Update as of Friday, January 6, 2012
Part I, Section F (of A-F)
The Future Colton Flyover and the SP Colton Depot in the Way
Colton, CA
It would seem that the water funneling system on the photo left will need to be relocated. Note all the overhead wires that will need to be moved also.
The residential sidewalk on 4th Street between the tracks and "K" Street (to the south) was out of service. The rails are barely seen where the sidewalk would normal be seen to end.
Note all the wires above the tracks that need to be relocated.
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After photographing the Colton Depot / Flyover scene, K.P. headed west on I-10 to see how the Milliken Ave. Flyover project was coming along on the eastern skirts of Ontario. But as the West Colton Yard's Receiving Yard was passed alongside, it was noted that the Receiving Yard was completely empty and something was brewing therein. Part II will deal with that, and will be posted tomorrow, Monday, January 9, 2011 by noontime Pacific Standard Time.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- K.P.’s absolute “theorem” from early, early childhood that he has seen over and over and over again: Those that CAUSE a problem in the first place will act the most violently if questioned or exposed.
K P--
Really enjoy your reporting on the progress of double tracking the Sunset route. I am wondering what type of a job you have that permits all the travel you do in documenting the progress?
Just a comment on the Herzog ballast train you saw:
I doubt that a train like that has any connection with the added track construction, at least during its initial phases. The intent of those trains is to dump their loads at moderately high speeds while the train is in motion (I think the "touted" dumping speed has been lowered from to time by reality checks.). It definitely couldn't be used to advantage on freshly-laid track with no ballast to begin with.
More likely to be seen when the new track receives ballast would be a string of remotely-controlled-dumping UP (now lettered SI, I guess) ballast hoppers being pushed at walking speed. Either that, or ballast spread by construction equipment from a large pile possibly unloaded by a "dump train" adjacent to existing track (not sure that a Dump Train can be unloaded in motion, or that would lead to an interesting third possibility!).
Carl
Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)
CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)
MikeF90 Per a post on another site the SP Colton depot and nearby buildings were in the process of being demolished yesterday. Too bad a local historical society couldn't have saved them.
Per a post on another site the SP Colton depot and nearby buildings were in the process of being demolished yesterday. Too bad a local historical society couldn't have saved them.
But what would it cost to move the building, and where would they put it?
A move was afoot a couple of years ago to save an old Harvey House in Seligman, Arizona, that the BNSF was going to demolish. Several locals protested and asked that the facility be spared and given to the City of Seligman. BNSF's reply was, "Okay, we'll donate it to you but you have to move it off railroad property. The building is reinforced, poured concrete with walls almost a foot thick. The interior is a hazmat site because of asbestos and lead paint inside and out. How many millions of dollars do you have to get it off our property?"
The building was demolished by the BNSF because the city couldn't afford even the cost of trying to move it. Seligman was on the old Route 66 but was bypassed when the Interstates were built. Amtrak doesn't stop there. The old Harvey House would not have been enough of a tourist attraction to entice visitors off Interstate 40.
This was much the same situation as in Casa Grande. The UP offered to donate the depot, provided it be moved off the property. The only difference was that the structure was too weak to move without incurring major structural damage. While this was being debated, transients started a fire, destroying it.
John Timm
desertdog . While this was being debated, transients started a fire, destroying it. John Timm
. While this was being debated, transients started a fire, destroying it.
Kind of like what happened to the old station at Marshalltown, Iowa. A new yard office had been built and the local historical groups started thinking about saving the old station. Until a fire burned it down.
I don't know if they ever determined the origin for the fire. The utilities had been shut off to the building. Someone with a cynical bent commented, "it's amazing what a fusee can do."
Jeff
Also the former Central RR of New Jersey station in Easton, PA, which was vacant and not in use when it was destroyed by an arson fire in 1974 or 1975. It had a great view across the "Two Rivers" confluence valley (Lehigh into the Delaware) and the rail lines, and was unique in that the eastern 1/3 of it was built on a girder framework over an adjoining street - see: http://www.thebluecomet.com/cnjeaston.jpg And here are the Lat./ Long. coords. for anyone who's interested: N 40.68672 W 75.21096
- Paul North.
