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What can engineers do?

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Posted by wabash1 on Thursday, January 14, 2010 4:12 AM

ValleyX

If that newspaper is from another town and a couple of days old, I'm not going to worry about it.  I've have no opportunity or no means to get to Atlanta or St. Louis or some such town in the last couple of days and I'll make that argument.  However, if that newspaper is local, I'm not leaving it on the engine, not even in the trashbag.  I've heard about the management so desperate to nail a crew that they go, in essence, dumpster-diving.  Such a job they have!

As for the rest of it, I fail to see why you leave your phone on, Wabash, if someone wants to leave you a message, it'll be there whether your phone was on or off.  Why risk it? 

Even if it is the USA today I am not taking someone else violation, We was getting trumped up charges against us just on newspapers alone and so we get on the radio and tell the yard master to have the shop come clean the engine, they told us to bag it and throw it out the window they pick it up later, every train was cleaned like that the yard was nasty and we was instructed not to throw trash out anymore and the trumped up charges dropped also. If they think they going to get me for someone elses newspaper then we are going to investigation.

As far as the phone goes what am I risking? Nothing they can not get into your grip for any reason unless you give them permission and you dont haft to show them your phone either, if you do then you deserve to get busted. but yes they did start calling your cell number to see if it would ring . they have yet to catch me. but ive been burned in the past by crooked trainmasters also, anytime one of those ( edit ) [ censered] come out to get on my engine the digital recorder is going, and it picks up real good,

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Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Thursday, January 14, 2010 7:39 AM

There's material for a good comedy bit or scene in a movie here.  The screenwriters in Hollywood - let alone ordinary people, like most of us here - couldn't make this stuff up.  Too bad an equivalent effort wasn't being devoted to getting the trains over the road, improving working conditions, beating the competition, etc.  As someone once said something like, ''The amount of fire directed against each other, dwarfs that which is directed against the common enemy''.

- Paul North.

"This Fascinating Railroad Business" (title of 1943 book by Robert Selph Henry of the AAR)
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Posted by kolechovski on Thursday, January 14, 2010 9:49 AM

Why would it matter if a cell phone rings?  It only matters if you answer it, right?  As for newspapers, why would it matter if it was out?  Even in the trash?  You could legitimitely have brought it with you on your way to work, had it with you (like in your bag) while comign aboard, not wasting time to find another trash can elsewhere.  Then, once on the engine, you could have simply unpacked ti while looking for other stuff within, or thrown it away then.  If they don't catch you reading it, how can they prove that you're actually breaking the rule?

But on what Wabash and others said, I'm sure there are plenty of crookeds looking for trumped-up charges like that.  I can't imagine what they get from it, but it is amazing the lengths some of them will go.  Still, innocent until proven guilty, right?  Let them go before a board and present actual proof of wrongdoing.  Most of them would fail, and after enough failures, would have grounds for being dismissed, right?  After all, they are being counterproductive...

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Posted by ValleyX on Thursday, January 14, 2010 10:29 AM

It matters because, if you're moving or if a crewmember is on the ground or engaged on some on-duty function, such as copying new additions to a dispatcher bulletin, it's supposed to be turned off.  So, if it rings, it's a violation.

Same goes for the newspaper but I'm not worrying about an old one from another town some distance away. 

But on what Wabash and others said, I'm sure there are plenty of crookeds looking for trumped-up charges like that.  I can't imagine what they get from it, but it is amazing the lengths some of them will go.  Still, innocent until proven guilty, right?  Let them go before a board and present actual proof of wrongdoing.  Most of them would fail, and after enough failures, would have grounds for being dismissed, right?  After all, they are being counterproductive...

Without saying much, the railroad is not like the rest of the world.  Not that I'd know much about the rest of the world.

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Posted by yellowducky on Thursday, January 14, 2010 11:42 AM

Things are sure different than when I worked on the B & O back in the early 70's.

