This topic would be worth a small column each month in TRAINS:
The Biodiesel Update
Every time someone has a Biodiesel report they can put it on the TRAINS Forum.
Just before the deadline all the posts can be checked and the best reports can be put in The Biodiesel Update column.
Everyone needs a reminder that Biodiesel exists and is the easiest to produce alternative to oil based fuels.
Andrew
Watch my videos on-line at https://www.youtube.com/user/AndrewNeilFalconer
Andrew Falconer wrote: This topic would be worth a small column each month in TRAINS: The Biodiesel Update Every time someone has a Biodiesel report they can put it on the TRAINS Forum. Just before the deadline all the posts can be checked and the best reports can be put in The Biodiesel Update column. Everyone needs a reminder that Biodiesel exists and is the easiest to produce alternative to oil based fuels. Andrew
AND, it can be used in a diesel motor with no modification to either the fuel or the motor.
Just pull up to the pump, "Fill 'er'up", and go.
kenneo wrote: Andrew Falconer wrote: This topic would be worth a small column each month in TRAINS: The Biodiesel Update Every time someone has a Biodiesel report they can put it on the TRAINS Forum. Just before the deadline all the posts can be checked and the best reports can be put in The Biodiesel Update column. Everyone needs a reminder that Biodiesel exists and is the easiest to produce alternative to oil based fuels. Andrew AND, it can be used in a diesel motor with no modification to either the fuel or the motor. Just pull up to the pump, "Fill 'er'up", and go.
That is not quite accurate. Today's low emmision diesel engines require some minor modifications in order to safely burn bio-diesel. Because of it's chemical properties, bio-diesel seems to react aggressively with many of the gaskets, in particular in the fuel pump. But these modifications are easy to make and low-cost.
Other than that, does any body know if any railroads use bio-diesel? I've heard that you could theoretically recycle the frying oil used at fast-food restaurants to produce bio-diesel. That sure would beat disposing of it as an environmentally dangerous waste! Just picture a railroad offering to "dispose" of all that grease at little or no cost to the fast food chains. Then they could recycle it to fuel their engines. Sounds like a real money saver to me, and it's environmentally friendly, to boot!
Here's a study appearing on the trade association website:
http://www.biodiesel.org/resources/reportsdatabase/reports/gen/20040401_gen334.pdf
Pump
Lee Koch wrote: kenneo wrote: Andrew Falconer wrote: This topic would be worth a small column each month in TRAINS: The Biodiesel Update Every time someone has a Biodiesel report they can put it on the TRAINS Forum. Just before the deadline all the posts can be checked and the best reports can be put in The Biodiesel Update column. Everyone needs a reminder that Biodiesel exists and is the easiest to produce alternative to oil based fuels. Andrew AND, it can be used in a diesel motor with no modification to either the fuel or the motor. Just pull up to the pump, "Fill 'er'up", and go. That is not quite accurate. Today's low emmision diesel engines require some minor modifications in order to safely burn bio-diesel. Because of it's chemical properties, bio-diesel seems to react aggressively with many of the gaskets, in particular in the fuel pump. But these modifications are easy to make and low-cost. Other than that, does any body know if any railroads use bio-diesel? I've heard that you could theoretically recycle the frying oil used at fast-food restaurants to produce bio-diesel. That sure would beat disposing of it as an environmentally dangerous waste! Just picture a railroad offering to "dispose" of all that grease at little or no cost to the fast food chains. Then they could recycle it to fuel their engines. Sounds like a real money saver to me, and it's environmentally friendly, to boot!
I don't know that restaraunts throw grease away. Back in my younger days working in a couple of restaraunts they would make a point of saving every once of used grease they could.....turns out a company would come by every week and pump out the grease traps and pay money to do it. Before the whole bio-diesel thing I guess there are a bunch of other uses for old grease and fry oil. It sure stank, though, whatever they used it for. I still get sick in McDonald's.
It IS kind of wierd thinking of Mickey D's as a fuel source (other than heartburn).
solzrules wrote: I don't know that restaraunts throw grease away. Back in my younger days working in a couple of restaraunts they would make a point of saving every once of used grease they could.....turns out a company would come by every week and pump out the grease traps and pay money to do it. Before the whole bio-diesel thing I guess there are a bunch of other uses for old grease and fry oil. It sure stank, though, whatever they used it for. I still get sick in McDonald's.