Paul_D_North_Jr Also the former Central RR of New Jersey station in Easton, PA, which was vacant and not in use when it was destroyed by an arson fire in 1974 or 1975. It had a great view across the "Two Rivers" confluence valley (Lehigh into the Delaware) and the rail lines, and was unique in that the eastern 1/3 of it was built on a girder framework over an adjoining street - see: http://www.thebluecomet.com/cnjeaston.jpg And here are the Lat./ Long. coords. for anyone who's interested: N 40.68672 W 75.21096 - Paul North.
Paul,I remember it well from my days at Lehigh. Like the depot at Casa Grande, a very unique structure, worthy of preservation.
Part II (of I-III), Section A (of A-G)
The Receiving Yard at West Colton Yard
Bloomington / Fontana, CA
At the west end of the Receiving Yard, as viewed from the Sierra Ave. overpass looking eastward, Track 201 (center) was totally gone.
A closer look:
Also, a self-propelled Herzog train was at the west end of the Receiving Yard.
Continued in Section B
Part II, Section B (of A-G)
It soon departed the empty Receiving Yard westward for unknown parts and for an unknown activity. Four views looking eastward.
Continued in Section C
Part II, Section C (of A-G)
The Herzog equipment went out Track 100 and proceeded westward on the siding.
A heavy telephoto looking back east, towards the Cedar Ave. end (the background overpass). Most activity was at that eastern, background end.
Continued in Section D
Part II, Section D (of A-G)
A wide angle view from that east end, from Cedar Ave., that looks west at the empty Receiving Yard.
A closer westward view of the empty Receiving Yard with active Herzog equipment in view.
In the above view, Track 202 has the yellow Herzog equipment on it. Track 201 is photo right of it and is the track being worked on. The southernmost of three signals on the upper right west side cantilever signal bridge is the only visible one. That yard track only has a very short section under CTC control, hence, the single-bulb top head for red and flashing red.
A more telephoto view:
Continued in Section E
Part II, Section E (of A-G)
While the overpass has big chain link fencing to shoot pictures through, alarmingly a section has had an obstruction attached making viewing and photographing difficult.
When pointing the camera eastward, a massive earthquake struck and the hump track separated as the ground dropped in many places ...
Well, not really. But, the view sure has that illusion. Even though the Receiving Yard was empty at the time, the Bowl had much rolling stock in it.
The east side of Cedar Ave. does NOT currently have that obstructive, blocking fence-work.
Continued in Section F
Part II, Section F (of A-G)
While Bloomington and the freeway area has much city-like activity, Bloomington does have a somewhat ("somewhat") rural atmosphere ... as typified by horsepower of a different kind.
It must have been close to quitting time, because an EASTBOUND came into the Receiving Yard, and its power soon uncoupled and headed to the engine facility by Riverside Ave. further to the east. (The second unit was UP 9904, one of the new Tier 4 rebuilt SD60M's called SD59MX's.)
Continued in Section G
Part II, Section G (of A-G)
With an arrived train now in the Receiving Yard, and the sun shining from the west, the work day was drawing to a close. A bunch of vehicles was on the roadway next to Track 209.
K.P. was surprised to still find any rebuilding activity at West Colton Yard. It was thought that that was all done.
It is wondered when the future yard at Red Rock (AZ) will finally ever be started ... or if Santa Teresa (NM) will replace Red Rock before it is even started.
Finally, a side tidbit ...
Early readers of this thread may remember this August 13, 2009 tote boards photo depicting two of the overpass height units from West Colton Yard lying down at the Colton Signal Dept. grounds.
Several year ago new, LED based tote boards replaced those old, large, bulky, incandescent bulb ones at Pepper Ave. about three miles to the east of Cedar Ave. K.P. has never seen such replacements at Cedar Ave. But, the below photo ...
... proves that the new ones do exist at Cedar Ave.
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On Tuesday, January 10, 2012, a shorter Part III will show what was found at the Milliken Ave. Flyover site in Ontario, CA. Posting will be before noon Pacific Standard Time.
Part III (of I-III), Section A (of A-B)
The Milliken Ave. Flyover
Ontario, CA
K.P. was surprised at how high the west structure had become. View looks west from the north side of the track at Milliken Ave.
