Royal Gorge War

[Anonymous]

Has anyone heard anything about the current Royal Gorge War going on between the City of Canon City, The Royal Gorge Bridge, and The Canon City & Royal Gorge RR.

To give you a basic rundown, the royal gorge bridge wants to hold extreme sports, parachuting, base jumping, and bungee jumping at the royal gorge bridge and use the railroad tracks below as a landing strip.

The railroad is willing to play along, but wants reimbursment for employees stationed at the bottom of the bridge to flag trains, coordinate moves, and evacuate injured jumpers. They also want reimbursment in the event that a train is cancelled. Now this all sounds somewhat reasonable as long as you disregard someone wanting to jump off of a bridge 1000 feet in the air and try and land on a railroad track running between 8 and 12 trains a day.

Now the war started with the bridge, which is owned by the city, complaining that the railroad was being unfair in their negotiations to hold the games. So now, the city has stepped in and is trying to evict the railroad from the city owned depot unless they give the bridge rights to hold these extreme games whenever they want, without notice, and with no protocol for safety of jumpers or trains.

If anyone has heard anything about this, or has any opinions I would greatly appreciate them

[FThunder11]

I've been there and its a nice bridge, but I think the train should be left alone (and the train is too expensive to ride, $100 to ride in the cab).

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by FThunder11
the train is too expensive to ride, $100 to ride in the cab).

Thats cheaper that anywhere else.

[jeaton]

Think of it! Bungee jumpers get extra points for slapping the windshield of the locomotive. Base jumpers rewarded for landing on the moving train. (points deducted for loss of limb or life).

Sound like real fun!!!

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by jeaton

Think of it! Bungee jumpers get extra points for slapping the windshield of the locomotive. Base jumpers rewarded for landing on the moving train. (points deducted for loss of limb or life).

Sound like real fun!!!

Jumper vs. train, hmmmm, my money is on the train. [}:)] [;)]

City vs. railroad. Hard to call that one. I bet most of us here are for the railroad though. [:p]

[Anonymous]

Wow, news to me. That is a nifty bridge. Yanno you can spit off th side of that thing and the spit is evaporated before it can hit the ground.

Seems silly that the city is willing to take the "lets not have proper safety" side of this argument...

[Anonymous]

How long will it be before the rest of the line gets torn up.
Seems to be a trend that this country tends to like!
By the way, how many miles does the railroad operate?
BNSFfan.

[Anonymous]

Sounds like the railway will need a permanent foreman set up there under red flags.

Sounds fair to me that the games people should reimburse the RR for the cost of the foreman and any unecessary delays.

[Puckdropper]

Sounds like an interesting thing for Myth Busters. Dangle a ballistics-jelly made dummy on the bungy cord, and run in to it with a freight train.

[Anonymous]

At the bottom of that gorge (for those who havent seen it) you basically have a 1000+ (too lazy to look it up) chasm where the bottom is entirely taken up by a RR main, and a bigger adjacent stream.

Before the "jumpers" brand the railroad to be unreasonable for their appropriate concern for safety, I have to wonder if the jumpers have explored all available options?

Surely the 'clearance' they seek at the bottom is not desired for the actuall extent of the jump, (you don't wanna come THAT close to the ground on the rebound) but rather as a means of lowering a jumper to ground after he's done bouncing around.

Wouldn't a Raft or pier into the stream bed accompli***he same task?

[Anonymous]

that would work great for the bungee jumping, but that is only a small part of the event. The majority of the event is base jumping, in which people jump off of the bridge, freefall, deploy a parachute, steer, and land on a strip of ground 1000' down and 561/2" wide. Oh, and the canyon narrows to about 50 feet wide at the bottom where the jumpers land.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by rgemd

that would work great for the bungee jumping, but that is only a small part of the event. The majority of the event is base jumping, in which people jump off of the bridge, freefall, deploy a parachute, steer, and land on a strip of ground 1000' down and 561/2" wide. Oh, and the canyon narrows to about 50 feet wide at the bottom where the jumpers land.

Well, that would be a WAYYY cool jump, don't get me wrong, but what about wind and the sides of the canyon? I mean a good 60 mph gust, and SPLAT on the wall...(??)

