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TV Alert- Mythbusters and Train Suction

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Posted by Paul Milenkovic on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 12:55 AM

The story is that to get the major drag reduction, the two bodies have to be pretty close together -- there are studies that missing containers in stack trains, uneven cars in freight trains, truck trailer and truck tractor with a big gap are all pretty draggy.  It is also said that you could save gas if you drove your car behind a truck.

I have run some experiments with driving behind trucks, SUVs and minivans while monitoring a gas mileage computer (ScanGauge).  Now driving too close to a truck is not recommended and driving while monitoring some instrumentation in your car may also be a concern.  But I found that you don't have to follow that closely to have an effect.  Driving between 1 and 2 seconds separation (4-8 car lengths) can result in as much as a 10 percent reduction in gas mileage (like going from 32 to 35 MPH).

A couple things I have noticed.  A regular truck is not the best because it breaks the wind up high -- campers that break the wind closer to the road appear to work better.  If you have any appreciable crosswind, you lose the effect.  Remember I am not tailgating anyone on account of safety considerations, I am just driving a normal traffic separation, and you can see the turbo-lag smoke come off the stacks of a truck during gear shifts and see it drift off to the side of the road before it gets to me.

The other problem is that while SUVs make good windbreaks, a lot of these vehicles are driven 10 over the limit -- without crosswinds, you can get gas mileage readings at 75 that you would otherwise get at 60, but I don't feel comfortable driving that fast.

But driving aside, the observation is that the windbreak tail of a vehicle such as a truck or train is pretty long and crosswinds interact with that tail.  So what you experience on the train platform may depend on both the kind of train and what the winds are doing.

If GM "killed the electric car", what am I doing standing next to an EV-1, a half a block from the WSOR tracks?

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Posted by BigJim on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 1:06 AM

Driving between 1 and 2 seconds separation (4-8 car lengths) can result in as much as a 10 percent reduction in gas mileage (like going from 32 to 35 MPH).

I see you haven't been watching any NASCAR races. Wink [;)]

Is this in any way related to the fact that if a person jumps off of a tall building they get sucked into the wall before they hit the ground?

.

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Posted by ben10ben on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 8:03 PM
The show is now on for those of you who wish to see it.
Ben TCA 09-63474
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Posted by CShaveRR on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 8:13 PM

I haven't seen anything in the "prologue" to suggest that this segment will be there.

(toward the end of the show):  Black powder and air tanks to cause propulsion.  I won't say the program sucked, but no trains did!

Carl

Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)

CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)

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Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 9:27 PM
According to the Discovery channel web site, this episode WAS supposed to air but didn't.  Not sure what happened... oh well.
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Posted by Nataraj on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 10:55 PM
man..... I was looking forward to this one...
Nataraj -- Southern Pacific RULES!!! ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The GS-4 was the most beautiful steam engine that ever touched the rails.
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Posted by ben10ben on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 10:56 PM
Sorry about that.

According to the website, the episode that aired tonight(10/18) was supposed to air next week(10/25).

Commercials tonight indicated that next week's episode is going to be a "revisit" episode.

That was still an interesting episode, but I would like to see the one involving the train still.
Ben TCA 09-63474
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Posted by Nataraj on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 11:15 PM
I e-mailed discovery channel about it.

This is when the show will officially be re-run, according to the mythbusters web site. IT WAS SUPPOSED TO AIR TODAY ( now )
But they aired next weeks episode

NOV 08 2006
@ 09:00 PM
MythBusters
Concrete Glider

NOV 09 2006
@ 01:00 AM
MythBusters
Concrete Glider

NOV 11 2006
@ 07:00 PM
MythBusters
Concrete Glider

Hope they show the episode, the dates above were supposed to be re-runs, I guess they are the premier now.
Nataraj -- Southern Pacific RULES!!! ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The GS-4 was the most beautiful steam engine that ever touched the rails.
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Posted by portypaul on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 1:07 AM
Has anybody seen this episode yet?  Any comments for someone who enjoys their show "downunder"?
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Posted by Leon Silverman on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 6:48 AM
Remember the show's motto:  "We are professionals.  Do not try this at home."
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Posted by PigFarmer1 on Tuesday, October 31, 2006 9:10 AM
Suction is real.  I don't know the scientific reasons, but I do have experience.  Recently while working on a MoW train we had a westbound Z train pass us.  We had a package of paper towels (Looks like a package of napkins one would purchase at the grocery store) on our train and that Z train sucked those towels right off of our train.  The towels were sucked right under the Z train where they were promptly shredded and then scattered down the tracks.  It was kind of impressive.
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Posted by arbfbe on Thursday, November 2, 2006 2:04 AM

After 29 years on the railroad (yesterday was the anniversary according to the RRB) I can say I have never experienced any suction on my person which would pull me into a train.  What I have experienced is a form of vertigo which draws you towards large objects you are close to.  Try walking down between two tracks full on cars in one of those old yards with very narrow space between the tracks and you will think you are drunk as you try to avoid brushing against the cars on either side.  The effect gets even worse if you are close to a track with cars which are moving. at even slow speeds.  So based upon my experiences in the yards and on the mainlines I think the suction of the train is bunk and just an old wives' tale so far as this suction pulling people into moving trains.  I even had a driver try to tell me how his automobile was sucked into the side of a train at a grade crossing he had stopped behind the gates for.  Sure kid, perhaps that will work with your Dad but not with me.

 

I will be watching for the results from the TV program should it ever run.  

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