A different, west side view from Airport Drive, looking north:
The center support has had all the plastic wrapping removed on the new concrete-work on the photo right.
Part III, Section B (of A-B)
The close east walling, as viewed from the north side, is getting higher too
From the south side, a very heavy telephoto looking east: The difference in ground elevation is rather striking. Unlike at most times, very few worker vehicles were parked in this stretch. A lone distant "white hat" worker in a small vehicle approaching the camera gave further evidence things were winding down for the day.
Dirt had been built up on the near east's south side so that flyover structuring could easily be swung into position (when the workers were on scene).
This will conclude the three-part multi-section "Update as of Friday, January 6, 2012" series.
K. P. Harrier Update as of Friday, January 6, 2012 Part III (of I-III), Section A (of A-B) The Milliken Ave. Flyover Ontario, CA K.P. was surprised at how high the west structure had become. View looks west from the north side of the track at Milliken Ave. The center support has had all the plastic wrapping removed on the new concrete-work on the photo right. Continued in Section B
KP This method of raising the grade you show on the first picture would appear to have many applications here in the east. when the ROW is tight raising one track at a time appears to have merit. Have you watched the depositing of the dirt? I was wondering how deep the dirt is before it is compacted ??
Once new tracks are placed on the new flyover and put into service I wonder if additional surfacing is scheduled for any unanticipated settliing that may occurr ?? Also how long speed restrictions might be in place. Maybe Paul North or Mudchicken has some imput?
K.P., one of your latest photos (link) may show recent track and signal changes (or my memory is going). IIRC the intermediate signal east of Milliken used to be bidirectional, right? Also, there isn't any sign of the Vina Vista switch stand unless this is an optical illusion; surely it has to be moved to the east end of the flyover.
Links to my Google Maps ---> Sunset Route overview, SoCal metro, Yuma sub, Gila sub, SR east of Tucson, BNSF Northern Transcon and Southern Transcon *** Why you should support Ukraine! ***
Replies ...
ccltrains (1-8):
Thank you.
About your inquiry about my job ...I don't have one per se because of a sudden disability years ago. But, family, relatives, life cares, and circumstances run me ragged with 'dispatches' everywhere for everyone's everything, if you can relate to that. Sometimes such things bring me to the Sunset Route, and I can do two things for the price of one ... and have fun at it too!
blue streak 1 (1-10):
Yes, the method of construction for the Milliken Ave. Flyover is an interesting one. My first reaction was that when the first train would go over it the train would crush the concrete, with the train crashing down in a bunch of concrete rubble and a massive dust cloud. But, I hear the construction method is a tried and true approach, so I don't think my fear will happen.
Yes, I have seen the sand being poured ...
... and tamped down very briefly too, though I have no specifics about the processes.
With the City of Industry's 'Up and Over' the work trains poured ballast on top of a sand based floor, which must have been heavily compacted as landfilling is for a track to go over it. So, when the 'Up and Over' opened for train use, there probably was no settling to worry about. A couple of reshown photos of a ballast work train on it:
The future Colton Flyover is supposed to have solid concrete mixtures in its interior. But, the Milliken Ave. Flyover is having just dirt poured into the framing. Somehow I imagine such would add weight (hence, stability) to an otherwise rather lightweight design. Maybe someone at the forum has more knowledge about the dynamics of such things ... What I am curious about now, though, is what the ties will rest on. Will they be put on concrete flooring or a combination of vertical concrete structure top edges and heavily compressed dirt? If I see what develops, I'll pass it along.
Replies continued ....
Replies (Continued) ...
MikeF90 (1-10):
That signal you commented on is the left side (as viewed from a locomotive), low mast, two-bulb automatic absolute entrance signal for westbound south side industrial trackage movements to the mainline ...
... and NOT of the high mast, three-bulb, mainline signaling type (upper left) in the same general vicinity.
The signal on the top photo above is behind the flyover end on the right of the second (just above) photo.
I probably should have clarified that when posting the photo in the first place. The EAST side signal you commented on is on borrowed time as that industrial track will have to be taken up for the flyover to CONTINUE lowering (photo leftward) to ground level ...