Can the event get insurance based upon the RR even being down there? That would seem rough to get.

[Anonymous]

For All:

http://www.royalgorgeroute.com/

http://www.imagesofcolorado.com/royalgorge.html

[Clutch Cargo]

O.M.F.G. you gotta be S@#$%^in me sailor.

Kurt

[jeaton]

Let see, a couple of tank cars of water and a high powered pump on a flat and we'll get that mess cleaned off the canyon walls. Nooooo problem!

The part that has me stumped is about avoiding a train and landing in a class five rapids. Jumpers carry a kayak?

[Anonymous]

Ok what would happen if the bungee gave way?...................OOPS!
Can you say OHHHHH [censored]!
That's a hell of a long D-R-O-P!
BNSFfan.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by BNSF9838

Ok what would happen if the bungee gave way?...................OOPS!
Can you say OHHHHH [censored]!
That's a hell of a long D-R-O-P!
BNSFfan.

Listen for the SPROING! and pray to God you don't hear a THWACK!

[rrnut282]

What about the fenced in area at the bottom of the inclined railway that goes down into the gorge? I don't remember who owns that, but it's within sight of the suspended girder bridge that the RR traverses and is close enough to the high bridge to be a target.

Still I would side with the RR on this one. Their request sounds prudent and reasonable, unless due to union work-rules, it is a 24hour a day position that they want reimbursed for whether an event is scheduled or not.

How is it xtreme sports can get liability insurance with the very real possiblity of loss of life and limb while the steam excursion business can't with very little possibility of injury???

[mudchicken]

You folks are only seeing a small part of the larger problem.

(1) City of Canon City owns the Royal Gorge Bridge and Tourist Trap amusement Park that goes with it.
(2) CC&RG is not the sole owner of the rail line at the bottom of the gorge. RRRR (Rock & Rail RR/ in bankruptcy with its parent rock company in Colorado Springs) owns a majority share and UPRR still has the right to dispatch it.
(3) CC&RG has misrepresented itself to the city more than once as being sole owner and operator in the gorge and has been Canon City's sweetheart business partner more than once in helping drive the tourist business engine there. City of Canon City took over the old ATSF depot and leases part of it and the parking lot that CGRX/CC&RG uses to load and unload from in Canon City.
(4) Canon City "good old boys club "(city government) has an ego that has to be seen to be believed. They believe their word is absolute and common sense has departed that part of Fremont County. There have been previous clashes in the gorge moderated by the FRA and no party involved escaped a tonge lashing by FRA.
(5) Canon City & the bridge people are clueless about 49CFR214, railroad safety and because of (4) are throwing tantrums because they did not get rubber stamp approval.
(6) The profitability of the "tourist trap" has declined over the years and the current fuel crunch bodes ill for the City's cash cow.

Sit back and watch the circus. It's very possible that Canon City will shoot itself in the foot while CC&RG faces hardships caused by its own arrogance. Then there's the problems with hikers in the bottom of the gorge, the rafters (anybody noticed the ambulance backboards lashed to trees and railroad appliances every 1/2 mile down the gorge?) and the misinformed local media in Pueblo... [X-)][X-)][(-D]

[locomutt]

QUOTE: Originally posted by mudchicken

You folks are only seeing a small part of the larger problem.

(1) City of Canon City owns the Royal Gorge Bridge and Tourist Trap amusement Park that goes with it.
(2) CC&RG is not the sole owner of the rail line at the bottom of the gorge. RRRR (Rock & Rail RR/ in bankruptcy with its parent rock company in Colorado Springs) owns a majority share and UPRR still has the right to dispatch it.
(3) CC&RG has misrepresented itself to the city more than once as being sole owner and operator in the gorge and has been Canon City's sweetheart business partner more than once in helping drive the tourist business engine there. City of Canon City took over the old ATSF depot and leases part of it and the parking lot that CGRX/CC&RG uses to load and unload from in Canon City.
(4) Canon City "good old boys club "(city government) has an ego that has to be seen to be believed. They believe their word is absolute and common sense has departed that part of Fremont County. There have been previous clashes in the gorge moderated by the FRA and no party involved escaped a tonge lashing by FRA.
(5) Canon City & the bridge people are clueless about 49CFR214, railroad safety and because of (4) are throwing tantrums because they did not get rubber stamp approval.
(6) The profitability of the "tourist trap" has declined over the years and the current fuel crunch bodes ill for the City's cash cow.

