The Western End of the Sunset Route: Today and the Future
Part II, Section C (of A-I)
Del Mar Ave.
Further east, the Sunset Route track now crosses the narrow, two-lane Del Mar Ave. in a peaceful, quaint, residential area:
The above grade crossing looking west:
Two eastward views, the latter a heavy telephoto:
Continued in Section D
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- K.P.’s absolute “theorem” from early, early childhood that he has seen over and over and over again: Those that CAUSE a problem in the first place will act the most violently if questioned or exposed.
Part II, Section D (of A-I)
San Gabriel Blvd.
San Gabriel Blvd. is a much wider, key grade crossing.
But the railroad's right-of-way is quite narrow considering: View looks west.
Alameda Corridor East material indicates the future trench all the way through here will be wide enough for two-tracks and a maintenance access road. That material also indicates that one-track will be laid in the trench, but the trench's wide width is in case a second main is needed way, way in the future.
Illustrations of the trench also show walling totally vertical, unlike in Alhambra where the walling was mildly slanted.
Below, an eastward view again from San Gabriel Blvd.: The long, sweeping curving finally ends, and the line then makes a straight shot eastward to El Monte.
A telephoto eastward view:
The trench will start elevating here in the vicinity of the camera location, at San Gabriel Blvd. Walnut Grove Ave. in the distance will remain a grade crossing, and reportedly only have to be lowered a few feet.
Continued in Section E
Part II, Section E (of A-I)
Walnut Grove Ave.
This is a westward view from the Walnut Grove Ave. grade crossing that will need to be lowered a few feet.
The above location is a rather maverick situation. Not only are the signals facing the opposite way than they usually face (both left handed signals instead of the traditional right handed arrangement, or the also normal both signal directions on a single mast), but it is the location of a high and wide detector. This one and the two-track one in Montebello on the LA&SL ...
... are the key trouble alert locations for trains destined to traverse the Alameda Corridor trench to the seaports. That trench is reshown in the below view.
Continued in Section F
Part II, Section F (of A-I)
The signals are reversed likely because of very close advertising sign clearance.
An eastward view from Walnut Grove Ave.:
An eastward, very heavy telephoto: The left sided signal at CP AL493 EL MONTE is barely visible a couple of miles in the distance. The wood tied (left) siding and concrete tied mainline can be seen turning southward (right) way in the distance.
So, this and the above posts is basically the whole area of the future San Gabriel Trench.
Continued in Section G
Part II, Section G (of A-I)
More Views from Orange Ave.:
City of Industry, CA
Not too many miles to the east ... At the 'Up and Over' south side ...
(Previously, posting emphasis was placed on the north and east sides of the Orange Ave. grade crossing / rail overpass.)
A westward view on the south side, at the newly planted trees:
Looking east, a more pronounced view of the newly planted trees:
In the above view, the intermediate signal for the future Main 2 is visible at the top, and the signal box for the two mains is just below the photo center.
A view from the southwest side: The new railroad bridging over Orange Ave.
Also, note that the far, EAST side does NOT have a sidewalk, and the unusual elevated area is kind of walled off from pedestrian usage.
Continued in Section H
Part II, Section H (of A-I)
A northeast view from underneath the Sunset Route:
Looking back towards Valley Blvd.:
In the above photo, the foreground industrial track necessitated the little used crossing gates.
Now, further east ...
Continued in Section I
Part II, Section I (of A-I)
Odds and Ends in Downtown Pomona, CA
At the east limit of the future CP AL514 HAMILTON, the very wide signal bridge basks in the unusual light of a lowering, setting sun.
The black signal heads in that light are not very well seen. But, less than a half of an hour later, those black heads resume a prominent, dominating visual roll.
As K.P. was leaving under darkening skies ... A lit up floodlight stand was spotted.
Why there were lit floodlights is unknown ...
... especially since nobody appeared to be around ...
After 11 hours of free time and a bunch of photos taken, the dispatch that originally brought K.P. to Pomona in the first place was resumed. It is hoped the forum received as much enlightenment as K.P. did on what is currently between Los Angeles and Pomona. It has been a long time since I had such lengthy free time to check out the Los Angeles to Pomona portion of the original Sunset Route.
KP!
I really enjoy seeing the progress of this project and the thorough information. It is facinating in the details and photos. An amazing piece. I rate it right up there with the piece by Nanaimo73 on the Bridges across the Mississippi River. Thanks for your sharing this work here.
