How is employee turnover in the railroad industry? Once someone has made it through the rigorous screening process and is hired is he or she likely to remain in the industry for life or for only a few years?
Ulrich How is employee turnover in the railroad industry? Once someone has made it through the rigorous screening process and is hired is he or she likely to remain in the industry for life or for only a few years?
Old heads always say you either quit your first year, or you hang around for 30.
Seems to hold true.
zug
6 done... 31 to go.
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
If you haven’t been run off in a year, it all starts to make sense right about that time.
Like Zug said, either they quit inside the first year, (or first derailment) or they stick around for the duration.
16 years in so far.
23 17 46 11
I just got my BA-6 , I'm betting most of the railroaders did. 287 months of service here.....The first few years I looked forward to seeing the time add up but now it just makes me feel old.
I was hell bent on working for a railroad, I nearly quit a few times but it was clear that I couldn't be happy anywhere else. All the times I was laid off I got in a lot of trouble.
I agree with everyone, if you can last the first year you have a chance of a long career, it usually takes about that long to weed out the ones that are not meant for the railroad life.
Randy
I heard this at a C&NW Historical Society meeting in an address by Dan Sabin(CEO of Iowa & Northern). 'We will be starting a Conductor class of 12 folks this summer. If we still have 5 employed by the end of the year, I will feel good',
The irregular hours/schedule for employees in road service can play havoc with family life.
Jim
Modeling BNSF and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin
Only 25 years left, unless Railroad Retirement changes something...
Retention can be an issue, especially when a different outfit nearby is paying a lot more for similar work hours and conditions...
Mike WSOR engineer | HO scale since 1988 | Visit our club www.WCGandyDancers.com
Same holds true for other departments in the railroad, not just the operating crafts.
edblysardIf you haven’t been run off in a year, it all starts to make sense right about that time.
We see that in the volunteers on our railroad as well. Some get it, some don't.
The deciding factor for some is what picture they had in their mind when they started here. If they had too romantic a view of railroading, or are just interested in being a railroader, they may not make the cut - we're a real railroad that has passengers with expectations and all of our crewmembers are expected not only to railroad safely, but to provide the customers with a memorable experience.
Of course, nobody is here for the money. We usually end up spending our own money for all sorts of stuff to keep things going.
.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
Randy StahlI just got my BA-6 , I'm betting most of the railroaders did. 287 months of service here.....The first few years I looked forward to seeing the time add up but now it just makes me feel old.
Yup and yup. Also, when I look at the total creditable earnings, I wonder where it all went!
-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/)
There were 16 of us in my class, age wise I was the oldest at 38.
Of the 16, there were five of us still here after 3 years, we 5 all stayed railroading….now we are two ground pounders, two are engineers, and one is a yardmaster.
Don, I know what you mean….my wife looked at that, said “no way, you couldn’t have earned that much!”
Scary how much three daughters, two granddaughters and a wife can spend!
edblysard Scary how much three daughters, two granddaughters and a wife can spend!
You said it. But we keep smiling because EX wives spend it even faster..
I hired with 4 other people. 3 quit within one year, one is a dispatcher, and I'm still a groundpounder.
zugmann I hired with 4 other people. 3 quit within one year, one is a dispatcher, and I'm still a groundpounder.
I don't mean to hijack the thread, but what is a "groundpounder?" Is it a conductor? Switchman?
Lone Geep
\
I hired out for a summer job - 47 years & 6 days ago.
Current seniority roster I am on has 2 of us with 1973 dates - the rest of the roster is 2001 and later.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
BaltACDI hired out for a summer job - 47 years & 6 days ago.
You are a worker, Balt. Some people are and go on and on. There are worse things to be in this life.
John
BaltACD I hired out for a summer job - 47 years & 6 days ago. Current seniority roster I am on has 2 of us with 1973 dates - the rest of the roster is 2001 and later.
So that must mean you can pretty much pick any assignment you want?
Time flies, I sometimes can't believe I've been in transportation myself for so long...on July 4 it will be 25 years! It was only supposed to be a summer job!
lone geepI don't mean to hijack the thread, but what is a "groundpounder?" Is it a conductor? Switchman?
Yes. Pretty much anyone who isn't in a purely supervisory role, or an engineer.
Biggest cause for turnover for the lowest on the roster is being furloughed, Guys get cut off, find another job to hold them over. They get recalled, quit their other job and come back only to be cut off again after a week or two. After doing this a couple times people don't come back.
To keep the low seniority guys connected, they started some retention boards. The low guys would work two days a week and keep their insurance. Many found other jobs to do the other days of the week. Thing is, they would get recalled to full time work, quit their part time work and get cut back again after a week or two.
We've had a few leave after working a few years, some even after becoming engineers. Some went to other railroads. A few left the industry entirely.
Jeff
Jeff,
The PTRA has a flow back agreement with the UP…if furloughed here, we can mark up in the same craft with our seniority date at the local UP terminal, in this case, Englewood.
