG AMTRAK SMILE AND SAID THANK YOU SENATOR HOPE YOU ENJOYED YOUR TRAIN RIDE AND HAVE A NICE DAY, WELL HE LOOKED AT ME WITH A SHREWD LOOK AND MUMBLED SOMETHING I COULD NOT HERE WHAT HE SAID BUT I'M SURE IT WAS NOT NICE,
IT JUST PROVES TO ME THAT THE PEOPLE WHO VOTED TO PRIVATIZE AMTRAK ARE THE PEOPLE ( REPUBLICAN IDIOTS IN CONGRESS ) WHO RIDE OUR TRAINS IN FIRST CLASS AND ARE ABUSING US IN THE PROCESS OF THE SLOW DEATH OF OUR JOBS WITH AMTRAK,

SO FOR ALL YOU BUSH SUPPORTERS GET READY TO GOING BACK TO LONG LINES AT THE GAS STATIONS , AND HIGHWAYS AND BYWAYS,
BECAUSE YOU JUST GOT FOOLED AND MADE YOUR PRESIDENT BUSH ALOT RICHER,

THEIR WILL BE AND END TO THIS SOMEDAY BUT WE WILL HAVE TO WAIT WHEN ----HILLARY CLINTON WILL BE ELECTED IN 4 YEARS SO FOR NOW -----------------------GOOD LUCK ALL


THANK YOU FOR LETTING EXPRESS MYSELF AND I HOPE WE ALL CAN PROVIDE FOR ALL OUR AMTRAK FAMILIES,

My fellow member of the forum. I have read your "words" with great interest. You are new to us and we welcome you. AMTRACK is a political requirement for the assurance of re-election for many politicians weather they like riding the rails or not. As is mentioned by some of my collegues above, many of them railroaders, No one is owed a living and Democrats are not always AMTRACK's friend. The members of the U.S. Senate have by in large been tacit supporters of Amtrack or tolerate its existance. Election and re-election is some cases is hard enough without opening another can of worms that is best be left alone --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------As for the Junior Senator from New York, I am sure that she would do anything politically expediant to get another vote. On that point I think she was successful with getting your vote, that is if you live in New York, at ol Trent's expense I'm sure.----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------This brings me to one small matter, excitement is fine and often expressed in this forum, but if it is not to much trouble please try to use lower case it doesn't use as much room in the thread----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------I do hope that you can find the good employment you seek, everybody deserves a shot at success.

[Anonymous]

$37 BILLION OVER THE LAST 30 YEARS! HOW CAN AMTRAK AND ITS EMPLOYEES CONTINUE TO DO THIS TO US TAXPAYERS?

[jeaton]

Just to keep the record straight, Congress did authorize $1.2+ Billion for FY 2005 (Oct 2004 thru Sept 2005. That is about the same level as was authorized for FY 2004. I think Amtrak's final request to Congress was about $1.6 Billion. The $400 million will have to come from cuts somewhere, but I suspect most will come from further deferral of the 5 year plan to put the physical facility in good working order.

I haven't checked news wires in the last several hours, but unless you have received a formal announcement of such plans from top levels in the Amtrak organization, or have actually received a notice of your termination, don't buy into every rumor. As noted in previous posts, Senator Lott (R), Miss and many other Republican Senators and Congressmen support better funding for Amtrak. Unfortunately, a number of key Republican congressional leaders were able to block bills proposing adequate funding for Amtrak.

Jay

[Anonymous]

....Kill this post....

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by sammythebull

Hillary for Pres? Ouch!!! Get real, it won't happen.

Oh boy here we go again with politics....

Might not be as farfetched as you think, she had a great deal of admirers and supporters..besides who are the Repubs going to run in 2008? *** Haliburton "like my fashoinable pacemaker" Cheney? I hear Dan Quayle is still avalaible...Hehehe!

Eitherway, every Congress has tried to kill Jamtrack since it started. If they do ever succeed in killing it then I would expect a huge outcry from their constituints who now have no alternate form of travel other than a dying on the vine airline industry and a pathetic Greyhound service or having to drive. I have to say in MHO this country really has its head up its collective a$$ when it comes to a national travel policy, there isnt one, unlike every other civilized nation on earth. The policy is "just let the magic of the marketplace" run everything...thats why we are keeping the airline industry alive with massive subsidies, what if congress treated the airline industry like Amtrack we'd be selling off airports like crazy.

Anyway rant over, eh!

