UP retires 8500 series SD90MAC-II's

[Mookie]

Whoa - time out.

Can someone condense this all for me? I got lost somewhere in the thread.

I know there are SD90's out there. Did the UP order them and then send them back?

Did BNSF order any and did they keep them?

I was just getting the 70's and 9's all compartmentalized and now they throw in the GEVO and the 90's and I can't remember what else.

Help someone?

Mook

And Keep It Simple - I have a very simple mind!

[waltersrails]

not all most i like some UP

[beaulieu]

Mookie lets start here

EMD calls the locomotive SD90MAC - UP calls the locomotive SD9043MAC, CP Calls the model SD90MAC, and CIT Financial calls the locomotive SD90MAC
These locomotives have a 4300hp. 16V-710G3C engine and it was designed to easily replace this diesel with a 16V-265H engine when the bugs were worked out.
This has never happened. UP bought 309 of these locomotives, CP bought 61 of these locomotives, and CIT Financial (CEFX) bought 40 of them. These are the "Convertables" The UP lost 2 of these locomotives in wrecks, but otherwise all of these are operating for their owners in normal service without any plans to dispose of them.

The locomotive EMD calls SD90MAC-H - UP calls SD90MAC, and CP calls SD90MAC-H has the 6000hp 16V-265H engine fom new. UP bought 22 of these locomotives that look like the SD9043MACs except for the roof over the diesel engine which has slanted corners. The UP is renumbering these locomotives into the series 8910 - 8931 and they will continue to operate them.
The UP also leased 40 SD90MAC-H locomotives numbered 8522 - 8561. These were built with the new angular bodystyle. The UP had the option to terminate the lease on these 40 locomotives after 5 years, the 5 years are up and UP sent these locomotives back to EMD. These are now being leased to KCS.
CP has 4 SD90MAC-H locomotives that they own. These are temporarily stored but CP doesn't plan on retiring these at this time. EMD also owns two demonstrator locomotives of this model that were never sold or lease to a railroad. EMD has announced an order from China for 300 locomotives using this same 6000hp 265H engine. This engine is also being successfully used in Marine and stationary power generation service.

[bnsfkline]

Actually, I have seen a photo on rrpicturearchives.net that shows the UP 8500 has also been returned to the leasor.

This has led me to belive that other SD90's besides the 8522-8561 series is also being retired and removed from the active roster.

[karldotcom]

We were just in Tehachapi talking about how we used to see the 90Macs on the long Roseville-West Colton drags....three a day with 108 cars each. Of course, they had a tendancy to lost contact as DPUs and pull apart trains all the time.

I did a phone trace on 8500-8510, and only UP8502 and UP8510 returned. The rest have been renumbered.

QUOTE: Originally posted by bnsfkline

Actually, I have seen a photo on rrpicturearchives.net that shows the UP 8500 has also been returned to the leasor.

This has led me to belive that other SD90's besides the 8522-8561 series is also being retired and removed from the active roster.

[trainfan1221]

I know that a lot of the modern locos, especially 6000hp models, were having trouble. I am surprised they would be taken out of service,though.

[Mookie]

Ah - Thank you! That clears it up!

Mook

[rrandb]

QUOTE: Originally posted by cnw8835

QUOTE: Originally posted by bnsfkline

I should change the topic title....Ok...I am....

This is the first incident of entire order of new AC traction model to be retired......We are witnessing history!

They aren't being retired, they are just being returned to the leasor.

It s is not historic when short term lease equipment is replace with delivered power as ordered. This was obviously a short term solution to a long term power shortage. I would need more info from either GM or UP as to why?. While I am sure GM was hopefull UP would purchase these units it was not the case. As allways ENJOY RMR

[K. P. Harrier]

As I recall, on UP, the SD90’s were a concoction of the Drew Lewis era. Instead of designing it correctly, the push was to get the product in service as quickly as possible. The failed results were predictable. GE’s offering in that environment also had lackluster results.