A few months ago I drove by a restaurant where they had spilled a large quantity of that grease while pumping it into the truck. It was all over the parking lot, and it smelled incredibly bad. I am glad I did not just eat nor was I about to.
"No soup for you!" - Yev Kassem (from Seinfeld)
Lee Koch wrote: Other than that, does any body know if any railroads use bio-diesel? I've heard that you could theoretically recycle the frying oil used at fast-food restaurants to produce bio-diesel. That sure would beat disposing of it as an environmentally dangerous waste! Just picture a railroad offering to "dispose" of all that grease at little or no cost to the fast food chains. Then they could recycle it to fuel their engines. Sounds like a real money saver to me, and it's environmentally friendly, to boot!
In Oregon, there is quite a cottage industry of making home bio-diesel making kits and of people then buying used oil of most any kind and making it into bio-diesel for their home use. There have been a couple of house fires due to botching the process and it burnt the buildings to the foundation. The FD said that once that stuff got to burning, they have not been able to put it out - not even foam would work.
When the restaurents run out of used oil, these home brew folks go and purchase Canola Oil (aka Rape Seed) fresh from the press.
Coffee grounds from the coffee places is also hot as an organic soil additive. Needs no composting.
I don't know of any railroads that do this, but I do know an English potato farmer who also makes his own brand of potato crisp. He runs all his tractors and trucks on the waste cooking that he's used to fry his potatoes. I think the Corris Railway in Wales may run their diesel locos on one sort of bio diesel or another. The Ffestiniog Railway, also in Wales, runs its steam locos on a mix of diesel and waste engine oil. I believe the Harz narrow gauge railway in Germany runs its steam locos on bio-diesel.
Try the middle of August, riding a tank car that is over full of old used cooking oil, with it sloshing out the manway cover every time the car starts or stops moving.
Ummm, nothing like smelling creosote and burnt dead french fries first thing in the morning to get your appetite working, not to mention giving your toe path a brand new coating of oil and slimy grease.
Did I mention the flies and mosquitoes love the stuff?
Did I mention that, if you get it on your clothes, you have to throw them away, because no matter how many times you wash them, the smell and stain will not come out, and you can’t wash them with anything else, because the smell will get on the other clothes?
I once walked over a mile ahead of a shove with the leading end having a cut of these cars, because the cars were all covered in the stuff, and if you did managed to get on one with out slipping and breaking your leg, the flies and skeeters would eat you alive.
South Dakota must have one heck of a rendering plant and processing center, we get around two hundred of these things every week from there, not to mention the tallow cars full of edible and inedible animal fat.
And what the heck is “Technical Animal Tallow”?
Fat from computer smart cows?
ericsp wrote: solzrules wrote: I don't know that restaraunts throw grease away. Back in my younger days working in a couple of restaraunts they would make a point of saving every once of used grease they could.....turns out a company would come by every week and pump out the grease traps and pay money to do it. Before the whole bio-diesel thing I guess there are a bunch of other uses for old grease and fry oil. It sure stank, though, whatever they used it for. I still get sick in McDonald's. A few months ago I drove by a restaurant where they had spilled a large quantity of that grease while pumping it into the truck. It was all over the parking lot, and it smelled incredibly bad. I am glad I did not just eat nor was I about to.
23 17 46 11
Tulyar15 wrote: Lee Koch wrote: Other than that, does any body know if any railroads use bio-diesel? I've heard that you could theoretically recycle the frying oil used at fast-food restaurants to produce bio-diesel. That sure would beat disposing of it as an environmentally dangerous waste! Just picture a railroad offering to "dispose" of all that grease at little or no cost to the fast food chains. Then they could recycle it to fuel their engines. Sounds like a real money saver to me, and it's environmentally friendly, to boot! I don't know of any railroads that do this, but I do know an English potato farmer who also makes his own brand of potato crisp. He runs all his tractors and trucks on the waste cooking that he's used to fry his potatoes. I think the Corris Railway in Wales may run their diesel locos on one sort of bio diesel or another. The Ffestiniog Railway, also in Wales, runs its steam locos on a mix of diesel and waste engine oil. I believe the Harz narrow gauge railway in Germany runs its steam locos on bio-diesel.
If I remember correctly the Borkumer Kleinbahn uses biodiesel for its locomotives.
Also, I read that you can use oil made from sunflower seeds. Makes your car smell like you have been frying fries!
greetings,
Marc Immeker
Lee Koch wrote: Other than that, does any body know if any railroads use bio-diesel? I've heard that you could theoretically recycle the frying oil used at fast-food restaurants to produce bio-diesel. That sure would beat disposing of it as an environmentally dangerous waste!