We didn't have cell phones (they were outside) or laptops (what about lap-bottoms?)

CB's were illegal for train handling back then, but probably about half the train crew used their own walkie-talkies, and even loaned their's to a Trainmaster or Road Forman of Engines if asked.

The only real no-no was not having a RR approved time piece if an official asked for your Watch Card. 

FDM TRAIN up a child in the way he should go...Proverbs22:6 Garrett, home of The Garrett Railroaders, and other crazy people. The 5 basic food groups are: candy, poptarts, chocolate, pie, and filled donuts !
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Posted by wabash1 on Thursday, January 14, 2010 1:18 PM

kolechovski

Why would it matter if a cell phone rings?  It only matters if you answer it, right?  As for newspapers, why would it matter if it was out?  Even in the trash?  You could legitimitely have brought it with you on your way to work, had it with you (like in your bag) while comign aboard, not wasting time to find another trash can elsewhere.  Then, once on the engine, you could have simply unpacked ti while looking for other stuff within, or thrown it away then.  If they don't catch you reading it, how can they prove that you're actually breaking the rule?

But on what Wabash and others said, I'm sure there are plenty of crookeds looking for trumped-up charges like that.  I can't imagine what they get from it, but it is amazing the lengths some of them will go.  Still, innocent until proven guilty, right?  Let them go before a board and present actual proof of wrongdoing.  Most of them would fail, and after enough failures, would have grounds for being dismissed, right?  After all, they are being counterproductive...

spoken as a true non-railroader, In the railroad world the more stuff a trainmaster catches or trumps up. It shows his worth and he advances from this, it got so bad at one time that trainmasters was stabbing each other in the back for recognition, and remember this is railroad not the real world you are guilty til they prove you even more guilty. The railroads dont care about moving frieght they are concerned about your saftey

Just so you know If the phone rings your in violation, if the phone is on your in violation, Zug and Valley I never said it wasnt in violation i said how they gonna catch you if they have no rights to your phone and no rights in your grip. why have phone on because if someone calls and does not leave a message there is a record of who called if phone is off there is no record.

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Posted by zugmann on Thursday, January 14, 2010 4:02 PM

If they didn't leave a message, then it must not be important....

 

Seems like a lot of work to skirt the regulations (but maybe that's just me).

 

  

The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of

my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.

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Posted by wabash1 on Friday, January 15, 2010 4:52 AM

I didnt say it had to be important i just wanted to know who called, and if there is an emergency at home i want to know the family can call and leave the message then when i stop i can retrieve it. Oh and dont say call the dispatcher and have them get ahold of me.that dont work.

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Posted by blownout cylinder on Friday, January 15, 2010 11:09 AM

In my line of work we don't have people running around worrying about whether or not someone is using a cellphone. I've enough issues seeing that the worker is there and was doing their job. I trust others to use their common sense---I know I know---to not use cell phones while at work for personal reasons. Unless in an emergency.

Maybe trust is rare-----or is it medium rare-----oh bother---

Any argument carried far enough will end up in Semantics--Hartz's law of rhetoric Emerald. Leemer and Southern The route of the Sceptre Express Barry

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Posted by ValleyX on Friday, January 15, 2010 11:35 AM

yellowducky

Things are sure different than when I worked on the B & O back in the early 70's.

We didn't have cell phones (they were outside) or laptops (what about lap-bottoms?)

CB's were illegal for train handling back then, but probably about half the train crew used their own walkie-talkies, and even loaned their's to a Trainmaster or Road Forman of Engines if asked.

The only real no-no was not having a RR approved time piece if an official asked for your Watch Card. 

As one who railroaded then and is still at it for a little while longer, you cannot not speak more truthful words than, "Things sure are different. . ." 

Never got asked for a watch card on the N&W, though, I only knew one old conductor who kept his up.

There's a lot of other things that used to be done that aren't anymore, we don't even need to go there, maybe when I'm safely retired.

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