[SactoGuy188]

I'm not surprised that UP is phasing out the SD90MAC's with the 265H prime mover. Those units were definitely not paragons of reliability and UP found out that the extra power weren't that useful in most cases. Interestingly enough, UP is keeping their 7500-series AC6000CW's, probably because the Deutz prime mover was quite a bit more reliable in UP service.

[trainfan1221]

In all honesty, the 6000hp mark was one that the railroads just weren't ready for in a single unit. I have read numerous articles stating that, and that the current 4400 models and the like are pretty much suitable for anything. Although I do believe those short lived 5000hp SD80macs Conrail had were pretty reliable. I know they are still around, just lost in the shuffle on NS and CSX.

[bnsfkline]

I still don't see why any other railroad ordered SD80MAC's. I now that CNW had orderd 30 of them, but UP changed the order to SD9043's 3 days before the cnw 80MAC's were to be put into production. I also read that CP had bought them, but I think that order was cancelled, since I have not heard anything else on them.

[Anonymous]

Upon listening to stories from UP, CSX and CP engineers, the SD90MAC-Hs and AC6000CWs are nightmares. They vibrate apart, go through fuel like crazy, and seem to break down too often. No wonder UP is returning. (Hey Class 1's, take a hint, follow good 'ole Big Blue's lead and tell EMD to bring back the SD80MAC! A good solid 5,000 HP)

[coborn35]

I believe only Conrail and now CSX have SD80MACs.

[Randy Stahl]

QUOTE: Originally posted by 4884bigboy

Upon listening to stories from UP, CSX and CP engineers, the SD90MAC-Hs and AC6000CWs are nightmares. They vibrate apart, go through fuel like crazy, and seem to break down too often. No wonder UP is returning. (Hey Class 1's, take a hint, follow good 'ole Big Blue's lead and tell EMD to bring back the SD80MAC! A good solid 5,000 HP)

Talk about fuel consumption , all the night mares of the SD90mac and 20 cylinders !!

[railroad65]

QUOTE: Originally posted by coborn35

I believe only Conrail and now CSX have SD80MACs.

NS 7200-7216

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by coborn35

I believe only Conrail and now CSX have SD80MACs.

Actually, when Conrail was split, CSX got 12 and NS got 18. They are orphans on NS as they are the roads only AC powered diesels.

[rrandb]

I saw EMLX/UP 8547& 8538 at KCS's K.C.,MO. yard today The up lettering has a stripe thru it. The EMLX initials are on the side of the nose just below the gray area that is angled and in front of up's numbering. The # 8547 has paint damage from a small fire on the engineers side at the first access door behind the air intake. I took some 35mm photo's but have not finished the roll yet.[8D] As always ENJOY.

[AlcoRS11Nut]

NO!!!! that sad...i liked them in armor yellow.

[Anonymous]

Well speaking from experence, the true MAC90's just couldn't stay running. Here you have a 4 stroke engine that was designed by a company that had never built one. Teathing pains is an understatement. There were a lot of times where we would have to take them back to the shop 2 or 3 times befor we could build them in a consist. The MAC90's spent most of their lives in the shop. The GE AC6000CW's on the other hand, had a lot of turbo problems with their Deutz engine. That's what happens when you take a marine engine and stick it in a locomotive.

[fuzzybroken]

QUOTE: Originally posted by espeefoamer

What does CP think of thier SD90s? Are they SD90 MACH-lls or SD90/43s?

CP has some of each, mostly 90/43s. Considering that they've ordered almost ALL GEs since then (with an exception for some GP38-2s), I guess they weren't too impressed...

I met up with a fellow railfan a while back who said that he saw a whole bunch of brand new UP SD90MAC-Hs, but I finally figured out that what he really saw was the newest SD70ACe's... They DO look kinda similar!

[Anonymous]

Hold up, wait a minute.... UP is retireing those SD90MAC's already!? What they do run out of parts or somthing? [:O][%-)][sigh]