From the perspective of CSX A&WP subdivision there are definite problems.
Today a northbound / eastbound ( going toward Atlanta ) BNSF intermodal haulage train has been parked for over 10 hours on our local siding. Other BNSF trains have passed it. Apparently HOS lack of crew. It is split into three sections so when a crew is finally found will take some time to put back together and do air test.
For the past couple months there have been major delays for trains here with many trains on siding for a long time. This includes the BNSF trains and other intermodals. Before the change never saw a BNSF taking the siding here and waiting. Has been a lot of fleeting and still many delays.
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Unbelievable Follow up.
At 0700 this morning woke up finding loco had backed and connected all three sections. This blocked 2 of three stree crossing including one state highway. Train finally whistled off at 1248.
This delay while trains in both directions passed but with space to put this train in operation. What a waste of crew time.
Congested operations breed crew waste.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
I watch trains on CSX's Jacksonville - New Orleans ex-SAL/L&N line, from my office window. Before the new operating plan, there were usually 3-4 trains per day. Now there are none to two, but some are longer than ever before. Used to, 110 cars was the maximum; yesterday or Monday there was one that looked like two trains put together, 117 cars of general freight, a locomotive, and 64 more cars (34 of which were autoracks). There used to be something of a schedule, but no more. I understand that I see the trains that pass in 8 of 24 hours, but seems to me there would have to be some regularity if cars are being delivered with any dependability.
Wonder how BNSF likes the delays of their haulage trains. Wedensday evening another HOS recrew happened here. 2 hour delay 1900 - 2100 blocking same 2 crossings. Never before has any of the BNSF haulage trains not been able to make the Birmingham - Fairburn run. Suspect that delays are occurring on CSX Lineville Sub Birmingham - LaGrange , Ga.
Brilliant!!
C&NW, CA&E, MILW, CGW and IC fan
New Division Bulletin issued - permits 11000 Ton, 12000 foot intermodal trains on areas that had lesser limits. Also permits operation of upto 140 empty autoracks over the mountain (with helpers as necessary).
Empty autoracks and helpers reads like a conflict in terms. I wouldn't want anything to do with a train of empty autoracks using helpers.
ValleyX Empty autoracks and helpers reads like a conflict in terms. I wouldn't want anything to do with a train of empty autoracks using helpers.
You don't want to work between Cumberland and Connellsville.
BaltACD ValleyX Empty autoracks and helpers reads like a conflict in terms. I wouldn't want anything to do with a train of empty autoracks using helpers. We are discussing a solid train of empty racks, correct? You don't want to work between Cumberland and Connellsville.
ValleyX Empty autoracks and helpers reads like a conflict in terms. I wouldn't want anything to do with a train of empty autoracks using helpers. We are discussing a solid train of empty racks, correct?
Empty autoracks and helpers reads like a conflict in terms. I wouldn't want anything to do with a train of empty autoracks using helpers. We are discussing a solid train of empty racks, correct?
I'm sure you're right about that. Still, all those light cars with a helper, nothing but autoracks, would require some very gentle handling.
ValleyX BaltACD ValleyX Empty autoracks and helpers reads like a conflict in terms. I wouldn't want anything to do with a train of empty autoracks using helpers. We are discussing a solid train of empty racks, correct? You don't want to work between Cumberland and Connellsville. I'm sure you're right about that. Still, all those light cars with a helper, nothing but autoracks, would require some very gentle handling.
With the rack structure added to the basic TTX flat car - autoracks are not light cars when empty and with the addition of their lading, they are not that much heavier when loaded.
Doesn't the section of track between Cumberland, Md and Connelsville, PA include the Sand Patch?
caldreamer Doesn't the section of track between Cumberland, Md and Connelsville, PA include the Sand Patch?
Yes - in both directions.
CSX had a 12,000 ft, 884 axle general manifest train (Q369) this morning on the Garrett sub heading for Chicago. If handled by 2 locomotives, that is a 218 car train....lots of boxcars and covered hoppers!
Not sure if the Q369 is part of the plan or not.
Ed
MP173 CSX had a 12,000 ft, 884 axle general manifest train (Q369) this morning on the Garrett sub heading for Chicago. If handled by 2 locomotives, that is a 218 car train....lots of boxcars and covered hoppers! Not sure if the Q369 is part of the plan or not. Ed
All general manifest trains are a part of the plan.
MP173CSX had a 12,000 ft, 884 axle general manifest train (Q369) this morning on the Garrett sub heading for Chicago. If handled by 2 locomotives, that is a 218 car train....lots of boxcars and covered hoppers!
They had one almost that big late last week around Defiance that was in emergency and that they were having trouble getting cleared so it could roll again. Kinda gummed up the works for a while...
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
Big trains take all the finesse out of Dispatching - they only fit at limited locations (even on double track account road crossings). When you are moving priority freight or passenger trains - large trains take it in the shorts!