... as does the flyover on the WEST end.
On another matter ... For your information, Mike, all I have to do now is find all the photo links in order to post an OPINION on the future locations of CP VINA VISTA and CP KAISER when two-tracks are laid through the Ontario-Fontana area. If nothing else, it will be educational for the forum, as it will deal with specifics of the area and touch on UP's contemporary CP installations policy.
Take care all,
K.P.
Theorizing CP VINA VISTA and CP KAISER
The Ontario-Fontana, CA Area
Part A (of A-B)
From UP personnel, it is known that both a CP VINA VISTA and a CP KAISER are planned, but the exact locations are unknown.
The timetable location of Vina Vista is at M.P. 526.00. Milliken Ave. is at M.P. 525.40, and the flyover being built there is reportedly 1.5 miles long. So, the eastern edge of the flyover would be 0.75 miles east of Milliken Ave., thus at M.P. 526.15, which is 0.15 miles east of the traditional Vina Vista location. A universal crossovers arrangement can't be built too much farther east (towards the camera in the below photo) because it would otherwise be called CP ETIWANDA for the overpass street by where the below photo was shot from. (Got all that?)
So, the M.P. 526.2 to 526.5 area is a good bet for the future CP VINA VISTA. The present intermediate signal in the Vina Vista area is barely visible by the I-15 Freeway bridges on the far background of the above photo.
In that above picture the second main to be laid could very well be laid to the north (right) of the present single-track main to avoid having to relocate industrial tracks as UP had to do in Casa Grande, AZ, as illustrated by the following over time sequential photos:
Of course, back on the first, top photo from the Fontana-Ontario, CA area, with two main tracks available, if a second-track (Main 2) was on the left of the present single-track main, it could sub as a switching track if the DS didn't need it right then.
Continued in Part B
Part B (of A-B)
While unofficially "Kaiser" is presently around M.P. 527.4 (a railfan timetable lists it as 527.5 as MikeF90 previously mentioned), the new CP KAISER, in K.P.'s opinion, likely will be somewhere between switches of the 6259-foot long north side South Fontana siding (between CP AL529 and CP AL531, both presently designated SOUTH FONTANA), and probably will be designated CP AL530 KAISER, with both present CP's AL529 and AL531 eliminated.
But, to do such, likely a track shift would be necessary. Track shifts at CP locations are unusual, but NOT unknown. The old 25 M.P.H. SP universal crossovers location known as HINDA was once at M.P. 559 on Beaumont Hill (beyond the track curve on the left in the contemporary photo below) ...
... but is now two miles to the west, and in high speed form at M.P. 556.8 (CP SP557 HINDA).
That CP SP557 HINDA trackage is angled slightly, so that the original Main to the west has the newer Main 1 to its NORTH, while to the east the original main has the newer Main 2 on the SOUTH side.
Below, another (though never posted before) east face west side view of CP SP557 HINDA: If you take a straight-edge (ruler) or piece of paper and hold it up to the lower right of the photo, parallel to the tracks, you will be able to see that slight shifting in alignment as the rails go further back.
K.P. believes the new CP AL530 KAISER (IF that will be the AL number or even the location) will be slightly angled as well, with a new Main 2 laid to the SOUTH west of the CP, but the new Main 1 laid to the NORTH east of the CP. Part of that conjectured new Main 1 is presently the north side South Fontana siding.
Conjecturing further, likely what was known as West Colton Yard Track 100 will be extended westward to the new CP, and the present Kaiser switching lead could likewise be extended eastward, so that, in conformity with UP's contemporary policy of consolidating CP's, there would be only one CP, the possible new CP AL530 KAISER.
Because of limitations of cheap computer diagraming, the word "Angled" has been placed on the diagram (mentally see the tracks as rising upward left to right).
Likely too, such a CP KAISER would have ALL 30 M.P.H. switches, involve cantilevered signals, and use yellow over yellow signals in advance of (NOT at) the CP while cleared in crossover mode. For the eastbound routing to the south siding (the old Track 100) or westbound to the Kaiser Lead, the advance signal would probably be yellow over lunar.
