Hi Again Quentin,
Yes, that could happen, but most modern FREDs will send a signal to the cab indicating the train line pressure(or lack of) at the rear of the train, this would alert the engineer that he didn't have a fully charged train, which should result in the train being "walked" to find the problem.
I believe, that it is a requirement that the train be "walked" before departure to inspect for things such as that. I would imagine that when the person inspecting the train reaches the rear, they would crack the angle valve to assure that there is air all the way to the back of the train. I do similiar to this when I pull doubles at work(Iam a truck driver) During my pretrip inspection, with the tractor brakes set, I release the trailer brakes and pull down on the trailer brake hand valve. Doing this charges both the SUPPLY line ( sometimes also called the EMERGENCY line) and the service line, this allows me to listen for air leaks while doing my Walk Around Inspection. Then when I get to the rear of the truck, I crack each of the Supply and Service valves at the back of the rear trailer checking for air pressure.
Recently doing this I was able to catch a closed service line valve on the back of the lead trailer, on a set of doubles that someone else had put together. If I hadn't pulled the hand valve, I may have missed the closed valve, as on that trailer they are in a hard to see location, I could have left the yard with just the brakes on the front trailer only working. It was an empty return to Portland, OR from Tacoma, Wa I probably wouldn't have had a problem stopping, but I don't want to think about the ticket that I would have gotten if the Kelso weigh station had inspected me that day.
Doug
May your flanges always stay BETWEEN the rails
At the originating terminal where a train is made up, it receives an intial terminal test. Simply put, this requires that the train brake line is charged to a certain level indicated by an air gauge at the end of the train, to make sure air is all the way through the train. A working EOT can be used for the gauge or it can be a hand held gauge.
Once the train is charged to the required level, the brakes are set up and each car checked to make sure it's brakes have applied. Once the entire train is checked, the brakes are released and again checked. The inspection for the release can be done while the train departs. Somewhere during this test brake pipe leakage is also checked. There are two methods that can be used, leakage can't exceed 60 CFM or 5 psi per minute. Cars that have brakes that are defective are set out. At the initial terminal 100% of the brakes must be working before a train can depart.
At intermediate points, any new cars added must have the initial terminal test done to them. Cars already on the train normally don't have to be inspected again. There are miliage limits that may require a train to be retested at some point. Also, if a train is disconnected from it's air source for longer than 4 hours, an initial terminal test of all the cars off air is again required.
Any time the brake pipe is changed by adding or setting out cars or engines, a continuity test is performed. The brakes on the rear car must set and release. This can be done by visually inspecting the rear car, or by seeing a reduction on the EOT of 5 psi or more when the brakes are set and then a 5 psi or more when they are released fulfill this requirement.
Jeff
I watched two episodes over the weekend, the coal train episode on my computer and the reefer train episode on cable on Sunday. After reading all that has been written about the series, and having to agree that the host is really "over the top" with his enthusiasm, I really enjoyed my two episodes.
challenger3980(Iam a truck driver) During my pretrip inspection, with the tractor brakes set, I release the trailer brakes and pull down on the trailer brake hand valve
Very interesting Doug.....Way back in the dark ages I was involved in testing transmissions on trucks and had a little experience with the air set up on tractor and trailer. Sounds like you did yourself a measure of safety by the good "walk around" inspection on your rig....One can stay healthy longer that way, for sure.
Quentin
eolafan I watched two episodes over the weekend, the coal train episode on my computer and the reefer train episode on cable on Sunday. After reading all that has been written about the series, and having to agree that the host is really "over the top" with his enthusiasm, I really enjoyed my two episodes.
Hey Kids,What time is it ?
Its Extrreeeeeeeem Train Time ! With that over the top,over excited ,sometimes shouting host Maaattttt Brown ! Tonight on The History Ch. 10/9c
Hey, thanks - forgot all about it. Here's the description - it's UP 844:
Extreme Trains: Steam Train
"The Union Pacific's historic 844 steam locomotive is the longest running steam train in America. Built in 1944, it has never been retired and still runs on UP's mainlines today. The 844 is so popular that when it goes out on the tracks a huge traffic jam forms on the roads along side as people "chase the train." Host Matt Bown rides the 844 on its annual outing that takes 750 rail fans from Denver to the biggest rodeo in the world in Cheyenne, Wyoming. This episode also looks at the gold rush of the 1850s."