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by daveklepper

Carter was a democrat and he cut Amtrak's subsidy. Bill Clinton was President when all but one of the 11.09.01 perpetrators (I like the term terrorists but it seem to be "Politically Correct" to call them "Militants") got into the USA without the need of a security check or consular review by picking up their USA visas at a Ryadh credit card office. Kerry helped Kennedy get the big bucks for the Big Dig without the long overdue North Station South Station rail connector. I could go on. There are good Democrats and the are not so good Demcorats. And the same is true of Republicans and us.

I have a particular thing about Hillary because the very fact that she is loyal to her husband means that she tolerated infidelity. I think if there is to be a first Woman President, it should be someone who has a solid family connection without any hanky panky. She also supports too many ideas that I think are kind of wierd even from a liberal point of view. And to correct a previous mistatement, yes there was one Democrat who voted for Clinton's impeachment. Lieberman.

right, right, right, and Ronald Reagan sold arms to the Iranians to prevent the release of the hostages until after the 1980 election so that he wouldn't lose to Carter, and later turned a blind eye to the illegal arms deals in the mid-eighties in order to funnel money to the contras in Nicaragua who facillitated the killings of thousands of innocents. It goes both ways. America rarely produces a "decent person" by any legitimate standard for president anymore. Clinton lied, Bush lied (about two VERY different things, mind you) and it all ends up getting forgotten about in the end. Oliver North, the sleazy little worm who trampled on the United States Constitution and was a figurehead behind the Iran-Contra affair is now a military analyst for Fox News. There's sleaze on both sides, who can't admit this?

But you do have to admit that the current administration, whilst being very pro-big business does seem to be very anti-amtrak. Amtrak, while providing a VERY IMPORTANT PUBLIC SERVICE, is not a great money-making oppurtunity, and therefore falls of the radar of the many big-business greedy cats who can only think in terms of large profit margins. Amtrak is especially not going to get the chance to become a great money-making oppurtunity if it's kept in such a shoddy state of funding by the current amtrak-indifferent administration.

Like I said, Amtrak, just like roads and highways, is a PUBLIC SERVICE. Public services should be supported to an extent by tax-payer dollars no matter how much whining is done by republicans about it. You pay into the society that you live under and grin and bear the fact that you won't be able to buy yourself a new big screen t.v. this year. I can't believe that all of the lousy and ridiculous things that this country spends tax money, you all are whining about tax money being spent on PASSENGER RAILROAD SERVICE, on a railroad forum, no less! I'm a bit confused...

[daveklepper]

Carter was a democrat and he cut Amtrak's subsidy. Bill Clinton was President when all but one of the 11.09.01 perpetrators (I like the term terrorists but it seem to be "Politically Correct" to call them "Militants") got into the USA without the need of a security check or consular review by picking up their USA visas at a Ryadh credit card office. Kerry helped Kennedy get the big bucks for the Big Dig without the long overdue North Station South Station rail connector. I could go on. There are good Democrats and the are not so good Demcorats. And the same is true of Republicans and us.

I have a particular thing about Hillary because the very fact that she is loyal to her husband means that she tolerated infidelity. I think if there is to be a first Woman President, it should be someone who has a solid family connection without any hanky panky. She also supports too many ideas that I think are kind of wierd even from a liberal point of view. And to correct a previous mistatement, yes there was one Democrat who voted for Clinton's impeachment. Lieberman.

[cpbloom]

QUOTE: Originally posted by johnsousa
[brSO FOR ALL YOU BUSH SUPPORTERS GET READY TO GOING BACK TO LONG LINES AT THE GAS STATIONS , AND HIGHWAYS AND BYWAYS,

I feel sorry for your loss of a job however....

You make it sound like prior to this happening Amtrak WAS properly funded and we didn't already have long lines at gas stations, highways and byways. Perhaps I should go to downtown Columbus Ohio and ride Amtrak before the service gets downgraded. OH DAMN I FORGOT! THERE IS NO AMTRAK SERVICE HERE!

[richardy]

QUOTE: Originally posted by johnsousa



SO FOR ALL YOU BUSH SUPPORTERS GET READY TO GOING BACK TO LONG LINES AT THE GAS STATIONS , AND HIGHWAYS AND BYWAYS,
BECAUSE YOU JUST GOT FOOLED AND MADE YOUR PRESIDENT BUSH ALOT RICHER,

THEIR WILL BE AND END TO THIS SOMEDAY BUT WE WILL HAVE TO WAIT WHEN ----HILLARY CLINTON WILL BE ELECTED IN 4 YEARS SO FOR NOW -----------------------GOOD LUCK ALL

Those of us that are business owners, work very hard to earn our income, and put up with the massive government paperwork it takes to be in business would disagree with you. Why don't you volunteer to come pay my tax bill to the government every three months, I think you will have a different view. Finally after twelve years I can keep slightly more of what I earn. I am a Republican and I support Amtrak, I pay to ride it so don't think as an Amtrak employee that everyone paying to ride the trains are Democrats! There are many Republicans that support Amtrak although after reading your comments that support has been reduced.