K. P. HarrierThe Western End of the Sunset Route: Today and the Future Part II, Section D (of A-I) San Gabriel Blvd. [snipped] Below, an eastward view again from San Gabriel Blvd.: The long, sweeping curving finally ends, and the line then makes a straight shot eastward to El Monte. A telephoto eastward view: The trench will start elevating here in the vicinity of the camera location, at San Gabriel Blvd. Walnut Grove Ave. in the distance will remain a grade crossing, and reportedly only have to be lowered a few feet.
[snipped] Below, an eastward view again from San Gabriel Blvd.: The long, sweeping curving finally ends, and the line then makes a straight shot eastward to El Monte.
K. P. Harrier The Western End of the Sunset Route: Today and the Future Part II, Section F (of A-I) Walnut Grove Ave. [snipped] The signals are reversed likely because of very close advertising sign clearance.
[snipped] The signals are reversed likely because of very close advertising sign clearance.
K. P. Harrier The Western End of the Sunset Route: Today and the Future Part II, Section H (of A-I) More Views from Orange Ave.: City of Industry, CA A northeast view from underneath the Sunset Route:
K.P., thanks again for taking and sharing. Also, consider entering some of your "Road Crossing" photos in this week's "Trackside" contest - I can't think of anyone else who has a bigger and more diverse collection of them, at least not that I've seen 'on-line'.
- Paul North.
Paul_D_North_Jr ..snipped.. What's under that bridge in the middle distance in the upper photo, and near the bottom in the lower photo ? Will it interfere with the trench depth ?
Links to my Google Maps ---> Sunset Route overview, SoCal metro, Yuma sub, Gila sub, SR east of Tucson, BNSF Northern Transcon and Southern Transcon *** Why you should support Ukraine! ***
Thanks for that unusual info, Mike - but it all makes sense. Would like to see one of those sometime . . .
Appear ... Disappear ... Appear ...
On the Update as of March 7, 2011 it was reported that the old CP boxes that had been at the Cactus and Dunes sidings (near Yuma, AZ) were at the Colton (CA) Signal Dept., in plain sight right by the public street.
Then, on the Update as of March 17, 2011 it was reported that those CP boxes were NOT observable any longer at the Colton Signal Dept.
What has NOT been reported is that those boxes mysteriously reappeared, and were photographed on March 29, 2011 with other boxes that were unlabeled. Behind the DUNES box just below were the two CACTUS boxes.
Moments after those March 29 photos were taken about three UP workers converged on the SILVER Cactus and Dunes boxes, and started working inside them, each worker in a separate box. Apparently, they were salvaging parts that could be used on the many, many remaining boxes on the western half of the Sunset Route still with single-track and old signals.
Or sold to railfans ? (remember that thread here a few months ago started by the guy who wanted some help in identifying the MP where his signal might have come from - purchased out of the back of a trailer from a UP C&S guy, as I recall)
Nahh - railfans probably aren't interested in those 'guts' anyway - only the showy signal 'heads' and lenses, etc., none of which are in the 'box'. Someplace else I read that the C&S people are in fact real zealous about salvaging any usable 'spare parts' from signals and controls that are removed from service, to better be able to keep any similar ones that still remain in service that way for as long as possible into the future . . .
Paul_D_North_Jr Someplace else I read that the C&S people are in fact real zealous about salvaging any usable 'spare parts' from signals and controls that are removed from service, to better be able to keep any similar ones that still remain in service that way for as long as possible into the future . . .
Someplace else I read that the C&S people are in fact real zealous about salvaging any usable 'spare parts' from signals and controls that are removed from service, to better be able to keep any similar ones that still remain in service that way for as long as possible into the future . . .
There's that valuable military experience coming into play again, I bet.
Some belated ...
Replies
Part A (of A-B)
jeffhergert (3-15):
Your expertise on signal indications as a UP trainman is noted.
The yellow over green signal indication at Porter Rd. (in the vicinity of Sunset Route M.P. 900) in Maricopa, AZ was new to K.P. I have no idea what is in advance of such an indication, possibly just green.
Here in California (like on Beaumont Hill) UP has been using yellow over yellow before a red over green 50 M.P.H. crossover indication. They have also been using flashing yellow in advance of a yellow over yellow, which seems unusual because a flashing yellow is a 40 M.P.H. instruction in advance of the advance for a 50 M.P.H. crossover!
