abandoned lines

[Anonymous]

Thanks Quentin and deepspire for that information.  I do vaguely recall reading somewhere that there were two rail lines leading off of the curve.

Here is an interesting photo I found showing a train on the curve in the days of innocence:

http://www.docheritage.state.pa.us/pics/view.asp?id=16

Is that dark spot on the hill beyond the curve in the right side of the photograph just a tree?  It almost looks like a tunnel opening with something leading to it.

[trainfan1221]

I just explored Muleshoe on a trip a couple of months ago, it was neat and some say it was bet just as scenic as Horseshoe.  I guess we'll never know now.

[trainfan1221]

Sorry guys, but when it comes to abandoned railroads we here in New Jersey win hands down.  I'm not proud of that, mind you..

[J. Edgar]

neat....drag the image south and you can see "Muleshoe curve" which is now abandoned

[Zwingle]

The ROW for both abandoned Horseshoe Curve branches can be seen here.

http://www.flashearth.com/?lat=40.49823&lon=-78.485062&z=17.3&r=0&src=msa

 

[Modelcar]

.....Yes...To answer the question for Bucyrus.

You probably can find older photos on the "net" that will show there were two railroad branches leading off of the "Curve".

One where you spoke of and another on the other side....Going up a valley {on the curves outside}, similar as the one you mentioned.

I have noted the one you spoke of from the access road that comes in from the west.  I visited there just a few years ago again and was able to see bits and pieces of the row.  {The access road that brings one in under the curve...thru the tunnel}.

There was also a depot on the "Curve" years ago too.  Just on the Altoona side of where the "park" is located now.

You can find a photo of the depot too....

[Anonymous]

I don't know much about Pennsylvania, but I did get into the car once in the early 1970s, and drove there from Minnesota just to see Horseshoe Curve and the EBT.  In hiking around the woods on the outside of the curve just downgrade from the park, there was a valley running upgrade and away from the curve at a tangent.  I found a fairly prominent railroad grade running up that valley.  I recall there were some remaining details such as culverts, rock walls, etc. It looked rather inviting to follow it into the forest, but I only went a few hundred feet, not wanting to commit the time.  Somewhere since, I have read of the identification of this long abandoned line.  Apparently, it was an independent coal feeder railroad that made a junction with the PRR at the curve.  I vaguely recall the corporate name contained the word, "Lick."  Was there more than one of this kind of branch leaving the PRR at the curve?

[daveklepper]

Of course nearly all towns and cities had streetcar systems.   Sometimes one can find old track still in the street, lamp posts with parts of brackets that used to connect to span wire for trolley wire, attachments for span wire on sides of buildings, car houses converted to other uses, etc.

Of course in some cases, now, old track has been repaired and reused (Kenny Avenue, Dallas), or replaced by brand new track 40 or 50 years after that last streetcar was supposed to have been run (Howard Avenue, Baltimore; Canal Street, New Orleans).

Can someone list "resurected" freight railroads? 

[Kevin C. Smith]

Well, let's see if I can recall what I learned and saw of the C&NW in my hometown..

The first line through was the Saint Paul Eastern Grand Trunk (which, as I have pointed out before, was never within 200 miles of Saint Paul and-though it was east of it-was more a branch line than a trunk line and was never particularly grand in any way) which built from Oconto, WI to Clintonville, WI in 1880-1884. The only remaining active portion is from Stiles Junction to Oconto Falls (Escanaba & Lake Superior). The ROW from Oconto to Stiles Jct lasted until the 80's/90's and is pretty visible yet. From Oconto Falls west to Gillett was taken up just after WWII, I believe-the Gillett to Shawano portion didn't make it that long. From Oconto Falls to Shawano, I expect the ROW shows up (if at all) on satellite pictures as a fence or treeline but there are a few embankemnts and cuts that are visible from the roads if you know where to look. The bridge abutments over the Oconto River are still there, too.

The next line was built in stages over the next 10-20 years north to Iron River, MI and remains pretty much intact as a hiking trail (though not the entire length). All this went in the 80's, IIRC.

The final portion was a cutoff line south to Pulaski, WI built in 1906. It was also the last to go and remains pretty much intact but too overgrown to see easily. The (longer) bridge over the Oconto River remains in use for another hiking trail.

Four different lines, boxing the compass, and not a single one left!