Other than that, does any body know if any railroads use bio-diesel? I've heard that you could theoretically recycle the frying oil used at fast-food restaurants to produce bio-diesel. That sure would beat disposing of it as an environmentally dangerous waste!
"Enviornmentally dangerous waste???" And we EAT this stuff????
Yup,
We had a tank car full of old cooking oil that had the steam pipes inside it rot away from age…
Because you don’t cap the inlet or outlet on the steam heating pipes, when our switch crew kicked the car, the pipe inside the tank broke or ruptured.
Over half of the contents of the car poured out in a matter of minutes.
The EPA made us remove the ballast, ties, and in some places over 12 inches of roadbed material, and have it hauled away in dumpsters that were tarped and labeled hazardous waste.
Seems if this stuff gets in a watershed or aquifer, it can cause all kinds of problems, not the least of which is it can kill aquatic plant life.
If it is allowed to stay in a stream or lake, it will “sheet out” and can block the sunlight from reaching the bottom plants…you get pretty big fish kills and big algae beds will form, robbing the oxygen from the water.
And if it is allowed to remain in, say soil, it disrupts the normal organic life, attracts predatory insects, and in some instances, can kill birds that ingest the insects that are feeding on the spilled oil.
Like the DDT problem, where the toxin was in the insects the birds fed on, and then it caused the thinning of the bird egg shells, ingesting the insects that are feeding on the oil introduces the oil into the birds system, and they are not designed to ingest most of the fats in the oil.
It disrupts their digestive process, and they end up starving to death.
Because Houston is on a migratory bird flight path, the EPA is pretty tough on any spill of organic materials.
We had a side swipe that tore open a tank car full of corn sweetener, and they made us remove just as much of the ballast and roadbed material as they could.
A Class 1 crew shoved a track blind and put a hopper of plastic pellets into the side of the tank car…dumped the hopper on its side, spilled the pellets everywhere, and then drenched the whole mess with the corn sweetener.
Because the bugs all went nuts over the sweetener, the sea gulls and other birds were having a feast of sorts, but were also ingesting the pellets.
Not something the EPA smiles on.
We got to wash and reuse the ballast in both cases, but the dirt and ties had to go to an EPA approved land fill for proper disposal.
And we have two underground streams running across the yard; they discharge directly into Buffalo Bayou.
Both streams now have EPA monitors at their discharge pipes to check for the presence of the cooking oil.
TomDiehl wrote: Lee Koch wrote: Other than that, does any body know if any railroads use bio-diesel? I've heard that you could theoretically recycle the frying oil used at fast-food restaurants to produce bio-diesel. That sure would beat disposing of it as an environmentally dangerous waste! "Enviornmentally dangerous waste???" And we EAT this stuff????
Hey Tom,
This is Europe. Here we even treat the waste rock from coal mining in Germany as a dangerous thing not to be trusted . Here in the Netherlands the port authority of Rotterdam had to sue our national environmental protection agency just to use that rock for erosion protection of the harbor bottoms. Luckily the judge didn't buy the agency theory since it had come just out of the ground from a depth of several hundred meters and it was not then classified as dangerous material! All because it was named "waste" rock.
USAF TSgt C-17 Aircraft Maintenance Flying Crew Chief & Flightline Avionics Craftsman
Could restaurant grease/oil be used in this process?