10:00 Pm Eastern Standard.
And, for those of you who didn't see it the last time - or want to see it again - immediately following is:
Mega- Disasters: Glow Train Catastrophe - the possibility of a wreck of a nuclear waste train to Yucca Mountain, in the middle of Las Vegas.
From the reviews here the last time: Don't fail to miss it !
- Paul North.
So I saw the first three episodes on ITunes and now the previous episode and tonights episode has not been loaded?? WTF?? I kind of enjoyed watching them and would atleast like to see the series. Anybody know when they are going to be uploaded to ITunes? Anywhere else I can see them on the net? I don't have the History Channel so watching it on T.V. is out for me.
I miss this week episode again!
Just watched it, and Wow, great shots of that beautiful machine.... The host was a bit obnoxious again, but wasn't as bad as he has been. I feel that the complete lack of mention of Wyoming in thier Reefer episode was redeemed with the shots of Cheyenne and talk of the city. It also seems kind of fitting that they showed the Frontier Days Rodeo Train Episode on the 6th round Tuesday of the 50th Annual National Finals Rodeo. The only gripe I have is a big one..... if you are gonna mention something historical get ALL the history... The gangplank was not "discovered" by Dodge, He enlisted the services of famed mountian man Jim Bridger who had used the route to get his wares from trapping as well as travellers over the Snowy, and Sierra Madre mountians. But even he did not discover it... It was origonally used by the Indians in their seasonal migrations. The Gangplank is actually an almost perfectly correlated surface sloping eastward starting at Rawlins, and then a portion is cut out by the valley now occupied by Laramie, and then resumes on Sherman hill, and drops into Cheyenne. In the morning I will find it in my notes and scan the diagram....
RJ
"Something hidden, Go and find it. Go and look behind the ranges, Something lost behind the ranges. Lost and waiting for you. Go." The Explorers - Rudyard Kipling
http://sweetwater-photography.com/
Agreed, The 844 is a beautiful and remarkable machine--as is the 3985. Steve Lee and his Steam Crew deserve much praise for their care, and feeding of these brutes. Matt Blum (the conductor, and narrator) is obnoxious in his exuberance. His script seems written mostly on a grade school level, what with the constant repetition of statements; statements which seem more to kill air time than inform. IMO I have found judicious use of the mute button seems to make the photography much more paletable. EXTREME TRAINS will never replace the dedicated video products, but it does help give one some enjoyment in the real world operations daily rail operations.
I wish they'd have at least shown the 3985. Well aside from the quick front end flash of it in the shop. You could see the E units in the background in one of the shots too. My biggest gripe is that there is always so much cool stuff around them that they don't show and what they do show passes by really quickly. If they are going to call the Cheyenne roundhouse "the busiest steam shop in the country", they should have at least shown what else is in there. With only 2 active engines that shouldn't have been hard to do. I think there are probably a couple of steam shops that stay busier though but obviously aren't class 1 railroads.
The 844 had the Centennial behind it. Not even a mention of it at all. He also mentions that the UP passenger cars are "among the oldest in the country". Hardly. There are much older passenger cars around than those although theirs are probably the nicest.
I'm always excited to see the show and am happy that we have it but every episode leaves me a little disappointed as you can see all of the missed opportunities in the background that could have made a really great show. I'm getting used to the host. He's annoying but I can tolerate it.
Do they really need the exploitative "Glow Train" silliness?
Those train cars are pretty inert. Youtube is filled with test crashes of the flasks.
samfp1943 Agreed, The 844 is a beautiful and remarkable machine--as is the 3985. Steve Lee and his Steam Crew deserve much praise for their care, and feeding of these brutes. Matt Blum (the conductor, and narrator) is obnoxious in his exuberance. His script seems written mostly on a grade school level, what with the constant repetition of statements; statements which seem more to kill air time than inform. IMO I have found judicious use of the mute button seems to make the photography much more paletable. EXTREME TRAINS will never replace the dedicated video products, but it does help give one some enjoyment in the real world operations daily rail operations.