Have to do the UP training class and rules re-cert, but its pretty much the same as ours.
Had a bunch cut off a few years ago, they exercised the agreement, went there.
All of them got called back, but one guy liked his job there, so he stayed, didn’t realize the contract required him to come back, got fired from the PTRA, (job abandonment)…UP cut him lose the same day!
Best thing about working for a terminal switching road is we all go home every day!
I think the 1 year or 30 year rule is true in many industries or careers. Two examples:
1. I worked in trucking for an LTL carrier the first 13 years of my adult life. Our roster of drivers was very solid at the top, the new drivers came and went.
2. Been in sales for the same company the past 23 years (has it been that long?) and our sales staff is made up of seasoned vets who have "made it" and a constant turnover of "newbies". I don't even take the time anymore to get to know them.
It used to be that if a new salesman (typically right out of college) made it to year 3, we had them. The pay, culture, etc was in place to make a great living. Not so anymore. Today's young adults have seen their parents "downsized" and have absolutely no problem in jumping to a new company/career. It is a problem for many companies.
My trucking customers almost always tell me their biggest challenge is driver retention. Probably the same for the railroads, even with the relative high pay.
Ed
This thread is really thought-provoking.
All jobs, it seems to me, have their up and downsides. I understand that railroading is dangerous, has strange hours and furloughs, etc. But what are the upsides? What are the "rewards" of railroading? What satisfactions, besides the obvious one of paychecks, does railroading offer its employees? Or, why DO people stick with railroading as a career? What do they get out of it? Someone here earlier wrote about the satisfaction of getting a load from point A to point B. I can understand that. But what else?
This question of turnover reminds me that in my profession (retired teacher here) we also have a ridiculous turn over rate in the same amount of time, obviously for different reasons, but it makes me think that a one to three year shakeout period is probably the norm in just about any line of work. There is simply no substitute for doing a job to learn what it's really like and whether one "cottons" to it. I wonder if railroad retention rates are significantly different from other jobs?
And congratulations to Balt on his long-lived career. I tip my hat.
NKP guy All jobs, it seems to me, have their up and downsides. I understand that railroading is dangerous, has strange hours and furloughs, etc. But what are the upsides? What are the "rewards" of railroading? What satisfactions, besides the obvious one of paychecks, does railroading offer its employees? Or, why DO people stick with railroading as a career? What do they get out of it? Someone here earlier wrote about the satisfaction of getting a load from point A to point B. I can understand that. But what else?
Most railroaders will tell you what keeps them here is the paycheck. For some you could also include in that the retirement benefit. Many of the old heads will say they hired on because they were looking for a job 30 or more years, some just for something temporary during college summer breaks or between graduating college and getting their first job in their field of study. They stayed because of the pay and benefits. Some had family or neighbors who worked for the railroad.
To a certain extent, you have more freedom in doing your work. You don't always have a supervisor right over your shoulder, telling you exactly what to do and how to do it. Along with that comes more responsibility, too. You are responsible for millions of dollars worth of equipment and freight. (But I'm not allowed to open a crew transport van door, go figure.) Not to mention that when things go really bad, they are really bad. Enough that it makes the TV, newspaper and Trains.
jeffhergert NKP guy All jobs, it seems to me, have their up and downsides. I understand that railroading is dangerous, has strange hours and furloughs, etc. But what are the upsides? What are the "rewards" of railroading? What satisfactions, besides the obvious one of paychecks, does railroading offer its employees? Or, why DO people stick with railroading as a career? What do they get out of it? Someone here earlier wrote about the satisfaction of getting a load from point A to point B. I can understand that. But what else? Most railroaders will tell you what keeps them here is the paycheck. For some you could also include in that the retirement benefit. Many of the old heads will say they hired on because they were looking for a job 30 or more years, some just for something temporary during college summer breaks or between graduating college and getting their first job in their field of study. They stayed because of the pay and benefits. Some had family or neighbors who worked for the railroad. To a certain extent, you have more freedom in doing your work. You don't always have a supervisor right over your shoulder, telling you exactly what to do and how to do it. Along with that comes more responsibility, too. You are responsible for millions of dollars worth of equipment and freight. (But I'm not allowed to open a crew transport van door, go figure.) Not to mention that when things go really bad, they are really bad. Enough that it makes the TV, newspaper and Trains. Jeff
I'm embarassed that I don't have a fast answer for that question. I like the ability to work alone alot , I don't have to deal with the public really. I like the retirement and now after 5 years you are vested. I like the challenge , getting a train from point A to point B is much more than it sounds. Its not like driving a truck or a car , its a constant lesson in physics. When I get on a freight train usually all I see of the train is maybe the first 10-15 cars. I have my consist and my train profile in my hand that tells me what the train looks like, the tonnage , length, position of the cars in the train etc. I base the way I operate the train on this information, When I finish my ruun , I usually do a rollby for the crew that relieves me , only then do I actually see what I hauled over the mountains. I am always a bit awed ind intimidated by the size of the train I just ran . To see the numbers and graphs doesn't do justice to fact these things are BIG and I beat physics and moved it at track speed over mountain grades.