[Zwingle]

My son and I were on vacation with the folks in Reading and went up to Knoebels (what a place!) amusement park. Going up route 61, I thought "Whoops, here's Frackville: you gotta see this". Went to far right center field, found a steep path littered with the debris of teenage debauchery, and stood on the foundations of the headhouse. Big as a canal lock with pieces of coal, ballast, crossties scattered around. The massive machinery, superstructure and view down the hill were all gone of course. But I could describe the operation to him and blew his mind.

http://www.flashearth.com/?lat=40.790746&lon=-76.235895&z=19.4&r=0&src=ggl

That looks like at one time it was a heck of an operation.

http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Acres/5200/Coal.htm

 

[MOPACnut]

I nominate Kansas as the abandoned rail line capital of the US. I made a map (by tracing a ks transportation map and gathering data from other sources) that shows the diffrence 100 (or more) years makes. At one point (1888) my county had 7 lines running through it. 4 Santa Fe (1st, 2nd, & Alma districts, plus a little known branch called the Osage City district (Osage City-Quenemo) which was nicknamed the peavine (yep the're were two)). 2 MO-PAC ( Osawatomie sub and the Ft. Scott-Topeka line, later cut back to Topeka-Lomax)). And UP had a line from Lawrence to Carbondale. Plus the're were 4 lines that were never built but were planned. The Lawrence & Emporia rr, KCM&O's Emporia-KC segment, an inter county one called the St Louis, Osage City, and walnut Valley. And MKT surveyed a line from Burlington to Quenemo.

Today the only lines left are the 1st one to be built in the county, ATSF's 1st district (1869), and the 2nd district, aka the transcon.

On another note. there's actually 2 abandoned MP Osawatomie subs. In 1930 MP built a new line next to the original from Rapp (w. of Osage City) to Council Grove. Nearly all of the original R of W is still visible, especially west of Bushong.

 And the only line built by the original rr is the ATSF 1st district. all others were smaller railroads that were bought out by ATSF, MP, and UP.

Want detailed info on these?

[U33B]

Northern Illinois has a few very intteresting examples. Noteworthy among them are the Aurora Elgin and Eastern, an interurban who's remants can still be identified among all the mini malls, housing subdivisions, and suburban sprawl on Chicagoland. Tracing the path of the Great Western is fun as well, much of the ROW has been converted into the Rails to Trails program. The CNW's line from McHenry to Lake Geneva is quite accessible as well. As for the North Shore, several sections on the Mundelien branch are evident from paralell rt 176. My new favorite is the comiclly misfortuned Woodstock and Sycamore Traction Co who's brief life during the early 1900's can still be traced, just barely, among the corn fields and rural roads of north central illinois. Great topic! This is always an unremarked sub-text to our hobby, good job! ~Kevin

[Modelcar]

....Rix:

Flash Earth is a good one to use for the satellite photos.

Bring up Flash Earth on Google...click on the words....install your address in little window at right bottom of screen.

I've found it works very well.

[rixflix]

I became interested (read fanatic) sbout railroads when 3-1/2 years old. In East Reading Pa we still had streetcars, the Pennsy and my beloved Reading Company to explore.

 My parents and grandparents were happy to describe the recently gone railroad facilities, the abandoned rural trolleys, the two mountain railroads with their long gone resorts and clubs, and every industrial site, church cemetary, roadhouse they could recall. My brothers and I ate this stuff up and since we had started a semi-feral summer life in the mountains on all sides, we explored them, the public library, and the historical society. Today, one brother has a regular museum and archive in his basement.

Then and since I've traced lines by foot, car, bicycle and often all three both around Reading, East Broad Top and where I currently live, Washington DC. Canals as well. Brambles, sock stickers, poison ivy and all.

Terraserver (I'm still figuring out Google Earth) is pretty good. I'd always wanted to see the Reading's Mahanoy Plane. It was taken out of service in the late 1930's but the railroad maintained it for awhile in case the Pennsy reneged on the Bear Run trackage rights. The bottom of the plane was called "The Foot" by locals and the headhouse was in Frackville. Terraserver's aerial photo showed the straight angled gash down the mountain starting at the NE corner of Frackville's athletic field.

My son and I were on vacation with the folks in Reading and went up to Knoebels (what a place!) amusement park. Going up route 61, I thought "Whoops, here's Frackville: you gotta see this". Went to far right center field, found a steep path littered with the debris of teenage debauchery, and stood on the foundations of the headhouse. Big as a canal lock with pieces of coal, ballast, crossties scattered around. The massive machinery, superstructure and view down the hill were all gone of course. But I could describe the operation to him and blew his mind.