I do not like being told the same thing over and over again, especially when I am really familiar with the subject. How many of the people who have seen and will see these episodes are as familiar with railroad operations as the contributors to the Trains forums are? Now, for one reason or another, I have not seen any of these episodes; I have thought about doing so, but did not get to it, so I do not know how bothersome the repetition really is. I do know, however, that the reported excitement that the host has shown would really irritate me.
If young people can be given an interest in railroading, perhaps they will be supporters of rail transportation when they grow up. Stating something twice may help get their interest. A question: Does the host use the same phrasing when he says something again, or does he rephrase it? I do get weary of hearing the same thing over and over again, but if it is rephrased it is not as irritating and can even be more understandable.
Johnny
fredswain I wish they'd have at least shown the 3985. Well aside from the quick front end flash of it in the shop. You could see the E units in the background in one of the shots too. My biggest gripe is that there is always so much cool stuff around them that they don't show and what they do show passes by really quickly. If they are going to call the Cheyenne roundhouse "the busiest steam shop in the country", they should have at least shown what else is in there. With only 2 active engines that shouldn't have been hard to do. I think there are probably a couple of steam shops that stay busier though but obviously aren't class 1 railroads. The 844 had the Centennial behind it. Not even a mention of it at all. He also mentions that the UP passenger cars are "among the oldest in the country". Hardly. There are much older passenger cars around than those although theirs are probably the nicest. I'm always excited to see the show and am happy that we have it but every episode leaves me a little disappointed as you can see all of the missed opportunities in the background that could have made a really great show. I'm getting used to the host. He's annoying but I can tolerate it.
There is another brief glimpse of the 3985 during the sequence showing the fueling of the 844 when Matt Brown is standing on top of the tender. The Challenger is actually sitting on a track next to the 844. I had to hit the freeze button on my DVR to confirm it. You can clearly see that there is boiler work going on on the 3985...I wonder who excluded the 3985 from the show, the producers or UP?
I would have liked them to have mentioned the Centennial but then again, the topic of the episode is Steam locomotives..
"I Often Dream of Trains"-From the Album of the Same Name by Robyn Hitchcock
Well I watched the "Steam Train" episode, and it was a lot better in many ways compared to last week's. The shots of 844 were awesome (and most of them wern't sped up!), and there were only a couple parts in the show where the camera jerked from scene to scene in split seconds. Lots of interesting subjects, like the information about the Art Lockman car (I hadn't realized it was a tool car), adding steam into the engine before firing it up, splitting the train in Denver Union Station, etc.
But, I have to agree that there were many things left out of the show that would have made it more interesting. Like others have commented, we see 3985 at the steam shop in Cheyenne but it is never mentioned by the host. In fact, it wouldn't have been mentioned at all if one railfan on the train didn't say anything. At the steam shop, I noticed a huge amout of rolling stock around the sheds, but noting was ever said about any of it. The Centennial was pulled on 844's train, both to Denver and back, but it was never mentioned. Most people who noticed it probably didn't realize 844 was pulling the largest operable diesel locomotive in the world. And in Denver, we see the Rio Grande Ski Train on one of the station tracks, and even though the cameras get really close to it, it, too, is never mentioned at all.
Another thing I found discouraging was when Matt got on the train and said he was going to talk to some railfans, he never really talked to any real railfans. The people singing in the one car looked like they had name tags on, like they were paid to come on the train or something. The people he talked to briefly that were dressed up wild-west style didn't look much like railfans, either. The only real railfan he talked to was the guy standing in the vestibule of the cars recording the sounds of the train. We don't get to see any real foamers.
And the show seemed to end abrubtly. I was expecting to see a final shot of 844 or something, but instead the show ended at the rodeo. Not that big a deal, but still...
Hey Kids !