Maybe someone high up in the signal department figured out that that doesn't quite make sense, so new Sunset Route installations are using yellow over green, as in Maricopa, AZ.
BNSF 6400 (3-22):
Regarding the feed elevator ... Your reply would explain why more power was on the west end than the east end.
cacole (3-23):
About the Marsh Station Rd. area east of Tucson, AZ ... Did you notice if the continuous welded rail (CWR) that was brought to the area was for one or two tracks?
CWR seems to be consistently delivered to sites way, way in advance of actual installation. That would be consistent with your previous reports that track will probably be put down towards the end of 2011.
I hope that bridge that will need to be built on the far western end of the reroute will start to be built soon; otherwise it could take a year or two to see trains running over the reroute.
MikeF90 (3-23):
Yes, it is somewhat puzzling that the Anderson Rd. grade crossing (east of Maricopa, AZ) has NOT been prepared for two-tracks as of your posting date. Especially because other grade crossings already have the short second-track section laid through them even though two-tracking is nowhere near to reaching them.
As you know, after your post, desertdog kindly posted a schedule for the actual redoing of the grade crossing for the second track. So I guess that is all done now ...
Paul D. North Jr. (3-24):
The "train or locomotive" by the future CP SP917 CASA GRANDE was just parked there, probably turned off for the weekend to conserve fuel.
Concerning photographing the big stack of signal masts in downtown Casa Grande, AZ ... Originally, the intent was to document the largeness of the stacked mast group. Then, I noticed the numbers and diagrams on the mast bottoms.
All the numbers were in the 3000 series. The mileposts in the Casa Grande area are in the 900 group (like the future CP SP917 CASA GRADE). So, Mr. North, I am pretty sure the numbers refer to the type or model of the mast.
For this post, I reviewed my photo files, and surprisingly, like diagrammed and numbered masts was previously photographed at the Colton Signal Dept. here in California. The following photo was shot back on December 27, 2010.
Going back further in time, the following May 4, 2010 photo was uncovered:
That mast on the right did NOT have any markings on its bottom! So, apparently UP had a policy shift (usually to save money) and masts are now ordered with predrilled holing for certain specific signal applications and arrangements.
Continued in Part B
Part B (of A-B)
cacole (3-24):
I'm glad I got to photograph the old Marsh Station Rd. Bridge over I-10 when I did. Your report made me realize that! I guess that bridge is gone now.
desertdog (3-24):
Yes, John, the Maricopa Amtrak stop by Highway 347 is a problem. By relocating it farther east, one has to wonder if a grade separation is rather far off, way in the future.
The UP tracks and the Highway 347 grade crossing appear to be in a very precarious location with little bridging layout design solutions.
http://classic.mapquest.com/mq/1-HBL6yRsceUuOHYYbRcF9
I wonder if the real motive for moving the Amtrak stop is so a flyover like the 'Up and Over' in the City of Industry, CA could be built. If Maricopa, AZ did that, it could be patterned after the flyover to be built at Milliken Ave. in Ontario, CA. Milliken Ave. will be so wide that the bridging over it will have a center support. The flyover concept would certainly solve the massive logistical nightmare of keeping Highway 347 open and FREE FLOWING during construction in-lieu-of an overpass or underpass. That would also make the location of CP SP899 EAST MARICOPA make very much sense!
To give cost perspective, the Magnolia Ave. underpass in Riverside, CA is projected to cost $53 million. The Milliken Ave. Flyover: $63 million. As for Maricopa, AZ, anything they do will likely cost suchlike big bucks!
MikeF90 (3-31):
The Sunset Route needs two-tracks through Colton, CA, so closing one during the Flyover's construction doesn't make sense. I have a gut feeling two-tracks will remain open all during the three year project, and the makers of the diagrams only had a halfway understanding of what they were drawing.
BNSF 6400 (4-3):
You are absolutely correct in technically calling a "wye" switch an "equilateral" switch. I don't know about you, BNSF 6400, but I find the latter term absent a mental picture in my mind. It just doesn't have visual meaning. It doesn't have zing.
So, when I wear a shirt, tie, and suit, the term "equilateral" is used. When I speak informally with just a top button unbuttoned shirt and jeans, well, I use "wye" ... (See the memo to mvs below.)
mvs (4-3):
A few, selected items to comment on ...
No. 1: That bumpy wye or equilateral switch (hey BNSF 6400, I'm in PJ's right now ...) at CP AL488 ALHAMBRA ... I wonder if that is inherent with such switches? Either a spring frog or movable point type would solve that, but I guess UP doesn't stock the wye or equilateral format in quantity.