With a number of two-bulb 'entrance signals' in the Milliken Ave. / Etiwanda Ave. area, it seems unlikely that CP VINA VISITA would have anything other than 50 M.P.H. mainline crossovers, so advance crossover indications most likely would have yellow over green, as at Maricopa, AZ.
While K.P. ironically has seen insufficient advance crossover signal indications in recent years to authoritatively comment on them, the known yellow over yellow in advance of 50 M.P.H. crossovers on Beaumont Hill in San Timoteo Canyon seems to be an operating quirk, possibly to keep trainmen's train speed in check on the somewhat steep Beaumont Hill.
About the above Vina Vista-Kaiser conjecturing, as MikeF90 recently said in one of his recent conjecturing posts, 'time will tell.' But, I'll bet my boots the above Vina Vista-Kaiser descriptions is the way it will be. And, of course, as said before, since I don't have any "boots," I guess I'm safe with such a bet if it doesn't work out that way ...
K.P. anticipates postings will be sparse, if any, in the next couple of weeks. A neglected good news / bad news tidbit by West Colton Yard might be able to be photographed and posted about, but that is not being bet on.
Drive safely, and it is hoped everyone and their families are in good health,
A yellow over yellow (Approach Diverging) doesn't have a specific required speed, except for "prescribed speed through the turnout." Such a signal before a 50 mph crossover would simply mean you're crossing over there, not exceeding the speed allowed for the turnout. That speed would be in the time table/special instructions.
Usually Approach. Diverging is used (around my area) with 30 mph turnouts. Where UP CCS cab signals are in use, the cab signal will change to Approach. Still the wayside signal by itself doesn't require the 30 mph. In exCNW ATC territory the cab signal remains Clear.
K.P., your CP Kaiser speculation is, to paraphrase billio, the way I would run my railroad! Both leads are lengthened (a good thing) and it could also incorporate control of the active Declezville lead if it was located just east of there. I rewrote your diagram a little more compactly:
Because of a Nice Mother-In-Law
K.P. often takes his mother-in-law shopping. However, yesterday, she was asked if she minded going a little bit farther to do the shopping, and that was agreeable to her! So, while she shopped, K.P. was able to finally walk up onto the new Riverside Ave. overpass over I-10 by West Colton Yard. What was found may surprise the forum, especially members of the photographing type. A post series entitled "Good News ... Bad News" will be forthcoming in a day or two.
jeffhergert (1-13):
Yes, yellow over yellow is kind of a 'jack of all speeds' advance crossover or turnout indication. The problem I see on Beaumont Hill / San Timeteo Canyon here in Southern California is that in advance of a yellow over yellow is a flashing yellow! So, theoretically, a train must reduce speed to 40 M.P.H. if the lined 50 M.P.H. switch four or five miles ahead is in crossover mode. Is that crazy or what! You, Jeff, as a UP trainman, may have some rational explanation for that, but it seems so very illogical to me!
Your input on cab signals is enlightening, and shows the limitation of having only four aspects displayable whereas actual line side signals have more combinations that can be displayed. Cab signals sure must be nice for trainmen on the Central Corridor. I personally think it would be a boon for trainmen on the Sunset Route and speed things up there. Of course, the Sunset Route doesn't have blind snow storms and blizzards to contend with like you do, Jeff, on the Central Corridor!
MikeF90 (1-13):
Interesting diagram! Equilateral or wye switches can compact a control point, as in the previously shown SP Alhambra Trench built over three decades ago.
From what I understand, UP has a certain disdain for equilateral switches, unlike SP who loved them.
Stay happy,
In my last post I didn't mean to imply that the turnouts have to be equilateral - that was just a diagrammatic way to accomodate track shift. Here is a similar layout with regular turnouts:
Kaiser lead ---\ /----/------ main 1 (former siding)main 1 ---------\--\--/ /--/--\---- main 2 (former main 1)main 2 (new) -------\--/ \--- WC lead
EDIT: fixed brain cramp and removed extraneous comments. Noted that 30 MPH turnouts would serve the purpose for entering / exiting yard leads. OTOH the presumed universal crossover at 'Vina Vista' should be the higher speed variety for trains transiting the area.
