I don't want to get into a debate about A&K (sometimes considered the "Darth Vader" of the short line industry). But I was pretty heavily involved in the Towner Line abandonment and ultimate line sale in the 1990's, so let me make a few observations.
The Towner line used to be part of a main line of the MP between Pueblo, Kansas City and points east. It was also the major eastern connection of the DRG&W (at Pueblo). Because of the importance of the Pueblo conection to DRG&W, the latter road got trackage rights over the Pueblo-KC line in the UP-MP merger. Once DRG&W and SP became part of the same family (following the abortive ATSF-SP merger), the "new" SP used the DRG&W trackage rights east of Pueblo (including rights over the Towner line) to cobble together a "central corridor" transcontinental route (including the Tennessee Pass line west of Pueblo) which had higher costs and poorer service than any of the competing transcontinental routes - not a winning combination.
UP proposed to abandon the Towner line as part of the UP-SP merger. The combined UP-SP system would obviously have superior routes to handle the transcontinental traffic SP had been handling over the line, and the on-line traffic was miniscule. The STB approved the abandonment as part of the UP-SP merger (Docket No. AB-3, Sub-No-130).
At this point the story gets interesting. The various communities served by the Towner line sought to preserve the line. From my perspective, their motivation seemed to have more to do with preserving real estate tax revenue than preserving rail service. Be that as it may, the state ended up purchasing the line from UP for Net Liquidation Value (the scrap/sale value of the line's assets less disposition costs), on the theory that, if the line proved to be non-viable (as it proved to be), the state could recover the value it had paid. I think it fair to say that neither the railroad nor the state expected that the deal would be successful in preserving rail service. That expectation proved to be accurate, as the road was never able to generate enough traffic to be viable. The state ultimately sold the road to recover its investment. Given this history, it is hardly surprising that the line ended up being proposed for abandonment - the wonder is that it lasted as long as it did. A railroad needs traffic to stay in business. Without the overhead traffic, there was precious little business to sustain this line From an economic standpoint, it should have been torn up in the late 1990's. And, but for Colorado state political considerations, it would have been.
Someplace in Trains way back when was a itttle story or photo caption like "Incident at Nepesta Curve" - might have been the FM publicity photo series, or a frontispiece-type photo and caption.
Bingo !
"Incident at Nepesta curve - a slow order not canceled"
- Paul Nortth.
Thank you.
Deggesty tree68 doghouse I doubt MC would be willing to post that here. If you do a search on "a&k railroad colorado problems" you'll find a few links that might give you an idea of what's going on. Hint: at least one link included the word "vultures." From what I have seen, these people are vultures; vultures (the bird kind) look for dead or almost dead animals and if the animal is not quite dead will attack it so as to hasten its death. May they be absolutely foiled in this instance.
tree68 doghouse I doubt MC would be willing to post that here. If you do a search on "a&k railroad colorado problems" you'll find a few links that might give you an idea of what's going on. Hint: at least one link included the word "vultures."
doghouse
I doubt MC would be willing to post that here. If you do a search on "a&k railroad colorado problems" you'll find a few links that might give you an idea of what's going on. Hint: at least one link included the word "vultures."
From what I have seen, these people are vultures; vultures (the bird kind) look for dead or almost dead animals and if the animal is not quite dead will attack it so as to hasten its death.
May they be absolutely foiled in this instance.
My understanding is that A&K and their dealings gives vultures a good name in comparison.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
MC, Nepesta (NA) is what some old timers used, and I may have known some of them. Now I are one!!
JOHN MEHRLING Between Fower and Boone there is a junction - which line is that coming in from the southeast? It looks like there were 2 roadbeds west of there? Can anyone give a little history of those lines? Thank you.
Between Fower and Boone there is a junction - which line is that coming in from the southeast? It looks like there were 2 roadbeds west of there? Can anyone give a little history of those lines?
EDIT: For the record, ATSF built into Pueblo from the east in February 1876....MoPac built into Pueblo in December 1887 and was officially in operation on 1/1/1888....There was almost a third railroad in the 26 mile stretch between Pueblo and NA Junction in 1906 [Headed to Burlington on the Rock Island out on the KS border], the Colorado & NorthEastern RR, but American Sugar Refining (later American Crystal Sugar) backed off in its war with Holly Sugar over the sugar refining and supply capacities in SE Colorado. Union Pacific's Kansas Pacific/ "Arkansas Valley Ry" (which I assume DC is expert on, being from the SE CO area) was coming from the other direction (Kit Carson-Las Animas-La Junta-Timpas Creek/Swink) in 1875 until it fizzled out in 1877....Coulda been a congested place.
tree68 doghouse Mr. Chicken, I know not who A&K is. Would you be so kind as to provide a brief history of the cast of characters and their nefarious deeds? I doubt MC would be willing to post that here. If you do a search on "a&k railroad colorado problems" you'll find a few links that might give you an idea of what's going on. Hint: at least one link included the word "vultures."
doghouse Mr. Chicken, I know not who A&K is. Would you be so kind as to provide a brief history of the cast of characters and their nefarious deeds?