No. 4: That spur in the trench ... I think it was to service a business that has since gone bye-bye. That trench was reportedly built in 1977-78. I checked an old 1981 SP timetable, and it had no such branch line at that M.P., so it likely was just an industrial spur.
No. 5: Your comment about the future 710 Freeway alignment going through the CP SP487 AURANT area gives perspective to that freeway. Hasn't Caltrans scheduled that project for the 27th Century? (Hehehe.)
Paul D. North Jr. (4-5, 4-5b):
About that billboard being so close to the tracks (M.P. 491.6) in the City of San Gabriel ... The billboard was probably put in under Southern Pacific ownership of the Sunset Route decades ago, and obviously they used to think much differently than UP does.
As far as a single mast instead of the present two masts ... My guess is that it is to make a clear distinction in an unorthodox situation. On the Alhambra Sub, UP has been converting two old target masts on each side of the track to a single tri-lighted mast on the NORTH side. To erect a single mast on the SOUTH side would be nonconforming. That is my unofficial guess, Paul. Otherwise, I have no idea.
Concerning that southwest side flasher unit at Orange Ave. under the 'Up and Over' ... That is a very good conclusion you made about why the south lights are angled so severely.
billio (4-6):
That Santa Teresa project that will supersede El Paso will make for a much more free-flowing Sunset Route.
While I've never been out there ... I wonder if the area is so desolate that UP won't even have a fence around the new yard. On the other hand, the border patrol may contract with UP to have an SD40-2 on a special south side track going back and forth carrying border patrol officers on the walkways with AK47's!
Several months ago I traveled between Yuma, AZ and San Diego, CA on I-8, and passed two border checkpoints. On the third one they apparently were suspicious, and ask if I would open my trunk, which I did. They seemed to be very disappointed that I didn't have ten illegal aliens crammed in there, and slammed the trunk shut, and waved me on. Railfans that are by the border seem to be in a different America ... but one has to sympathize with the life and death hostile environment those border patrolmen work in ...
Well ...
... I think I'm caught up now.
Take care, everyone.
K.P.
K. P. Harrier cacole (3-23): About the Marsh Station Rd. area east of Tucson, AZ ... Did you notice if the continuous welded rail (CWR) that was brought to the area was for one or two tracks? CWR seems to be consistently delivered to sites way, way in advance of actual installation. That would be consistent with your previous reports that track will probably be put down towards the end of 2011. I hope that bridge that will need to be built on the far western end of the reroute will start to be built soon; otherwise it could take a year or two to see trains running over the reroute.
K.P. -- There are 14 lengths of CWR at each end of the area. If CWR is in 1/4 mile lengths, that would be 7 miles of rail for use on a 3.5 mile section, so a passing siding may be in the plans, though I can't imagine why they would do this on a track that is already part of a double-track line and is 40 miles from Tucson in the middle of nowhere and no projected industries to serve, because you're within state or federal land holdings.
The grading up to the bridge at the western end has been re-done and now lines up with the old bridge, so all the UP will need to do is cut the rail and move it over to tie in to the newly laid track.
The electric company has been putting in poles, wire, and transformers in preparation for powering block signals or perhaps even turnouts, but no signals or signal boxes are present and no concrete platforms for signals were installed as part of the site preparation.
Interstate 10 was totally closed and the old Marsh Station Road highway bridge was removed on the night of April 8th. Interstate 10 will have to be closed again when the Union Pacific removes their bridge later this year.
On the afternoon of April 6th surveyors were busy all along the new roadbed, but there are no signs of any ballast or concrete ties being pre-positioned.
Before the yellow over green it could either be a green, another yellow over green, or a yellow over flashing green. Our 50 mph crossovers use all of the above on the approaches, depending on maximum track speeds at the location.
If they have a flashing yellow and then a yellow over yellow before 50 mph turnouts, it sounds like they upgraded the turnouts but not the signals. The yellow over yellow doesn't have a specific speed associated with it per se, although the flashing yellow does has noted.
Unusual conditions happen, in Omaha we crossover at one place on a single yellow (approach). The signal progression is: flashing yellow (either over or under a red since it's at a controlled crossover), yellow over lunar, yellow over red, and finally the single yellow. You don't know if you're crossing over or going straight until you see which way the points are lined.
Jeff
See why I prefer to have as little to do with signal indications as possible ?
