Train? What train?

[Murphy Siding]

     A news story from our local TV channel( KELO- Sioux Falls, S.D.) website says that a train hit 2 cars this morning at a crossing downtown.

       According to the story, a train was stopped at a crossing with 2 tracks,  but not blocking the crossing.  The warning lights were flashing.  The engineer(?) of the stopped train had waived the cars through the crossing(!), when they were hit by a slow moving train on the 2nd track. (Oops)

     The two vehicles were damaged on the sides, and no one was hurt.  The engineer was quoted as saying he didn't know the second train was there.

     The crossing is probably within the yard limits of the yard.  Trains frequently move back and forth across this  street while moving cars to a couple of sidings, or assembling trains for departure.  Typically, the trains are moving very slowly across this street, and most drivers are aware of the trains.

     From the photo in the article,  I gather that the train with the engineer in it was the local, and the train that hit the cars was backing up.  It looks like the rail car that made impact was an empty center beam car.

     How in the world did the engineer- or the conductor, or brakeman, if that's who it really was- not know there was another train on the next track?  Wouldn't he have a radio on him, and be hearing the other crew communicating?  If a trainman was to flag cars through the crossing, wouldn't  / shouldn't he be off the train, and standing in the street, where he could see street traffic and road traffic?

     For what it's worth, the temperature  was bitter cold this morning,  with a wind chill of -26 degrees. 

[overall]

In the rules somewhere it says expect a car or cars to move on any track at any time. He should have known better.

[BaltACD]

What we have here is a failure to communicate!

It is the responsibility of the crew making the shoving movement to protect the movement, most normally by having a crewman on the lead car of the movement, stopping the movement short of crossing to provide protection of the crossing and then resuming the movement after protection has been established.

Items that have not been confirmed from your description, did the crew making the shove communicate with the 'local' stopped at the crossing to have it provide crossing protection for the movement.  Was the 'local' the train that originally activated the crossing protection?  If so, was it's 'flagging' in response to it knowing that a) it activated the protection and b) it was not going to be crossing the crossing.

One thing for all crewmen to remember - if you request another employee to perform a action you are responsible for - YOU are still responsible for the action, no matter how well or how poorly the other person perfoms that action.  If the crew making the shoving movement requested the 'local' to flag the crossing, the incompetence of that flagging is still the responsibility of the crew making the shoving movement.

Cold or heat have no bearing on rules compliance.

[traisessive1]

CN's rules state that crew members are not allowed to wave traffic through a crossing.

No hand signals.

That leaves verbal instructions only.

This engineer is 100% at fault. No crew should ever signal a vehicle, verbal or hand, through a crossing unless they are on the ground, on the crossing.

[Norm48327]

"CN's rules state that crew members are not allowed to wave traffic through a crossing."

I've seen them do just that in Michigan.

[Mookie]

Norm48327

"CN's rules state that crew members are not allowed to wave traffic through a crossing."

I've seen them do just that in Michigan.

on the train or on the ground at the crossing?

[edblysard]

Which is why we never flag automobile traffic through any crossing down here…if they get hit or managed to run onto each other in their haste, you, the T&E employee are responsible and liable for the damages.

We have gone so far as to paint clearance marks on our tracks 50 feet beyond the crossing circuit, and have given safety failures to crews who left equipment fouling these marks.

The few times I have blocked a crossing, or had to stop just shy during a movement and the gates activate, if we will be there a few minutes, I make sure I walk far enough down the tracks to be out of normal pistol round range…and I wait till we are going to move before I head back…never flag automobile traffic through a crossing, ever.

[ungern]

edblysard

The few times I have blocked a crossing, or had to stop just shy during a movement and the gates activate, if we will be there a few minutes, I make sure I walk far enough down the tracks to be out of normal pistol round range…

Ed,

Do people take shots at you if you block a crossing?

Ungern

[tree68]

Because the crossing next to the station has no automatic signals, and because we don't use the horn around the station, flagging that crossing is a regular event, either by a member of the crew who dismounts to do the job, or by a crew member available at the station.

I have, many times, been the crew member at the station, and waved cars over the crossing when the train was far enough out.  Of course, speed is usually on the order of 5 MPH, so there's usually plenty of time.

On the other hand, we always flag the crossing on the ground. 

[edblysard]

Twice so far in almost 16 years, once at Manchester crossing about 11:30 pm, they took a few shots at our locomotive as we entered the crossing, the FRA glazing is a little tougher than they though, got a nice star burst in one windshield and a bullet mark on the nose.

Second time was at Dorset street on our “east” main, we had cleared a switch while dragging out of our receiving yard, but on purpose did not clear the at grade crossing about 25 feet  past that point…immediately began shoving back into the yard proper, I was riding the point, my helper was on the other side of the hopper, a train dragging by on our “west” main radioed to us someone blocked at the crossing was shooting at us, it was on my “far” side so I never saw it, but my helper got inside the end of the hopper, I radioed in for our special agents to head that way, and when got into the yard proper we stopped and looked at the car, several small caliber bullets had left a collection of “skid marks” on the hopper about 3 feet behind where my helper was riding.

Our cops said it was a .22 caliber pistol, and of course by the time they got to the crossing, there wasn’t an automobile to be seen on either side of the crossing.

Keep in mind both of these crossings are in heavy industrial areas, with small, closed in neighborhoods, very economically depressed populace, if you were in LA you would call the area a barrio, in New York, a ghetto or  a slum, lots of gang activity.

Dorset Street is along the turning basin for the ship channel, it leads to one of the gates into the Port of Houston Public docks.

Same crossing way back when I was new, working as a helper, we performed the same move, dragging out, but did clear the crossing, as another train was “behind” us shoving back into the yard also, we were going to have to wait a few minutes for him to clear up.

The movement stopped with the last car still in the gate circuit, so the gates stayed down, but after a minute, with no movement on the track, the circuit “timed out” the gates and raised them.

Immediately the blocked traffic began to honk at the one car right at the crossing, he wanst moving because he was not sure what we were going to do.

My foreman, standing in the middle of the crossing, waved that car through, but at the same time, a car several deep on the opposite side decided he wasn’t going to wait, jumped out of line and floored it, we had a nice head on directly centered on the crossing, blocked both of our mains.

No one seriously hurt, but both drivers sued the carrier, claiming my foreman caused the accident by waving the first car on.

I don’t clear that crossing at all, on purpose, for that very reason.

And I don’t take my helper over there when pulling receiving tracks either, one target is enough