I have seen pictures of locomotives with small flags of various colors (white, blue, etc.), what is the reason for these flags?
During the day, locomotives use(d) flags instead of (or in addition to) the class lights. The colors mean the same thing - white = extra, green = additional sections to follow, red is a rear marker, denoting the end of the train.
Short of state flags, you won't see a blue flag on a locomotive that's underway. Blue flags indicate that there are workmen working on the locomotive (or cars/train) and that the flagged equipment can't be moved.
Since pretty much all freight trains are now "extras," you won't see the flags (or class lights) used any more, except perhaps on tourist/excursion trains, and even then, chiefly for effect.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
The class lights/flags are for use in Timetable & Train Order operation, which has been out of use for many years now. It was developed before the existence of radios, and better communication has now made it redundant. In Canada Train Order operation was gone by the early 1990s, and had been confined to lightly trafficked for years before that.
As Tree68 said, White is an extra train not found in the timetable, Green is for a train which has been split into sections (usually because there is too much traffic for one train) and all sections except the last must display green flags/lights, and Red is the marker for the trailing end of a movement. CN still equips Distributed Power-capable locomotives with built in red marker lights, but their use is not required by the rulebook anymore. As far as I know, they are the only railroad besides Amtrak to continue using red markers.
Blue flags however are still in everyday use, they are used by Carmen or customers to block train/yard crews from accessing equipment not ready to be moved. Usually the switch going into that track will be lined away and locked with a special lock train/yard crews don't have a key for, as an extra security measure. Blue flags (and blue lights by night) are normally placed between the rails, but there are smaller ones which fit onto a locomotive's windowsill, and our local fuel dealer has a plug which fits into the MU cable port on a locomotive, and not only does it flash a blue light, it prevents the locomotives from loading so you can't move.
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-an Articulate Malcontent
SD70M-2Dude The class lights/flags are for use in Timetable & Train Order operation, which has been out of use for many years now. It was developed before the existence of radios, and better communication has now made it redundant. In Canada Train Order operation was gone by the early 1990s, and had been confined to lightly trafficked for years before that. As Tree68 said, White is an extra train not found in the timetable, Green is for a train which has been split into sections (usually because there is too much traffic for one train) and all sections except the last must display green flags/lights, and Red is the marker for the trailing end of a movement. CN still equips Distributed Power-capable locomotives with built in red marker lights, but their use is not required by the rulebook anymore. As far as I know, they are the only railroad besides Amtrak to continue using red markers.
The segment of railroad I hired out on was operated by Timetable & Train Orders on a automatic block signal system. There were schedules for 1st, 2nd & 3rd Class trains. The signal system conveyed the information of track occupancy. The Schedules and Train Orders conveyed authority for movement. The 1st Class schedules were for our scheduled passenger trains, 2 in each direction daily. The 3rd class schedules were used for the operation of the local freights. The 2nd class schedules were tools to operate the 8 or so merchandise trains that were scheduled over the division in each direction daily. The numbered 2nd class schedules were spread around the clock and WERE NOT assigned to any particular merchandise train, but to what train happened to show up within the TT Schedule 12 hours of viability. (Rules stated after 12 hours schedules lost their authority and trains on those schedules would have to move further as an Extra train.
Second (or third) sections of a TT Schedule, were not because of trains being split, they happened when multiple trains showed up in the same time frame as a existing schedule.
Today's work force - Dispatcher and Train and Engine Crews would not be able to operate under such a system - it is too archaic and too involved - it is part of the reason why it took years for employees to get PROMOTED to Conductor, Engineer and Train Dispatcher.
As information, EOT's display a flashing red light to the rear of trains.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
If a railroader sees a blue flag moving, their reaction is worse than waving a red flag at a bull. Once the railroader overcomes the disconnect, the safety of everybody on the line becomes paramount and the blue flag is stopped dead before anything else gets dead.
(Still remember what happened after a blue-flagged locomotive consist crept about 2 inches with a RFE under the cab at Raton (Looking at a Sentry wheel slip sensor/scanner in the traction motor cover) when the RCE consist failed unexpectedly and the slack somehow rolled in with brakes set. The RFE was still white as a ghost hours later.) ...Holy Inquisition!
mudchicken(Still remember what happened after a blue-flagged locomotive consist crept about 2 inches with a RFE under the cab at Raton (Looking at a Sentry wheel slip sensor/scanner in the traction motor cover) when the RCE consist failed unexpectedly and the slack somehow rolled in with brakes set. The RFE was still white as a ghost hours later.) ...Holy Inquisition!
She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw
I thought one of the essential elements of a complete "train" was "Displaying Markers", which could be a red flag (usually inserted into the trailing coupler knuckle) in daylight ?
- Paul North.
Paul_D_North_Jr I thought one of the essential elements of a complete "train" was "Displaying Markers", which could be a red flag (usually inserted into the trailing coupler knuckle) in daylight ? - Paul North.
Or a fusee at night.
Passenger trains are required to show a red light - a flag won't do.
As you note, the marker, be it an EOTD, FRED, flag, or fusee says "this is the end of the train."
Oftimes you'll hear a roll-by report include "marker in place."
Is red EOT marker a requirement? Do they still use a FRED with rear end DPUs?
Or is the dim rear facing headlight enough?
rdamonOr is the dim rear facing headlight enough?
When one particular train runs, it displays two very large white flags, staffs crossed.
Of course, the flags have big red meatballs and the staff crossing is hidden by the Imperial Chrysanthemum. There are three more chrysanthemums, one at the rear and one on each side under the Emperor's window...
When I saw the Imperial train it was pulled by a 4-6-2. The photo I use for a screen saver has a DD-51 class diesel-hydraulic on the point.
Chuck
Interesting description of Train Orders Balt, that almost seems like an updated version compared to what I am used to hearing about. Either way modern railroaders (myself included) would be lost in it.
The Canadian rulebook (CROR) was changed recently, and I don't believe a marker is required anymore, certainly not a lit one. All the rebuilt VIA cars do not have them anymore, and they have started running with a red reflectorized plate stuck in the rear knuckle, but the CROR does not require them to, it is a VIA rule. Our SBUs (CN-ese for EOT/FRED) of course have a built in red flasher, but it's not active 100% of the time. What I meant is that CN and Amtrak are the only major North American railroads to still equip locomotives with built-in red lights.
And I too got chills when I read MudChicken's story, that would be enough to give any self-respecting railroader a heart attack. Blue flag protection (known as CROR 26 up here) is still a sacred commandment that must never be broken, for many lives may depend upon it.
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