Usually my fast answer to this question is I am a railroader because I am under-qualified to be an adult film star . But for once I think this deserves some real thought . I do have an illness , I have Crohns disease, I could easily be on a disability. Guys I work with sometimes encourage me to get out. I htink about leaving sometimes but I dread the idea of not being useful anymore ,
If I spent a day or two looking for an issue on a locomotive its a good feeling after I make a repair to see, hear and feel the thing pulling tonnage.
Although I often run the trains, my favorite job is being a locomotive electrician , I love the detective work !!
Randy Stahl I like the challenge , getting a train from point A to point B is much more than it sounds. Its not like driving a truck or a car , its a constant lesson in physics. When I get on a freight train usually all I see of the train is maybe the first 10-15 cars. I have my consist and my train profile in my hand that tells me what the train looks like, the tonnage , length, position of the cars in the train etc. I base the way I operate the train on this information, When I finish my ruun , I usually do a rollby for the crew that relieves me , only then do I actually see what I hauled over the mountains. I am always a bit awed ind intimidated by the size of the train I just ran . To see the numbers and graphs doesn't do justice to fact these things are BIG and I beat physics and moved it at track speed over mountain grades. Randy
I like the challenge , getting a train from point A to point B is much more than it sounds. Its not like driving a truck or a car , its a constant lesson in physics. When I get on a freight train usually all I see of the train is maybe the first 10-15 cars. I have my consist and my train profile in my hand that tells me what the train looks like, the tonnage , length, position of the cars in the train etc. I base the way I operate the train on this information, When I finish my ruun , I usually do a rollby for the crew that relieves me , only then do I actually see what I hauled over the mountains. I am always a bit awed ind intimidated by the size of the train I just ran . To see the numbers and graphs doesn't do justice to fact these things are BIG and I beat physics and moved it at track speed over mountain grades.
To give someone the scale of trains that the industry is currently hauling - go to Google Earth and follow the path of some of the known Class 1 Main lines - as your follow along the lines you will come across trains on the line - you will be amazed at just how much geography these trains actually occupy, end to end.
I just plain have a lot of fun (although there are plenty of pain in the rear days). I am on the telecom side of the house, and there is nothing like watching trains from the top of a 400' tower. The scenery is great, the folks in our craft are decent to deal with (obviously there are exceptions), and the pay is excellent!! I may be on the road 8-10 days at a time, but I have 5-7 days off in between. I always enjoy seeing trains rolling, not from a railfan perspective, but thinking about all the pieces that have to come together to get that train from point a to point b.
jeffhergert ... between graduating college and getting their first job in their field of study. They stayed because of the pay and benefits.
... between graduating college and getting their first job in their field of study. They stayed because of the pay and benefits.
There's my life story. Graduated college, and within 2 weeks I was collecting my first RR paycheck.
Pay isn't super great where I'm at, but for a blue-collar type job outside of a major city, it is pretty good, esp. if you can hold a regular job and not have to deal with the on-call crap.
Work isn't that hard physically or mentally, and benefits are pretty good. Too early for me to think about retirement other than save as much as I can for it. Working around trains is pretty cool, and other people you meet think it's pretty cool, too. Plus there's such a wide variety of people working out here, and that's neat.
Will I stick around for another 30+ years? Who knows. If the economy picked up tomorrow and I could find another job that paid similar and allowed me to work a M-F 9-5 with lots more vacation time, I could be tempted. Burn that bridge when I get to it.
Downsides? I'm not crazy about certain regulatory agencies trying to legislate common sense out here lately. Too many rules and regulations from people that never lifted a cutlever. That whole safety vs. service thing. And if somebody is incompetent, they are going to pile 'em up no matter how many rules and regulations we have.
zugmannDownsides? I'm not crazy about certain regulatory agencies trying to legislate common sense out here lately. Too many rules and regulations from people that never lifted a cutlever.
Zugman,
Please allow a couple of observations from a guy who spent his life working for the Federal Government.
If you find government regulations burdensome you better believe they are a lot worse for government employees. From one perspective, the government exists to regulate and in some ways it is very good at it. For example, I did a fair amount of work with government checks. Many people believe with all of the government checks that are issues it must be impossible to trace even one. So they deny receiving a check. But it doesn't work; eventually the government catches up with it.
So if you are going to look for a job without government regulations you will look a long time. And all you will ever find is a job where you are paid off the books. With no benefits.
You would be surprised at how many people leave the private sector to work for the government because government has very steady work and reasonable benefits. But the railroad industry, which has the same, may be different. One advantage you have is that you can, if you want, look for a job with another railroad. In government you can't do that.
Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.