I see most everyone watch last night's episode, and I am glad to see you like this one the best ! SO DID I ! There is no better looking,sounding locomotive in the world than UP 844 ! I love it ! Iv seen 3985 several times and have chased it and got miles of video but it just aint as pretty as 844, man o man ! I see now why they called them greyhounds...Did everyone catch the railfan recording the whistle and train noise ? Thats me made over LOL ! I too have an 844 HO model that I pull my UP passenger cars with...About the Centennial unit,I was surprised that nothing was said about it,also I was surprised to learn they had to steam up the 844 the way they did,I guess thats because of its age? Well, maybe all of our questions will be answered in the next 3 episodes,I hope so anyway...I also like the way he mentioned railfans and rodeo fans..Was the guy and his 2 sons singing, railfans or rodeo fans?
OH Yeah Matt, He was tolerable as some one previously said last night and his antics werent as pronounced as in previous episodes,this worked for me...
The 844 looked very nice - all polished up, and the aerial views were great. For sure, I'll now have to put seeing her "live" on my "bucket" list ! Really enjoyed watching the rods go around - that's something to see, that long silvery bar rhythmically rising and falling inside that long wheelbase of rotating discs. And the shots from underneath on the ties as she passed overhead were neat - really get to see a different view of the running gear. Love that steamboat whistle, too.
But that said, there was still way too much of the "DANGER !" stuff* - "This thing could - [choose 1] - EXPLODE !!! " or " - DERAIL !!!" Yes, we know about boiler explosions - but although he pointed out the water glass, he never explained that there are multiple pumps and/ or injectors, plus a low-water alarm, plus the fusible plugs in the crown sheet. And even though he legitimately got in the history of several long-time ago boiler explosions, no mention of the 1995 (?) quasi-explosion of the boiler on the Gettysburg RR.
(* - Anybody else remember that stupid robot from the 1960's TV space drama with the "Space Family Robinson" - Lost in Space ? It always used to say, "Warning, Warning - Danger, Danger !!" On of my former co-workers used to do a pretty good imitation of that whenever his AutoCAD program would encounter a fault or corrupted file or something else that it didn't like.)
Also, for all of the valves and gauges on the 844, only a few were explained or mentioned - the whistle cord (chain), the water glass, and the firing handle. Nothing really about the throttle, or the reversing lever, adjusting the cut-off, the air brakes, or the valve gear and what it does, etc., etc.
But we got told time after time unto death that there were "750 railfans [mostly - "rodeo fans" a couple of times] that they had to get to Cheyenne". The guy and 2 boys singing were just hired performers, I thought - nothing there to tell that they were fans or "foamers" - even the song they performed, "Oh, Susannah" is folk or western, not a railroad song ! The one guy who came closest was really an HO modeler, who was taping the train to use for background sound on his model RR - no photo- or video-graphers, or even someone from the engineer's-hat-and-goggles crowd.
But 844 was the show, and the UP RR came off really well. If we could only separate out the host's portion of the soundtrack and mute just that - and leave in the 844 and the train crew's comments - then we'd have something !
If you think Matt's "it could explode" every 15 minutes was annoying, did you stay tuned for the "Glow Train" show that followed? Talk about paranoia. They kept showing a mushroom cloud superimposed on a Las Vegas shot. I turned it off in disgust, the show was so slanted.
rrnut282If you think Matt's "it could explode" every 15 minutes was annoying, did you stay tuned for the "Glow Train" show that followed? Talk about paranoia. They kept showing a mushroom cloud superimposed on a Las Vegas shot. I turned it off in disgust, the show was so slanted.
That is becasue society today is only interested in Global Crisis..... so the media uses that to generate interest....
Aids, SARS, Bird Flu, Global Warming, Rainforest Deforestation, El Nino. Just a few of the examples of how that worked in history...... Notice how most of them rose quickly in the media attention, and then after a while faded out because of another global crisis?
.....Everything has been covered that I saw and would have complained about. Do enjoy seeing that great steamer 844 in what must be excellent running condition.
Watching from a pacing vehicle as the driving rods flashed around at speed just boggles my mind how those pieces do stay together. I realize everything has been sized via the engineers of design to be able to do the job....it really is fascinating.
A beautiful steam engine in such shape still available for us to see doing it's job is wonderful and a real machine of beauty. Glad to get to see it perform. Now if somehow Matt would be reprogrammed to a more suitable dialog and presentation.