http://www.changingworldtech.com/information_center/index.asp?id=5
edblysard wrote: Yup, We had a tank car full of old cooking oil that had the steam pipes inside it rot away from age… Because you don’t cap the inlet or outlet on the steam heating pipes, when our switch crew kicked the car, the pipe inside the tank broke or ruptured. Over half of the contents of the car poured out in a matter of minutes. The EPA made us remove the ballast, ties, and in some places over 12 inches of roadbed material, and have it hauled away in dumpsters that were tarped and labeled hazardous waste. Seems if this stuff gets in a watershed or aquifer, it can cause all kinds of problems, not the least of which is it can kill aquatic plant life. If it is allowed to stay in a stream or lake, it will “sheet out” and can block the sunlight from reaching the bottom plants…you get pretty big fish kills and big algae beds will form, robbing the oxygen from the water. And if it is allowed to remain in, say soil, it disrupts the normal organic life, attracts predatory insects, and in some instances, can kill birds that ingest the insects that are feeding on the spilled oil. Like the DDT problem, where the toxin was in the insects the birds fed on, and then it caused the thinning of the bird egg shells, ingesting the insects that are feeding on the oil introduces the oil into the birds system, and they are not designed to ingest most of the fats in the oil. It disrupts their digestive process, and they end up starving to death. Because Houston is on a migratory bird flight path, the EPA is pretty tough on any spill of organic materials. We had a side swipe that tore open a tank car full of corn sweetener, and they made us remove just as much of the ballast and roadbed material as they could. A Class 1 crew shoved a track blind and put a hopper of plastic pellets into the side of the tank car…dumped the hopper on its side, spilled the pellets everywhere, and then drenched the whole mess with the corn sweetener. Because the bugs all went nuts over the sweetener, the sea gulls and other birds were having a feast of sorts, but were also ingesting the pellets. Not something the EPA smiles on. We got to wash and reuse the ballast in both cases, but the dirt and ties had to go to an EPA approved land fill for proper disposal. And we have two underground streams running across the yard; they discharge directly into Buffalo Bayou. Both streams now have EPA monitors at their discharge pipes to check for the presence of the cooking oil.
Just imagine a wrecked boxcar full of Alka-Seltzer and a bunch of sea gulls feeding on it.
The Boone & Scenic Valley RR has used biodiesel for a few years. They seem to be satisfied with it.
Jeff
edblysard wrote: Try the middle of August, riding a tank car that is over full of old used cooking oil, with it sloshing out the manway cover every time the car starts or stops moving. Ummm, nothing like smelling creosote and burnt dead french fries first thing in the morning to get your appetite working, not to mention giving your toe path a brand new coating of oil and slimy grease. Did I mention the flies and mosquitoes love the stuff? Did I mention that, if you get it on your clothes, you have to throw them away, because no matter how many times you wash them, the smell and stain will not come out, and you can’t wash them with anything else, because the smell will get on the other clothes? I once walked over a mile ahead of a shove with the leading end having a cut of these cars, because the cars were all covered in the stuff, and if you did managed to get on one with out slipping and breaking your leg, the flies and skeeters would eat you alive. South Dakota must have one heck of a rendering plant and processing center, we get around two hundred of these things every week from there, not to mention the tallow cars full of edible and inedible animal fat. And what the heck is “Technical Animal Tallow”? Fat from computer smart cows? ericsp wrote: solzrules wrote: I don't know that restaraunts throw grease away. Back in my younger days working in a couple of restaraunts they would make a point of saving every once of used grease they could.....turns out a company would come by every week and pump out the grease traps and pay money to do it. Before the whole bio-diesel thing I guess there are a bunch of other uses for old grease and fry oil. It sure stank, though, whatever they used it for. I still get sick in McDonald's. A few months ago I drove by a restaurant where they had spilled a large quantity of that grease while pumping it into the truck. It was all over the parking lot, and it smelled incredibly bad. I am glad I did not just eat nor was I about to.
http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/waisidx_01/9cfr351_01.html
Definition of Technical Animal Fat (PDF)
I once saw part of a cow, I think, fall out of an overloaded dump that was probably heading to a rendering plant.
The Mount Washington Cog Railway will be using Biodiesel. This is according to a story on the newswire.
The next issue of TRAINS should have more details.
B. T. U. for B. T. U. what gain is there with biodiesel? I have heard ethanol from corn is actually a slight loss.
Figure in the energy to plant, harvest, transport and process grain into diesel. Assuming soybeans are the grain base, petroleum based nitrogen fertilizer should not be an issue as it is with corn.
Waste cooking oils should not be counted, other than the slight processing involved. These are actually an otherwise wasted by product. Waste cooking oils will make hardly a dent in the total demand for diesel.
Biofuels are already being cited as reducing grain supplies on hand. This will drive up the price of grain. Feeding us is about the only thing that will interrupt the love affair with the automobile. At what point will supply drive the use of grain back to foodstuffs?
Whatever happened to the self contained, nuclear electric locomotive?
Randy Vos
"Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings
"May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV
This is a company that moves its products by rail.
They have a fleet of long tank cars.
ABENGOA BIOENERGY
www.abengoabioenergy.com/
These fuels traded and sold might not be used by the railroads, but they are transported by railcar.
Click on the web link and you will see the ECO-ENERGY Tank Cars.
http://www.eco-energyinc.com/
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