I was reading an article in Trains about having to "big hole it" because a trucker stopped on the tracks or someone cut it way too close.
The Old Engineer always said "people will drive for miles to get on the track with a train at the same time!"
Made me wonder: I can't come up with an occupation other than railroading that has to contend with the general public literally challenging them when they are doing their jobs. Police and Fire - yes - interference, but not actually a challenge. Or maybe we just don't hear about it.
Don't think there is going to be an answer for this, but it is still a musing of mine.
Mook
She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw
Tom
COAST LINE FOREVER
It is better to dwell in the corner of a roof than to share a house with a contentious woman! (Solomon)
A contentious woman is like a constant dripping! (Solomon)
well people not being aware of trucks on the road.Not all truckers are bad.
stay safe
joe
Deshler Ohio-crossroads of the B&O Matt eats your fries.YUM! Clinton st viaduct undefeated against too tall trucks!!!(voted to be called the "Clinton St. can opener").
I'm not sure it's a challenge as much as ignorance...
I recall reading recently (probably a link in a forum posting) about someone being told how much distance it takes a train to stop, and their response was that was preposterous, because the government wouldnt let something that unsafe happen....heck, a lot of folks dont even have a good understanding about how far it takes them to stop their own car, and that twice the speed means four times the stopping distance...
Then, there are those you hear about who attempt suicide by train. Or, murder by train.
As long as we have at-grade crossings (which will be forever) there will be people who are injured or killed because they are too self involved to realize that not everything will yield to their personal priorities...
Sigh.
Just east of Elkhorn, NE is a crossing with signals and gates. Old US 30 parallels the tracks here for about a mile and the street over the tracks has a 4 way stop with old 30 about 150 feet or so from the crossing.
A few years back about 2 AM we are coming up to the crossing. Just as the gates are fully down a pickup drives up and goes around the gates. Didn't even pause to see how close we were, although the driver probably saw us coming. We weren't going at top speed and he cleared us with time to spare. Then, at 2 in the morning with no other car in sight, he pulls up to the 4 way stop and comes to a complete stop, before procededing.
I've often wondered why the driver did that, stop for the stop sign I mean. Don't misunderstand, I don't condone or endorse running stop signs, it's just funny to me that someone who disregards the law, if not their own personal safety at a crossing WITH a train coming is so particular at a road intersection with no other traffic in sight. You'ld think if you don't care at one, you wouldn't care at the other.
Jeff
J. Edgar wrote:your crusin at track speed....windows open......smile on your face....some jackalope drives thru the gates with the kids looking up at ya waving.....the other side is .....3am in a cornfield stopped with the headlight off......at a dirt road......3 cars go by in an hour and each one STOPS and asks if its ok to cross ......twilight zone???
My favorite is when we stop short of a crossing and the lights go off and the gates up, everyone wants to stop. But when the lights are on and were rolling track speed it's just the opposite.
This is my point exactly. People wouldn't pull out in front of a fire truck - as a general rule. I know there are exceptions. But they don't usually see them and then deliberately pull out in front of them.
Something about a train brings out some buried reaction in people that they really must challenge that train. They wouldn't think of grabbing at a barking German Shepherd.....
Mookie wrote: This is my point exactly. People wouldn't pull out in front of a fire truck - as a general rule. I know there are exceptions. Something about a train brings out some buried reaction in people that they really must challenge that train.
This is my point exactly. People wouldn't pull out in front of a fire truck - as a general rule. I know there are exceptions.
Something about a train brings out some buried reaction in people that they really must challenge that train.
There is indeed a "buried reaction" that motivates the risk taking that is unique to railroad crossings. That is that nearly every experienced driver knows that trains can cause a ridiculously long delay with no knowable end point. Whereas traffic lights and stop signs cannot impose such an arbitrary, unreasonable inconvenience.
Mookie wrote: This is my point exactly. People wouldn't pull out in front of a fire truck - as a general rule. I know there are exceptions. But they don't usually see them and then deliberately pull out in front of them.
A 22 year old woman in Glendale, AZ apparently had a problem seeing a fire truck that was parked at the curb with it's lights flashing:
Fortunately she was alone in the vehicle, so didn't take anyone with her.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
suppose there might have been either a) a cell phone or b) alcohol or c) both of the above involved?
for my nickles worth, The point made earlier is about the unknown delay times is probably what drives most folks to beat the train...after all,everyone is so busy a 3-5 minute delay might ruin their whole calander for the day!
I really love it when I'm on light engines or a real small train doing track speed. You come up to a crossing and as soon as the lights start to flash and the gates come down, some motorist decides to take a different route. About the time they get turned around, we clear the crossing and the gates go up.
jeffhergert wrote: I really love it when I'm on light engines or a real small train doing track speed. You come up to a crossing and as soon as the lights start to flash and the gates come down, some motorist decides to take a different route. About the time they get turned around, we clear the crossing and the gates go up.Jeff
And they have a 2 block straight shot at the crossing and until they get right up to the gates, they don't seem to see that a train is stopped and blocking the crossing.
The Driver always comments that obviously that train is so small it can't be seen from 2 blocks away.
I think Mookie has hit upon one of the most salient observations in post #9 where she speculates about drivers having a "buried reaction" that makes them want to challenge trains at grade crossings. There is almost a magnetic attraction that draws road vehicles into the path of trains. However, I do not believe that it is due to a lack of intelligence on the part of drives as is so widely trumpeted by the railroad industry. If that were the case, the unusual risk taking would not just be confined to confrontations with trains. It would instead include conflicting routes with all vehicles.
And when I speculated that the buried reaction that motivates drivers to try beat a train is based upon the driver's worry about a delay, I was not referring to a 3-5 minute delay typical of a long train passing at road speed. If that were all that drivers anticipated, there would be no more motivation to risk their lives or the chance of getting a ticket. Drivers take 3-5 minute delays without complaint at every traffic light. They even usually tolerate being bogged down in slow moving traffic jams for much larger delays while refraining from recklessly escaping on the shoulder.
No, what drivers dread about railroad crossings are the 10-30 minute delays that can develop as a slow moving train stops and waits. From a driver's point of view, a train that blocks a crossing for 20 minutes with impunity can just as easily bock it for 90 minutes. And the worst part is that there is no way a driver can know how long the delay will be. Granted these severe delays don't happen that often, but most drivers have experienced them. And they bring the recollection of this experience to every encounter with a train at a grade crossing. It does not matter that a train is destined to clear the crossing in just 3 minutes. Drivers have no way of knowing that until after the train clears, so just expecting the possibility of a delay, some of them don't want to take that chance of a delay, so they take the risk.
Rail-Roadwarrior wrote: J. Edgar wrote:your crusin at track speed....windows open......smile on your face....some jackalope drives thru the gates with the kids looking up at ya waving.....the other side is .....3am in a cornfield stopped with the headlight off......at a dirt road......3 cars go by in an hour and each one STOPS and asks if its ok to cross ......twilight zone???My favorite is when we stop short of a crossing and the lights go off and the gates up, everyone wants to stop. But when the lights are on and were rolling track speed it's just the opposite.
Drivers routinely challenge the validity of "Road Closed Ahead" signs at construction sites, too. I have yet to see a sign that says "for everyone but you", yet I see evidence that they must exist everyday. A flagman at a highway project gets less respect than Rodney Dangerfield.
My pet theory for this behavior is not wanting to give up control. Behind the wheel I'm (God-like) in control of my destiny and no sign, flag, or flashing red lights is gonna tell me where I can or can't drive.
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