As for Hillary if you think it is bad now it will be very bad with her. Business will suffer and more will move offshore. Don't be fooled, business creates the tax base not the government!

One last point, I have absolutely no respect for someone who shouts their message.

[Anonymous]

Our pres and many members of congress have made tons of money on oil/gas production/sales. Do you think they are really interested in in reducing useage of said commodities? I think not.

As has been witnessed Amtrak continues to suffer at the hands of our current administration and congress. Only we (the taxpayer) raising our voices will help. However this must be done soon or Amtrak could become a thing of the past.

[Modelcar]

....She just was voted the most admired lady in the USA for 2004.

[Anonymous]

Hillary for Pres? Ouch!!! Get real, it won't happen.

[Modelcar]

....If I'm not mistaken...sen. Trent Lott has been a supporter of Amtrak and has worked to get funding ..and I realize he is a Republican and many of that side do not but I believe he is one that does.

[Junctionfan]

They don't owe him a living but it is anti productive to layoff a bunch of workers and degrade the service from lack of funding if the administration is truly interested in reducing middle eastern fuel consumption and reduce the national unemployment rate too.

[slotracer]

So us taxpayers Owe you a living..????

[Anonymous]

FIRST OF ALL I WOULD LIKE TO SAY HAPPY HOLIDAYS ,
NOW I AM A NEW AMTRAK ( OBS ) EMPLOYEE, AND I JUST FOUND OUT THAT THE REPUBLICAN CONGRESS DID NOT GIVE US OUR ANNUAL
FUNDING, SO THAT MEANS THAT ALL AMTRAK EMPLOYEES (THE EMPLOYEES WITH LESS THAN 2 YEARS SENOIRITY) WILL BE SOON GETTING PINK SLIPS,
WELL THAT MAKES ME VERY UPSET THAT THIS IS GOING TO HAPPEN,
BUT THE REPUBLICAN IDIOTS WHO RIDE OUR TRAINS IN THE FIRST CLASS ACELA FOR FREE ON OUR TAXPAYERS DOLLARS WHICH WE KNOW WHO THEY ARE --MR SEN. TRENT LOTT OF MISSISSIPPI, WHO RECENTLY RODE ON MY TRAIN IN FIRST CLASS ACELA WITH HIS ( WIFE ? ) AND BODYGUARDS SAT AND ENJOYED EVERYTHING THAT WE HAD TO OFFER, THEN UPON EXITING THE TRAIN IN WASHINGTON D.C .
@UNION STATION I LOOKED HIM RIGHT IN THE EYE WITH A BIG AMTRAK SMILE AND SAID THANK YOU SENATOR HOPE YOU ENJOYED YOUR TRAIN RIDE AND HAVE A NICE DAY, WELL HE LOOKED AT ME WITH A SHREWD LOOK AND MUMBLED SOMETHING I COULD NOT HERE WHAT HE SAID BUT I'M SURE IT WAS NOT NICE,
IT JUST PROVES TO ME THAT THE PEOPLE WHO VOTED TO PRIVATIZE AMTRAK ARE THE PEOPLE ( REPUBLICAN IDIOTS IN CONGRESS ) WHO RIDE OUR TRAINS IN FIRST CLASS AND ARE ABUSING US IN THE PROCESS OF THE SLOW DEATH OF OUR JOBS WITH AMTRAK,

SO FOR ALL YOU BUSH SUPPORTERS GET READY TO GOING BACK TO LONG LINES AT THE GAS STATIONS , AND HIGHWAYS AND BYWAYS,
BECAUSE YOU JUST GOT FOOLED AND MADE YOUR PRESIDENT BUSH ALOT RICHER,

THEIR WILL BE AND END TO THIS SOMEDAY BUT WE WILL HAVE TO WAIT WHEN ----HILLARY CLINTON WILL BE ELECTED IN 4 YEARS SO FOR NOW -----------------------GOOD LUCK ALL


THANK YOU FOR LETTING EXPRESS MYSELF AND I HOPE WE ALL CAN PROVIDE FOR ALL OUR AMTRAK FAMILIES,