That "weird" signal is a (once) fairly common Union Switch & Signal two light Style "N-2" dwarf signal on a pedestal with a protective screen over it. Otherwise it's not weird at all. Three light version are more unusually, but even those are rather often found on eBay.
K. P. Harrier Update as of Saturday, December 3, 2011 The Milliken Ave. Flyover Ontario, CA Part IV (of I-IV) The west side of the flyover is again getting higher. [snipped]
Part IV (of I-IV)
The west side of the flyover is again getting higher.
[snipped]
K. P. Harrier Replies... [snipped] Yes, I have seen the sand being poured ... ... and tamped down very briefly too, though I have no specifics about the processes. With the City of Industry's 'Up and Over' the work trains poured ballast on top of a sand based floor, which must have been heavily compacted as landfilling is for a track to go over it. So, when the 'Up and Over' opened for train use, there probably was no settling to worry about. . . . But, the Milliken Ave. Flyover is having just dirt poured into the framing. Somehow I imagine such would add weight (hence, stability) to an otherwise rather lightweight design. Maybe someone at the forum has more knowledge about the dynamics of such things ... What I am curious about now, though, is what the ties will rest on. Will they be put on concrete flooring or a combination of vertical concrete structure top edges and heavily compressed dirt? If I see what develops, I'll pass it along.
With the City of Industry's 'Up and Over' the work trains poured ballast on top of a sand based floor, which must have been heavily compacted as landfilling is for a track to go over it. So, when the 'Up and Over' opened for train use, there probably was no settling to worry about. . . .
But, the Milliken Ave. Flyover is having just dirt poured into the framing. Somehow I imagine such would add weight (hence, stability) to an otherwise rather lightweight design. Maybe someone at the forum has more knowledge about the dynamics of such things ... What I am curious about now, though, is what the ties will rest on. Will they be put on concrete flooring or a combination of vertical concrete structure top edges and heavily compressed dirt? If I see what develops, I'll pass it along.
Some compaction effort on the fill would be good to ensure against settlement, but it wouldn't be as sensitive or critical as if it were a 'pure' soil or sand material. I'll see if I can discern anything else from other K.P. photos or some industry links and sources.
I expect the fill will end at about 24" - 30" below the finished top of rail. Then, perhaps a sub-ballast layer, or perhaps just ballast, the combination being about 12" - 16" thick together, will be placed in a couple of separate layers, and compacted with either a highway-type roller (before the track is placed), and/ or an on-track tamper after the track is constructed. The ties will rest on the ballast (only) - resting them on a solid concrete and a less-solid (even though well-compacted) is a recipe for differential settlement, broken ties, and other headaches, and thus is to be avoided.
Good News ... Bad News
West Colton Yard Area
Riverside Ave.
Rialto, CA
Part I (of I-III)
Riverside Ave. is a major north-south thoroughfare in Rialto, CA that goes over both I-10 and the Sunset Route in the M.P. 535 area. The roadway divides West Colton Classification Yard's bowl area (and engine facility) on the west and the Departure Yard (and shop buildings) to the east.
Riverside Ave. was closed for only six months (April to October, 2011), and an entirely new bridge over I-10 was quite speedily erected. While K.P. went over the bridge a few times since the route reopened on Halloween Day 2011, an opportunity arose Friday, January 13, 2012 to investigate and document the new bridge in relation to the theme of this thread, i.e., "Sunset Route Two-Tracking Updates." Traffic-wise, it is indeed good news that the bridge over I-10 is again open.
From the east side of the new overpass, looking west at I-10, with the Bowl area of West Colton Yard on the left:
The incorporated City of Rialto was 100 years old when the overpass opened for vehicle traffic a few months ago, in 2011. Oddly, the new overpass fencing is of the standard size chain link fence type and not the typical small wire meshing commonly erected, though for decorative purposes there are a few small areas of the small meshing (top left).
Such regular, sized new chain link fencing at Marsh Station Rd. on the new reroute east of Tucson, AZ was previously posted about.
With such chain link fencings, is a trend surfacing now that is more conducive to railfan photography?
A contrast of just how wide the new bridging is compared to the same old bridge presently over West Colton Yard: View looks south.
Continued in Part II
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