Then at Knoebels he blew mine by making me ride the reconstructed wooden (from Texas?) coaster. Thanks Adrian! I will never ride another. Bump cars, YES!

When physically (I'm getting old enough to fear that word) tracing tracks, if you meet people along the way and they look friendly, tell them what you're doing and ask questions. You'd be surprised at the stories and clues you can get.

Rixflix

 

[choochoobuff]

This is a great site, I have already answered some questions that I have been pondering for a while.

[rickmc]

This PDF http://www.iowarail.com/railroads/maps/Chronology_06.pdf shows abandonments in Iowa.

 It was published in Trains as a 'Map of the Month' some time ago, and is available at the link above on the web.

Rick

[Modelcar]

.....Yes, I am one who admires looking and finding old ROW's.  I have interest in seeing how engineering was put to use to get from point A to point B.

Most of my hunting thru such areas has been in the home area of Pennsylvania.  Old coal hauling roads from all the mining towns scattered around in Western Pa.

Amazingly, much is still visible.  Satellite maps show lots still there to see.....

[Anonymous]

I perceive old railroad grades to be historical artifacts that help me feel or visualize the long gone era where they operated.  I think of the beehive of activity during the original grading and track laying and all the trains that puffed and clanked over them day and night, in all the seasons, as they outlasted the memories of generations of the people who worked them.  How many stories could those silent cuts and fills tell?

The old roadbeds do seem to endure relatively long in the west where population is sparser and there is little need to reclaim the land.  In the agricultural country of the Midwest, many railroad grades are gone without a trace.  Underground though, the artifacts are still there.  Railroad grades are littered with old iron; spikes, angle bars, track bolts, nuts, brake shoes, journal box lids, pieces of rail, brake beam hangers, brake rods and pins, couplers, coupler links and pins, draft gear parts, cast iron washers, pieces of firebox grates, etc.  Some still lie visible on the surface after a century or more.  Some of these generic parts from the 1800s can be quite different from their counterparts from the more recent era.  Nineteenth century journal box lids, for example, can be solid cast iron with the manufacturer's name or logo cast into the surface.  Many were not hinged, but rather, dropped into a tapered opening like a wedge.

Occasionally, one finds evidence of a wreck as a particularly dense profusion of iron parts, sometimes right on the surface or sticking out of the ground.  It is possible for these wreck sites to hold any fragment or part imaginable from rolling stock, locomotives, or track-work.  Never were all the pieces picked up when a wreck was cleared.  Out west, there are wrecks where rolling stock was simply left where it landed, and lies there today.

[Mr_Ash]

Lots of abandoned 3' narrow gauge lines in southern Colorado (D&RGW, RGS, C&S, DSP&P, F&CC, ext.) you can still see the row in alot of places on google earth. I went hiking on parts of the Rio Grande Southern many years back and there are still some remaining bridges & water tanks and even the remains of a tender from wreck.

Check out this site for info on RGS surving structures & equipment

http://rgsrr.home.comcast.net/~rgsrr/rgs/index.html

Also www.drgw.net and www.drgw.org have lots of info on the D&RGW with lots of old pictures & maps of equipment, structures & row

[inch53]

I can give a few here in east central and central Illinois.

NYC - Cairo line, from Paris to Cairo, gone. Some of the grades and bridges can still be found, along with a couple depots that I know of.

NYC's, Paris - Mattoon - Pana - St Louis, gone, some grades n bridges can also be found along IL-16.

PRR from Dennison - Paris - Decatur, gone, part of the grade can be found in places. I did hear of a trestle, a few mile south of Paris, but I haven't check it out yet.

NKP, Danville - Metcalf and Neoga - St Louis is gone. The Eastern Illinois RR runs Neoga - Metcalf section.

IC, Mattoon - Newton - Evansville gone. There are two left depots in Cumberland county.

B&O, Springfield to Shawnee town gone, but part of it from outside of Springfield - Taylorville - Pana went from rail to trail

C&EI, Danville - Villa Grove gone there is a couple depots still around as museums I believe.