Johnny
doghouseMr. Chicken, I know not who A&K is. Would you be so kind as to provide a brief history of the cast of characters and their nefarious deeds?
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
mudchicken chutton01 Ok, so the STB filing is void - probably my search term string was lacking, but that was the latest info I could find with simple searching (lots of info from 2000 or so discussing how spiffy the new operators were going to be).As for the Todd Point, CO - USGS map - this is what I could find - not sure what the hint means.BTW, the turn of the century articles indicated the freight traffic expected was pretty much grain and quarry, with a rail museum eventually. What were/are the real revenue prospects for this line? (1) As for the map, lower right hand corner, it's there in bold black letters (it isn't in Hutton's cut & paste attachment above...DC got it.)...Looks kinda dumb when you don't even know whatcha bought? (2) white winter wheat (the drought is finally over), relatively high grade (for filtering) limestone deposits, oil & gas (read fracking) carload bulk materials plus some E-W bridge traffic. Car storage has helped a little, but it kills operations (A&K already stripped the backtracks and sidings where they could get away with it - a couple of the Ag industries didn't catch on until it was too late. Typical less than above board or ethical A&K stealth tactic.)
chutton01 Ok, so the STB filing is void - probably my search term string was lacking, but that was the latest info I could find with simple searching (lots of info from 2000 or so discussing how spiffy the new operators were going to be).As for the Todd Point, CO - USGS map - this is what I could find - not sure what the hint means.BTW, the turn of the century articles indicated the freight traffic expected was pretty much grain and quarry, with a rail museum eventually. What were/are the real revenue prospects for this line?
Ok, so the STB filing is void - probably my search term string was lacking, but that was the latest info I could find with simple searching (lots of info from 2000 or so discussing how spiffy the new operators were going to be).As for the Todd Point, CO - USGS map - this is what I could find - not sure what the hint means.BTW, the turn of the century articles indicated the freight traffic expected was pretty much grain and quarry, with a rail museum eventually. What were/are the real revenue prospects for this line?
(1) As for the map, lower right hand corner, it's there in bold black letters (it isn't in Hutton's cut & paste attachment above...DC got it.)...Looks kinda dumb when you don't even know whatcha bought?
(2) white winter wheat (the drought is finally over), relatively high grade (for filtering) limestone deposits, oil & gas (read fracking) carload bulk materials plus some E-W bridge traffic. Car storage has helped a little, but it kills operations (A&K already stripped the backtracks and sidings where they could get away with it - a couple of the Ag industries didn't catch on until it was too late. Typical less than above board or ethical A&K stealth tactic.)
Mr. Chicken, I know not who A&K is. Would you be so kind as to provide a brief history of the cast of characters and their nefarious deeds?
Looks to me like our college MC has found that Otero County is involved for a very short distance which 'probably' voids the abandonment application because of the inaccurate description.
(1) The thing is in limbo. The abandonment filing is void.
(2) There are two offers for assistance out there...
(3) The rail pickup train is gone.
(4) A&K (V&S) is about to collide with STB. A&K tried a procedural end around the last time and it blew up in their face. Two separate sets of attorneys plus CDOT made a fundamental blunder that nobody, except the surveyors (PLSC) caught. PLSC also hammered them on the Federal Grant R/W issue that they tried to sweep under the rug.
(5) A&K owns the railroad, but they failed to notify STB or anyone else until recently (another A&K junkman's careless blunder)
(6) A&K is going to have to explain why it ignores state statute in two separate cases. They are already in the state's crosshairs for two other screw-ups that date back to the 1990's. Their biggest enemy is looking back at them in the mirror.
Chutton: Your entry above is missing something very key, very simple. Look at state map and see if you can find it. Hint: look at a USGS quad for Todd Point, Colorado.
Stay tuned.
You may already know this, but V&S railway filed for abandoment of the line in August of this year 2015)
V and S Railway, LLC—AbandonmentExemption—in Pueblo, Crowley, andKiowa Counties, Colo.V and S Railway, LLC (V&S) has fileda verified notice of exemption under 49CFR part 1152 subpart F—ExemptAbandonments to abandon a line ofrailroad extending between milepost747.5 near Towner and milepost 869.4near NA Junction, a distance of 121.9miles in Pueblo, Crowley, and KiowaCounties, Colo. (the Towner Line). TheTowner Line traverses United StatesPostal Service Zip Codes 81022, 80125,81062, 81033, 81063, 81076, 81021,81045, 81036, and 81071
i am curious about the 122 mile long towner railroad which operates 122 miles of ex MP track from NA junction near pueblo, colorado to Towner colorado on colorado/kansas border. is this shortline still in business, or is it being torn up for scrap. heard that V&S Railway owned it and then heard state of colorado owned the railroad. can anyone help me sort out which is correct info?
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