Sit back and watch the circus. It's very possible that Canon City will shoot itself in the foot while CC&RG faces hardships caused by its own arrogance. Then there's the problems with hikers in the bottom of the gorge, the rafters (anybody noticed the ambulance backboards lashed to trees and railroad appliances every 1/2 mile down the gorge?) and the misinformed local media in Pueblo... [X-)][X-)][(-D]

Mudchicken,
Shoot themselves in the foot[?]

I know were both being polite,and politically correct!
But I can think of another place of anatomomy they should be shot!

[Clutch Cargo]

Shot in the *** or Foot.
You would have to be a "Seriously Wacked out Individual" to jump off of that bridge.

Kurt

[Anonymous]

MC 1--City Fathers 0

The whole idea sounds like a big lawsuit and a funeral or two (that's the REALLY bad part) just looking for a time to happen. Does Colorado law allow suing municipal govt's for negligence or gross negligence???? I hate to say it, but we may have to just sit back and watch the show![(-D]

In all seriousness, my deepest condolences, in advance, to the families of the inevitable victims of this scheme, assuming they let them jump with no protection on the RR.

[Anonymous]

Ever see what happens to a 50lbs watermellon after you throw it off of a 10 story building? Like OUCH!
Or drive down a dark county road doing 100 mph and watch all the bugs start collecting on your windshield!
My point is,If thay let these morons bungee jump off the bridge there will be a hell of a mess on their hands,and I surly don't want to see the mess.
Tell you what,that's a hell of a long drop strait DOWN.OUCH!
BNSFfan.

[Mookie]

Dinner on the mystery train. Try to identify the body as it arrives on your plate, from above?

Am I reading this right?

Mook

[rrnut282]

As if the train crews don't have enough to look out for going through there, hikers, beached whitewater rafters, rock slides, wash outs, etc. Now they have to look up and beware, too, hoping their windshield wipers are up to the task.

[Anonymous]

Just to set the record straight. The CC&RG and RRRR each own 50% of the rails through the gorge. The negotiations for these games are being dealt with by the CC&RG and not RRRR because the city cannot threaten to evict RRRR from the depot. CC&RG has even brought this point up to the city council that they themselves cannot make the final decision. RRRR is also against the events as they have just been taken over by new management and plan to reopen the quarry in Parkdale this summer. RRRR approved the games last year because they were not running any trains through the gorge at that time.

The CC&RG has always tried to work with the city, the rafters, and the hikers. The CC&RG paid $40,000 to pave the public parking lot next to the depot. At no cost, the CC&RG has always assisted in the evacuation of injured rafters, hikers, or fisherman. The CC&RG has even helped the bridge by hauling parts and crews in by rail to repair the incline railroad.

By no means is the CC&RG perfect in every way. But the point of this forum was to inform the public of how local governments can manipulate and screw businesses to meet their own needs.

[daveklepper]

Isn't there anyone willing to go there and talk common sense to these folks? Someone from Operation Lifesaver? Common sense there will save lives, won't it?
Some Hoghead with experience?

[Mookie]

QUOTE: Originally posted by daveklepper

Isn't there anyone willing to go there and talk common sense to these folks? Someone from Operation Lifesaver? Common sense there will save lives, won't it?
Some Hoghead with experience?

And that silly Common Sense comes to the surface again!!!!! We must work to capture it and bury it again!

Mook

[mudchicken]

update

http://www.canoncitydailyrecord.com/Local/Railroad,%20bridge%20progress%20toward%20agreement%206-10-04.htm

[mudchicken]

Latest sabre rattling & bonehead moves...

http://www.canoncitydailyrecord.com/Local/Deadline%20set%20for%20railroad%206-22-04.htm

City/ Bridge Company "not threatening" the CCRG & RRRR?

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