Here's some link to help find other abandoned rails

http://www.abandonedrails.com/

This link I use to find some abandoned rail and old RR structures still around,

http://www.rrshs.org/

An inter-urban that ran from Terre Haute IN to Paris IL lasted from 1907 to 1931. There are two stations still around, Paris and Vermilion IL

Here's a link to some other inter-urban rail that's gone in Indiana,

 http://home.att.net/~burtontun/20THIandE.htm

[Looshi]

Using Microsoft's Live Search Maps and their ability to draw lines on the map I have outlined the complete Cincinnati and Lebanon Northern System.

http://maps.live.com/

 The CL&N began as a narrow gauge commuter line in the 1880's and converted to standard gauge in the early 20th century. The three lines listed in the map were eventually all bought and integrated under one company into the Pennsylvania system.

 Regular passenger service ended in the 1930's and parts of the line were abandoned as early as the 1950's. Today much of the line is abandoned and the parts remaining are disjointed. Short parts of the line near Norwood are used by the Indiana and Ohio to service industry, and a tourist train with a GP7 operates on the track around Lebanon and Mason.

 Using the "Bird's Eye View' feature it is easy to see details in the area around the line, some of which are 50+ years old. I consider the CL&N a facinating example of an Eastern Narrow Gauge and small pike with both urban and rual areas. I also have an album of photos, some of which still need to be uploaded.

[WCfan]

Around here we have the old CNW Kelly line. The line west to Marshfield was Abandoned a while ago. But the line East to Green Bay wasn't abandoned till later in 94 or 95. The line still goes out to Kelly for a little ways. But then is a bike train to Shanow.

The last one around here that I some what know of is the CNW line that paralleled the MILW to Mosinee. It was abandoned a while ago. But the CNW went to the mill in Rothschild not to long ago. The tracks are still hiding in a row of trees.

[al-in-chgo]

I guess the best-known example on Chicago's North Side is the former NORTH Shore interurban line, that ceased operations in 1963.  The main line ran thru Wilmette (just above Evanston); the alternate "Skokie Valley Route" was partially reactivated by the CTA and runs from Howard Station on the Chicago/Evanston border to Skokie as the "Skokie Swift."  [ Sad to say the Swift went off Skokie cat last year but happy to say it runs weekends again, the first time in many years.]

IIRC, farther north the former North Shore route parallels one of the Milwaukee-bound lines heading north from Chicago (UP North by Metra? CP thru Rondout?  Help me, someone!  ), and much of it is a bicycle path.   IOW except for the fact there are no visible trolley tracks in Wimette, a lot of it is still recognizable.  Even north of the Skokie Swift's terminus at Dempster Ave. near I-94 in Skokie, the patch to the near north is a utility easement, but buffs who "read" landscape and infrastructure well will guess it to be what is once was, ROW. 

 

 

[Modelcar]

Beautiful photos.....Must take time to check them all.

Now I have done so....Awesome, awesome photos....!!

[Anonymous]

I have always been intrigued by abandoned railroad beds, especially if they retain a lot of character such as cuts and fills, remains of trestles, bridges, tunnels, etc.  Here is a beauty presented in lots of photos including some reference photos of the trains during the time of operation: http://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,108977

 

[J. Edgar]

MI had some Interurbans too i believe...but because of Henry Furd they disappereared quick....

[Modelcar]

.....Lots of abandoned interurban lines in Indiana too.

[J. Edgar]

the south half of the lower pennisula of MI is criss crossed with abandoned lines...mostly old MC/LS&MS ...i also use Flash earth for over head mapping....i would also look at IN OH and IL...more old rail lines then roads it seems

[Ishmael]

The line running parallel to US-412 in Dunklin County, MO would have been a branch of the Frisco. They served Kennett, and particularly the Kennett Cotton Oil Company. I don't know where the branch originated, but the last time I was down there was when the Frisco was still independent and running black and gold GP9s.

There were a number of lines built by Louis Houck, radiating out of Cape Girardeau, MO. They've been abandoned since the 30's, in fact SE Mo was still mostly swamp at the time. I have photos of the remains of a RR called the Saline Valley Railroad, abandoned about 1913. There are still wood trestle pilings in Saline Creek and some roadbed. This is in Perry County, MO.

There are a lot of others here in MO, you also have a good many in Arkansas. I understood there was a segment of the Mo. & North Ark., running between Cotton Plant and Fargo. I was doing a lot of work on the Houck lines, but other things got in the way and now I'm too lame to tromp through the woods like I used to.

[Modelcar]

....Note:  If you are successful in bringing up "flash earth" site....click on those words to bring up the screen to find the address window down at the right bottom side of the screen.