I know - these kinds of complicated situations are probably more the exception than the general rule, but I don't yet see the logic in them - I'd just have to either memorize them, or look at my Employee TimeTable and all the notes I'd have in there to refresh my recollection each time I went through such a location . . .
More double track opened, plus photos of the yellow over green and red over green
http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?1,2441862
john_edwards More double track opened, plus photos of the yellow over green and red over green http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?1,2441862
Just to 'activate' that link.
Paul_D_North_Jr See why I prefer to have as little to do with signal indications as possible ? I know - these kinds of complicated situations are probably more the exception than the general rule, but I don't yet see the logic in them - I'd just have to either memorize them, or look at my Employee TimeTable and all the notes I'd have in there to refresh my recollection each time I went through such a location . . . - Paul North.
Once upon a time, the UP (and others) seemed pretty consistent; and UP had the 4-speed cab signals. Then came simplified 2-head signals and now 50-mph crossovers instead of 40-mph. Advance approach no longer corresponded to higher limits or even relevant in 70-mph territory.
UP still has a single head signal approaching Bryn Mawr, the diverging point for CP to Bensenville Yard, on the New Line where yellow indicates approach prepared to stop even though a moderate speed diverging route may be lined.
cacole [snipped] There are 14 lengths of CWR at each end of the area. If CWR is in 1/4 mile lengths, that would be 7 miles of rail for use on a 3.5 mile section, so a passing siding may be in the plans, . . .
cacole The grading up to the bridge at the western end has been re-done and now lines up with the old bridge, so all the UP will need to do is cut the rail and move it over to tie in to the newly laid track.
cacole On the afternoon of April 6th surveyors were busy all along the new roadbed, but there are no signs of any ballast or concrete ties being pre-positioned.
Altogether, my estimate amounts to 9 - 10 weeks until the traffic is running on the new track - say, the end of June - and another month until the old track is gone (end of July). This is based on a comfortable pace for maximum efficiency, not the shortest or fastest possible time. Let's see how close I am - or how far off !
P.S. (at 11:00 PM EDST): - For comparison, BNSF's similar 2nd new main track through Abo Canyon, NM is about at the same stage, and is roughly the same length - maybe a mile longer. It too is supposed to be done this year - I have read that by the end of the 3rd quarter was desired so as to help handle the fall intermodal import rush for Christmas, and perhaps sooner, so that seems do-able for this UP project.
Link to a couple photos (not mine) and a brief explanation of a Track-Laying Machine on a new BNSF subgrade on the Powder River Basin line in 1995: http://www.robl.w1.com/PRB/I-950479.htm
- PDN.
Of Scotty and His Star Trek Transporter
The two new CP AL514 HAMILTON electric boxes that have been in storage at the Colton Signal Dept. for months ...
... are no longer in Colton ...
... but, unbelievably, finally in Pomona (CA) itself! Scotty must have 'beamed' them over there!
K.P. was involved in an unexpected six-hour layover dispatch to Pomona on Friday, April 15, 2011, and found allot now going on from Alhambra to Colton. It is hoped a full photo report to the forum can be put together in the next few days ...
Update as of Friday, April 15, 2011
Colton to Alhambra, CA Report
Part I (of I-X)
The Milliken Ave. future flyover site was visited, and some grading had been started to the WEST, but not towards the east.
At this point, it is unclear exactly what the grading is about, as two graded strips were present. Views look west.
A westward telephoto:
In the above photo, the new CP box that was at Colton now appears to be at the east end of the Guasti siding.
There was NO grading to the east of Milliken Ave.
Continued in Part II
Part II (of I-X)
In downtown Pomona, the two new CP AL514 HAMILTON boxes that had been at Colton are now on site. The east box:
The graffiti marked east box (left) of the two at Colton ...
... is the east box at the CP site in Pomona.
That east box is about halfway between Hamilton Blvd. and the big, wide, east signal bridge (background upper right).
Continued in Part III
Part III (of I-X)
Looking west from Hamilton Blvd. the present CP box (right) is seen, and the new west CP box (background) apparently was just offloaded without leveling it.
It is right by the west signals (left) of the present Hamilton CP, near the panel track between the LA&SL and SP lines.
As with the east box, the west box is about halfway between Hamilton Blvd. and the walling where a signal bridge is believed will be erected in the future.
In the above photo, an 18-wheeler (right) was parked by the walling.
Continued in Part IV
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