Some of the best camera work I've seen so far, as long as it was directed at the train (I just watched it tonight). UP comes off looking pretty good.
He pushed a button. Big deal! He moved the turntable. Bigger deal (and how'd he get it to speed up that way?)! He threw a switch. Even bigger deal--but you don't get to see how that works.
So much more could have been shown (Pat's less of a railfan than I--having to answer her questions gives me a fairly good idea of issues that could have been addressed, but weren't).
Anyone else find it interesting that he didn't offer to help out or ride at the rodeo?
Carl
Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)
CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)
CShaveRR Anyone else find it interesting that he didn't offer to help out or ride at the rodeo?
......I'd say he wants to stay around for his day job Carl....
All I can say is my wife now has a better (if only elementary level) of the whole railroad thingy. ;)
Modelcar .....Everything has been covered that I saw and would have complained about. Do enjoy seeing that great steamer 844 in what must be excellent running condition. Watching from a pacing vehicle as the driving rods flashed around at speed just boggles my mind how those pieces do stay together. I realize everything has been sized via the engineers of design to be able to do the job....it really is fascinating.A beautiful steam engine in such shape still available for us to see doing it's job is wonderful and a real machine of beauty. Glad to get to see it perform. Now if somehow Matt would be reprogrammed to a more suitable dialog and presentation.
To quote you paragraph Quentin,
All that stuff going round and round and in and out at the same time I would agree ! 844 is poetry in motion !
I was wondering about something. I keep seeing a car with dynamic brake fans on its roof during the Steam Train episode and I finally got to see the locomotive around 00:58:00 helping the 844.
Before their CEO died the NYS&W had a steam program but the locomotive was always assisted by another unit. I'm not sure they will still run the Mikado since the forums have reported sales of their stock and they cleaned out their Butler yard of some old stock.
One question I do have. In the steam days, how long is the consist of an engine like the 844? Surely not the huge consist on the Extreme Trains Steam episode?
I watched the 844 episode in a motel room Tues. Last night I watched it at home on my 57" HD. All I can say is "WOW" Great camera work. This episode is the best one so far. Matt is starting to grow on me. If you all get a chance, watch the show in HiDef. It is "Awesome"
aegrotatio I was wondering about something. I keep seeing a car with dynamic brake fans on its roof during the Steam Train episode and I finally got to see the locomotive around 00:58:00 helping the 844. Before their CEO died the NYS&W had a steam program but the locomotive was always assisted by another unit. I'm not sure they will still run the Mikado since the forums have reported sales of their stock and they cleaned out their Butler yard of some old stock. One question I do have. In the steam days, how long is the consist of an engine like the 844? Surely not the huge consist on the Extreme Trains Steam episode? I believe the car your talking about is the generator car that furnishes heat and elec.to the passenger cars..I dont think passenger trains use dynamic braking...Someone correct me if Im wrong...
I believe the car your talking about is the generator car that furnishes heat and elec.to the passenger cars..I dont think passenger trains use dynamic braking...Someone correct me if Im wrong...
aegrotatio I was wondering about something. I keep seeing a car with dynamic brake fans on its roof during the Steam Train episode and I finally got to see the locomotive around 00:58:00 helping the 844. One question I do have. In the steam days, how long is the consist of an engine like the 844? Surely not the huge consist on the Extreme Trains Steam episode?
I think you are seeing the HEP generator car, OR it could be the Centennial locomotive that was helping the 844 due to the very large consist (I think Matt said 28 cars).
A normal consist for an 800 "back in the day" would have generally topped out at 15 or 16 cars.
Mike
aegrotatio I was wondering about something. I keep seeing a car with dynamic brake fans on its roof during the Steam Train episode and I finally got to see the locomotive around 00:58:00 helping the 844.
I was privileged to visit the Cheyenne roundhouse a couple years ago. The host - the steam engineer - said there is always a diesel in the consist every time they put the steam locomotive on the road. He said that assures the railroad that they will be able to clear the track in case the locomotive falters.
When I was there, 844 and 3985 were both in residence. 844's trailing truck was lowered. 5511 and 838 were there too, 838 a shadow of her former self.
John
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