BaltACD(even on double track account road crossings).
This one apparently had to somehow be cut at two crossings if I remember the discussions correctly. Maybe Joekoh will chime in with some details.
q 324 has been combined with q 508.It's a Garrett-Toledo Manifest train.Dispatcher has reported some of these trains are 14,000 ft long.They have a pick up at the Defiance yard.With them being so long they need to cut the crossing at the yard(hire road) and sometimes squire ave.The switch for the yard is off of track 1.Csx has the train usually on track 2.They pull the cut of cars for the yard and go past west standley.They back through the crossover and go to the yard on track 1.The conductor rides from mile post 82 into the yard(2 mile + ride).324 has to wait for traffic so they can make the move.They also have to wait to get back out to their train.This makes single track railroading and possible recrews too.Hope this helps.
stay safe
Joe
Deshler Ohio-crossroads of the B&O Matt eats your fries.YUM! Clinton st viaduct undefeated against too tall trucks!!!(voted to be called the "Clinton St. can opener").
tree68 MP173 CSX had a 12,000 ft, 884 axle general manifest train (Q369) this morning on the Garrett sub heading for Chicago. If handled by 2 locomotives, that is a 218 car train....lots of boxcars and covered hoppers!
MP173 CSX had a 12,000 ft, 884 axle general manifest train (Q369) this morning on the Garrett sub heading for Chicago. If handled by 2 locomotives, that is a 218 car train....lots of boxcars and covered hoppers!
The bigger/ longer the train, the more opportunities for something to go wrong. As a result, they're less reliable than 2 regular trains with the same number of cars. Someone who has a better understanding than me of statistics and probability could explain why.
I didn't fare well in statistics class...
But... Back when my fire department marched in parades in competition, it was common knowledge that keeping the number of firefighters in the line of march to a minumum was beneficial. Points were deducted for infractions - and the less people marching, the less chances for demerits.
So it goes with long trains, I suppose.
Does the crew make it from Garrett to Toledo or is that frequently a relief job in the making? As for auto racks, I've seen all kinds of catastrophes with auto racks on curved track, loaded and empty.
It depends on how many trains have to pass before they get back out to their train.They can be limited by the power they are given for the train.Heard one crew say"Heavy train,crappy power".Local law enforcement has been watching the crossings as well.
blue streak 1 Unbelievable Follow up. At 0700 this morning woke up finding loco had backed and connected all three sections. This blocked 2 of three stree crossing including one state highway. Train finally whistled off at 1248. This delay while trains in both directions passed but with space to put this train in operation. What a waste of crew time.
As you stated in your OP, the train was broken up into 3 pieces for at least 10 hours. That means that the 2 pieces that were off air would need a class one air test, which can not be done until the train back together and on air. A class one airtest can take some time, depending on the length of train, the walking condidtions and the overall motivation of the crew. So to call the time the train was in one piece and not moving "a waste of crew time" is not all that acurate, unless you know the class one test has been done and the train ready to go.
An "expensive model collector"
What's being discussed are some of the inherent limitations on the "efficiency" of the railroad. I no longer wonder at the hegemony of trucks, despite their own limitations, mainly payload size.
I do think the rails hurt themselves with these godawful train lengths -- usually to save money on two-man crews. Granted these crews are good for only 200 miles. But c'mon! You're still way ahead of the trucks on labor costs, even if that advantage is compromised by capital costs the trucks don't have.
Don't get greedy, and try to keep customer service and public relations in the profit equation!
In the area around Chicago, many municipalities have ordinences about trains blocking crossings for excessive lengths of time. Is CSX running afoul of these laws with these long trains?
dakotafred I do think the rails hurt themselves with these godawful train lengths --
I do think the rails hurt themselves with these godawful train lengths --
I don't. As a dispatcher I hate them, however as a stockholder I love them.
n012944 blue streak 1 Unbelievable Follow up. At 0700 this morning woke up finding loco had backed and connected all three sections. This blocked 2 of three stree crossing including one state highway. Train finally whistled off at 1248. This delay while trains in both directions passed but with space to put this train in operation. What a waste of crew time. As you stated in your OP, the train was broken up into 3 pieces for at least 10 hours. That means that the 2 pieces that were off air would need a class one air test, which can not be done until the train back together and on air. A class one airtest can take some time, depending on the length of train, the walking condidtions and the overall motivation of the crew. So to call the time the train was in one piece and not moving "a waste of crew time" is not all that acurate, unless you know the class one test has been done and the train ready to go.
To have a train sitting for 10 hours is a waste of equipment time. A sitting freight train is not making money.
n012944 dakotafred I do think the rails hurt themselves with these godawful train lengths -- I don't. As a dispatcher I hate them, however as a stockholder I love them.
Short-term cost savings, but long-term revenue losers.
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