286,000 lb question

[CShaveRR]

QM,

The "219000" figure you were reading on the car sides was the load limit--"LD LMT".

Next time, read both the "LD LMT" and the "LT WT" figure and add the two up. The answer should be precisely 286000.

That's the gross rail load--the weight of the load, plus the weight of the car itself.


Now, as for your monster tank cars with more than four axles, the gross rail load will be higher than 286K, just because there are more than four axles to support it. My guess would be that the gross rail load on such a six-axle tank car would be based on the old 263K standard, multiplied by 1.5 (because there are six axles instead of four), or somewhere around 395K.

And for those of you who want to see pictures of some of these monsters, there's a site devoted to them:

http://railwhales.railspot.com/

Carl

[mudchicken]

Saw plenty of 'em around the LA refineries, assume Ed sees "just a few" too. Switch crews in LA referred to them as "rolling bombs", especially the propane versions.

[TH&B]

The centipeed tenders (like those on UP844) has 5 axles in a row. Pennsy had 4 axle tender trucks. Sure two axle trucks are truely flexable on bad or sharp curved track, but 3 or more axles are a good way to spread weight when on good track like a main line should have. Germany uses 5 axle trucks on hot bottle cars, but they run on good track.
-ps; Carl very interesting website.

[edblysard]

See them all the time.
Yup, rolling bombs are a good description.
The trucks are buckeye trucks, the third axle member is pinned to the solid two axle truck, and can move or flex up and down.
Huge spread bolsters.
Some of the older ones have puncture plates or shields on the ends, in case of a derailment, the trailing cars knuckle wont punch a hole in the headcap.

Ed

[Modelcar]

...CShaveRR: Yes, I overlooked that of adding the 2 figures together....And that's going to be a little tough to do as I drive...but just a bit more of info. Today as I drove past another cut of them were placed there and the LD LMT of that group was 223,000.

[broncoman]

QUOTE: Originally posted by PNWRMNM

Broncoman,

Any short line handling open or covered hoppers has the problem. Even paper mills want 286K boxcars. Root problem is that marketing is offering incetive rates with too much incentive!

I don't know a figure so I won't give one, but it seems many of the rice elevators in my part of the country are only accessed by shortlines. Most were spin-offs from Class 1s. It would seem hard for say UP to market a rate when they still need the short line to get it from an elevator to a main line. It seem like the capital to build a new elevator would be huge compared to that of upgrading 10 miles worth of track, given the cost of real estate in CA, especially if you can find it near a main line.

[Anonymous]

Broncoman: I bet if you check the appropriate short lines' web sites, you'll find that many if not all accept 286K cars, at least as far as the rice elevator.

You're correct that it's cheaper to upgrade 10 miles of track (assuming no bridges) than it is to build an elevator. But you don't need to build an elevator -- you can store the grain in the old elevator next to your now-defunct short line, then truck to the main line and use a simple jackscrew to load the car. Or, if you're moving a lot of grain, build a simple loading facility. Many main-line elevators built in recent years have no storage capacity at all; they merely are a transloading point and most of the cost is a track long enough to hold 220 cars (110 empties on one side become 110 loads on the other).

Because all grain starts in a truck, it can easily stay there a few more miles.

Grain is a business of tons and pennies. Most of the decisions on how to handle it turn on a few pennies a ton, but since there's lots of tons, even a penny a ton matters very quickly.

[Anonymous]

CONGRESS JUST GIVE POOR SHORT LINES THE MONEY AND STOP SPECIAL INTERASTS CONTOLLING WASHINGTON

[Anonymous]

I have the feeling I would feel a little uneasy about riding in a loco in front of one of these things....

[broncoman]

Thanks for the information Mark. The place that I work gives me a front row seat to the Davis wye. California Northern is quite busy there. I have friends that use the elevator in Woodland, and was curious based on this topic. I will scope out some of the cars tomorrow.

[TH&B]

I like those big rail whales, they look COOL. I've only very rarely seen them in real on passing frieghts. That is what I want my share of tax $$$ to go to... more rail whale bombs 315K, bigger then ever, then I'll go rail fanning a little more often again.

[Modelcar]

...It seems out of place connected right to the engine where human lives are involved...One would think there would be at least several idler cars between that load and the power.

[jeaton]

Modelcar-I suspect that most railroader get a little nervous anytime tanks are enroute. Propane has to be the worst nightmare. I once made a stop at the IC's Baton Rouge yard (on business). Felt like I was sitting on a primed keg of powder with a two year old playing with matches.

I thought I'd figure the "savings" based on the car components of that four truck monster.

One (1) ea set coupler and housing.
One (1) ea set brake hose
Two (2) tank ends
One (1) ea set/load/discharge/safety valves
Two (2) placards
Guy who dreamed this up? PRICELESS

[Modelcar]

....Yes if that's Propane that would be an explosion to set records....I remember some years back there was some Propane cars or car explosion just east of kingman, Az. on the then Sante Fe and I was familiar with that area and from the description it caused damage in a wide radius.

[edblysard]

Mac,
Depends if the car is placarded as class 3 combustible, it is a perfect cover car.
See if you can find a haz-mat or placement in train handbook.
Can't tell from the photo, what color was the placard?
If it was red on top, and white on bottom, with the number 3 on it, or solid red with the 3, it is a combustible, with no restrictions in train placement.
If it was a hazardous car, it would have to have 5 non hazardous (cover)cars between it and the motor.
And, not to be too much of a smart alek, but it really dosnt matter where in the train it is, even 5 cars deep or deeper, if something that big goes boom, its time to bend over, grab your ankles and kiss you tail goodby!

Send me a e-mail address that supports photos, and I will send you a placement in train chart with the placards and what they mean.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[Hugh Jampton]

It's not propane. You can see what it is slopped down the sides from the top hatch. Propane doesn't do that.

[jeaton]

Hugh- Right on that point. For all, it could be salad oil or may even happen to be empty for that picture.

[TH&B]

Jeaton, don't understate the savings in those cars, it's 4 placards you save, not just two. I still say build more of them because they look so cool, and you can see all those wheels so clearly.

[jeaton]

Oops, my bad. Two more placards put it over the top, and I forgot the cool factor. Seriously-that is priceless.